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Ask Slashdot: When Is the User Experience Too Good?

gadzook33 writes "I had an interesting experience at work recently. A colleague suggested during a meeting that we were building something that would make it far too easy for the customer to perform a certain task; a task that my colleague felt was deleterious. Without going into specifics, I believe an apt analogy would be giving everyone in the country a flying car. While this would no doubt be enjoyable, without proper training and regulation it would also be tremendously dangerous (also assume training and regulating is not practical in this case). I retorted that ours is not to reason why, and that we had the responsibility to develop the best possible solution, end of story. However, in the following days I have begun to doubt my position and wonder if we don't have some responsibility to artificially 'cripple' the solution and in doing so protect the user from themselves (build a car that stays on the ground). I do not for a second imagine that I am playing the part of Oppenheimer; this is a much more practical issue and less of an ethical one. But is there something to this?"

32 of 397 comments (clear)

  1. I assume... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    I assume you work for Zynga?

    1. Re:I assume... by lxs · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Or Amazon. That no-click shopping patent is just around the corner.

    2. Re:I assume... by DickBreath · · Score: 4, Funny
      > I assume you work for Zynga?

      When he makes a statement like:

      I have begun to doubt my position and wonder if we don't have some responsibility to artificially 'cripple' the solution and in doing so protect the user from themselves

      That tells me he should consider working for Apple.

      --

      I'll see your senator, and I'll raise you two judges.
    3. Re:I assume... by interkin3tic · · Score: 4, Funny

      No, he works for a company which makes sex simulator videogames. He has a responsibility to make sure the human race keeps breeding.

      Relevant saturday morning breakfast cereal.

    4. Re:I assume... by hackula · · Score: 5, Funny

      After you hit the usage cap on the sex bot, it starts crying and asking you why you don't ever want to talk about having kids.

    5. Re:I assume... by dr_blurb · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I have begun to doubt my position and wonder if we don't have some responsibility to artificially 'cripple' the solution and in doing so protect the user from themselves

      That tells me he should consider working for Apple.

      It tells me that at the moment he's on the Gnome 3 dev team.

    6. Re:I assume... by MikeTheGreat · · Score: 5, Informative

      +5 INFORMATIVE? What do you people do in your free time?

    7. Re:I assume... by maroberts · · Score: 5, Funny

      +5 INFORMATIVE? What do you people do in your free time?

      Mod Slashdot Comments

      --

      Donte Alistair Anderson Roberts - hi son!
      Karma: Chameleon

  2. like Windows? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

    Are you sure you want to delete that file?

    1. Re:like Windows? by jellomizer · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Most software you need to do the following.

      Create Date
      Read Data
      Update Data
      Delete Data.

      CRUD for short. However in terms of the UI
      you need to change the order to RCUD Read, Create, Update, Delete. As those are in the order of damage you can create from low to high.

      So Reading data should be the easiest to do on your system, as most people should just be reading data.
      Secondly create new data, should be the next step, as if you created something wrong typically it is the easiest to remove.
      Updating data can cause more problems as you could change correct data to bad data, and often most systems you will not know what happened after you changed it.
      Then Delete data, which is obviously could be bad if it was too easy.

      --
      If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
  3. Too good? I think not by grasshoppa · · Score: 5, Insightful

    If your interface would allow a user to shoot themselves in the foot without proper precautions, then your user experience is, by definition, *not good*.

    The goal of any application is to let the user perform a function FASTER than manipulating the data themselves, manually. If your UI enables the user to destroy a significant portion of that effort easily, then you have failed to achieve your goal.

    --
    Mod me down with all of your hatred and your journey towards the dark side will be complete!
  4. Depends ... by gstoddart · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Who is the target market for your product?

    If it's for Joe Sixpack, and he might metaphorically poke out an eye with it, then maybe.

    If it's for system admins and the like who neither need nor want training wheels, not so much.

    You certainly can expose too much functionality to people who shouldn't have it. But you can also make something useless to the people who actually do need to do it.

    --
    Lost at C:>. Found at C.
  5. Apple-like thinking. by Microlith · · Score: 5, Insightful

    However, in the following days I have begun to doubt my position and wonder if we don't have some responsibility to artificially 'cripple' the solution and in doing so protect the user from themselves (build a car that stays on the ground).

    I suppose this is the rationalization that Apple uses internally to justify their walled garden. Gotta protect users from themselves whether they want it or not.

    Rather than being assholes like Apple, perhaps you could make this configurable in some fashion? Whatever the hell "this" is?

    1. Re:Apple-like thinking. by UnknowingFool · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I suppose this is the rationalization that Apple uses internally to justify their walled garden. Gotta protect users from themselves whether they want it or not.

      Apple has a front-line customer support model. That means that they have to directly deal with every grandmother, novice, etc that touches their products. So yes they make things so that they can't be tampered with. As a power user, you dislike it, but if you had to deal with direct customer support, I suppose you'd change your tune really quick. You don't like it, don't buy Apple products. And I suppose you don't use OS X. I spend more time using Terminal in OS X than I anything else.

      Rather than being assholes like Apple, perhaps you could make this configurable in some fashion? Whatever the hell "this" is?

      As long as he is willing to deal with any support nightmares that come with that decision.

      --
      Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
  6. When is the user experience too good? by David+Gould · · Score: 4, Funny

    Since 1984.

    --
    David Gould
    main(i){putchar(340056100>>(i-1)*5&31|!!(i<6)<< 6)&&main(++i);}
  7. Power User mode by FrostDust · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Put a button that toggles your program's "dangerous flying car" interface, with a nice warning about they can now wipe their system with a single click, and you aren't responsible if they misuse the software.

  8. Users need protecting from themselves by Imagix · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Yes, there is. Part of the UI is to protect the users from inadvertent operations. That's part of why various destructive operations in programs have the "are you sure?" dialog box. The good ones also have a checkbox that says "Don't ask this again". There's a difference between making it hard to do a task, vs preventing the task altogether. There may be legitimate reasons why one may need to do the said task. Also, provide a way for the user to consciously remove the speed bumps you're putting in. I don't mind software that wants to hold your hand by default, but I want a way to tell it to get the heck out of my way and let me do my task.

    1. Re:Users need protecting from themselves by SQL+Error · · Score: 5, Interesting

      The bad ones have "Are you sure?" The awful ones have "Don't ask this again." The good ones have "Undo."

  9. A better philosophical approach by jwales · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Learn to think in the wiki way.

    Rather than make it hard for users to do what they want to do, on the (very valid) assumption that some of them will do bad things, or things they don't really want to do, it is better to make it easy for users to recover from those mistakes, and for others to recover easily from any side effects of those mistakes.

    This is not always possible. But it usually is.

    Jimmy Wales - Wikipedia.org

    --
    Wikia
    1. Re:A better philosophical approach by jwales · · Score: 5, Informative

      I actually don't take any salary at all. Nor expenses. It's a fun joke, but it would be funnier if actually true.

      --
      Wikia
  10. I've heard this before by decipher_saint · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I've heard this before and every time it was about letting the software bypass some business rule important to an external process.

    Well yeah of course I could let you add a negative Debit for an Asset but your accounting department will come at you with sharpened coffee mug or something.

    Well, I guess the other time I hear "this software is too good" usually comes from sales and it makes my skin crawl every time.

    --
    crazy dynamite monkey
  11. Re:This is more common than you think. by gstoddart · · Score: 4, Insightful

    This is just like every time software asks you, "are you sure?" before deleting a file or record.

    And why it's so easy for shitware like the ask.com toolbar to end up on systems.

    People got used to thinking "oh, crap, I just need to keep clicking next until it finally installs". Now you need to check every page of the install to be sure that installing someone's toolbar or whatever isn't checked by default (which it always is).

    People either start ignoring the warnings, or stop caring what they say and click next anyway.

    --
    Lost at C:>. Found at C.
  12. Re:Too good? I think not by serviscope_minor · · Score: 4, Insightful

    If your interface would allow a user to shoot themselves in the foot without proper precautions, then your user experience is, by definition, *not good*.

    What if the user interface lets them shoot everyone else in the foot at no cost to themselves, while accomplishing their task quickly and with ease.

    It's a great user interface from the user's point of view, but a really terrible system to have.

    --
    SJW n. One who posts facts.
  13. Re:Too good? I think not by Jane+Q.+Public · · Score: 5, Insightful

    "If your UI enables the user to destroy a significant portion of that effort easily, then you have failed to achieve your goal."

    Ultimately, your goal is to get paid. If you don't do what the customer wants, you have failed to achieve your goal.

    It is acceptable to try to dissuade them. It is acceptable to warn them. But document it when you do. And if they still want it despite all your warnings and attempts to convince, then give it to them. That's what you're getting paid for. If they complain later, show them your documentation and where they insisted even though you advised against it.

    I once worked for a company that demanded the ability to do X in the software, despite my warnings that it was a bad idea. So I put in confirmations. When they first clicked the button to do X, it first popped up a message saying "This will result in _____. Are you sure you want to do this?". If they clicked Yes, then another confirmation popped up: "Are you really sure?" And if they clicked yes again, a third confirmation popped up: "Are you really, really, REALLY sure?"

    An administrator mentioned to me later that he thought the warnings were funny, but he liked the fact they were there.

  14. Re:Too good? I think not by grasshoppa · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Agreed. At the end of the day, those who write the checks get what they want.. I was speaking more of the theory rather than the practical.

    In those situations where I've recommended and warned against the functionality, and the user still demands it, I have considered it more my failure to communicate the risk than the user's failure. But, as you say, I wanted to get paid so I delivered what the user requested.

    --
    Mod me down with all of your hatred and your journey towards the dark side will be complete!
  15. Re:Too good? I think not by Frosty+Piss · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Ultimately, your goal is to get paid. If you don't do what the customer wants, you have failed to achieve your goal. What if the ability to do X harmed others?

    Many companies exhibit sociopathic behaviors in pursuit of maximizing shareholder value.

    --
    If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
  16. Re:Too good? I think not by Antipater · · Score: 5, Insightful

    It should be noted that your whole post has the caveat "unless someone could get hurt". Working in heavy industry, we quite frequently tell our clients "No, you do not want X. X does not make sense, and you will hurt yourselves. You want Z instead." If the client insists, we stop doing business with them. If the crane you built collapses because the customer wanted a "press here to collapse crane" button, nobody is going to give a damn that you have documentation proving the client really really wanted the button.

    When it comes to health and safety, the customer is not always right.

    --
    Everything is better with chainsaws.
  17. Re:Too good? I think not by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Writing software has to be about more than getting paid.

    For instance: Remote start cars are awesome. Putting a remote start in a manual can have unintended consequences. For instance, the car might jump forward crushing a person between two parallel parked cars.

    True story, and actually, the designers of that software were sued.

    At some point liability for your code will fall back on you, and it's your responsibility to say no and not take the money if you are actually creating a dangerous situation.

  18. Re:Too good? I think not by gstoddart · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Ever notice that when you deliver something, they've managed to change the requirements?

    Ever delivered something which met the formal requirements and had them say "well, that's not what we wanted"?

    There is often an unbelievable disconnect between what users tell you they want versus what they actually really really wanted but had no idea until it was too late.

    End users will often help you design unusable software which is exactly what they asked for.

    --
    Lost at C:>. Found at C.
  19. You insensitive clod! by conspirator23 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Since you felt it would be tedious to explain specifics, you create a huge hole in our ability to give you a serious answer that is relevant to your situation. So to speak on a purely generic level, there's no such thing as too good a user experience.. The notion that you might make the user of your product TOO happy, or make their lives TOO easy, is the sort of sadistic logic that I would normally attribute to someone whose just shitty at developing user interfaces and wants some kind of perverse rationalization to justify their shortcomings.

    However... this whole "flying car" analogy leads me to believe that you're not really talking about "user experience" in terms of user interfaces, ergonomics, and the like. It seems to me that you're talking about feature sets and what you are empowering the user to accomplish with your software. For example, some advanced text editors may enable global search and replace. That same text editor may support using regular expressions in a variety of ways. With this hypothetical text editor, it might be possible to combine the application of these features and modify dozens of critical files in unexpected ways, really wrecking the local PC.I'm wondering if this is the scenario that's really behind this question? If so, referring to this as "user experience" is misleading.

    I'm fully in agreement that you want to be careful about what sort of capacities you grant the users of your application. If that particular feature has a crappy risk/benefit ratio, then drop it altogether. On the other hand, if you have powerful but risky features that you believe the software needs, then you should be working hard to improve the user experience in such a way that inexperienced users don't stumble across those features accidentally. Although I have personally railed against Microsoft's history of nesting options under multiple layers of dialog boxes, part of the intent there is to segregate "power user" options where they will not distract casual users from the features they actually care about.

  20. Re:Too good? I think not by mattventura · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I think the real problem with warning messages is that they're so overused that people ignore them. If UI designers had saved warning messages for things that were actually important ("You're about to delete a file") rather than stupid things ("You are loading a web page with unsecured elements") then people might actually pay attention to them.

    Hell, back when Vista first came out I had to go through FOUR, yes four UAC dialogs to create a folder in program files and rename it.

  21. Re:Too good? I think not by fahrbot-bot · · Score: 4, Funny

    What if the ability to do X harmed others?

    That responsibility/consequence fall to the user, not the tool used.

    • User: "Computer, detonate the warhead."
    • Computer: "This will result in destruction and many deaths. Are you sure you want to do this?".
    • User: "Yes."
    • Computer: "Are you really sure?"
    • User: "Yes."
    • Computer: "Are you really, really, REALLY sure?"
    • User: "Yes."
    • Computer: "Target out of range."
    --
    It must have been something you assimilated. . . .