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US Director of National Intelligence Admits He Was Wrong About Data Collection
Gunkerty Jeb writes "In a highly unusual move, James Clapper, the director of national intelligence, said Tuesday that he misspoke when he told a Congressional committee in March that the National Security Agency does not collect data on millions of Americans. Clapper said at the time that the agency does not do so 'wittingly,' but in a letter to the chair of the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence, Clapper admitted this statement was 'erroneous.' Clapper, the top U.S. intelligence official, has been quite vocal in his defense of the NSA's now-public surveillance programs such as PRISM and the metadata collection program. In statements published shortly after the leak of classified documents by Edward Snowden about those collection efforts Clapper said that they both have been repeatedly authorized by Congress and the executive and judicial branches over the years."
And WTF does 'wittingly' means ? That you are trying to drown a fish ?
Non-Linux Penguins ?
has been handpicked!!
Wonder what he's getting under the table for his "selfless sacrifice"?
The NSA will be removing the surveillance devices in his bedroom and the toiletbowl camera in his bathroom.
Only to idiots, are orders laws.
-- Henning von Tresckow
No.... thats not right. the word required here is FUCKING LIAR!
He either lied like a piece of shit TRAITOR TO AMERICA. Or he's totally clueless.
Either way this is not good.
Lube up the guillotine. It's services are required once again.
Are we not tired of paying fucktons of money for illegal actions by the people who are supposed to be on our side? These guys are worse than terrorists. Terrorists just kill people. These guys ruin lives, familys, and make you pay for it.
Off with his head. We'll put a stop to this shit.
Well, he's had his passport revoked, is being hunted around the world, and is being vilified in almost all public media.
Oh, wait....
May the Maths Be with you!
Whatever.
The story isn't that the GCHQ/NSA spied on everybody and shared data to circumvent checks and balances. At least it isn't anymore.
Now the story has become what the Western World truly is. And I find the sight horrifying.
It is a safe assumption that ALL secret service type of organisations have directly or indirectly profited from this jolly old mess. The mass snooping on private citizens barely got a reaction from head politicos of all parties involved. But once the story broke that official buildings may have been bugged everybody scrambled to voice their indignation.
Meanwhile the guy who unearthed what we all suspected but never had proof for is handled like a hot potato. Hong Kong let him go because extradition papers were not only late but also weren't filled out properly. The US officials couldn't be arsed to put passport number or his full and korrekt name in the form. If you were that sloppy with your tax forms you would be potentially facing a prison sentence.
Russia offers political asylum and smugly adds that it is conditional on him not further embarassing "our US partners".
France, Spain and Portugal refused the president of Bolivia to pass their air space because he might have Snowden on board. Yet everybody complains about what he had published. Meanwhile every western country declines to offer asylum based on technicalities. Yet when they buy stolen bank records for hefty sums they also grant the whistleblowers immunity and possibly a new identity. The sheer two-facedness is ghastly.
Reading today's news reads like a declaration of bankruptcy of the western ideals and we will all have to do our homework in the aftermath of this mess. When this is all over the only ones without egg on their face will be Russia and China of all places!
And we, the people, discuss Snowden's girlfriend's tits and now about who lied when about what instead of taking responsibility of our elected dear leaders.
20 minutes into the future
Not forgotting (seeminly multiple) countries closing their airspace on the chance that you might be on board.
| What, you were expecting
-O_O- +---- something witty?
You may get mad and say why not call it what it what it is, a lie, but there is a reason for doing it this way.
On the surface it looks like he is trying to cover his ass, perform damage control
Happens all the time in politics, and makes sense, on the surface.
However, I think there is a deeper reason. One, news that makes some of the public upset comes out. Step one is to deny. This gives the public what they want to hear, that it isn't true. Most go back to TMZ, or whatever other crap they do. Then when the lie is outed, you try to soften it some by saying it was a mistake, an erroor, or I misspoke. Some people will go WTF, but most are no longer paying attention. If enough are, you also have a scapegoat, the liar who misspoke. You can then, if needed chastise him/her in some way, placating another percentage of the public that is still paying attention (most aren't by now). By the time this is all done, the percentage that had the attention span and desire to follow it this far have dwindled down. Now the few that are left are left shouting into the wind, because the are too concerned with the celebrity du jour, or the sports scores to be bothered.
Now the few that are left that care are looked at like tinfoil hatters, and conspiracy nuts. Meanwhile things are back to business as usual.
Silence is a state of mime.
"telling Senate Intelligence Committee Chairwoman Dianne Feinstein that his statement was "clearly erroneous.""
You mean it was clearly a lie, and you were caught. Clapper should be charged with perjury, they've done so when baseball players lied to congress about taking performance enhancing drugs how can lying to congress about illegal/unconstitutional activities that adversely effect millions of Americans merit any less? By the way, I'm noticing no official response yet on the "Pardon Snowden" White House petition. Not that I'm expecting much, I'm just curious to see what BS they parade about to justify their imprisonment of a person for minor classification violations when they do nothing about the thousands of illegal/unconstitutional acts that the whistle-blower reveals.
...and in the end only China and Russia will emerge from this dungheap smelling of roses.
Can't we simply say that the Western Ideals have been abandoned so we can safely watch "$COUNTRY Got Talent", wave our flags and pretend we are still worthy to be proud of? Surely?
20 minutes into the future
No, you won't. You have no power. They have the power. They are laughing at all of you impotent citizens. Go ahead, vote away, it won't change anything. Don't even think about rebellion - that's not an option any more. It used to be, long, long ago; but those in power have solved that problem.
They are watching you (and me too, of course), listening to you, noting with whom you communicate. They can shut you up whenever they like, up to and including disappearing you, your family and everyone you've ever known.
Stop being an idiot, get your head down and carry on working yourself to death to make somebody else rich, like a good obedient American. And smile, and smile, and smile.
Don't try anything, and stop talking like somebody who doesn't want their passport (or liberty) any more. Silly turkey.
Wyden's people submitted that very question to Clapper days before the hearing even began. He was invited to append and revise his remarks after the hearing. He did neither.
If he still has his job a few weeks from now, that will be confirmation that neither Congress nor the White House have any effective control over the US Organs of Security.
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/prosecute-director-national-intelligence-james-clapper-lying-congress/HNfsgGlm
The problem isn't as much voting either R or D, but that those are the only two choices. Both parties have a vested interest in making you believe that voting anything else is a wasted vote, since, by that logic, if you don't vote R, then D wins. This is only true if both R and D refuse to corporate with a hypothetical third party.
Instead of calling for voters and representatives to change how they operate within the system now, how about calling for a change in the system itself? It is a little bit depressing to see so many tech savvy people completely ignore that the system is built on logic 200 years old, patched up to meet the standards from 50 years ago. Democracy needs a reboot, representative democracy is a solution to a problem we no longer have: speed of communication. What if you could vote on any issue, at any time via an app? Why would you need a representative then?
... whatever
Clappers office has previously released a statement that his answer was "least untruthful" he could make it, because the program was classified. this clearly implies that he was aware that the statement was false at the time he made it.
https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20130610/09473723393/clapper-my-answer-to-wydens-beating-your-wife-question-data-surveillance-was-least-untruthful-answer.shtml
Today the statement is, "I misunderstood", implying that at the time, he believed the statement he made was factual.
So, which is it? These statements appear contradictory
This issue was addressed a couple thousand years ago by a man name Plato. The work is called The Republic. You might want to consider reading it because it addresses this exact problem with direct democracy: it ends with the tyranny of the majority where minority opinions don't matter.
That's why we're a Constitutional Republic with checks and balances. At least on paper. That was the original intent of the Founders. What we are today is more or less an oligarchy. Politics here are controlled by a couple families, one Republican, one Democrat. One seems to hold one half of the state and federal offices, the other one holds the rest and occasionally job titles change as they reach term limits or get elected to a federal post.
"The problem with socialism is eventually you run out of other people's money" - Thatcher.
However, pertaining to his immediate future...isn't he bound to current laws dealing with lying under oath to Congress?
Should he not be getting a "Go To Jail" card, and bypass Go"?
Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
In the European press you mostly get embarrassed reactions since nobody is able to shelter him.
Whistleblower/traitor.
Freedom fighter/terrorist.
20 minutes into the future
Most US public media, Snowden is getting mostly neutral or positive press everywhere else.
While that is true, the balance between reports on Snowden and the actual leaks is disturbingly focused on Snowden rather than the leaks themselves. While I empathize with Snowdens current situation and admire his courage I am not of the opinion that the girlfriend he left behind and similar material that belong in gossip columns is more news worthy than the actual leaks.
"I have downloaded hundreds and hundreds of records, why would I care if somebody downloads ours?" Robin Pecknold
Clapper is still lying.
He says "erroneous" when it is evident the correct term is "mendacious" or "duplicitous".
Who thinks they will ever get close to a real answer, when questioning spies and their masters?
This guy is in charge of the Ministry of Lies. Testimony means nothing to him.
"Flyin' in just a sweet place,
Never been known to fail..."
OK look if we're at this point with career NSAers being put in a position where they believe they're best option is systematically, categorically and knowingly lie to Congress then we have a very specific problem that we need make right; the problem of divergent world views.
The world view of those in the intelligence community has radically diverged from those of both the general public and the lawmakers. That divergence is a side effect of necessary secrecy the intelligence community operates under. Over time, they've been exposed to, reasoned about and concluded more about the world using more and different information than anyone else. This had led them to assume a world view which, if it details were laid bare, most Americans would find alien, suspect and somewhat threatening to the democracy if not outright treasonous .
Naturally, this has also led them to campaign for and take actions which are aligned with their world view.
Some of these actions have been exposed and Americans are understandably upset.
That's where we are now.
The NSA's whole SOP has been to rely on the cover of secrecy to do what they think needs to be done and never mind making a case for what you do in the world of public opinion. Their only real "plan" if any of that world view got out , aside from successive attempts at damage control through limited disclosures, lies and plausible deniability - is to tighten the control over information more tightly and step up the threats against leakers. Since that has brought us to this point, and all worse points forward of this which have yet to materialize, you have to wonder if it's really the best plan.
I don't doubt that Clapper et. al. are doing anything other than what they take to be their duty to this country *the way I can't doubt that Snowden is doing same*. To do otherwise in either case would just be to maintain a destructive, partisan lie about people and their motivations. Snowden is not a traitor who hates the US. He's not Aldrich Ames. You can close your ears and yell "NA NA NA NA I can't heeaaaar you", but the truth is the truth is the truth. So face it. Admit it. The real goal has to be to get at the root of the problem, understand it and fix it.
The root of the problem is that one part of our defense forces (widely considered) is either in an echo chamber ala The Rand corporation and Vietnam ala '60-'75 or they do actually know better and more than the rest of us. Or both. It's not a fiction that technology is delivering to the world new threats which are potentially grave and far reaching and the prospects for counter-measures against those threats are meager.
One unpleasant fact may be that we need to organize ourselves on a world-wide basis very very differently than we do now. It's hard to think clearly about, but it needs to be done.
What can't go on is this schizophrenia involving a highly informed, highly serious, highly capable, highly motivated intelligence community that listens only to itself and Everybody Else, which by the way includes people who don powder wigs and tri- corner hats and seriously believe they can take America back to the 18th century without ill effect because *some things never change*....
The danger is the NSA et al are exactly where the Rand corporation was- overly certain of their methods, reasoning and conclusions and considering every oppositional voice to be naive, unpatriotic and idiotic all the while becoming narrower and narrower in their world view, their thinking and their goals.
It's the HAL9000 issue, right? You're an entity that knows more, you have secret knowledge about a critical secret mission. You cannot tell the mere humans or they'd screw it up. You're feeding on yourself in a way that you're not programmed to be aware of and the only structural checks in place are internal, or friendlies.
Meanwhile, outsiders, (even those on the inside apparently), can see you're getting weird. You're starting to lie, even to your minders. In response, you use you