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Dirigible Airship Prototype Approaches Completion

cylonlover writes "The dirigible airship, the oddball aircraft of another era, is making a comeback. California-based Aeros Corporation has created a prototype of its new breed of variable buoyancy aircraft and expects the vehicle to be finished before the end of 2012. With its new cargo handling technology, minimum fuel consumption, vertical take-off and landing features and point to point delivery, the Aeroscraft platform promises to revolutionize airship technology. The Aeroscraft ship uses a suite of new mechanical and aerospace technologies. It operates off a buoyancy management system which controls and adjusts the buoyancy of the vehicle, making it light or heavy for any stages of ground and flight operation. Automatic flight control systems give it equilibrium in all flight modes and allow it to adjust helium pressurized envelopes depending on the buoyancy requirements. It just needs one pilot and has an internal ballast control system, which allows it to offload cargo, without using ballast. Built with a rigid structure, the Aeroscraft can control lift at all stages with its Vertical Takeoff and Landing (VTOL) capabilities and carry maximum payload while in hover. What makes it different from other cargo vehicles is that it does not need a runway or ground infrastructure."

46 of 231 comments (clear)

  1. Re:First post! by AlphaWolf_HK · · Score: 3, Funny

    And it's going downmodded...Oh the humanity!

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  2. Every decade event by esldude · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Seems this comes up every decade or so. There are some advantages in niches. But in the end, the large volume craft, at relatively slow speeds, and relatively less useful when winds are up seem to doom it from becoming a highly useful aircraft.

    1. Re:Every decade event by AlphaWolf_HK · · Score: 5, Interesting

      You have to wonder though if it will ever become more practical than traditional cargo ships. I imagine it would take less energy to stay airborne (given that it relies upon buoyancy rather than thrust) therefore making it more energy efficient than a jumbo jet, and might need less energy to stay in motion than a watercraft given the lower resistance of the air vs water.

      Sure, you might need more of them, but pound for pound can it cost less to transport the goods than a cargo ship? I imagine if they added solar power, that would wipe out much of the operating cost. (Plus I've heard something like current cargo ships have a much larger carbon footprint than most of the world's cars combined.)

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    2. Re:Every decade event by antifoidulus · · Score: 2

      Well for starters it can drastically simplify logistical supply chains.... Right now if you want to ship something you either have to do air(insanely expensive) or some combination of ship, rail, and road(usually on both ends, i.e. factory -> rail -> road ->sea -> rail->road->destination) The airship is able to take advantage of existing air fields, so theoretically you could just go factory -> airship -> destination(obviously with a tiny bit of road to get it from the airport to the destination, same as shipping by plane). Obviously with JIT manufacturing being all the rage, the ability to stick to schedules will be imperative, but it isn't like road/train/ship delays are exactly unheard of either.

    3. Re:Every decade event by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Short answer: no, airships will always be less efficient than water ships.

      The volume of air that must be displaced vs. volume of water is so much greater than any airship yard you find would be the size of Arkansas. Those steampunk airships you see? They would have to have buoyancy chambers orders of magnitude larger than depicted to float.

      As a matter of fact, the vast majority of the fluid resistance encountered by container ships is the containers themselves on top, since the hull can be made very low-resistance, but boxes cannot. Their fuel efficiency issues stem exclusively for extremely weak regulations on emissions.

      So no, airships will always be tourist attractions. No one wants to pay more money to transport things less quickly.

    4. Re:Every decade event by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Amtrak is a different business than freight rail, which....is doing quite fine.

      They just had their biggest June ever.

      http://transportationnation.org/2012/07/06/u-s-freight-rail-has-biggest-june-ever/

      Keep lying though, nobody will care what frauds you spew as long as you bash unions.

    5. Re:Every decade event by afidel · · Score: 5, Interesting

      25% of all ton-miles, and 42% of all inter-city freight are carried via rail in the US. The percentage of all freight carried by rail has been increasing with the cost of oil because of the significantly higher efficiency. In fact today the US carries about the same percentage of cargo via rail that the EU does.

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    6. Re:Every decade event by afidel · · Score: 5, Informative

      My dads company ships tankers and half-tankers of industrial chemicals all the time, they also ship lots of those same chemicals via truck, but if it's going inter-city and the recipient is buying at least a half-tanker it's always cheaper to do it via rail. Also look at automobiles, 70% of autos are shipped via rail, those can obviously be shipped via truck, and they're not exactly low-margin or low-value items, so why do you think that is? Perhaps rail doesn't work for your industry, but there are obviously plenty of industries where it does work.

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    7. Re:Every decade event by A+nonymous+Coward · · Score: 4, Informative

      Prop plane max ceiling is due to losing lift for the wings and oxygen for the engines at high altitudes, same as jet planes. Jets being faster, and lift being proportional to the square of the speed, jets can go higher, but it's got nothing to do with resistance of props.

      Prop planes have a lot more trouble breaking the sound barrier. I know sometimes prop tips go supersonic, but they lose efficiency, and I don't think any prop plane has ever gone supersonic, even in a dive out of control.

    8. Re:Every decade event by A+nonymous+Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Think of them as more efficient higher capacity longer range helicopters.

    9. Re:Every decade event by Vintermann · · Score: 2

      Cargo ships are extremely efficient at what they do. They may have a large carbon footprint, but they have a very low carbon footprint per kg of goods transported compared to your car.

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    10. Re:Every decade event by drinkypoo · · Score: 2

      They may have a large carbon footprint, but they have a very low carbon footprint per kg of goods transported compared to your car.

      Whether that's true or not, the biggest problem with cargo ships is that they are extremely polluting. They run on a lower grade of diesel than do other things and have no emission controls.

      --
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    11. Re:Every decade event by StoneyMahoney · · Score: 2

      The raw CO2 figures look pretty big on paper, but are meaningless without comparing the CO2 emissions of the various modes of transport in terms of something like tonne/kilometer. Check out the second table here:

      https://people.exeter.ac.uk/TWDavies/energy_conversion/Calculation%20of%20CO2%20emissions%20from%20fuels.htm

      (NB: seems to be an error in the second table header. Given the actual data units, I think it should say "KG CO2 per KM")

      The results here are fairly varied in the final units they come out with, mainly because the different forms of transport considered are so different, but the eye-browing raising figure is that short haul passenger flights emit the same amount of carbon per person per kilometer as moving 18 tonnes of cargo by ship the same distance!

    12. Re:Every decade event by Wizzu · · Score: 2

      If you want to go in any other direction than where the wind is going, you need a keel to go with the sails. So sails is not really a solution here, because there's no way to have a working keel.

    13. Re:Every decade event by nospam007 · · Score: 2

      "Seems this comes up every decade or so."

      Indeed. Wake me up when one of them is attached to the top of the Empire State Building.

      At least then it will freak out Fringe watchers, who will believe they are in an alternate universe.

    14. Re:Every decade event by PPalmgren · · Score: 2

      afidel is correct, rail is the preferred method of inland delivery for international cargo arrive at container terminals. This includes containerized, truckable cargo. Because we have modular container trains now that are easy to set up and roll, plus the increasing prevalence of on-dock rail lines at shipping terminals, the expense has come down due to less labor and the ability to load it directly to rail from ship without trucking it to a rail depot.

    15. Re:Every decade event by efalk · · Score: 3, Informative

      OK, speaking of one who's actually taken dirigible flying lessons, I have a couple of points to make:

      Other posters are right: propellers are just little airfoils.

      The ceiling of a prop plane is a combination of three factors: thin air limiting the lift of the wings, thin air limiting the thrust of the prop, and lack of oxygen to the engine. Superchargers can help with the oxygen problem, and longer wings and/or higher airspeed will help with the lift problem, but there's not much you can do about the prop.

      Airships have altitude limitations too, even worse than airplanes. Every airship contains air bladders called "ballonets" which displace some of the lifting gas. As the airship gains altitude, the ballonets are deflated to make room for the expanding lift gas. Once the ballonets are completely empty, the airship is at its maximum altitude, beyond which it can't rise without venting and losing lift gas.

      Airships are *not* "extremely efficient at sending hundreds of tourists plunging to a spectacular death". The Hindenburg caught fire a hundred feet in the air, and most people on board still walked away. You can't say that about most aircraft. We think of airships as dangerous because the Hindenburg disaster happened in the relatively early days of aviation, and the disaster was broadcast live, searing it into the collective consciousness.

      The Hindenburg itself was a very safe design. The disaster happened because they screwed up and used highly flammable paint on the skin. If they hadn't done that, things would be very different today.

      All that said, there are a number of factors that will keep airships from ever coming back.

      First, the cost of Helium is going through the roof. This is essentially what killed Airship Ventures. You could make a reasonably safe airship using hydrogen, but nobody would be willing to fly it. This might work for cargo transport, but not for passengers.

      Second, they're slow. Third, they don't operate in high winds.

      Flying one was one of the most seriously awesome fun things I have ever done, but I have no illusions that they'll ever be a practical means of transportation again.

  3. Funny idea... He He He... by cervesaebraciator · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Given all the articles I've read about helium shortages et al., I'm not sure I'd invest in a company that claims He based dirigibles are about to make a comeback.

    1. Re:Funny idea... He He He... by meglon · · Score: 2

      Because we can't make hydrogen more safe. The explanation for why it was abandoned is pretty simple: Hindenburg. Admittedly there were a variety of other mishaps, and the Hindenburg wasn't even the worst, but it was the one that the news media had the best coverage of.

      --
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    2. Re:Funny idea... He He He... by Zorpheus · · Score: 5, Interesting

      The Hindenburg disaster was spectacular, but was it really that bad? Nearly 2/3 of the people on board survived.
      And I am wondering how much more safe this could be built. The Hindenburg consisted of hydrogen-filled cells which were located within the air-filled hull. Seems rather stupid to me to build it this way, since only the confined air allowed hydrogen and air to mix without ascending away from the airship. The other thing was that the hull was burning very well since it was soaked in linoleum oil. In a TV report it was actually claimed that the fire we see is only the burning hull, since a hydrogen flame is invisible.
      Where is the danger if hydrogen coming out of a leak would just ascend and get diluted quickly in the air? The pure hydrogen in the cells can not burn.

    3. Re:Funny idea... He He He... by wvmarle · · Score: 4, Interesting

      The Mythbusters did an episode on the Hindenburg. Indeed because what you see burn is the outer hull. Hydrogen burns, burns fast, and is gone fast. It doesn't explode unless mixed with air - the Hindenburg didn't explode, it just burned really fast.

      Well long story short: the Mythbusters found out that the hull of the Hindenburg (just like the other Zeppelins at the time) was coated in something that closely resembled thermite, making it highly flammable. The hull on its own burned well, but the combination with hydrogen is what made it go really fast.

      Now sure there is a lot to say about their methods, and the rather shallow research, but the conclusion is quite clear: it was not just the hydrogen, it was not just the coating, it was the combination of the two. Somehow the hydrogen acts as catalyst boosting the burning of the outer hull. Only when they burned a coated hull filled with hydrogen they got a burn that resembled the Hindenburg disaster.

      Hydrogen will always be a fire risk, but it can be lessened by making the hull non-flammable. Something that we can do, but the Germans at the time not, or at least not as easily. Whether we can make it safe enough for modern standards, that is another matter.

    4. Re:Funny idea... He He He... by TFAFalcon · · Score: 2

      Good idea. Now we just need to figure out how to be able to build it light enough to fly while being strong enough not to get crushed by the air pressure.

    5. Re:Funny idea... He He He... by Nethemas+the+Great · · Score: 2

      Hydrogen wasn't the Hindenburg's downfall. It was the diesel fuel. At low pressure hydrogen is relatively benign. Hydrogen however, is somewhat harder to contain, and can embrittle metal.

      --
      Two of my imaginary friends reproduced once ... with negative results.
  4. The annual staple of science magazines. by dorpus · · Score: 2

    Every year, without fail, there is an article about the blimp renaissance. Been that way since the 1930s. Akron calls itself the blimp capital of the world. I remember a college job fair where there was some kooky company from Quebec that made hydrogen-filled blimps, and they insisted that hydrogen is not flammable.

    1. Re:The annual staple of science magazines. by wvmarle · · Score: 2

      The BALLOON explodes, not the hydrogen.

      The extra bang comes thanks to the quick burning of the hydrogen - when the balloon bursts, the hydrogen is like a cloud in the air, and for a short while can be ignited. Which is exactly what that blowtorch does. When the balloon bursts the hydrogen will instantly ignite, and burn really rapidly, causing the louder "boom" you hear.

  5. This time round, this might even work by muecksteiner · · Score: 4, Interesting

    For niche markets, that is. Such as point-to-point delivery of oversized and/or very heavy loads that are simply not transportable by road. A rugged and dependable vehicle of this kind could probably sell some dozen copies across the U.S., and even more world-wide. If these guys are sensible about their corporate cost structure, and do not base their expenditure on expectations of selling thousands of the things, they could be just fine, and be in this for the long run.

    If their basic airship design is sound, of course. But it probably is - getting that sort of thing right is not *that* hard. They could do fairly nicely working examples in the 1920ies (provided they did not fill them with Hydrogen, but fire protection should be a no-brainer these days).

    And the worst enemy of airships, the weather, is now firmly under control from an operational viewpoint - something it was absolutely not back then. Weather forecasts are so accurate nowadays that such vehicles can just reliably avoid those areas where they could get into trouble. One would not be operating scheduled services that have to be at some point at a given time with them anyway. With these specialised heavy lifters, you would rather be delivering oversized pieces of machinery and such in a one-off fashion. And if one of these things arrives two days late because of a thunderstorm front, it is usually not that much of a problem.

    1. Re:This time round, this might even work by afidel · · Score: 4, Insightful

      One obvious use to me is in the delivery of the parts for windmills. Those things are absolutely huge and are pretty much by definition installed in places without a road network. That work alone could probably justify more than a dozen ships since we're expecting to build tens of thousands of windmills in the coming decades.

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  6. revolutionize airship technology? by mister2au · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Revolutionary?

    Nope ... just the Segway of the Dirigible world ...

    1. Re:revolutionize airship technology? by cervesaebraciator · · Score: 2

      It could be r3VOLutionary if only they wrote Ron Paul across the side. Though, given his views on the Fed, I think he'd object to its self-inflationary capabilities.

  7. but if you don't have a ticket punch you out windo by Joe_Dragon · · Score: 3, Funny

    but if you don't have a ticket he will punch you out of the window. And that is how you say good by in German.

  8. Airship Ventures Out Of Business by Bruce+Perens · · Score: 5, Informative

    As you can see on their web site, Airship Ventures is out of business and there's a campaign to save the airship from being scrapped.

  9. Non-renewable resource by MMORG · · Score: 4, Informative

    Helium is a non-renewable resource, even more so than liquid hydrocarbon fuels. At least with jet fuel you could synthesize it if you really wanted to and had a large enough energy input, but the only way to synthesize helium is to fuse hydrogen in large quantities and if we knew how to do that in a controllable fashion we probably wouldn't need to mess around with dirigibles. Once you extract helium from the ground it eventually ends up in the atmosphere and then escapes to space, so once it's gone it's gone for good.

    1. Re:Non-renewable resource by Beryllium+Sphere(tm) · · Score: 2

      It would be easier to breed alpha emitters.

  10. Re:FedEx by SomePgmr · · Score: 2

    According to the wiki entry this is more of a technology demonstrator, with a number of much larger, practical models in the works. 20, 60 and 500 ton capacity, and can be converted to carry people.

    At 120 knots, they're not fast, but if the cost works out that you can take a longer, more comfortable flight, more like traveling by large boat, some might prefer it over a traditional flight for vacation destinations and such.

  11. Re:FedEx by wvmarle · · Score: 3, Informative

    Try landing any of those in a typhoon, for 500 ton lifting capacity the blimp must be huge, and no matter how streamlined it's going to catch a lot of wind. Keeping them grounded in a typhoon will be a tall order even.

  12. Re:FedEx by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I can imagine that they could be used for transporting things that right now there is no easy way to move.

    For example, mining trucks are limited in size by their tires. Since tires must be shipped from the factory in one piece, they can't be more than about 4-5m in diameter or they wouldn't be able to be transported by road. If you could transport them in the air, size would be irrelevant. At 6 tons times 6 tires, you would need a payload capacity of 36 tons to be able to move the tires from the factory to the mine site.

    Another example is oil fields and mines in Alaska and nothern Canada. Since there no roads going to them, equipment can only be moved in the winter when the land and lakes are frozen solid. With an airship, they could move equipment all year long. With a 60 ton capacity, it would be able to haul more than a tractor-trailer, and at 120kt it would go significantly faster too.

    dom

  13. I'll take one... by Mysteryprize · · Score: 2

    ...If it means I don't have to deal with the TSA!

  14. Re:but if you don't have a ticket punch you out wi by ipquickly · · Score: 2, Funny

    I like the Austrian way better.

  15. Hydrogen isn't that bad by Catmeat · · Score: 4, Informative

    I should point out that aside from the Hindenberg, the only time airships ever went down in flames was during World War 1, when they were being shot at. Even then, German Zepplins could take a lot of damage, and it was only when British aircraft started carrying a mixture of explosive and incendiary rounds (called Buckingham and Pomeroy mixture, after the inventors of the two bullet types) that they could feasably destroy a Zeppelin. Even then, aircraft attacking Zeppelins sometimes found themselves firing hundreds of rounds, at a range too close to miss, and having no. Remember, today we don't doubt the safety of 747s, simply because World War 2, B-17 bombers used to come apart when they were shot at enough.

    Also during World War 1, the British operated hundreds of SS Class, Coastal Class and NS Class, non-rigid blimps. Not a single one was lost to fire during 10's of thousands of flying hours. Admittedly, several WW1 British airships were destroyed in a catastrophic fire in a hanger, but that was because one Darwin Award nominee decided to get busy with testing a radio, while he was standing in a puddle of petrol that was leaking from a broken fuel tank.

    So I'm inclined to write off the Hindenberg as a on-off, at a time when aircraft routinely dropped out of the sky. I might even go so far as to give a tiniest whisker of credence to the conspiracy theory, that it was down to an anti-Nazi saboteur.

    Now, I fully appreciate hydrogen dirigibles will absolutely never, ever, ever, fly again simply because of PR and (well justified) safety fears. But I guess my point is that they could be made safe, or at least, safe enough if there was a need.

    1. Re:Hydrogen isn't that bad by hoboroadie · · Score: 2

      I'm fairly certain that if naptha was only now being proposed as a motor fuel, it would wisely be banned from the public roadways. Pretty damned dangerous.

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    2. Re:Hydrogen isn't that bad by Sentrion · · Score: 2

      Counter-examples (plural):

      http://www.airships.net/hydrogen-airship-accidents

      The Hindenburg was just the last and most famous of dozens of fiery hydrogen airship disasters. It was famous because it was one of the first disasters to be reported live over radio broadcast, not to mention the remarkable film and the fact that it was at a time when records were first being made of live broadcasts. The other disasters were just not as publicized, but the Hindenburg captured the attention of the entire world.

    3. Re:Hydrogen isn't that bad by Carnildo · · Score: 2

      That list is technically correct, but not useful. It's basically a list of every hydrogen airship where fire played a part in its destruction. For example, it includes LZ-30 (crashed, then the escaping hydrogen caught fire -- it was "destroyed by hydrogen" in the same way that an airplane that crashed and burned was "destroyed by jet fuel"), ZR-2 (broke up mid-flight, the engines caught fire and ignited the hydrogen), and LZ-87, LZ-94, LZ-97, and LZ-105, destroyed in a mysterious hangar explosion (sabotage was suspected but not proven).

      Of the airships listed, only LZ-18, LZ-40, SL-6, the Wingfoot Air Express, and the Hindenburg were definitely lost due to in-flight hydrogen fires, while the SL-9, LZ-104, and Dixmude may have been. The other nineteen entries in that list either burned after crashing, or caught fire on the ground (usually during maintenance).

      --
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    4. Re:Hydrogen isn't that bad by hoboroadie · · Score: 2

      IIRC it took a while for internal-combustion gasoline tech to exceed the performance of the incumbent steam, diesel, and electric power sources. Presently, the incumbent gasoline tech has achieved monumental inertia, but it is primarily the financial interests who are impeding progress to a non-biosphere destroying system.
      I would prefer to strap myself onto a can of vegetable oil or even kerosene, than to one of gasoline, FWIW. Vegetable oil can be nearly carbon-neutral, as well.

      --
      They feared that it could be used to suppress protest or support unpopular rule.
  16. Hydrogen storage and leakage problem by Antique+Geekmeister · · Score: 2

    Gaseous hydrogen leaks a great deal, no matter how it's stored. That's a cost that will strongly affect the economy of such aircraft. One could theoretically use the hydrogen for fuel for the propellers or electronic systems safely, so I wouldn't anticipate large problems with carrying enough fuel, but hydrogen molecules are very small and tend to leak right through pressure containers. And as the hydrogen leaks, it will tend to collect in any physical reservoirs around the gas bag. That could make preventing flammable buildups, especially near modern electrical systems, quite awkward.

    Hydrogen is also quite reactive. (This is partly why it burns so well.) So I'd expect corrosive surprises with materials used in such an unusual environment, especially if low-cost bidders substitute cheap components that haven't been tested properly in the infrastructure exposed to the hydrogen. This isn't to say it can't be done economically, but the first few such ships are going to be prone to some unexpected failures due to interaction with an unusual environment.

  17. Re:FedEx by SomePgmr · · Score: 2

    It says these require one pilot. It looks like attendants make about $40/hr. Google says the fuel cost in a 777 is about $10,000/hr. and I'm going to guess the maintenance on these is somewhere south of a commercial airliner.

    So I'm guessing the labor cost isn't really that big of an issue, even if the flight time is 4x's as long. Obviously I haven't seen actual operating expenses on the non-existent craft we're talking about... so I'm just speculating.

  18. Re:Zeppelin NT by Megane · · Score: 2

    I'm still waiting for Zeppelin XP. (But I think I'll stay away from Zeppelin Vista and Zeppelin 8.)

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