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New Sony Patent Blocks Second-hand Games

silentbrad writes in with a story about a Sony patent that would block the playing of second-hand games. "... the patent application was filed on 9 December 2012 by Sony Computer Entertainment Japan, and will work by linking individual game discs to a user's account without requiring a network connection meaning any future attempt to use this disc on another user's console won't work. The patent explains that games will come with contactless tags that will be read by your console in much the same way as modern bank cards. When a disc is first used, the disc ID and player ID will be stored on the tag. Every time the disc is used in future, the tag will check if the two ID's match up and, if not, then the disc won't work. The document goes on to explain that such a device is part of Sony's ongoing efforts to deter second-hand games sales, and is a far simpler solution than always-on DRM or passwords. It's worth noting that Sony has not confirmed the existence of the device, and the patent doesn't state what machine it will be used in, with later paragraphs also mentioning accessories and peripherals. ... There's also the issue of what happens should your console break and need replacing, or if you have more than one console. Will the games be linked to your PSN account, meaning they can still be used, or the console, meaning an entire new library of titles would need to be purchased?"

19 of 344 comments (clear)

  1. Sony shiting on its customers by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    ...customers do not (want to) know it and continue buying from these assholes.

    Well, have a very nice fuck you year Sony.

    1. Re:Sony shiting on its customers by Lonewolf666 · · Score: 5, Informative

      Indeed. Sony is one of currently three companies I would not buy any digital equipment or software from (the other two are Apple and Activision Blizzard).

      The rootkit on audio CDs and the deletion of Linux support from the PS3 are not forgotten. The patent in the article is only proof the thinking at Sony hasn't changed, it is not a new trend.

      --
      C - the footgun of programming languages
    2. Re:Sony shiting on its customers by Pieroxy · · Score: 4, Interesting

      The worst of all is that once you've blown your console to bits and you buy another one, you have to buy all your games all over again. As always, this will hurt regular users and encourage piracy for people in this situation will feel entitled (rightly so IMO) to crack their console in order to play their already purchased games. And from that point on they will download torrentz instead of buying because they will hold a (legitimate IMO) grudge against SONY and their console is already cracked.

      Apparently, shooting themselves in the foot feels good for them since they do it over and over again.

    3. Re:Sony shiting on its customers by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      While I hate this concept, I don't think it has that failing. Since it uses a user account instead of a console id adding the user account to the new console should allow replacing units.

      So when Sony decides to ban your account for <something they deem ban worthy (whether it is or not)> you also lose all your games. I bet their EULA will also contain "... by reading this line of text you forfeit your right to sue us as well as grant us the right to use your account in any manner which we see fit, including (but not limited to) claiming (on your behalf) that you did violate our terms and are very remorsefulness ...".

      They will also need to pass the cost of this "feature" on to the consumer via the game console as well as a charge per game.

    4. Re:Sony shiting on its customers by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Since it uses a user account instead of a console id adding the user account to the new console should allow replacing units.

      And if your household has more than one account? You know, if kids and parents each have their own accounts? Only one of the accounts can play the game even if it's played on the same console.

      This is their dream of limiting content to a specific individual. Want that song to play in your car and your home? You'll need to buy more than one copy. Both of you like having it on your MP3 player? We don't care if it is a household or if you're married, you each need to buy a copy (even if the government sees all purchases made by you to belong to both).

    5. Re:Sony shiting on its customers by Spaseboy · · Score: 4, Informative

      Believe me, I had this problem. My PS+ sub renewed with an out-of-date credit card and 3 months later I am told I don't have access to PSN. No email, no reason, just call Sony. They want me to send a cashier's check, by postage mail, to them for the amount then they will "consider" unbanning my account. I can't pay it electronically where I can be sure they receive the amount and there is no guarantee they will unban my account after they receive payment.

      I sold my PS3 the next day and I'm trying to sell my PSV.

      --
      "I don't want more choice, I just want nicer things!"
      -Jennifer Saunders as Edina Monsoon
  2. As usual... by Puls4r · · Score: 5, Insightful

    All these DRM schemes are future-failures. More specifically, at some point in the future, you will be denied the game you purchased because of the DRM. Get a new console? Now you have to (somehow) reset your card so you can run it on the new console. Want to take it to a friends house? Pack up your console! Company goes out of business, or stops supporting it because it's obsolete? Say goodbye. In the future, old games won't be worth more because of rarity. They'll be worth more if you still have some way to make them work after their DRM scheme fails. Of course, it will be cracked. Quickly. Which is a GOOD thing.

    1. Re:As usual... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Or you wind up like this guy:
      http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2012/11/how-nintendo-drm-trapped-400-of-downloaded-games-on-my-failing-wii/

    2. Re:As usual... by firex726 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      A shame since I often find myself going back and playing older games from 10+ years ago.
      Many times the companies who made them are long since gone.

      I guess "Retro Gaming" is going to be redefined as playing last years Madden or CoD.

  3. Obvious Solution by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    Just don't buy anything by Sony.

    1. Re:Obvious Solution by MickyTheIdiot · · Score: 5, Informative

      Actually, yes, it is possible. In the e-book market there are books that are now prominently promoting the fact that they are DRM free as a selling point.

      If this occurs in the tight assed corporate game market it will take a while, as the customers are more oblivious... but wait until Joe Sixpack from Alabama gets bit by this a few times and you'll see the Ric Romeros of the world start to pick up on it.

    2. Re:Obvious Solution by PopeRatzo · · Score: 4, Insightful

      You think their competitors will do something different?

      If people stop buying Sony, you bet your ass their competitors will start doing something different.

      I think the days when people start shopping more strategically are coming. When consumers discover the power of their choices, you will see a lot of things change real quickly. For the better. In a lot of areas of our lives.

      Shop mindfully, I say. Even if you don't do anything differently, at least be aware of the ramifications of the choices you make as a consumer.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
  4. Patents work for once! by Cryacin · · Score: 5, Informative

    So the competition will be less tempted to steal their IP, and I as well as surely many others can take their business to them!

    Officially, screw you Sony. I will never, ever, over my dead body buy another product from you, or an affiliated company.

    And to their patent lawyers, please, I beg you - Make the patent watertight.

    --
    Science advances one funeral at a time- Max Planck
  5. Simple 1 step solution by Terry95 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    There is a really simple solution to this. DO NOT BUY ANYTHING FROM SONY. Complain to magazines and web sites that review their stuff. If they ignore you then boycott that site / mag too. DONE. Don't bitch and whine about it. Don't wave your arms and scream it's unconstitutional while you stand in line to fork over $75.00 for the latest repackage of the same game you've already played 50 times. Just Freaking walk away! People really fail to grasp this. Don't bother to pirate their stuff. Sure this can be broken - but why? Treat them like they don't exist. Honest you WILL live without Sony. But Sony will NOT live without customers. Then if this actually matters to enough people Sony will become a responsible corporation and behave in polite society. If not then you will have taken the moral high ground anyway, and probably given your money to a responsible studio that doesn't treat its paying customers as mortal enemies. Had you rather be on the side of good - or play Killzone 15? Free choice. It cuts both ways.

  6. Re:Remember Steam by Vanderhoth · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Also with Steam, I'm not locked to a specific machine. I can load my steam account on my Wife's PC or my Brothers laptop or one of my three other computers. Sony wants to lock the disk to a specific machine, which are normally not very portable.

    Of course I already avoid all Sony products including any subsidiaries I know about.

  7. Leave it to Sony by crazyjj · · Score: 4, Funny

    Always behind on technology, but on the cutting edge of evil.

    --
    What political party do you join when you don't like Bible-thumpers *or* hippies?
  8. Re:Fine, but not the problem they should be tackli by FireFury03 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The 2nd hand market exists because the price of games are too high.

    Second hand markets will continue to exist, no matter what the price of the new product; so dropping the price of new games isn't going to solve that "problem". I do wonder what effect abolishing the second hand market would have on new games sales though - nievely you might say that new sales will increase because there is nolonger any competition, but that ignores the fact that the customer only has a finite amount of money. Lots of people fund their new purchases (in part) by selling stuff they no longer want, if they can't sell their old stuff they have less money to invest in new stuff. I'd certianly be less inclined to blow £50 on a game if I knew I could never sell it, and similarly less inclined to spend £hundreds on a console if I knew I could never buy any cheap games for it. (But then maybe I'm wrong - I'm not a gamer, I can think of far more fun things to do with my time and money than sit in a darkened room in front of a console for hours on end).

  9. IANAL by Dcnjoe60 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    IANAL, but I wonder if such a patent, assuming valid, would be legal to use in the US and other jurisdicitons. There is a lot of case law describing consumer sales and what one is allowed to do with what one purchases, including resale of said goods. While Sony might have a legal patent, it might not be legal to impliment it.

    As I said, IANAL, but maybe somebody who is could chime in.

    1. Re:IANAL by tattood · · Score: 4, Funny

      I certainly ANAL

      TMI, dude. TMI.

      --
      WTB [sig], PST!!!