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Navy Seals Disciplined For Revealing Secrets As Consultants On Video Game
Hugh Pickens writes "CBS reports that seven active duty members of SEAL Team Six, best known for killing Osama bin Laden, have been disciplined for revealing secrets working as paid consultants on a video game, Medal of Honor: Warfighter. The game does not recreate the bin Laden raid, but it does portray realistic missions, such as an attack on a pirates' den in Somalia. Electronic Arts boasts that real commandos, both active duty and retired, help make its games as realistic as possible. EA says Medal of Honor Warfighter was 'written by actual U.S. Tier 1 Operators while deployed overseas,' and that it 'features a dotted line to real world events and provides players a view into globally recognized threats and situations letting them experience the action as it might have unfolded.' It is unclear what secrets members of SEAL Team Six gave away, but while serving as consultants for the game, they used classified material which had been given to them by the Navy and also violated the unwritten code that SEALs are silent warriors who shun the spotlight. 'We do not tolerate deviations from the policies that govern who we are and what we do as Sailors in the United States Navy,' says Deputy Commander of Naval Special Warfare, Rear Admiral Garry Bonelli. 'The non-judicial punishment decisions made today send a clear message throughout our Force that we are and will be held to a high standard of accountability.'"
How on earth can the military staff haemorage their IP for the sake of an ef'fing book deal. There is too much public information on public deals that put military operations and lives at risk. The whole point of military superiority is based on an advantage of forces as a result of numbers, skill, training, tactics, operations, etc. I know that, as a geek, I love reading aircraft, lazer, and weapons development trials and developments but c'mon. All the US people are doing is destroying its own capability.
Now I understand how freedom of information protects against poor weapons systems, faulty weapons systems, bad quality, abuse of authority, etc. I don't have all the answers but what I do know is stupid - leaking you current tactics manuals and giving away all of your secrets. Might as well open-source the military.
FFS
Put 'em in jail. If they can't break out, they weren't really good Seals anyways.
rewriting history since 2109
Obviously just a PR stunt for promoting the game. Also serves USA PR interests carrying on myth of that whole bin laden complex raid and mysterious sea burial malarkey!
the sheeple are so dumb they believe anything with no evidence if it is official enough.
you could say something about apple and somebody here will say "citation needed" and wont believe you without some kind of proof. the greatest villian we've been presented with so far in the 21st century dies and there is no evidence and everybody believes it. i tell you it is a crazy world.
And the EA PR team just shared a collective orgasm. They must already be trying different font settings to display "So real, Navy Seals were disciplined for it!" on the game cover.
They just created seven new security contractors the government will hire back for 10 times the cost. All that and a video game, win win.
A quote:
Read more about it here.
...and I only know what he is because we've been friends since grade school.
He normally is very clear - he simply can't talk about what he does, where he was or will be, etc. No big, right?
The last year or so, I've heard him make more SEAL-related comments than I've heard him say in the previous 10. He is particularly bitter and annoyed at the 'prima-donna douchebags' that are writing books and showing up in movies.
He gets it, he does: there are great piles of money and fame and hero-worship to be gained. But he points out: nobody does his job because they want to get rich or famous.
Basically, he's disgusted at the SEALs who have taken the 'public visibility' course, and can't really understand why they aren't immediately let go and firewalled. He said he's recognized things that they've discussed, or shown in movies, that are operational methods that while the bad guys may suspect we can do it if they think about it, it's stupid to wave it in front of them. It's going to get operations blown and SEALs killed.
-Styopa
There is a serious problem of believing in our own hype. It's one thing when the enemy believes that you CAN do something (which you can't, but want them to believe you can), it's a much more dangerous situation where YOU believe you can do something (but cannot reliably do it).
The deification of special forces in popular culture is very dangerous. These people are human beings, physically fit and specially trained to be sure, but regular human beings with an immense logistical system to support them.
I worry tremendously because the general population (and government leaders) will permit actions which while technically possible, are tremendously risky from the perspective of national interests. We blind ourselves with our successes and can easily slip into a might makes right belief system. I feel that we hear far too often the phrase 'teach em a lesson'.
Believing that we can or should 'teach lessons' through the use of our special forces is incredibly dangerous and actions like the raid to kill Osama should only be undertaken sparingly because not only is the risk high, but without maintaining the moral highground it will become an incredibly dangerous world when OTHER actors being to reach out and 'teach' their own 'lessons' on a similar scale.
Out of modpoints but really liked a post? 1BDkF6TtmmeZ3yqXbz9yhdYVqRYnwFoXDj
"we will attack tomorrow at 2am" makes sense to keep that secret. "we had to fight three groups of guards before we got to bin ladin" makes no sense at all.
My orders came through. My squadron ships out tomorrow. We're bombing the storage depots at Daiquiri at 1800 hours. We're coming in from the north, below their radar.
When will you be back?
I can't tell you that. It's classified.
“He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
"These people are human beings, physically fit and specially trained to be sure, but regular human beings with an immense logistical system to support them."
To be fair it's the level of physical fitness and training that matters and makes a large difference as much as anything.
When I was younger I was in the army cadets in the UK, and on an annual camp once we were sent through a fairly small forested area to try and find 5 professional soldiers hidden in there camo'd up. We did find one, hidden up a tree, but still hard to see, he was in the TA and fairly new to it at that though.
When we'd given up we walked to the edge of the forest and they were told to come out of hiding. One guy comes out with his face covered in mud with some pretty clear signs of a boot print on it. It was my boot print, as he'd been led down in a narrow gully deep with leaf litter which I'd walked straight through. The guy was a gurkha, who aren't even really classed as special forces, but it was this experience above all else that made me realise the gap between what we think is realistically possible, and what is actually possible can sometimes be quite large such that we don't even entertain it. When he showed us exactly where he'd been hidden he literally had his face covered in mud with only his eyes showing through and leaf litter on top, the amazing part was how quickly and quietly he was able to disguise himself the way he did- you could be chasing him, lose him from sight for 20 seconds and he'd have all but vanished. I'm glad I was just an army cadet and this wasn't a real war, as otherwise I suspect he may well have chopped my balls off with his kukri, and I'm kind of fond of my balls being left where they are. Between the softness of the deep leaf litter and the thick sole on my boots, I simply hadn't realised I'd walked right over someone's face.
So if this guy, not even selected for the SAS was this talented, I've always wondered what sort of things the special forces themselves get upto, and get away with. Everyone watches war films, and plays Call of Duty or whatever and thinks "Yeah, I could be that badass if I joined the military", but to most of those people you couldn't, you really couldn't. It takes a steely determination and years of practice, exercise to achieve the things they do and these people, the best of the best are the people who if they hadn't gone down the military route and joined the special forces would likely have been Olympic athletes, or other stand out professionals. It's not the sort of thing your average person has the patience and determination for.
The fact that this meme gets consistently modded to oblivion when there's more than enough evidence to suggest that it's at least a fucking possibility does nothing but increase the probability of it in fact actually being the case, at least in the minds of those not necessarily hooked on the Fox News/CNN tit...
Never say never, I suppose - but the idea does seem a little crazy. He's been dead for quite some time and there's been no problem justifying the foreign wars without him. There was also no problem doing it before any of us ever heard of him. Seems like a long and risky road for the government to take to get a justification that they didn't even need.
...from the active duty SEALs used in Act of Valor? Oh wait, I know the answer: Because Act of Valor was a nice little right-wing propaganda film that showed the Navy in their best light. And EA is just a gaming company. Or something like that.
Considering that many Special Forces unit soldiers have advanced college degrees, or the education equivalent to one, id question your 'source' if information. The average enlisted solider might not always be that smart, but the government doesn't hand someone above an E-5 access to millions of dollars worth of equipment if they are as dumb as a tool bag.
The paranoia is there, because you can't know what will let the enemy connect the dots until it's too late. You can't know what information they need, so you try to hide it all.
Doesn't make much sense for us regular folks, but we aren't likely to be shot or tortured if someone gets some information from us.
For large sets, this will be our guide even unto death, for the LORD will work for each type of data it is applied to...
What they want to keep secret are the ways in which they do things.
Surprise, they like it. Confusion, they encourage it. These are things that help keep them alive.
In football you of course do not want the opposing team to know what play you are panning on doing next.
But it is also damaging to have the opposing team have your play book.
The seals were giving out pages of the Seal playbook for a fucking video game. I play games. I like em.
Really though. Giving out pages of the Seal playbook so that a fucking video game can be a little better should be punished. Heavily.
Why is it so hard to only have politicians for a few years, then have them go away?
I can echo some of what this former soldier says, but disagree with some.
I served in the Navy from '77-'83. I got out as a petty officer first class so I wasn't exactly at the top of the heap.
From a financial standpoint, this was just about the worst possible time to be in the U.S. military for about a hundred years. We had just moved back to an all volunteer force after years of a very unpopular draft. Vietnam had created a public perception that only baby killers and drunks wanted to enlist in the first place so the overall quality of people enlisting was all over the map. People really did join up because they had to (sometimes because the judge ordered them to), or because they felt an obligation as a citizen to do so. Not much in between. (BTW, some of the best sailors and Marines knew started out with some judge telling them, "Four years in uniform or prison. Your choice.")
Standards were pretty low because all of the branches were desperate to fill slots. High school diploma? Boy, you were an ace recruit!
It was common practice for recruiters to pull all kinds of tricks to fill quotas; lying on enlistment forms, taking qualifying tests for recruits, etc. I can't say that I blame them, though. If they didn't, they were subject to all kinds of judicial abuse. (Court martials for not filling quotas? Really??)
While I was in boot camp, I worked in the chow hall's storage locker. I personally saw huge stacks of canned beef with expiration dates from the late '50s. The cooler broke down and we were still told to put the spoiled milk on the line. When I finished with Service Week, just about the only things I would take off the line was bread and water. At least I knew that was fresh.
I knew married chiefs and senior chiefs with 20+ years in who qualified for food stamps. Year long deployments with 2 week turnarounds, while rare, weren't unheard of.
One year, 3 ships were declared unfit for sea the day they were scheduled to deploy due to lack of funds for proper maintenance.
The Iran hostage crisis exposed fundamental flaws in our communications network, logistical support, and inter-service doctrine. Thankfully, that was all largely addressed before the Gulf War.
In spite of all that, it wasn't all bad. My electronics training was pretty good considering the lack of resources. I had an opportunity to work with a really broad range of communications gear with people who really knew their stuff. I was way ahead of my civilian colleagues when I got out and hit the market.
Once I got out to the fleet I found out that Navy chow was actually pretty good most of the time, especially at shore stations. From an enlisted man's point of view, it's one major advantage that the Navy has traditionally had over the Army, after all. ;-)
I worked a swing shift schedule at one base for several years. We covered electronic maintenance on communications gear all over Oahu. Our command was responsible for supporting not just Navy, but Marine, Army, and Air Force equipment too. It gave us the chance to sample chow at a lot of different bases during our midnight runs.
I'd have to say that the best midnight breakfasts to be had were at Hickam Air Force Base. The cook behind the grill served up a mean Western omelet.
Wheeler Army Airfield had a pretty good chow hall, too. I was partial to their steak sandwiches.
The chow hall at the submarine base at Pearl Harber was run by a Filipino master chief who injected a lot of his native dishes into the menu. It's where I was introduced to lumpia. My mouth is watering just thinking about it now, 30+ years later. :-)
Given the same circumstances and what I know now, would I still enlist? Absolutely. My Navy electronics training got me started in IT with both the skills and the experience to put me head and shoulders above the competition. As a junior sailor I had more responsibility in my early 20s that most civilians don't get until they're
My favorite part of the conspiracy theory is where the government is competent enough to cover this up indefinitely, but not competent enough to come up with a better plan.