Slashdot Mirror
Apple Revises Warranty Policies In Europe To Comply With EU Laws
ccguy writes "Apple revised its warranty policy in Italy last year after being hit with a €900,000 fine for not complying with an EU-mandated two-year term. The company has today revised the terms of its warranties in France, Germany and Belgium, specifying that customers are entitled to repairs and replacements of their Apple products for a full two years after purchase, and not just one as previously stated. No word yet on when the rest of the EU will see those changes, but it would now seem to be just a matter of time before other countries get the new terms as well."
Their products only last a year, by then you would be two versions behind and obsolete.
The article, as many articles before, confuses "manufacturer's warranty", which is unchanged, and "legal rights against the seller". Apple as the manufacturer can give any manufacturer warranty they like in the EU, and they give the same warranty as any other manufacturer. The seller, that is the shop that sold the goods, whoever that seller is, has legal obligations to make sure the product works for a reasonable time.
The only thing that has changed is that Apple makes more clear on the page where they explain their one year manufacturer's warranty, that you have other rights against the seller. If you look at Dell's website for example, there is not the slightest trace of such information, even though Dell doesn't sell through any store, so if you buy a Dell product, then they are _always_ the seller (whereas Apple is sometimes the seller, and Apple stores also sell other company's products, in which case that Apple store also is the seller responsible to handle your legal rights).
No word yet on when the rest of the EU will see those changes, but it would now seem to be just a matter of time before other countries get the new terms as well.
Nope. the customers in other EU countries already have the same (or very similar) terms. Because these terms are based on laws that are based on EU guidelines. And law trumps whatever Apple says they are willing to do.
The only thing missing is Apple admitting to the customers what rights they have under the law.
B*****m
Language!
Well, duh. This is just the paperwork catching up with the law. EU citizens already have 2 year warranties.
Excuse me, but please get off my Pennisetum Clandestinum, eh!
Any of you wonder why the text reading “revised the terms of its warranties in France, Germany and Belgium” links to an article that instead says: “Apple has updated its policies”? And why said article doesn’t link to those policies but instead (for Germany at least) links not to a promised PDF but an article at ifun.de?
http://www.ifun.de/apple-kommuniziert-gewaehrleistungsanspruch-deutlicher-41275/
In which is stated that Apple adds this paragraph to its product pages in the Apple Store:
“In Deutschland haben Verbraucher gemäß BGB innerhalb von zwei Jahren ab Übergang der Ware Anspruch auf eine kostenlose Reparatur, einen kostenlosen Austausch, einen Rabatt oder eine Rückzahlung durch den Händler, wenn das gekaufte Produkt zum Zeitpunkt des Übergangs nicht dem Kaufvertrag entspricht.”
My human translation: “In Germany—according to BGB [Bürgerliches Gesetzbuch/civil code]— customers have the right, within tow years of transfer of the goods, of free repair, free replacement, a rebate or repayment by the vendor, if the purchased product does not comply with the terms of the purchase contract at the date of transfer.”
They do this because with the Apple Store (be it online or brick and mortar) they are the vendor. This, EU-mandated, german warranty applies to the vendor. If you buy an Apple product at Random-Computer-Hütte and it breaks within one year you can either call the manufacturer Apple upon their 1-year warranty or go to the vendor. If it breaks after a year but within two years you’ll have to deal with that vendor. If you buy at an Apple-run store manufacturer and vendor are the same. And if it breaks after two years you could use Apple-care if you bought it.
Still, Apples warranty gives better protection. With the EU-warranty, if the product breaks after 6 months the burden of proof that the product did not comply with the terms of the purchase contract when you bought it, is on your side. And if you buy AppleCare you not only get Apple warranty for three years instead of one, but free phone support on top of that.
By coincidence, I happened to notice this on their UK site, yesterday evening:
"Claim period
2 years (minimum) from date of delivery, 5 years in Scotland and 6 years in the rest of the UK"
http://www.apple.com/uk/legal/statutory-warranty/
"Absorbing your worst..."
If you're in the UK it's always worth remembering that the Sales of Goods Act cover electrical goods for up to 6 (or is it 7?) years depending upon the product's application. Recently I quoted it to Quantum to get them to replace our knackered DLT S4 drive that packed up after about 4 year's use. I argued that since it was an enterprise product it was reasonable to assume it should last the full 6 years. They agreed surprisingly quickly and replaced the unit with a new one. A friend of mine used the same tactic on Apple with a broken Time Capsule that was also out of warranty - same result, quote the Sales of Goods Act and they'll give you a replacement.
The problem is that Apple acts as both the manufacturer and the seller if you buy from Apple Store (online or retail). As a manufacturer Apple provides a one year warranty and still do so, that was never the issue. However as a seller Apple also is responsible for hardware defects, and this is something that they have to do for two years; but only if you actually bought from them. If you bought from a reseller then it's the reseller that has that responsibility. That responsibility is very limited in comparison to a traditional warranty and as a customer you essentially has to prove that the defect was the result of manufacturing. As a seller you are also responsible for explaining this to the customer. Apple did not explain this well enough to customers, and that was what the problem was all about.
Are you sure you're in the right thread?
(-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
The problem is that Apple acts as both the manufacturer and the seller if you buy from Apple Store (online or retail). As a manufacturer Apple provides a one year warranty and still do so, that was never the issue.
Whong. The EU law applies to manufacturers and requires them to provide a manufacturer's warranty for a "reasonable life" of the device. For computers and suchlike, that's 2 years according to the law.
However as a seller Apple also is responsible for hardware defects, and this is something that they have to do for two years; but only if you actually bought from them. If you bought from a reseller then it's the reseller that has that responsibility. That responsibility is very limited in comparison to a traditional warranty and as a customer you essentially has to prove that the defect was the result of manufacturing. As a seller you are also responsible for explaining this to the customer.
Wrong. A seller may provide an additional warranty beyond the legally required manufacturer's warranty. That in no way alters the manufacturer's duty under EU law to provide a 2 year warranty.
Apple did not explain this well enough to customers, and that was what the problem was all about.
Wrong. The problem was that Apple (the manufacturer) does not provide a manufacturer's warranty of 2 years as required by EU law. They insisted it should only be 1 year, in flagrant defiance of the EU laws. The fine they received was a minor wrist slap, but would probably have been repeated in heavier increments if their illegal stance had continued.
Isn't that sort of short for a PC?
Troll is not a replacement for I disagree.
Call your Congressman. Send him a postcard.
Whong. The EU law applies to manufacturers and requires them to provide a manufacturer's warranty for a "reasonable life" of the device. For computers and suchlike, that's 2 years according to the law.
Nonsense. It applies to sellers.
In the case of Apple, the manufacturer is a big and world wide known company. But in reality, most products are built by companies that you have never heard of, and that you would never be able to contact. If I go to the local supermarket and buy some electronic goods, made in China by god-knows-who, a manufacturer's warranty would be completely useless to me, because my chances of getting things fixed by a company somewhere in Shanghai are practically zero. Instead, I go to the seller, and they fix it.
It is very simple: If you, as a customer, buys an electronic device in the EU, and it malfunctions within 2 years, you are entitled to a free repair or replacement. There is no discussion possible. The store you bought it from has to take care of it, whether it is the manufacturer itself or some reseller. Its their problem.
int main(void) {while(1) fork(); return 0;}
Luxembourg is a nice country, but you're highly mistaken about worker rights. Go read the Code du Travail if you've got some time. You can find it on legilux.lu.
Ahhh...the great dumpster continuum. Many a free computer will be found there. -- sowth (748135)
We are openly breaking the law, and you must drag us to court, before we change that. It's just because we like your money. Ethics is a foreign word, that we see as a limitation to reaching our goal of making money in every way conceivable.
Monkey spunk. Your contract is with the seller, not with any of his suppliers, subcontractors etc.
http://ec.europa.eu/consumers/ecc/consumer_topics/buying_goods_services_en.htm
"Always try to contact the seller first: under your 2-year guarantee, the seller is liable if the product turns out to be faulty or not as advertised. "
I do hope you're not a practicing lawyer.
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
Or are you seriously suggesting that a US based manufacturer has to provide this warranty if a EU based retailer resells their products?
It doesn't matter. They've got their own store-fronts that operate in the EU (both online and physical), they're explicitly selling to EU consumers, they specifically invoice within the EU too. The location of the head office and the factories isn't too important; EU law applies because of all the other factors. (In particular, the 2 year guarantee is because that is what is considered to be the amount that can be expected from a computing device costing those sorts of amounts, and EU consumer law doesn't allow manufacturers to disclaim very much when it comes to selling to consumers. B2B is different.) Of course, this doesn't protect consumers anywhere else in the world. They need their own local laws. Also, this wouldn't apply to sale of used computers; there it is the seller that bears the brunt of the onus, and the expected level of warranty is also lower.
"Little does he know, but there is no 'I' in 'Idiot'!"
At Portugal you can claim the warranty from the Seller or the Manufacturer at your choice. The warranty period is for AT LEAST 2 years, or anytime later if you can prove it was a manufacturer defect (basically impossible except if it is a class issue). Apple did give me some trouble back in 2009 to repair a MBP battery with about 18 months and I asked them nicely to fuck off. They replaced it after a few days.
When Apple was fined for this, lot of Apple fans at Slashdot said that Apple will withdraw their products from sale in Europe. Then all of Europe's citizen's will rise in revolt to get European countries to change their laws so that Apple can sell their products with whatever warranty Apple deems fit.
It applies to the manufacturer.
No, it doesn't, where the hell did you get that idea from? http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=CELEX:31999L0044:en:HTML
Article 5
Time limits
1. The seller shall be held liable under Article 3 where the lack of conformity becomes apparent within two years as from delivery of the goods. If, under national legislation, the rights laid down in Article 3(2) are subject to a limitation period, that period shall not expire within a period of two years from the time of delivery.
Of course news about a fake are Fake News.
They don't have to. They have the choice of whether or not to sell in Europe.
Here are two wrongs.
There is two kinds of warranties. A two years conformity warranty and at least a one year hardware product warranty. The problem is the conformity warranty. The producer warrants that the product is in conformity with the technical specs declared at sale time. In the two years interval, if some thing is not really like in the specs, the producer is liable to change the product or to pay the customer.
And this tell us that Apple lies to their customers. The product is not like in the commercial.