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U.N. Realizes Internet Surveillance Chills Free Speech

An anonymous reader writes "The Electronic Frontier Foundation reports that the United Nations has finally come to the realization that there is a direct relationship between government surveillance online and citizens' freedom of expression. The report (PDF) says, 'The right to privacy is often understood as an essential requirement for the realization of the right to freedom of expression. Undue interference with individuals' privacy can both directly and indirectly limit the free development and exchange of ideas. An infringement upon one right can be both the cause and consequence of an infringement upon the other.' The EFF adds, 'La Rue's landmark report could not come at a better time. The explosion of online expression we've seen in the past decade is now being followed by an explosion of communications surveillance. For many, the Internet and mobile telephony are no longer platforms where private communication is shielded from governments knowing when, where, and with whom a communication has occurred.'"

25 of 90 comments (clear)

  1. Captain OBVIOUS by fredgiblet · · Score: 4, Insightful

    So they realized it, but the problem is that pretty much all the people in power want it that way, so nothing will change, no matter how many sternly worded letters and resolutions get introduced.

    1. Re:Captain OBVIOUS by Dunbal · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Yeah they realized it. Now, it took how many people how many years and how much money to realize what everyone already knows? Ahh, you have to love bureaucracy. But just wait, they'll come up with a solution that makes everything more expensive and actually makes the problem worse instead of better.

      --
      Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
    2. Re:Captain OBVIOUS by Clsid · · Score: 2

      It worked wonders for the US in Yugoslavia and Iraq. It works for other countries like Russia by avoiding the Libyan scenario in Syria. China effectively has to be more open and invest overseas to gain friends since they want to regain control of Taiwan (Chinese investments in Costa Rica), which means UN members has to withdraw their support on Taiwan.

      The UN is a lot of things though, not just the security council. It is a great opportunity for world governments to consolidate policies, especially with things like the Millenium Development Goals. Like every form of government, it's not all bad or good, but just what we have.

    3. Re:Captain OBVIOUS by rtb61 · · Score: 2

      The UN vs World Wars, hmm, let's stick with the UN. As for the privacy issue, the rich and greedy have finally realised they can not steal our privacy without giving away theirs.

      --
      Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
    4. Re:Captain OBVIOUS by readin · · Score: 2

      Like every form of government, it's not all bad or good, but just what we have.

      The U.N. isn't a form of government, it is a club of governments. The behavior of a club is largely determined by what kind of members it has. Most members of the U.N. are autocratic oppressive government and U.N. behavior reflects that.

      --
      I often don't like the choices people make, but I like the fact that people make choices. That's why I'm a conservative.
    5. Re:Captain OBVIOUS by cold+fjord · · Score: 2

      Its the UN, have they EVER been anything but worthless, expensive, and ineffective?

      Depends on your point of view. You could view it as a "convenient" place to bash Israel, or an institution with an enormous time wasting obsession with Israel.

      From: Middle East Quarterly - Winter 2004
      The Case for Israel

      ... The Case For Israel ... Dershowitz points out that a full 27 percent of the U.N.'s country-specific resolutions critical of a state have been directed against it. In contrast, no resolution in the history of the U.N. Commission on Human Rights has condemned Syria, China, Saudi Arabia, or Zimbabwe, all of which are self-evidently far worse violators of human rights. Israel, asserts Dershowitz, has a "far better record on human rights than any other nation in the Middle East and most other nations in the world." As evidence, he notes that "Israel is the only nation in the world whose judiciary actively enforces the rule of law against its military during wartime" and that "Israel has killed fewer innocent civilians in proportion to the number of its own civilians killed than any country engaged in a comparable war."... The Case for Israel

      I think that anti-Israel resolutions as a percentage of the cumulative total number of resolutions has actually fallen quite a bit over the last couple of decades. It might in fact be major progress getting it down to only 27%. On the other hand, what would the UN be if it didn't have Israel to bash? Would the 57 OIC - Organisation of Islamic Cooperation members still bother to show up?

      Somehow it seems oddly important for its size: Israel is only 1/6 of 1% of the landmass of the Middle East

      I can see how the UN might appear to be largely worthless.

      --
      much of left-wing thought is a kind of playing with fire by people who don't even know that fire is hot - George Orwell
    6. Re:Captain OBVIOUS by hairyfeet · · Score: 2

      Israel is an asshole surrounded by other assholes, the best thing the USA could do is wash our hands of the whole damned thing. The sad part is we waste billions of our tax dollars because of a bunch of right wing loony tunes and a single line written by goatherders about Jews in Zion...ya know what? if their God is so damned weak that it can't keep a handful of people in one place without the US military? Then you have a shitty God and should really go elsewhere.

      As for the UN? Waste of time, that is ALL it is. Every single example the other poster gave as a positive? Was just rubber stamping shit that the west was gonna do anyway! I mean if the UN told Dubya he couldn't take over Iraq and Afghanistan does anybody HONESTLY think he would have given a fuck? Does anybody HONESTLY think that if the UN told Nobama he couldn't be using drone strikes he would give a shit?

      Its an impotent org that makes its little resolutions nobody follows or cares about, occasionally sending "peacekeepers" to be nice targets, that's about it. Its nothing but the league of nations in a different skin and just as worthless. As for the other poster saying "they prevented world wars"? I'm throwing a flag, bullshit on the field. What stopped world wars was THE BOMB, which is why every tinpot dictator wants one now that they can't play one side off against the other like they did during the cold war. The UN didn't have a damned thing to do with it, it was fear of starting WWIII that kept everyone just slaughtering third world countries in "proxy wars", NOT the worthless UN.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
  2. Captain Obvious strikes again! Too bad... by CmdrEdem · · Score: 3, Insightful

    .. that UN can`t really do anything unless countries support it. Countries where governments are more and more interested in speech restriction so they can keep the shiny power!

    --
    This combination doesn`t exist: ETIs that know about humanity and want to see us dead. Otherwise we wouldn't exist.
    1. Re:Captain Obvious strikes again! Too bad... by interval1066 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      that UN can`t really do anything unless countries support it.

      The UN WON'T do anything, and acting like the UN is some kind of savior is foolish, I'm really surprised at the number of supposedly intelligent people who always want to run to the UN to solve world problems. Shall I chant the number of wars and atrocities the UN has seen fit to turn its back on over the last 40 years yet again? Maybe I'm a fool but it seems like the UN's FIRST responsibility as I read their charter is to either prevent or interceed in such matters, and your running to them to write up some kind of rules on international censorship? ~cough~

      --
      Python: 'And then suddenly you have a language which says "we're all stuck with whatever the whiniest coder wants".'
    2. Re:Captain Obvious strikes again! Too bad... by superwiz · · Score: 2

      Italy has nukes. I don't remember the last time Italy's opinion on anything counted for anything. Germany doesn't have nukes. And the keeps wondering if the German's will keep EU alive if they have to lend money to Italy. Power to build is the power to sustain life. Power to build increases whenever it is used because it increases sustainability of life. Power to kill ends as soon as it is used.

      --
      Any guest worker system is indistinguishable from indentured servitude.
    3. Re:Captain Obvious strikes again! Too bad... by tragedy · · Score: 2

      Italy doesn't, technically, have its own nukes. It's a nuclear weapons "sharing" arrangement under NATO. I think pretty much the way it works is that another NATO country (OK, the US) with nukes keeps some on one of its own bases in Italy or otherwise under some sort of lock and key. In the event of something requiring their use, they get released or unlocked somehow and Italian soldiers take over. Of course, Germany is another country that participates in the nuclear sharing program so the comparison the GP made between them based on one having nukes and the other not having nukes is a little baffling.

  3. Not the monitoring, it's the ACTION that matters by SuperKendall · · Score: 4, Interesting

    It doesn't matter how much or who monitors you.

    What matters is what actions are taken from the monitoring - if any.

    Given that monitoring is impossible to prevent or really limit, all efforts should be made in shaming those taking bad ACTIONS based upon collected data.

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
  4. Re:Ah, a sternly worded letter! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    A first post means more than a sternly worded letter. At least the first post gets read and replied to.

  5. Re:Not the monitoring, it's the ACTION that matter by canadiannomad · · Score: 4, Insightful

    all efforts should be made in shaming those taking bad ACTIONS based upon collected data.

    To heck with *shaming* people who take bad actions with collected data need to be *punished*. And pretty severely at that.

    --
    Hmm, the humour and sarcasm seem to have been be lost on you.
  6. Re:Not the monitoring, it's the ACTION that matter by CmdrEdem · · Score: 4, Interesting

    "Information is power." This is not strictly true, but information multiplies actions` effectiveness. The more information someone has about anyone makes easier to manipulate the victim without anyone`s knowledge. Always keep that in mind.

    --
    This combination doesn`t exist: ETIs that know about humanity and want to see us dead. Otherwise we wouldn't exist.
  7. Surveillance is bad for business, too... by real-modo · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Bruce Schneier points out one of the ways in this essay.

  8. noh8rz to UN: no shi by noh8rz10 · · Score: 2

    t sherlock

  9. Re:Not the monitoring, it's the ACTION that matter by SuperKendall · · Score: 2

    "Information is power." This is not strictly true, but information multiplies actions` effectiveness

    That's exactly right, but since we cannot stop the information gathering all we can work on is the other end of the lever, and to make there be some serious repercussions to others using that information as a multiplier.

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
  10. Re:Shaving Claims by smittyoneeach · · Score: 2

    But can your weiner win a mayoral seat in NYC? That's the question, Anthony.

    --
    Get thee glass eyes, and, like a scurvy politician, seem to see things thou dost not.--King Lear
  11. Two quotes come to mind . . . by PolygamousRanchKid+ · · Score: 3, Interesting

    "We must plan for freedom, and not only for security, if for no other reason than only freedom can make security more secure." -- Karl Popper, The Open Society and Its Enemies

    "To me, social media is the worst menace to society." -- Recep Tayyip Erdoan, Prime Minister of Turkey

    . . . what interesting times we live in . . .

    --
    Schroedinger's Brexit: The UK is both in and out of the EU at the same time!
  12. Re:Not the monitoring, it's the ACTION that matter by Culture20 · · Score: 2

    It doesn't matter how much or who monitors you. What matters is what actions are taken from the monitoring - if any.

    What matters is what actions could be taken from the monitoring, because eventually some government somewhere will try to step over the line and take those actions.

  13. Re:Not the monitoring, it's the ACTION that matter by Jockle · · Score: 2

    People with unchecked power almost always abuse it; history has taught us that. So yes, it is extremely foolish not to be wary of the government, and it is even more foolish to let it spy on the people.

  14. Re:Missing the point by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    And just as absolutely you will not be able to prevent the monitoring.

    Not necessarily. The entire government doesn't have to be corrupt from top to bottom in order for abuses to happen, and mistakes (like the government overreacting to bomb jokes and infringing upon people's freedoms) will inevitably occur no matter how corrupt the government is.

    It's difficult to prevent the government from secretly monitoring its citizens, but maybe not impossible.

  15. we the real anonymous will now speak by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    What you have had before was fun interesting and a start to show what kids can do if given freedom and with that freedom they WILL rise up....When you persecuted , infiltrated and incarcertated those kids ....you bring us into the light....we are not the script kiddies. We are not the dumb bearded kids living in basements and with moms....no we are YOU....look around , all walks of life , all brackets of age and wealth and of every religion or non religion ....( well except scientology but cults dont count )

    We are as a associative group are of like mind and seek the freedom of all nations peoples ot live without fear of a police officer or army officer to harm them when they speak there mind....SOME speech , mostly that of hate should not be tolerated however for it is that which gives rise to the very people that have taken our civil rights and liberties. They like scientology or hitler used hate to bring you form being a individual into a hive mind so they could act for you often in ways you would abhore given more time to make your reasoning.

    THE USA for all its wealth and pwer has one main problem....it has now a rank of 31 for avg math skills.its reading isn't far off. Who needs ot read or count when you have actors and musicans and army men with automatic rifles? WELL there comesa time on earth when all this violence will be seen for what it is....just old school riuch people trying to keep there status above you all like gods or kings. The USA will ahve at obama;s end of term 21 trillion in debts.

    china will be getting close to passing it...have you seen the skies of its capital during the day....now think of L.A. during nixons time when enviromental movements began...

    what has changed.....are you better off?
    is there peacfe on earth.....ask your sleves this ....if by the odd chance some alien space craft came here and suveyed this world what would you htink if you were them?
    NO really. of all the cultures on earth we hackers get this the most. WE know that race , religion and wealth mean nothing to us....we are all equal....
    you cannot fight this....nor our curiosity to learn and know more.
    YOUR laws of copyright and patents are going to destroy us one day....and i will cry...

  16. Please check your history. by s.petry · · Score: 2

    The UN is absolutely not a government. The UN was established as a way of resolving disputes without wars. The UN is a set of agreements between governments on how to resolve disputes. Soldiers working for the UN are provided by member governments, and act in the voted interest of all of the government members of the UN. Aid from the UN is provided by the member governments and distributed by the voted interests of the member governments.

    In concept, the UN is a good thing. In practice however, larger governments are able to abuse the platform as an excuse to do bad things just like they abuse their own powers in their home governments.

    Today, we must be very cautious of the UN. Sovereign nations must remain sovereign for the UN to work, yet there is a tremendous amount of rhetoric attempting to convince people that all countries are subjects of the UN. We have seen the UN used as a shield for certain member governments to destroy sovereign governments.

    To my last paragraph, you should remember that you only hear what your governments want you to hear in regards to Libya, Syria, Egypt, etc... There is another side of the story (at least one, but often more) that you don't hear. The established media, even in countries like the US, rarely presents reality. Thankfully the Internet allows you to search for information which breaks the illusion, and anyone trying to get out of the cave still can.

    --

    -The wise argue that there are few absolutes, the fool argues that there are no probabilities.