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Israel To Get Massive Countrywide Optical Upgrade

Posted by timothy on from the just-in-time-for-the-censorship dept.

A Google Fiberhood-style rollout in the U.S., says a Goldman-Sachs estimate, would cost in the neighborhood of $140 billion. Even for Israel, a country approximately the size of New Jersey, there's a high pricetag ("billions of shekels") for installing fiber optics dense enough to reach most of the population, but just a massive fiber-optic rollout is planned, with the project led by Swedish firm Viaeuropa. If the scheme succeeds, it will cover two thirds of the country over the next 10 years or so.

21 of 157 comments (clear)

  1. Re:That high? by nschubach · · Score: 4, Informative

    Sorry to repost, but I just did a Google conversion: 1,000,000,000 Israeli New Sheqel equals 268,190,000 US Dollars

    --
    Every time I start to have faith in humanity, I ruin it by driving to work between 7 and 8 am.
  2. New glasses by Intropy · · Score: 4, Funny

    Anyone else read the headline and think everyone was getting new prescription eyeglasses?

    1. Re:New glasses by Johann+Lau · · Score: 2

      You are one though, seeing how the poster asked "did anyone", not "did all of you".

      I knew it wasn't going to be about eyeglasses, but yeah, that was my first association too, as if "optics" was a new hip word for it like "shades". Made me smile, as did dressing you down ^^

    2. Re:New glasses by hairyfeet · · Score: 2

      No I figured it was yet another country getting what they paid for while we get fucked by the corps and end up on the short bus to the info superhighway.

      Despite what Wolfram & Hart...err I mean Goldman Sachs says we have actually paid over 200 billion in the form of massive tax breaks and other incentives to get nationwide fiber over a decade ago, what did we get? A low res Goatse from the ISPs who gave their CEOs bonuses with the money.

      Scream socialism all you want but the ONLY WAY we are gonna get nationwide fiber is to nationalize the system, have the states lay it just like the roads, and then lease the lines to the companies who will have to compete for customers. because we are already falling behind the rest of the planet, hell Romania is kicking our ass when it comes to bandwidth, and we have already seen that rather than lay lines the corps will just put ever nastier caps while pocketing the profits. You can't have a free market when most people are stuck with a duopoly at best, most with only a monopoly, so we really have no choice but to nationalize the system.

      After all if 200 billion in tax breaks and other incentives couldn't get the ISPs to lay down shit what makes anybody think they will just because their customers want netflix? They know they have you by the balls, so it'll be ever nastier caps and ever worse service while the rest of the world passes us by.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    3. Re:New glasses by Catbeller · · Score: 2

      Yes, we are bigger than Romania. We also have more money than they, per capita, and more people. Your point is puzzling; we aren't trying to do the same with the same amount of money. Resources scale with population and wealth. If what you said somehow made sense, we'd have no highways or electrical power outside of the cities.

      You did't address the fact that the ISPs and telcos were given tens of billions in tax breaks in the last fifteen years to build the networks they now say they cannot afford to build. I was there, I remember. They stole the money; the OP is correct.

      And the "government" built the roads, the phone lines, the water systems, the waste management systems, the airports, the regulatory systems that you use every day without noticing. Not only is government - that's us, it's us - capable, but does it far more cheaply than private entrepeneurs claim they can do it. Private investors want profits, and will game the customers for ever more each quarter. And do; this is abundantly obvious from the current example of the telcos sandbagging Netflix and raising rates. Other countries (as we used to do) set up the projects, build the infrastructure, and contract out the maintenance. And get far, far more payback for far less outlay. In the US, the outlay is eternal and goes into tens of billions in profits each year instead of network growth. The profits finance 1) raises for executives 2) political bribery 3) war chests for buying out competitors and patents so that the companies can protect their monopoly status. It's robbery by ideology. The free market doesn't work, because markets are not free - they are gamed by clever, motivated tribes of thieves who are far more agile and informed than you or your representatives can hope to be. Cut them out.

  3. Uruguay Fiber Optic Plan by fyi101 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Here in Uruguay we are rolling out fiber optics for the entire country (3.5 million people approx.), with about 240,000 connections by now, and connections for all populated centers of 3500 homes and above by 2015. Price tag is about U$S 550 million. I think the plan is to replace the entire copper infrastructure in a few years. Each country is different, but in principle it's doable... (Of course we have the advantage of a state monopoly on wired telecommunications. Yes, I do mean advantage.) See http://www.elobservador.com.uy/noticia/236698/fibra-optica-un-plan-estrategico-de-us-550-millones/ use Google Translate for the Spanish-impaired.

    1. Re:Uruguay Fiber Optic Plan by MickyTheIdiot · · Score: 2

      During the "stimulus" think a couple of years ago there were a lot of talking heads saying that stuff like this was wasteful.

      I think it's exactly the opposite. There is nothing better you can do in rural and smaller areas. You can't have businesses anywhere without good Internet.

      Here in the US we're going to see a 3rd world status in regards to networking by the end of our lifetimes (that is if it's not already that way yet).

    2. Re:Uruguay Fiber Optic Plan by careysub · · Score: 2

      Here in the US we're going to see a 3rd world status in regards to networking by the end of our lifetimes (that is if it's not already that way yet).

      No, we are not. People and companies willing to pay for top-quality networking have access to it.

      You left of "willing and ABLE to pay". So as long as the rich can get top-quality networking the U.S. is golden? The U.S. is 19th in the world in broadband penetration, and 19th in the world in broadband speed. Can a nation compete economically when it is far behind in the core infrastructure of the 21st Century?

      The expectation that rural areas should get equal connectivity at the same cost as urban areas will always keep the average service below the average service in other countries that are willing to pay what it costs.

      How dare rural people expect electricity at affordable prices, decent roads like city-folk, mail service, and broadband? Who do the think they are? Real Americans? You would think they were citizens of what claims to be the greatest nation on Earth or something!

      Oddly enough those rural people are in deep red state territory, vote heavily Republican, yet the people seem concerned whether they get access to 21st Century technology are those Marxist America-hating Progressives.

      And actually U.S. broadband penetration is so poor (22%) most city-dwellers can't get it.

      --
      Starships were meant to fly, Hands up and touch the sky - Nicky Minaj
  4. Re:Nice! Wonder if the illegal settlements get it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Dude, wake up... even the Israeli Prime Minister acknowledges that many current and planned settlements are in violation of internationally-recognized borders, and he openly admits that he doesn't give a rat's ass. When even the puppets running the institution that you are white-knighting for decide that defending their actions is a waste of time, it may be time for you to take up a different hobby.

  5. Re:Nice! Wonder if the illegal settlements get it by MisterMidi · · Score: 4, Informative
    Here's a citation:

    Israel dismantled 18 settlements in the Sinai Peninsula in 1982, and all 21 in the Gaza Strip and 4 in the West Bank in 2005, but continues to both expand its settlements and settle new areas in the West Bank in spite of the Oslo Accords, which specified in article 31 that neither side would take any step that would change the status of the West Bank and the Gaza Strip pending the outcome of the permanent status negotiations. However, Israeli settlement expansion has continued unabated.The international community considers the settlements in occupied territory to be illegal. Israeli neighborhoods in East Jerusalem and communities in the Golan Heights, areas which have been annexed by Israel, are also considered settlements by the international community, which does not recognise Israel's annexations of these territories. The United Nations has repeatedly upheld the view that Israel's construction of settlements constitutes violation of the Fourth Geneva Convention. The International Court of Justice also says these settlements are illegal, and no foreign government supports Israel's settlements.

  6. they are slow like dial-up by sudo · · Score: 3, Informative

    Lets hope they also upgrade their connectivity to the rest of the world.

    Our company has tech centers in Israel and most of the time it feels like they are connected via dial up.
    Even copying files they regularly stall.

  7. Re:Nice! Wonder if the illegal settlements get it by crunchygranola · · Score: 2

    Possession is nine tenths of the law. I don't care about the Palestinians if they're too weak or stupid to figure out how to take the land back either with themselves, or with the aid of the mighty Muslim ummah.

    So you are actively encouraging the Palestinians to take up violence against Israel! Interesting position...

    NB: If Israel wants to take possession of the West Bank, they need to give full citizenship rights to all of the Palestinians, otherwise they are not a democratic state but an apartheid regime.

    --
    Second class citizen of the New Gilded Age
  8. Your tax DOLLARS at work by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    " The fiscal year 2013 budget request “includes $3.1 billion in Foreign Military Financing [FMF] for Israel and $15 million for refugee resettlement. Within the U.S. Department of Defense, the U.S. Missile Defense Agency’s FY2013 budget request includes $99.8 million in joint U.S.-Israeli co-development for missile defense.""

    "To date, the United States has provided Israel $115 billion in bilateral assistance. It is currently the second largest recipient of aid worldwide, with Afghanistan now first."

    U.S. Foreign Aid to Israel: 2012 Congressional Report - Christopher Olver | April 26, 2012 ....I realize the US trade empire has a vested interest in a friendly outpost in the middle east, but when will Israel be considered strong enough to stop getting what amounts to charity?

  9. Re:Nice! Wonder if the illegal settlements get it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Dude, wake up...

    I'm not wearing a bathrobe, don't call me dude.

    even the Israeli Prime Minister acknowledges that many current and planned settlements are in violation of internationally-recognized borders,

    I don't think there's much debate that many countries don't recognize these territories. Why shouldn't he acknowledge the stated opinions of other countries?

    and he openly admits that he doesn't give a rat's ass.

    Again, why should he? I don't think it's a newsflash that the countries that attacked Israel and then lost territory are upset about it.
    Question for you: If Israel had lost territory during the war, would you be clamoring for Jordan, Syria, or Egypt to return it to them?

    When even the puppets running the institution that you are white-knighting for decide that defending their actions is a waste of time,

    Puppets? Really? Think about exactly who you're defending here.

    it may be time for you to take up a different hobby.

    My hobby is enlightening the ignorant, and I will never give it up. There is too much to be done.

  10. Re:Nice! Wonder if the illegal settlements get it by dskoll · · Score: 3, Informative

    We don't recognize the accumulation of territory by force as being legitimate

    Nonsense. If this were the case:

    Acquisition of territory by force has happened all through history, is continuing to happen, and will continue to happen for the forseeable future. The supposed illegitimacy of this practice is used as a tool to demonize Israel, but it's completely ignored when anyone else does it.

  11. Re:Nice! Wonder if the illegal settlements get it by nbauman · · Score: 2

    The entire international community, including the U.S., the U.N., and the International Court of Justice, consider the settlements to be illegal.

    Not only that, but Theodor Meron, the legal counsel of Israel's own Foreign Ministry in September 1967, said so. The Prime Minister’s Office asked him for his opinion on the legality of civilian settlement in the West Bank and Gaza Strip. He wrote that it was clearly illegal: “civilian settlement in the administered territories contravenes the explicit provisions of the Fourth Geneva Convention.”

    So that was the Israeli government's own official legal opinion.

    Gershom Gorenberg, an Israeli historian, found a copy of the memo when he was doing research in the archives. http://southjerusalem.com/settlement-and-occupation-historical-documents/

  12. Re:Nice! Wonder if the illegal settlements get it by dskoll · · Score: 3, Insightful

    That was then, this is now.

    Well, how conveeeenient. We (the USA, Russia, etc.) have grabbed all the territory we need, so now we'll make what we did illegal and grandfather ourselves.

    There have certainly been other land grabs since the Geneva conventions (Turkey grabbing northern Cyprus; Russia grabbing Abkhazia and South Ossetia) and yet we don't see the hate-fueled virulent outcry against Turkey and Russia that we see against Israel.

  13. Re:Nice! Wonder if the illegal settlements get it by dskoll · · Score: 3, Insightful

    If you want your country to be safe and secure, don't make enemies of everybody in the world.

    What's the alternative? If Israel evacuated the West Bank today, it would have rockets landing in Tel Aviv and Jerusalem tomorrow.

    There is no solution to the problem. The best Israel can do is keep a lid on the violence and make sure it only proceeds at a low-level. Eventually, it may find a real peace partner in the Palestinians. But I'm not optimistic. Even the "moderate" Palestinians say very different things in Arabic to their own constituency compared to what they say in English for the international community.

  14. Re:Nice! Wonder if the illegal settlements get it by dskoll · · Score: 2

    I am arguing for Israel to be treated by the international community (wrt to annexation of territory) exactly the way other countries such as Russia, China and Turkey are treated.

    Or if you like, treat those countries the way Israel is treated. But at least have some fairness and consistency.

  15. Re:Nice! Wonder if the illegal settlements get it by dskoll · · Score: 2

    Because nearly every nation in the world soundly denounces their actions as "illegal" and "infringing upon internationally-recognized borders.

    Ah, yes. The sacred and infallible will of the majority of UN members must be respected.

  16. Re:A universally hated people needs to be secure by Catbeller · · Score: 3, Informative

    "She is a homeland to a people whom the world hates because they dare present to humanity (brace yourselves) MORALITY"

    The Palestinians? Never thought of it that way before. Thanks. Yeah, they are Semites, ain't they? We should stop being so anti-Semitic...

    Waiting for the pre-4000 BC Ebla-ites to stake their claim. After all, they were there before anyone else. Plenty of descendants about, mostly Palestinian, I'd imagine. Prior possession is 100% of the law, ya know. Might be some Neaderthals or Cro-Magnon claimaints, too. There's been people in that once-fertile land for over twelve thousand years. Probably hundreds of thousands. Maybe a half million years, depending on how you define homo sapiens.

    The land is a mined-out, farmed-out dessicated near-wasteland of the not-so-real. It's been peopled to death.