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Foxconn Workers On Strike Over iPhone 5 Production
itwbennett writes "That army of robotic assembly line workers we mentioned yesterday apparently can't get started soon enough. As many as 3,000-4,000 workers are on strike at Foxconn's Zhengzhou factory, upset at stricter quality control requirements with the iPhone 5 and having to work through a national holiday this week. 'According to workers, multiple iPhone 5 production lines from various factory buildings were in a state of paralysis for the entire day,' China Labor Watch said. Sina Weibo and Tencent Weibo are both blocking searches in Chinese for 'Foxconn strikes.'"
Strike, it's the only power they have. Until they get shot for being on strike that is, or run over by a tank.. this is happening in China you know..
And actually, China lets them strike because it hurts the US more than China. It's not like Apple is going to close the slave labor camps any time soon, even if they lose a few bucks.
-The wise argue that there are few absolutes, the fool argues that there are no probabilities.
Couldnt they go on strike the day(s) of the holiday, just return the next day and start working?
Won't someone think of the hipsters?
But.. but.. but... I thought by boycotting Apple I was helping the workers!!
Clearly you were [if its true]. That is kind of the point of the article.
But.. but.. but... I thought by boycotting Apple I was helping the workers!!
You know what, I totally misread the summary. It's my bad and I apologize. Please mod my post down.
"I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)
Though I suppose there's some big syndicate behind them, which invariably is not a good thing.
“He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
when US and European Labor movements really started to assert themselves and address inequities and call the Robber Barons to task.
China has their army and Police -US companies had Police and Pinkertons....the workers still prevailed in the end, although much has been lost recently...
Hopefully it will not be bloody, but they deserve better than they are getting even if it means we might be paying slightly more for the next plastic POS we buy.
I'm just sayin'
I had a reading comprehension fail there, it's my bad.
"I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)
the ipod's promise to revolutionize the way we live, only applies to its consumers.
Good people go to bed earlier.
They'll be even more unhappy once they realize that robots can do their jobs even cheaper than they can. You know it's bad when even mainstream media is picking this up. A few months ago I was watching one of those Nightline/Dateline/Whateverline evening news shows that was talking specifically about Foxconn. At the end they showed the up-and-coming robot that does the work of the Chinese workers and in half the time of a human for half the cost. The reporter asked something along the lines of "what is going to happen when businesses realize they can assemble the gadgets in the U.S. and not pay to ship them across the ocean?"
24 beers in a case, 24 hours in a day. Coincidence? I think not!
I don't see how a country with such a large workforce can have any traction in a strike? Foxconn is a huge employer over there. Their working conditions are what most westerners would describe as "sweatshops", but then so are 95% of the rest of the manufacturing plants over there, so despite being unusual for "us", it's not at all uncommon for "them".
I wonder how long it takes for Foxconn to find another 4,000 workers willing to do the job for the pay? I simply can't believe that any of those employees weren't fully aware of what was and could be asked of them. They just want more pay for what's probably more work, and certainly longer work weeks. But if there are three people lined up behind you waiting to do that job for that pay the moment you turn your back, a strike doesn't seem like a good idea.
Strikes and unions just don't make sense for unskilled labor. And just because it's electronics doesn't make it skilled - if you're doing something that could be replaced with a robotic arm, it's not "skilled", skilled refers to mental skills, not physical.
I wish I had more insight into this "chinese holiday" thing though. I get the impression they take it a lot more seriously than we're giving them credit for. I see a lot of the chinese stores going on holiday all at once, it's obviously a widespread thing, maybe that five day vacation is their unwind time for the rest of the year in the sweatshop? In that case I think I can start to understand where it becomes a big deal. Kinda stupid of Apple to expect them to launch a new production line at that time, they had to see that one coming. I would expect them to have had a conversation with foxconn, "can you DO this?" And foxconn either adding a premium to the cost during that time, or sniveling and saying they'll make it happen, to keep their biggest customer. Oh to be a fly on the wall...
I work for the Department of Redundancy Department.
But to be honest, I hope that both they get what they want AND the iPhone 5's quality goes up. The build quality seems to be pretty hit and miss at the moment. I'm actually thinking of buying a Samsung Galaxy 3, fragile behemoth that it is, just so I don't have to worry about getting a lemon iPhone 5.
I thought everyone was choosing the Galaxy III over the iPhone because of NFC, storage and screen size ;) No wonder Samsung is expecting to earn $7.3bn while Apple are reducing orders on chips and screens.
I hope I have satisfied your off-topic troll comment trying to spin worker abuse as a good thing, with a lie.
But in the US they have a high tax rate, and aren't allowed to just dump their waste in the local river... so that wont happen anyway.
I've seen a lot of people with iPhones and Samsung Galaxy S3s. Whenever I see a Galaxy S3, I think, how in the fuck can you actually USE that thing? So my question is, do you have first hand experience with the S3, and is it just too ridiculously big?
I'd rather have an Android but will gladly go to the iPhone if it means getting a rocking phone that actually fits in my pocket and doesn't make me look like a dork.
I believe that Android phones come in a variety of shapes and sizes. You may not believe it is true that there is not one true phone. Android phones come with keyboards; projectors; even larger sizes [and smaller ones]; at every price point; game pads; waterpoofing; 2 sim slots. Personally I quite like the HTC S for a good android phone with a smaller screen. ...but then this is another off topic post to try and detract from worker abuse at Apples manufactures.
Which American companies actually pay American Taxes? Not Google, Apple, Microsoft, General Electric, or any other large company that has the resources to hire good accountants. The cost of waste disposal for an assembly line probably isn't that much.
Well.. maybe. Or Maybe not. But Definitely not sort of.
I'd rather have an Android but will gladly go to the iPhone if it means getting a rocking phone that actually fits in my pocket and doesn't make me look like a dork.
Too late.
"Tongue tied and twisted, just an Earth bound misfit
I've said it before, and now I'm saying it again. Nerve stapling all around, or failing that, off to the punishment sphere with the lot!
Tubal-Cain smokes the white owl.
The butthurt is strong in this one, O Master!
Tubal-Cain smokes the white owl.
Neat coincidence, no?
Hm...throwing fake blood on hipster iPhone 5 users...
Gladly. Please point me to a cell phone that is made 100% in the first world and I will immediately buy it.
~ a low user id is no indication I have a clue what I'm talking about.
How do we know which phones those are? We only talk about Apple!
"I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)
We already ship our e-waste to China, why would that be any different.
Two of my imaginary friends reproduced once
I suppose if you call billions of dollars paid in taxes as nothing, then yea, GE paid nothing. Pretty sure it's the same with the other companies, but you can research it yourself.
...for the Chinese government to come in and do some hard core strike breaking any day now. Workers of the world flee in terror!
Ah, the irony of "The People's Party". Seriously, now, why do we even bother calling China a Communist country any more, it should just officially be changed to a "Totalitarian Bureaucratic Oligarchy".
That article doesn't really say quite what you're asserting that it does.
Stricter quality control requirements with the iPhone 5?! So the purple flare really does come standard? And Foxconn doesn't make the maps app but if they did, it might be more accurate, lol. I don't have numbers on iphone failure rates but if the 4s was worse than previous versions as reliability, I could see them cracking the whip (probably literally) on version 5 production. I know that from 2007 to 2009 the macbook quality dropped from 2nd place to 6th so it does seem likely. If you're curious, an ASUS, MSI, Toshiba, Sony, and Samsung are all now more reliable than a macbook, and at most 1/2 the price.
Consumer disk storage is 6 cents a gig. Still a factor of 16 less than flash. As long as that ratio holds there will be no overnight takeover of the storage market by flash. Instead it's a creeping progression largely driven by the mobile market, outside of which the vast majority of mass storage being sold is still rotating disks. Sure a few geeks like me have begun to swap out their noisy, slow hard disks for ssd, but that's a few geeks. The PC market, the cloud, and enterprise storage, which together completely dwarf the mobile segment in terms of capacity, will continue to prefer cheap over fast and quiet for some time to come.
When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
There goes AAPL's quarter.
When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
Ya'll realize the iPhones, Galaxys, HTCs, etc. are probably not only made in the same country, but in the same building, right?
Sadly there's very little choice in the matter if you want a cel phone.
Why is your master training you to sense butthurt?
"I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)
They'll be even more unhappy once they realize that robots can do their jobs even cheaper than they can.
Don't be silly, they'll be building the robots.
When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
Here's more relevant information about the reasons for the strike: http://www.businessinsider.com/foxconn-workers-go-on-strike-2012-10 The important bit is that workers are striking not because they are against stricter quality, but because tighter quality checks meant they must work harder to produce iPhone components presumably at the same rate as earlier models. And they were told to do this without additional training.Victory for workers would mean Foxconn hiring more workers and less exhausting working pace for all workers there.
Not really. At least some S2s were made in Korea, for example. Nokias used to be made in Finland (not anymore, unfortunately).
Ya'll realize the iPhones, Galaxys, HTCs, etc. are probably not only made in the same country, but in the same building, right?
Sadly there's very little choice in the matter if you want a cel phone.
...are you sure. I am pretty positive that Samsung manufacture their CPU's in America [supports workers rights]. HTC is a Taiwanese manufacture so most of their phones are made there, both use Google OS which famously left china for ethical reasons...and tried to bring Manufacturing back to America with the Nexus Q. That is ignoring the abuses in this instance question are about iPhones not other Phones...but the short response is the ethical consumer simply does not buy Apple products, realistic alternatives are trivial to find.
Gladly. Please point me to a cell phone that is made 100% in the first world and I will immediately buy it.
...Sony is Japanese and have there own manufacturing plants. That is not forgetting that Samsung manufacture their chips in America, Google is trying to bring manufacturing to America in the form of the Nexus Q.
It is not really that hard to find companies with manufacturing facilities where workers rights are protected, or companies trying to do the right thing...but then your not interested in that your interested in defending Apple, rather than support more ethical companies. The world would be a better place with more ethical consumers.
I spend most of my time in China and Taiwan, whence the following data point, and the reason for my posting anonymously.
Workers on the Apple product assembly lines make the same repetitive motions 2,800 times per day (Macbooks) up to over 3,400 times per day for the tablets and phones. 10 minute breaks every two hours. 10 hour work days. 6 day work weeks. (But, the iphone5 is so successful, the day off is cancelled.) High-school kids in parts of china have been dragooned into serving as operators, with the threat that they MUST do these or not graduate. They get paid $US340 per month, and that's not a lot of money, even in the Chinese hinterlands.
I have two HTC phones, both on the basis of the fact that they were made in Taiwan. I simply will not own products where I know, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that the supply chain is unethical in its treatment of workers.
... which famously left China for ethical reasons?...
They left because they could not gain enough marketshare over established local brands.
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
I'd rather have an Android but will gladly go to the iPhone if it means getting a rocking phone that actually fits in my pocket
Maybe it's time to trade your oshkosh b'gosh for grown-up pants? You're a big kid now.
Apple wouldn't obscure the truth would they?
Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
http://www.pdfernhout.net/beyond-a-jobless-recovery-knol.html
A 21st century issue: the irony of technologies of abundance in the hands of those still thinking in terms of scarcity.
Machines do a better job of repetitive tasks, and humans should be (if you believe all the promises made about technology a century ago) healthier, working less, and spending more time in pursuit of self-fulfillment.
It's time to liberate ourselves. Put the robots in the factories, and put the humans back on the couch (with crisps, remote control, maybe a bluetooth keyboard and game controller).
Futurist Traditionalism
Robots should be compensated at a fair wage. For several reasons: 1. So that humans can still get jobs (albeit crappy ones) 2. So when the Robots become sentient, they can't hold being made unpaid slaves as a grievance against the human race. 3. So plutocrats just can't fire/low ball every human worker.
It can't be reasoned with. It doesn't feel pity or remorse or fear and it absolutely will not stop, ever, until you are unemployed.
http://www.ctj.org/taxjusticedigest/archive/2012/02/press_release_general_electric.php
General Electric's (GE) annual SEC 10-K filing for 2011 (filed February 24, 2012) reveals that the company paid at most two percent of its $80.2 billion in U.S. pretax profits in federal income taxes over the last 10 years.
Following revelations in March 2011 that GE paid no federal income taxes in 2010 and in fact enjoyed $3.3 billion in net tax benefits, GE told AFP (3/29/2011), "GE did not pay US federal taxes last year because we did not owe any." But don't worry, GE told Dow Jones Newswires (3/28/2011), "our 2011 tax rate is slated to return to more normal levels with GE Capital's recovery."
As it turns out, however, in 2011 GE's effective federal income tax rate was only 11.3 percent, less than a third the official 35 percent corporate tax rate.
"I don't think most Americans would consider 11.3 percent, not to mention GE's long-term effective rate of 1.8 percent, to be 'normal,' " said Bob McIntyre, director of Citizens for Tax Justice. "But for GE, taxes are something to be avoided rather than paid."
Pretty sure it's the same with the other companies, but you can research it yourself.
GE is one of 280 profitable Fortune 500 companies profiled in "Corporate Taxpayers and Corporate Tax Dodgers, 2008-2010." The report shows GE is one of 30 major U.S. corporations that paid zero -- or less -- in federal income taxes in the last three years. The full report, a joint project of Citizens for Tax Justice and the Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy, is at http://ctj.org/corporatetaxdodgers/.
The difference between the 47% of Americans who don't pay federal income taxes and GE, is that GE makes billions of dollars per year.
[Fuck Beta]
o0t!
So, the US consumers (us) complain about scratches caused by rubbing keys on the iPhone 5, which probably caused the whole "stricter quality control" thing, and then turn around and complain about the stricter quality control thing?
No wonder customers are always right.
Keep in mind that Foxconn is a Taiwanese company. That said, they're engaging in the same cutthroat business practices that most Chinese companies would. The distinction is that they make some of the world's most desirable consumer electronics and they're Taiwanese. So the Chinese government is less likely to clamp down and the likelihood of the western media hearing about it is slim. Not that the Chinese government isn't eager to get this strike under control, because it doesn't bode well for them in the long run. Many HTC phones are indeed manufactured in Taiwan where conditions are a lot better. But if you happen to have one made in China, chances are things aren't all that different than at a Foxconn factory.
The mechanization of the manufacturing process is a strong likelihood, especially for higher end products. Whether it reminds in China or moves elsewhere, it's not good for China. I suspect the weakening Chinese economy is a big factor in the strike. I wouldn't be surprised if there's pressure from the top to over deliver in order to keep foreign interests happy.
Foxconn: Sub-Saharan Africa!
I swear to God...I swear to God! That is NOT how you treat your human!
The cost of waste disposal for an assembly line probably isn't that much.
It may be cheaper to pay China to eat our production waste than to make our product and dump their own waste. Either way China wont miss their 7 toed children bathing in toxic waste.
Disagreeing with you does not make me a troll.
Maybe it's time to trade your oshkosh b'gosh for grown-up pants? You're a big kid now.
As opposed to 93-pocket cargo pants, which make people really look mature.
Damn_registrars has no butt-hole. Damn_registrars has no use for a butt-hole.
Too much choice is actually bad. But hey. You're on a roll. Not going to stop you.
Non impediti ratione cogitationus.
It is not really that hard to find companies with manufacturing facilities where workers rights are protected
I wish that were as true as you may be trying to imply. Workers' rights are rapidly going the way of the dodo bird, especially in the USA. Meanwhile countries who actually respect their workers are facing economic instability due to our runaway unchecked capitalism and the fact that some arrogant bastards on wall street damn near broke the world. This leads to even higher unemployment in countries where workers rights were respected, as their (now former) employers go to places where 18 hour work days for near zero pay are considered acceptable practices.
Damn_registrars has no butt-hole. Damn_registrars has no use for a butt-hole.
I agree with you. Apple does everything out of self-interest. They could give a rats ass about the worker. I wouldn't exactly call Sony a good example though.
The problem is there aren't that many choices to begin with.
Doing something right in one place (like freedom, free software, GNU/Linux) and being unable to do it in another (move production to countries with decent working conditions) shouldn't count against a company.
The problem is when a company isn't doing what they reasonably could.
Sony, Microsoft, Adobe, Apple, and others are doing wrong. They always do wrong. They just don't have any *good* in them whatsoever. They don't have people at the top doing whats right. There are no incentives for them to do whats right. It's just not happening. The corporate charters aren't for whats right. They are for what brings in the most money.
The companies which are doing whats right to the degree that they can are privately funded or non-profit (ThinkPenguin or Mozilla for instance).
But even the organizations whom you might think are doing what is right aren't. Raspberry Pi for instance. They are using chipsets dependent on non-free software. Maybe this could be excused if they were working on freeing it. As far as I know they aren't though. It's sad.
Unfortunately all the people that used to do that to fur wearers are the biggest Apple users now.
Chinese robot (if the article is correct): $175/month.
Excuse moi.
Does the robot have to be "Chinese"?
Is the robot allowed to migrate to US of A and perhaps, get a "Green Card"?
Muchas Gracias, Señor Edward Snowden !
Pretty sure it's the same with the other companies, but you can research it yourself.
No, just for the big ones. The small ones have to pay a lot more.
"First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
It's ironic that the one country in the world most in need of a Marxist revolution is "communist" China.
And this, ladies and gents, is why I won't touch AAPL stock with a 3.048 meter pole. Fads can turn on a dime. It's absolutely unpredictable. They thrive on "cool", and if that picks up and goes, begging for it to come back just makes you look even less cool.
For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
Don't forget payroll taxes, fuck this doublespeak. The implication is that they don't pay any taxes, this needs to be actively combated.
FFS. Payroll taxes and State taxes do not go towards paying down the Federal Deficit.
GE does not do its part in paying the tax that would prevent the bankruptcy of America.
Your pedantry does nothing to advance a solution.
[Fuck Beta]
o0t!
I don't know why the Chinese government even bothers with blocking anymore...
"Hey, did you hear about the Foxconn strikes? Do you think they're real?"
"Dunno, lemme check" *looks up Foxconn stirkes*
*search blocked*
"Yep, they're real"
The government's economic development plans for the region is to move up market into more advanced, higher valued, manufacturing and services. Part of the plan is to is to encourage more workers rights, higher wages, increased health-care, welfare, improved education, move the workforce up market, and help force low paid manufacturing out. Lower value manufacturing is now being encouraged to move the interior regions to lift the economy and incomes there. It's all well documented and written about. It should come as no surprise that there will be some labour issues in the southern coastal regions during the transition.
They're directing and regulating competitive market forces to achieve national growth. Milton Friedman probably wouldn't approve - but it's worked so far.
Hipsters by definition used iPhones before it was cool. Now that everyone have one they probably have focused on not yet popular Windows Phone 8 handsets,
They don't pay any payroll taxes on assembly-line robots, since robots are neither on the payroll nor indeed human.
Unless you belong to a small handful of countries, Taiwan is a part of China. Officially.
If you had said the Federal Debt, then you'd be correct, but only because the Federal Deficit is the yearly amount we fail to collect in taxes for expenses incurred. What do you think the Federal Gov. does with your payroll taxes?
The eWaste is mostly from manufacturing components. Moving assembly to the U.S. won't contribute much to eWaste.
until morale improves.
I did not want any smartphones because of their size, however, took galaxy s3. Although it is kind of big, it also very very thin, and very very light so even when I carry it in front pant's pocket, I barely feel it.
Holding it could be a bit awkward, but big screen allows for big ass buttons, which makes interaction easier.
Battery life time sucks.
... China's version of the "47 percent", no doubt.
.. It says: "Made in China", now you.
--- I am known for the ones who want to find me on the net. Is that a privacy risk or a privilege? One might wonder..
Foxconn Denies Report of Unrest at iPhone Factory
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/07/business/foxconn-denies-report-of-unrest-at-iphone-factory.html?partner=yahoofinance&_r=0
The components, factories and infrastructure are still all in China. Even if you had the robots, it'd be cheaper to have them in China. It wouldn't eliminate shipping costs either, you'd still have to ship them from the US to the customers.
China should take a cue from Harper's Conservative Canadian government and simply create a new law making it illegal for them to strike, then use the OMG for the sake of the greater good of our fragile economy to justify it.