Australians Urged To Spoof IP Addresses For Better Prices

angry tapir writes "Choice, a prominent Australian consumer advocacy group, has urged Australians to obfuscate their IP address to avoid geo-blocking and use US forwarding addresses to beat high IT prices. Australia is currently in the middle of parliamentary inquiry into the country's disproportionately high prices for technology. Choice also suggested setting up US iTunes accounts and using surrogate US addresses for forwarding packages from American stores. Choice has noted previously that Australians pay 52 per cent more for digital music downloads on iTunes compared to US users."

Comments

Tor and using a specific exit node (and SSL!)

[Anonymous Coward]

This is how I ended up buying Battlefield 3 premium on Origin for a fraction of the cost (1500 INR (=22 EUR) instead of 50 EUR) by pretending to be from India.

Re:Tor and using a specific exit node (and SSL!)

[Anonymous Coward]

And this is the real reason for DRM, not piracy.

Re:Tor and using a specific exit node (and SSL!)

[2fuf]

Yes, it's the reason for DRM and at the same time the reason for piracy ;-)

Re:Tor and using a specific exit node (and SSL!)

[Solandri]

Not exactly. I do agree that region-coding DRM sucks and should probably be banned. But that's not what's going on here.

The Australian dollar has gone up about 40% against the US dollar in the last 5 years. If you compare game prices in AUD vs USD and subtract ~40%, you'll find the prices are nearly identical.

International contracts involving two currencies are usually written to cover one year at a fixed exchange rate. Consequently there's a large lag between when a currency goes up, and when prices go down (time constant is on the order of a year). Especially if the seller is a large manufacturer (like Apple), while the buyer represents a small market (Australia). They may not have enough negotiating leverage to get next year's contract changed to better reflect the high rate of currency appreciation. (To be fair, the manufacturer may also be worried that a currency rapidly rising in a few years is a sign that it'll also rapidly fall in coming years. And they don't want to get stuck holding the bag if that happens.)

Then you have the same thing going on at the retail level, where the retailer (who got ripped off by the manufacturer) now realizes the shoe's on the other foot, and they now have the upper hand in negotiating prices with the individual buyer. So you end up seeing retail prices which reflect the exchange rate 5 years ago, with half the excess going into the pockets of retailers, the other half going into the pockets of the overseas manufacturer.

The suggestion to buy from overseas is a good one. Typically the currency exchange fees and overseas shipping fees will more than offset any advantage you gain from lower pricing from buying overseas. But when the disparity is this pronounced, its sufficient to exert downward pressure on prices. The last thing you want to be doing in this sort of situation is grudgingly pay the higher prices.

Re:Tor and using a specific exit node (and SSL!)

[LordLimecat]

Everyone keeps throwing the word "bribe" around in these kind of contexts. It would be nice, at least once in the history of slashdot, if someone could provide evidence of such a claim (especially since such evidence could go a long way to fixing the problem).

Re:Tor and using a specific exit node (and SSL!)

[green1]

ok, we'll call it "campaign contributions" instead. better? same deal though, money going to a specific politician with a specific expectation of that politician later.

Re:Tor and using a specific exit node (and SSL!)

[green1]

So how do you explain a country where the dollar has been at par with the US dollar (or within a few cents) for almost 10 years now, and yet all prices are close to 50% higher (not Australia, Canada) e.books cost more, mp3s cost more, physical products cost more.
There's only one justification, and it is greed.

Did you hear that?

[Anonymous Coward]

That's the sound of the USTR laughing his way to the bank.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Price_discrimination

It's just another hilarious way intellectual property law is used to make money through abusing international borders.

Good riddance to geo-blocking

[madsdyd]

I live in Denmark, and recently spent 30 minutes to try and buy an english e-book online.

Found it at 3 different retailers (US, UK, Australia), that refused to sell it to me (add it to the basket), because of my location.

Then found it at 2 additional retailers, that allowed me to add it to a basket, then accepted my credit-card information, before refusing to actually sell it to me.

Then I got sort of mad and decided to break a 15 year old principle on not pirating stuff. Went to google, and had the ebook literally 30 seconds later! 10 seconds later on my device, and I could start reading.

What on earth are they thinking!

Oh, and I then later wrote the agent for the writer in question here in Denmark, and in the UK to offer payment. I have not heard a word from the UK agent, and the Danish one just confirmed that they do not sell the english language version of that writer in Denmark as an ebook.

Fools, really. And, they are probably, as I write this, banging on the door to the parliament, requiering stricter copyright laws.

Fools.

Re:Good riddance to geo-blocking

[Chatsubo]

Stuff like this is especially maddening when they require you to ship digital products.

I had an experience recently where I got a gift voucher for Amazon. I went there knowing a game I wanted would be about the value of the voucher. To my delight I found a digital-only version for the right price.

"Sweet, I'll be playing this puppy in an hour or so!". No beans. Digital copy not available in my country.

WHAT?! Why?! I can go down the road and buy this title legitimately in my country for the same price!

Then I was going: OK, I'll buy the frikkin physical thing then. Only to find shipping the damn disc to my country was going to cost the entire price of the game. So to use my voucher I was going to have to pay the entire price of the voucher for shipping. Something I could, once again, just go do at my corner store.

Finally I contacted a US-based friend and just shipped the disc to him for no shipping charge, and had him email me the serial. Then I found a digital copy of the data myself.

Hint: Never give foreigners vouchers for online retailers. It's a burden to the recipient.

Re:Good riddance to geo-blocking

[Chrisq]

I live in Denmark, and recently spent 30 minutes to try and buy an english e-book online.

Found it at 3 different retailers (US, UK, Australia), that refused to sell it to me (add it to the basket), because of my location.

IANAL but the UK site is probably breaking the law due to the free movement of goods and services within the EU.

Re:Good riddance to geo-blocking

[Lumpy]

Welcome to what happens when copyright get's out of control. Thank the United States Congress for that.

Re:Good riddance to geo-blocking

[Lumpy]

BluRay drive for the computer. anyDVD and handbrake. It strips out the region locking and the useless DRM to allow you to create a file that can play on a media center or right there on your laptop/desktop

Rip out their DRM.

Re:Good riddance to geo-blocking

[jonfr]

I have also seen this. But I live in Denmark. Amazon refuses to sell e-books to Denmark from UK. Therefor breaking EU law in this regards (single market). Why this is the case I do not know. But I am sure this is illegal to start with. Regardless who is selling the digital material. This does not only apply to e-books. As Amazon for instances refuses to sell mp3 files to Denmark as well.

I am also a publisher of e-books. I do not understand this type of stupid. As I for instance I want to sell my e-books everywhere. The sad thing is that I might not have a lot to say about it in the end.

Re:Good riddance to geo-blocking

[Chrisq]

Likely they will claim that their hands are tied by the publisher.

Interestingly most publishers say they are keen on a single market for books across the EU:

The publishers also insisted that they are signing licences with authors allowing them to distribute the books in a said language on a pan-European basis. There is no obstacle in the contract between publishers and retailers which prevent these retailers to sell a German ebook to Greece or a Spanish ebook to the United Kingdom for example.

BTW the linked article makes it look as though I was wrong in thinking that the free movement of goods and services would make it illegal currently, but moves are afoot to make it so.

Re:Good riddance to geo-blocking

[AmiMoJo]

This issue is currently being tested in the European courts. Ebooks, digital music, satellite TV broadcasts and the like are typically supplied by the content provided with an exclusive license for a certain part of the world. The retailer is not allowed to sell outside that area by the license agreement. So far the courts have ruled this to be illegal under current rules.

For example there is a woman in the UK buying English league football matches from a satellite TV provider in Europe for a fraction of the price it would cost from Sky in the UK. So far the courts have agreed that she is within her right to do that, even though Sky are supposed to have an exclusive license to show the games in the UK.

Re:Good riddance to geo-blocking

[luvirini]

Indeed they are, but US is pushing it hard globally, most others involved are just nodding heads.

Legacy of Regional Pricing

[StoneyMahoney]

Regional differences in pricing stem from pre-globalisation economics. With no overlap between regional markets, prices would be set on a per-market basis and never the twain did meet. In a post-globalisation Internet-levelled playing field, regional price differences make no little sense for purely-digital products, except where national sales-related taxes differ. The only reason to maintain these regional price variations to artificially inflate profit margins at the expense of the consumer.

In theory, the libertarian free-marker doctrine should cause this price difference to level out fairly quickly once the market starts to take advantage of (and offense to) these cross-border variations. Let's see if that theory works in practice...

Anyone want to bet on legislation increasing to prevent cross-region sales instead?

It's not just games

[mjwx]

It's not just games that we buy from overseas for cheap. Phones, cameras, computers, car and bike parts. All because local distributors used to have us by the balls with pricing. Games were A$90, Movies and CD's A$30 a piece and considering the AUD has been above 1 USD for the last few years, pricing like this is just taking the piss.

Well no more, I can order just about anything and get it shipped here for less. I order games from the UK for half the price of local games, DVD box sets that retail for A$75 I purchase for 11 pounds (AUD$17), My Canon Ixus 230 came from Hong Kong for A$100 less than here, I bought myself a laptop from the US, US$899 (A$840, a very favourable exch rate at the time) and got it shipped over tax free (personal imports under A$1000 are not subject to GST, note this is now A$900), Asus didn't even sell this model here but the previous model was A$1400. Even retailers are getting in on this very sweet action, JB HiFi and even Harvey Norman are selling "direct import" cameras and games and giving the middle finger to distributors.

You think in this environment the distributors would have learned and instituted fair pricing... Well they haven't and as much as the bang on about it, no one in parliament will lift a finger to protect them. Suffer in your jocks you smarmy, self centred bastards. Now we just need to allow more used cars to be imported, an Australian Nissan 350z costs A$30-40K, an imported Japanese Nissan 350GT costs A$20-30K imported and they are practically the same car (the 350z was down-tuned compared to the 350GT) but you are only allowed to import cars on the SEVS list (Specialist and Enthusiast Vehicles) which were never available for sale in Oz so I couldn't buy a cheap JDM Honda Integra Type R.

This is how I ended up buying Battlefield 3 premium

My sympathies sir, I too bought Battlefield 3 before realising how crap of a game it was.

Re:It's not just games

[Canazza]

Make it a Green issue. All that importing half-way across the world must burn alot of Jet Fuel. I'm sure they'll sit up and listen when they figure out that over-inflated prices are destroying the Great Barrier Reef.

Re:It's not just games

[arisvega]

To me the actual topic here is: "Australia is currently in the middle of parliamentary inquiry into the country's disproportionately high prices for technology." (emphasis mine)

But why is that? Was this situation 'naturally selected' because of a compination of Oceania's geographical placement and some opportunistic merchants, because of something more sinister, or what? Any insights?

Re:It's not just games

[ozmanjusri]

How much jet fuel does it take to ship a Technet subscription?

Microsoft charges $599 in the US compared to $1048 in AU.

http://i.imgur.com/qQNn4.png

Re:It's not just games

[Elbart]

The US-navy deploys those with F18s. Those aircraft-carriers are expensive.

Re:It's not just games

[grcumb]

You think in this environment the distributors would have learned and instituted fair pricing... Well they haven't and as much as the bang on about it, no one in parliament will lift a finger to protect them.

It's especially galling to see that prices for identical hardware are lower in New Zealand, which has only a small fraction of Australia's population and which is actually farther from the most common markets.

I live in a country (very) roughly equidistant from the two, and travel fairly regularly to both. Last year, I was shopping for an Android phone and discovered that the number on the sticker was the same in both countries. Given that NZD 1 is worth about AUD 0.79, that's a bit of a difference. Just to add insult to injury, the prices were from the very same tech store chain!

There is no logical reason that I can find to justify hardware prices in Australia.

Re:It's not just games

[fatphil]

If only someone would take all the massless parts of the product - the 0 and 1 bits, and transport them at next-to-no cost to Australia. Imagine the fossil fuels saved by doing that - these guys would be regarded as heroes. Shame about all the prison time they'd be forced to serve at the hands of the MAFIAA.

Re:It's not just games

[Chatsubo]

Now we just need to allow more used cars to be imported....

Oh my, South Africans _love_ to complain about how cars manufactured in SA (esp. Toyota) can possibly sell for less in Aus. than in SA. If you think you get a bad deal on cars, imagine how we feel. We have huge taxes on imported cars (a US$30k car gets ~70% import duty) to prevent outside competition with domestic manufacturers, so they charge what they want... because imported (by distributors) brands are even more expensive.

The companies lining their pockets are gonna keep it that way.

Canada has the same issu:e

[Anonymous Coward]

Books in Canada are marked with two prices; one for a sale in Canada and one for a sale in the US. Despite the fact that the Canadian dollar is worth about the same (sometimes more sometimes less depending on the day) as a US dollar, the cost difference is usually significant. There's no real reason for it. The difference is a hangover from when the difference between the two currencies was large. Retailers see this as a profit boost.

Many other products are generally more expensive in Canada vs the US - cars in particular. Border towns in Canada see a huge flux of people cross-border shopping as a result.

Now and then someone complains, the retailers whine about OH NOES, IT'S DIFFERENT IN CANADA - LESS PEOPLE - SHOULD COST MORE. Yeah - always fun comparing the huge price discrepancies between Amazon.ca and Amazon.com for the same product.

AC

Productivity Commission Report

[Spikeles]

There was a report last year from the Productivity Commission which is "the Australian Government's principal review and advisory body on microeconomic policy and regulation. It is an independent statutory authority in the Treasury Portfolio and responds to references from the Treasurer. "

This specific report is for the Retail industry, but there is a very good chapter on online and price differences, which includes some parts talking about things like Apple's Price Discrimination. For those interested, the report can be found here Economic Structure and Performance of the Australian Retail Industry. The price differences part is Chapter 6.

I'll quote some relevant parts:

Box 6.4 - Apple’s international price discrimination
Costs associated with the distribution of Australian specific content and marketing could mean that higher fixed costs apply to the Australian subsidiary. But given the costs associated with the distribution of music and other media are only likely to be a relatively small share of total costs, this does not fully explain or justify the price differential.

The Commission considers that Australian consumers will buy goods where they feel they get the best deal regardless of retail format and that retailers that do not, or are unable to, respond effectively to competitive pressures will face serious challenges.

Brazil have the same problem

[TheDarkMaster]

Here we have the same problem, but in our case it affects anything and everything that comes from overseas. I have to pay three times what you Americans pay for an SSD, ridiculous is not it?

Incidentally, interesting question ... Why businesses can freely look around the globe a place to produce things, while we consumers are forced to buy our things in a very restricted manner (You can even import, but only if you pay double or even triple) and for much more than we should? Capitalism and free market for large companies, Dictatorship for consumers?

and they wonder why we "steal" shit,...

[AbRASiON]

Steam does this - although generally not Valve who are good about this but more big big publishers who are sharing the service with Valve. Luckily with US contacts, I can be 'gifted' games at US prices.

It's disgusting and it's bullshit, if you're willing to sell a game, or a song or a book or fuck even a physical product to an American for X price and I produce the same amount of money for you and I take care of the shipping (or downloading the fucking bits) then frankly, fuck you for trying to charge me more.

This is much worse for console using folk on PSN and the 360, sure I have a US PSN account but I don't WANT to have to buy PSN 'money' in US format from gift cards just to get games at reasonable prices and then be left with 3$ or 13$ or whatever in 'change' on my account.
Honestly this bullshit just stops me participating entirely.

About the only reasonable thing of late is PC parts in Australia, due to the proximity to Asia and the AU$ being strong so long (and of course PC parts, high turnover) for the most part, CPU's, RAM, HDD's and so on are very very close to the US. Mind you if you are picky and want something high end or obscure like high end SAS controllers and stuff like that, sorry buddy, 4x the price.

So as I started with,... they wonder why we steal shit.... sigh

Very important

[David Gerard]

Choice is really highly respected in Australia. This makes this an extremely mainstream issue, not just of geek interest.

Re:Willful Misrepresentation is a Crime

[bloodhawk]

But we are not misrepresenting at all, I am legitimately utilising a VPN Service. I am not saying I am something I am not. It isn't our fault companies are morons and rely on a VPN address to try and work out what country I am from. IP Addressing was never intended for this use.

Here is where you are wrong

[Guru80]

This isn't an intellectual property issue, this is about giving the music business back to the musicians and destroying the music industry for good.

The musicians don't want to be in control of getting their songs sold or booking performances. They want the "industry". The only one's that don't are because they are already part of the "industry" themselves so they protect it. Face it, music is full of people who would be homeless and broke despite their talent if someone else wasn't there to force feed them marketing, sales, multi-million dollar contracts.

There is a relative handful that would thrive in the absence of said industry but most would be lost so for that alone we are stuck in the stone age when it comes to the music industry. Don't fool yourself, the vast majority of artists are willing to ride the Titanic to the bottom.

Re:Here is where you are wrong

[mcgrew]

The musicians don't want to be in control of getting their songs sold or booking performances. They want the "industry".

Where do you get these "data"? How many musicians do you know personally? I know quite a few, and none of them would touch an RIAA contract with a ten foot pole, despite labels courting them.

Face it, music is full of people who would be homeless and broke despite their talent

It's also full of people who are multimillionaires despite their lack of talent. If you're good, you'll get gigs.

The only one's that don't

You should have paid more attention in class, son.

It's The Spin

[Kozar_The_Malignant]

Of course technology costs more down in Oz. it has to be manufactured to handle the fact that electrons spin widdershins down there.