Slashdot Mirror
Why WikiLeaks Is Worth Defending
SomePgmr writes "By now, anyone with even a passing interest in the WikiLeaks phenomenon is familiar with most of the elements of its fall from grace: the rift between founder Julian Assange and early supporters over his autocratic and/or erratic behavior, the Swedish rape allegations that led to his seeking sanctuary in Ecuador, a recent childish hoax the organization perpetrated, and so on. Critics paint a picture of an organization that exists only in name, with a leadership vacuum and an increasingly fractured group of adherents. Despite its many flaws, however, there is still something worthwhile in what WikiLeaks has done, and theoretically continues to do. The bottom line is that we need something like a 'stateless news organization,' and so far it is the best candidate we have."
Freedom to post whatever you want in a public forum is important in our world today. Wikileaks seems to self destructing and isn't necessary in the grand scheme of things.
Feel free to compare the United States to any other nations they express a serious interest in from a military, economic, or overall political standpoint. Try living in both nations for five years apiece. Then report back on your findings, provided you have the spine to actually try this for yourself.
And the point of this is what?
Just a coincidence or a witch hunt, amazing how things fall apart when you are Enemy of the State.
#1 Reason - Pentagon Papers https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pentagon_Papers .
When the USA keeps secrets, the entire world suffers. Sad, but true. There probably isn't a single country that the USA hasn't screwed over in one way or another, including herself.
To the rest of the world, it is the government, not the people making these dangerous decisions. It has happened with both political parties. JFK lied and every President since has too. The military has kept many secrets.
They should try helping and protecting their sources, not dropping them and pretending they don't exist.
But not Assange. He's not WikiLeaks. Simple as that. He betrayed them with this massive stunt.
Non impediti ratione cogitationus.
If you are the kind of person who's easily swayed by the media's depiction of Assange, then yes, you most definitely need wikileaks
This is rich. In the US we don't have investigative journalism anymore and haven't had it since Iran-Contra for political and Vietnam for war coverage. In both circumstances, the government learned not to allow the media too close. That is why reporters were not allowed to investigate Iraq and Afghanistan on their own without being "imbedded". That is why you have no focus on the trillions spent on these war efforts and no reporting on the corruption of our government by the deep pockets of those who financially gain from fear (read Homeland Security) and war (read military industrial complex). Instead what we get for "news" is spoon fed us by the Pentagon and the White House and taken as gospel. It then gets repeated by every new organization without a single fact verified. In short, what we got for new organizations are merely propaganda machines.
This is a sig. This is only a sig. Had this been an actual sig you would have been informed where to tune for more sigs.
Why we need WikiLeaks: Remember the article on the Australian tax authority the other day where they want expansive powers to snoop on businesses on the off-chance they might be paying less taxes than the government would like?
OK, then, we the citizens need powers to snoop on government bureaucrats on the off-chance they're doing something illegal. If they're not doing anything wrong, they should have nothing to fear.
I'm not a lawyer, but I play one on the Internet. Blog
I guess I missed the part where the US has annexed sovereign states by force, or systematically imprisoned, impressed into forced labor, and murdered millions of people based solely on their ethnicity.
That was during the 18th and 19th century (you know, the Indians, slavery, annexation of Hawaii, etc.) so it's understandable why you missed it.
As far as world domination goes, the US has far surpassed the Germans, and even the British -- that's why there are hundreds of military bases all over the world, and why there's one set of rules for countries in the imperial fold (e.g. Israel's nukes) and those outside (e.g. Iran's legal nuclear program).
True, the U.S. empire is "softer" than the German one -- it doesn't need mass extermination camps, it merely needs to imprison over 2 million of its own citizens, and apply surveillance over the rest, in order to keep the lid on things. That plus mass narcotization of its population via consumerism, entertainment and actual pharmaceuticals has proven a more effective form of centralization of power than the crude 20th century models.
This is a canard. Oh the media's spineless, everything it publishes is spoonfed, etc. That's just garbage. The real problem is we too many people don't want to think critically anymore; who would rather whine than ask questions or participate. They outsource responsibility for civic engagement to other people. That's why they don't notice that there are many, many reporters who are committed to discovering the truth and who take risks to do so.
"where the US has annexed sovereign states by force,"
Texas?
"or systematically imprisoned"
Gitmo.
"impressed into forced labor"
100% of military helmets are made by prison inmates. This is not all they're forced to do.
"and murdered millions of people based solely on their ethnicity."
Chinese/Japanese, WW2? Negroes both before emancipation and in the tests on them in the ghettos in the 60's.
I mean, if you're going to pretend that the holocaust was SOLEY based on ethnicity, you'd have to include every ethnic race in the world. And it was religiously led for the jews and politically motivated (kill the outsider, the source of all our problems and things will be fine) for them all.
Really? Are you saying that your history class literally failed to cover the Mexican American War, slavery, and the systemic genocide of the native population? These were standard topics in American History when I was growing.
This is rich. In the US we don't have investigative journalism anymore
Wikileaks was neither investigative nor journalism. It was a data dump of sensitive information. Anyone that doesnt know the difference, such as apparently yourself, can offer no opinion that would be worth consuming on the subject. You are already too far gone to have any real grasp of reality.
"His name was James Damore."
I guess I missed the part where the US has annexed sovereign states by force, or systematically imprisoned, impressed into forced labor, and murdered millions of people based solely on their ethnicity.
Then you must be Rip Van Winkle. There is an element of truth in your assertion, in that - since the 19th century, as others have pointed out - the USA has not seen fit to annex other nations in the sense of adding them to its own territory. Instead, it finds it more convenient to invade them, destroy their existing political systems, and set up puppet "Quisling" regimes. But dead people are dead however they got that way, and wherever the US armed forces have gone there seem to be an awful lot of "excess deaths". Maybe the liberated brown people simply die of excessive joy at their newly-conferred rights and freedoms.
I am sure that there are many other solipsists out there.
The disturbing thing is that you see a few people in every Wikileaks story saying that we have no right to know what our government is doing. We are the government! We have every right to know, and I firmly believe that politicians should be hounded by investigative reporters like paparazzi hound vapid celebrities. However, as a society, we are more interested in who Tom Cruise is currently dating (or if he's secretly gay) than we are how much money a state Senator is embezzling. Even when we do get any kind of investigative reporting, it's usually just sex scandals. Wikipedia even keeps a list of them.
Wikileaks isn't exactly my ideal candidate, but it's one of the few organizations that's willing to actually shine a light at something important. Everyone else is either too scared or compensated not to do so.
"As far as world domination goes, the US has far surpassed the Germans, and even the British -- that's why there are hundreds of military bases all over the world, and why there's one set of rules for countries in the imperial fold (e.g. Israel's nukes) and those outside (e.g. Iran's legal nuclear program)."
The difference is one of consent. Poland did not consent to German military bases. Nations benefit heavily from American military bases on their soil, that's why they're there. The only exception I can think of where a nation doesn't want an American military base on their soil is Cuba, and even there Guantanamo was put there pursuant to (at the time) Cuba's consent.
Information is power; If a government is forced to be wide open then they lose power. Open information should replace or be added to the 2nd Amendment. The whole point of the 2nd Amendment was to act as a brake on out of control government. But at this point in history a bunch of guys running around with 9mm pistols isn't going to change a thing. But open information can change everything. Corrupt contracts become a whole lot harder if the whole process becomes open. Things like ACTA become impossible if every step of the lobbyists become open and accountable. When I am talking open I mean really really open. Things like the DHS would be wide open. The only time I would think the government should be allowed to be even slightly closed would be open investigations which would require a judge to say, OK this is closed for 30 days. Then wiretaps and whatnot would be effective. But the second the investigation ends the records are instantly open.
All finance should be open right down to the paperclips. Wasteful spending can't happen if everyone can take a peek into their area of expertise and say, "Whoa there cowboy. You don't buy laptops for $2000 and a service plan of another $1000 per year." Or "That isn't the right concrete for an overpass. It will fall down in 10 years."
Think of the steps that had to be taken in private in order to create the Dick Murtha Airport.
Keep in mind that there are Nordic countries where they publish income tax records onto the internet. They do record who looks though. So you can see your neighbour's taxes but they can see that you are a nosy bastard. The result has been some fantastically rich people somehow claiming around $100,000 in income being busted by people finding this and then it becoming front page news.
How many times have the police gotten out of control where the whole thing was dealt with "internally"? Open government would end this.
Except that they can't help us. For democracy to exist there they have to do it their way, which is what Pussy Riot was attempting to do. For democracy to survive in the West we have to defend it our way because freedom has potent domestic enemies. The truth hurts those enemies and neither you or I am innocent whilst we are choking on apathy and ignorance. This isn't a question of Nation or Party. The corruption that poisons our world governments seeks to crush any freedom of speech and expression of democracy anywhere. That's the reality we live with everyday.
If a man hiding in a Embassy because he faces life imprisonment for standing up for the truth in the face of corruption isn't exactly that then who is? Murdoch, Faux News? Ok he has flaws, what human doesn't? Does that mean Wikileaks is tarred by his iniquities? Whose opinions sway judgement and control rhetoric, the corrupted organisations that own the media outlets around the world whose interests are at stake?
The irony in all of this is astounding. An Australian, is a refugee in an Ecuador embassy, on British soil who seek to extradite him to Sweden where he fears extradition to the United States where he faces life in prison for exercising freedom of speech and defending democracy.
Wikileaks is the front line for the war on freedom, all our freedom. While the lies rule our governments we are all slaves.
My ism, it's full of beliefs.
And when that consent was withdrawn, they did not leave...
I am John Hurt.
It's a reckless, amoral organization, that doesn't care who it hurts, doesn't care if it gets blood on its hand [sic]
Yes, that is true of the US Federal Government. That is what you meant, isn't it?
and could care less about the fate of the people who supply its documents.
Now maybe you are referring to Wikileaks. But your argument is disingenuous in the extreme. Ever hear the story about the mice who decided to bell the cat? A wonderful idea in principle, as then they would always know when the cat was approaching. Only one small practical problem: who gets the honour of actually belling the cat? Knowing that the odds of dying horribly are very high. My name for someone who deliberately volunteers for a mission like this is "hero". The fate of the people who supply the documents is altogether, and solely, the responsibility of those who inflict that fate. Your government.
Remember what Benjamin Franklin said, back when there was some hope that the USA would actually become a free country? "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety". Well, Bradley Manning refused to give up his liberty in order to obtain safety - and now he is being punished for it. Assange has laid his life and liberty on the line, and he may very well be next.
What the world needs, and still has plenty of, are people of good moral character, who will fight for what's right, who will take stands, and who will take risks.
I have way more respect for the three young women of Pussy Riot and what they have accomplished than anything Wikileaks has done.
I'll assume you are misinformed, rather than anarchically vicious. Read this, and say that again:
http://www.counterpunch.org/2012/08/23/the-secret-history-of-pussy-riot/
I am sure that there are many other solipsists out there.
Julian himself is an arrogant fool. Did he ACTUALLY think he'd get away with releasing truckloads of U.S. intelligence info? And when it was pointed out to him that he may well have killed people who were working with us, he said that anyone working with the U.S. deserved to die (yeah, he did. it was in an interview broadcast by the BBC).
An exact quote, preferably with a source, would be preferable. Then we would have some idea what it was, exactly, that Assange said.
Maybe it was something like, "Anyone who participates in what the Nuremberg Tribunal described as the supreme war crime - unprovoked aggressive war - deserves to die". After all, the USA and its allies hanged a lot of Germans and Japanese for exactly that crime. And if they shot them before they had a chance of a trial, no one shed any tears.
"The International Military Tribunal at Nuremberg, which followed World War II, called the waging of aggressive war "essentially an evil thing...to initiate a war of aggression...is not only an international crime; it is the supreme international crime, differing only from other war crimes in that it contains within itself the accumulated evil of the whole". http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_of_aggression
I am sure that there are many other solipsists out there.
Irwin Schiff went to prison for not paying his taxes. I don't fault him for that. Civil disobedience, is after all, a noble act of defiance. However, as such, you have to be prepared to suffer the consequences. The US Government is what the US Citizens decide it should be. Who's fault is it that the American people are too lazy to fight for what they want? Oh, too busy working to put food on the table. What crap! The average person watches some 20 hours a week with their eyes glued to the TV watching vacuous nonsense.
Imagine what one could accomplish spending half those hours engaged in some aspect of civics. Oh, that's right, no one remembers that along with their rights, they have certain duties and responsibilities.
I wonder how different the US would look if Martin Luther King had sat back and watched Real World.
Who cares about a spook being outed? The spook and her family. Outing Plame was a lot more reckless than anything Wikileaks ever did.
Anarchists never rule