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Petition For Metric In US Halfway To Requiring Response From the White House

Posted by samzenpus on from the keeping-it-imperial dept.

fsterman writes "Without any prompting from the U.S. Metric Association, a We The People petition to standardize the U.S. on the metric system has received 13,000 signatures in six days. That's half the number needed for an official response from the White House. It looks like ending the U.S.'s anti-metric alliance with Liberia and Burma (the only other countries NOT on the metric system) might rank up there with building a death star."

14 of 1,387 comments (clear)

  1. US Metric System by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    "Liberia and Burma (the only other countries NOT on the US metric system)"

    Right. And now the Metric system itself is from the US? Who writes this stuff.

    1. Re:US Metric System by AK+Marc · · Score: 5, Insightful

      There's nothing special about the meter. The "special" part is meter and liter are related, as are kg and liter, so everything is related. That and the relation for increasing and decreasing units or prefixes is the same base as our counting system. Not special about any particular unit, but better for large and small numbers being related. Or do you know how many inches in a furlong off the top of your head?

      --
      Learn to love Alaska
    2. Re:US Metric System by NFN_NLN · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Metric is every bit as arbitrary as imperial, it's just a bit easier to do unit conversions with them.

      The metric system is not arbitrary. There is only one unit each of length, mass, volumes, etc. It is also coherent.

      Coherence"

      "Each variant of the metric system has a degree of coherence – the various derived units being directly related to the base units without the need of intermediate conversion factors. For example, in a coherent system the units of force, energy and power are chosen so that the equations

              force = mass × acceleration
              energy = force × distance
              power = energy / time

      hold without the introduction of constant factors. Once a set of coherent units have been defined, other relationships in physics that use those units will automatically be true - Einstein's mass-energy equation, E = mc2, does not require extraneous constants when expressed in coherent units.[18]

      The cgs system had two units of energy, the erg that was related to mechanics and the calorie that was related to thermal energy so only one of them (the erg) could bear a coherent relationship to the base units. Coherence was a design aim of SI resulting in only one unit of energy being defined - the joule.[19]

      In SI, which is a coherent system, the unit of power is the "watt" which is defined as "one joule per second".[20] In the US customary system of measurement, which is non-coherent, the unit of power is the "horsepower" which is defined as "550 foot-pounds per second" (the pound in this context being the pound-force), similarly the gallon is not equal to a cubic yard (nor is it the cube of any length unit).

      The concept of coherence was only introduced into the metric system in the third quarter of the nineteenth century; in its original form the metric system was non-coherent - in particular the litre was 0.001 m3 and the are (from which we get the hectare) was 100 m2. A precursor to the concept of coherence was however present in that the units of mass and length were related to each other through the physical properties of water, the gram having been designed as being the mass of one cubic centimetre of water at its freezing point."

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metric_system

    3. Re:US Metric System by mjwx · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Metric is every bit as arbitrary as imperial

      0 C - point at which water freezes, 100 C - point at which water boils.

      Yep, totally arbitrary. Lets not even start with Kelvin.

      it's just a bit easier to do unit conversions with them.

      By "a bit" you mean an imperial shitload (2.4358 Metric fucktons) easier. I know there is 1000 millimetres in a metre, 1000 millilitres in a litre, 1000 milligrams in a gram. Same with centi, deci, kilo, mega and so forth. How many furlongs are there in a mile, inches in a furlong? How do we start dealing with tiny fractions of an inch or many hundreds of thousands of miles?

      It's also a lot easier to convert between different measurements in metric. 1 millilitre is 1 cubic centimetre (CC) of water (1 cm x 1 cm x 1 cm), 1 litre is 1000 CC's.

      --
      Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
    4. Re: US Metric System by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Not to disagree with your point. But I would say that the main problem with units like foot and inches is not the base per se, but the inconsistent bases across the spectrum.

      If it used base 16, for example, across the board, then it would be just as sane as metric. Eg 1/16 inch, 1 inch, 16 inch to a feet, 16 feet to a yard, 256 yards to a mile, etc.

      Instead, we have a mishmash of lengths that used different base at every level. If base 16, or 12 or whatever, really has some good, why not apply such goodness across the board?

    5. Re:US Metric System by quacking+duck · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Economics and timing is a poor but convenient excuse, it's only been used for the last three decades to justify not doing anything.

      It would have been more economical to start phasing out imperial 30 years ago, but instead millions of additional dollars have been wasted making, for example, signposts in miles and speed limit signs in mph.

      It will *never* be a "good time" to change to metric, but the longer you *don't* change, the more money you've wasted and the more it will cost when you finally do change over.

      Hell, it would've been more economical to stop printing $1 bills years ago, seeing as $1 US coins have been available for ages. But no, new $1 bills are still made, and so people continue using them.

      Instead of saying it's not economical or bad timing, just say some of the real reasons: Americans on the whole are resistant to change, don't want to learn a new and generally better way of doing things, or just want to be different somehow from the rest of the world (except such nice company as Liberia and Burma).

    6. Re:US Metric System by gagol · · Score: 5, Insightful

      All systems of units are arbitrary.

      Some are arbitrary and logical, easy to work in your head... Some are a bunch of disparate measurement systems that makes almost no logical sense what so ever. If I have to choose, I take the logical one, thank you.

      --
      Tomorrow is another day...
    7. Re:US Metric System by bloodhawk · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The costs involved in producing parts and machines that need to be done in both metric and imperial is reduced thus reducing consumer costs on imported items. Costs involved for producing items for export are also reduced, reduced confusion all around for a small amount of short term confusion.

    8. Re:US Metric System by fsterman · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Metric is every bit as arbitrary as imperial

      Imperial units internal relationships = arbitrary
      Imperial units external relationships = mostly-arbitrary (generally measures of someones body parts)

      SI internal relationships = non-arbitrary
      SI units external relationships = semi-arbitrary (generally measures of physical phenomena that are roughly universal)

      The metric system is at least 1 unit of arbitrariness less arbitrary than the imperial system.

      --
      Is there anything better than clicking through Microsoft ads on Slashdot?
    9. Re:US Metric System by ceoyoyo · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Not having to have two sets of wrenches and not crashing landers into Mars come to mind.

  2. Re:That's a lot! by fredgiblet · · Score: 5, Insightful

    No. But we should do something smart to help the entire population.

  3. Re:Good luck with that by fredgiblet · · Score: 5, Insightful

    All but three countries in the world have done it. Are you saying we're unable to cope with an issue that nearly every country has managed to handle?

  4. Re:Good luck with that by Marcika · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Yup. The UK metricated in the 1970s, long before they started having railways or steam engines or spinning jennies.

  5. Stop Acting Like These Petitions Mean ANYTHING. by MrLizard · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Every time I read one of these articles, I sense this bizarre attitude that getting 25,000 signatures somehow means that a law will be passed or that something meaningful has been accomplished or that it's important to sign/not sign whatever bit of garbage is being bandied about at the moment. The "We The People" site is about as important, useful, or relevant as a pop-up poll promising you a free iPad for responding. The "response" from the White House is virtually always "We've read your stupid petition. Here's your response: It's stupid.". Laws are not passed in America by direct democracy, and, even if they were, you'd need about a hundred million votes, give or take, not 25,000. 25,000 signatures -- in a population of 300+ million -- are nothing. You can get 25,000 people to sign virtually anything. To get a law to the President's desk, you need to convince 50% of Congress to do something -- actually, more than 50%, given the many procedural obstructions that exist. Absolutely NO MEANINGFUL, CONCRETE, OR SIGNIFICANT ACTION WILL EVER BE TAKEN SOLELY AS A RESULT OF A PETITION ON THAT WEB SITE. Every time a web site or news service acts as if signing a petition on "We The People" is somehow different from writing "I wish the magic fairies would give me a pony!" on a scrap of paper and then keeping it under your pillow, it adds to the "slacktivism" of the American people and undermines any actual progress towards any desired goal, regardless of your political leanings. THE SITE IS A JOKE. It means NOTHING. It will not influence a single vote in Congress. It will not cause the President to take any action he was otherwise not going to take. Every moment wasted signing a petition, asking someone else to sign a petition, asking someone NOT to sign a petition, etc, is a moment wasted from your life (yes, like the moments I wasted writing this). You would accomplish more for yourself watching "Here Comes Honey Boo Boo", because at least you'd be entertained. (I assume, I've never actually watched it. If I want to see drunken redneck idiots, I can drive a mile to my local Wal Mart.)