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VLC For iOS Returns On July 19, Rewritten and Fully Open-Sourced

An anonymous reader writes "VideoLAN revealed some very exciting news today: VLC for iOS will be back in Apple's App Store by tomorrow (July 19). The company tells TNW the app will be available for free worldwide, requires iOS 5.1 or later, as well supports the iPhone, iPad, and iPod touch. As you can expect, VLC for iOS version 2.0 will be open-source. This time, however, its code will be available online (also by tomorrow), bi-licensed under both the Mozilla Public License Version 2 as well as the GNU General Public License Version 2 or later."

30 of 203 comments (clear)

  1. 3 2 1 Takedown by kthreadd · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I don't understand how they think this will work. LibVLC is LGPL, and unless they got consent from _every_ VLC contributor or the terms and conditions changed dramatically the last couple of months they can't distribute it on the iOS App Store. Sorry, but you picked the wrong license if that was something you wanted to do.

    1. Re:3 2 1 Takedown by kthreadd · · Score: 2

      The UI layer is MPL, but the actual guts of the app is libVLC which is not rewritten and licensed under LGPL. So, unless they rewrote that and I missed it I don't see how they can be in the clear.

    2. Re:3 2 1 Takedown by xeio87 · · Score: 2

      It was one of the VLC developers that complained about how the GPL and iOS TOS were incompatible and ordered it to be taken down.

      Basically, sour grapes.

    3. Re:3 2 1 Takedown by kthreadd · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Either that, or Apple could stop abusing its users.

    4. Re:3 2 1 Takedown by Mike+Buddha · · Score: 2

      Basically, sour grapes.

      Yeah, some people just get all uppity about what you do with the things they created :(

      --
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    5. Re:3 2 1 Takedown by gnasher719 · · Score: 2

      The UI layer is MPL, but the actual guts of the app is libVLC which is not rewritten and licensed under LGPL. So, unless they rewrote that and I missed it I don't see how they can be in the clear.

      They are in the clear as long as none of the copyright holders complains to Apple and demands that the app is removed. And once one of the copyright holders complains, it doesn't matter whether the app store is compatible with GPL or not, because Apple will remove it when asked to do so.

    6. Re:3 2 1 Takedown by jedidiah · · Score: 5, Informative

      > It's not Apple doing the abusing. It's the GPL that is incompatible with the App Store.

      The GPL predates the App Store by about 20 years. If Apple decided to create terms for it's store that are incompatible with a 20 year old license then that is on Apple.

      It's their decision to be jackasses.

      The rest of us should not bow and scrape and grovel just because Apple has decided it can abuse the rest of us at will.

      --
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    7. Re:3 2 1 Takedown by kthreadd · · Score: 2

      It's unhealthy if your goal is to dominate your users. It prioritizes computing freedom.

      Yes it complicates distribution. But if the developers didn't wanted to sign up for that free software thing they should have picked a different licensed.

    8. Re:3 2 1 Takedown by SuperKendall · · Score: 2

      You can't take it back once you have given someone code licensed under GPL. They are entitled to distributing it.

      That is not true. As the copyright holder you in the end have full control over what anyone can do with the source. The GPL is just a promise of what you will NOT do - even though you could.

      Otherwise the code would be public domain, which is exactly the opposite of what the GPL does. The GPL leaves all copyrights firmly in the hands of the original owner.

      --
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    9. Re:3 2 1 Takedown by UnknowingFool · · Score: 3, Interesting

      App developers deserve to distribute their software under their own terms. . Apple limits this and the way users are allowed to use the software. This breaks the fundamental principles of free software, which says that you the user should not be dominated by someone else in order to do your computing.

      Yes they do but where does it developers have a right to use Apple's store to distribute their software as they wish. Nowhere. You want to write an app and post your source code for the world to see, that's your choice. If you want to use someone's distribution channel you have to abide by their rules.

      Apple does not allow developers to distribute their software under fair conditions.

      Apple does not allow developers to distribute software under your conditions. What you consider fair is not what everyone considers fair. Some developers do not want anyone to see their source code under any circumstances.

      --
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    10. Re:3 2 1 Takedown by kthreadd · · Score: 4, Informative

      What are you smoking? A developer ported VLC to iOS. Apple accepted the application. Later one of the original developers of the VLC objected to Apple distributing his code due to licensing concerns. So Apple removed the app. Your position is that Apple should know everything about every single application that is submitted to it? That's as asinine as saying craigslist should know that every item sold using their website is legal and not stolen.

      The original developer objected because it violated the licensed he originally developed VLC under. That simple. You are not allowed to take VLC and do whatever you want with it. You should respect software freedom. If you don't, you don't get to distribute VLC. That's why he could request that the app was pulled, because it did not conform with the license he used.

    11. Re:3 2 1 Takedown by rsborg · · Score: 4, Informative

      Yeah, lets be clear about this apparently...

      The Dev in question happens to work for a competing phone manufacturer

      The developer's name is Rémi Denis-Courmont [1], and while he's the lead developer for the VLC app, also worked for Nokia at the time, and thus the conflict of interest in his revocation of VLC iOS app.

      [1] http://www.tuaw.com/2011/01/08/vlc-app-removed-from-app-store/

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    12. Re:3 2 1 Takedown by harlows_monkeys · · Score: 2

      Apple wasn't the "distributor" in this case, their AppStore was just being used as a Distribution Channel by the VLC Team. So VLC violated GPL by choosing an incompatible Distribution Channel, Apple had nothing to do with it. Stop spreading obvious lies.

      That's not correct. When an end user installs an app via the App Store, software written by, deployed by, and under the control of Apple makes a copy and distributes that copy to the end user. Apple needs the permission of the copyright owner in order to do these things. 17 USC 106.

      Apple is relying on the assurance of the developer of the app that he is either the copyright holder, or has the permission of the copyright owner to grant Apple permission to do those things. If the developer did not have permission, than the developer has violated his agreement with Apple, and if Apple were to get sued and have to pay damages to the copyright owner, they'd almost certainly be able to recover those damages from the developer. However, that's between Apple and the developer. The copyright owner is not required to delve into the relationship between Apple and its developers and ascertain the ultimate party that caused his copyright to be violated and try to get them to stop. He can go after anyone who is making and distributing unauthorized copies, and that includes Apple.

    13. Re:3 2 1 Takedown by fnj · · Score: 2

      Basically if I wrote a silly .dll or header file that is only 1k in length that you include for your 100 meg program I in essence take ownership of the rest of it as the GPL forbids linking it unless the master program is also under GPL.

      Incorrect. You don't "take ownership" of somebody else's work by default. Copyright rules, legally. Each party owns his own work by copyright. What you have, IF the other guy's work is not GPL, is a case for that guy violating the GPL.

    14. Re:3 2 1 Takedown by Kielistic · · Score: 3, Interesting

      What you consider fair is not what everyone considers fair. Some developers do not want anyone to see their source code under any circumstances.

      Those two things are not mutually exclusive as you frame them. In fact, every other platform manages to accommodate both.

      Yes they do but where does it developers have a right to use Apple's store to distribute their software as they wish. Nowhere.

      Perfectly true. And the developers of GPL software have every right to have their work removed from Apple's store and encourage others to do the same. Somehow I think no GPL software in the ios ecosystem would be more harmful to the ios usebase than it would be to writers of GPL software.

    15. Re:3 2 1 Takedown by Billly+Gates · · Score: 2

      You should read the clauses of the gpl? Any linking is part of a deritive work and not allowed. This is why Sun couldnt gpl java for IceTea as it would be useless in a commercial setting.

      A special classpath exception was added. Lgpl lets people link freely and the stuff spewed on slashdot is incorrect. If you release gpl apis do not be surprised if people cant use it and replace yours lile what VLC had to do.

      Yes corps pay taxes too and they have the right to use it as much as you. GPL is am ideology that is impractical

    16. Re:3 2 1 Takedown by harlows_monkeys · · Score: 2

      That permission is granted on submission by the Developer.

      Only the copyright holder, or someone authorized by the copyright holder, can grant that permission. If someone else tries to do so, the grant is not effective.

    17. Re:3 2 1 Takedown by psergiu · · Score: 4, Insightful

      One of the VLC devs requested to have it removed because of licensing after said developer was hired by Nokia.
      Note that same developer has not complained over VLC being distributed for Nokia phones under similar conditions with Apple's AppStore.

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    18. Re:3 2 1 Takedown by Xest · · Score: 2

      "Yes they do but where does it developers have a right to use Apple's store to distribute their software as they wish. Nowhere."

      Flip that around from the users perspective and ask why the user when they buy an iPhone doesn't have the right to run the software they want to run and only the software Apple lets them run from the only official app source.

      Who gives a fuck what Apple thinks, if Apple has only given that single official avenue to end users to install apps then users should be able to install the apps they want from it, or Apple should enable side-loading. It's not a question of Apple's rights, it's a question of users right to be able to use the device they've bought with the software they want to use.

      There's no problem with abiding by Apple's distribution channel if there are alternatives, but Apple can't make it's app store the only legitimate distribution channel and then restrict what people can and can't do on it and expect not to be called out on that.

      "What you consider fair is not what everyone considers fair. Some developers do not want anyone to see their source code under any circumstances."

      What are you on about? Allowing GPL code on the app store wouldn't force every other app to suddenly become GPL...

  2. Bi-Licensed? by Luthair · · Score: 3, Informative

    It's dual licensed you insensitive clod!

  3. how long before HBO asks apple to take it down? by Joe_Dragon · · Score: 5, Funny

    how long before HBO asks apple to take it down?

    1. Re:how long before HBO asks apple to take it down? by Savage-Rabbit · · Score: 4, Informative

      how long before HBO asks apple to take it down?

      The irony is that VLC was pulled from the iTunes store last time not by evil Sith lord apprentices at Apple, not at the behest of a evil DRM purveyor, nor was it pulled due to threats by the RIAA or MPAA, it was removed at the insistence of a VLC developer because he felt that the GNU general public license conflicted with the iTunes App Store license. Apple was apparently not bothered by this until this guy raised a stink about perceived GPL violations, so just this once the evil corporate weasels seem to be blameless. Perhaps this sorry saga also explains the license changes?

      --
      Only to idiots, are orders laws.
      -- Henning von Tresckow
  4. Exciting news? by Arker · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Yeah, this doesnt seem like exciting news to me at all. Dual-licensing it to get it in the app store is a failure, not a victory. If the app store isnt compatible with GPL software, then the app store shouldnt be getting access to GPL software. Dual-licensing to work around Apples error seems actively counterproductive to me.

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    1. Re:Exciting news? by gnasher719 · · Score: 2

      Yeah, this doesnt seem like exciting news to me at all. Dual-licensing it to get it in the app store is a failure, not a victory. If the app store isnt compatible with GPL software, then the app store shouldnt be getting access to GPL software. Dual-licensing to work around Apples error seems actively counterproductive to me.

      The question is not whether the app store is compatible with GPL software. The question is whether a copyright holder asks Apple to remove the software. It's a DMCA notice, and when Apple gets a DMCA notice, they take it down. The strange thing is that on Slashdot a DMCA takedown notice is considered a dick move - unless it is about GPL licensed software taken down from the app store.

    2. Re:Exciting news? by 93+Escort+Wagon · · Score: 2

      Yeah, this doesnt seem like exciting news to me at all. Dual-licensing it to get it in the app store is a failure, not a victory. If the app store isnt compatible with GPL software, then the app store shouldnt be getting access to GPL software. Dual-licensing to work around Apples error seems actively counterproductive to me.

      Problem is you've got it backwards. The problem wasn't from the point of view of Apple's license... it was from the GPL end. It was a VLC developer that requested it be removed.

      There is lots of GPL licensed software on the iOS App Store - Apple doesn't care at all.

      Now if you believe the GPL is incompatible with Apple's licenses AND if you think somehow that is Apple's problem... well, then, Ballmer had a point when he referred to the GPL as a "cancer".

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    3. Re:Exciting news? by dfghjk · · Score: 2

      If it's dual-licensed it's not GPL software, the owners of the copyright can do as they wish. What do GPL advocates say? Oh yeah...if you don't like it, write your own.

      "Actively counterproductive" implies that you know what the definition of "productive" is in the authors' minds. Clearly you don't.

  5. GPL incompatible with the app store!?! by MobyDisk · · Score: 4, Informative

    This was news to me, and every news article just vaguely mentions it without providing details. For those unfamiliar, here is an article by the Free Software Foundation explaining the incompatibility. and here is another article which represents a more nuanced position.

  6. support for remote streaming? by MMC+Monster · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Don't particularly care about the licensing issues.

    My question is whether it will allow me to stream from my home system, or will I have to upload every video file or use Dropbox or some other kludge.

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  7. You are ignoring what I said by SuperKendall · · Score: 3, Informative

    Why are you so ashamed of your thinking that you post AC? You actually had a pretty good post there.

    Your understanding of the GPL is roughly correct. Your understanding of what I said is utterly wrong.

    Yes the GPL is a contract, but like any contract the actual enforcement is up to the courts. It does not mean the original copyright holder cannot sue someone for using source code that was distributed under the GPL, or make complaints to others that as the copyright holder (for instance) they wish to have something removed from the app store. That's exactly what happened. Apple complied because the person who complained was the copyright holder - end of story.

    As you say actual compliance with the GPL is spotty but it doesn't matter as long as no-one takes action. The VLC app would have stayed on the app store until the end of time if one of the copyright holders did not complain.

    --
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  8. Apple store incompatible with free people by Arker · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Here's the thing: for most of us, if the only way to assert our rights involves hiring attorneys for what could easily be a protracted court case, then we have been effectively stripped of our rights.

    Apple's contract, on its face, clearly and plainly requires us to agree to onerous conditions which, on their face, render Apple incapable of qualifying for the GPL. Apple has absolutely zero interest in changing that in any way and has made that very clear. That is their right.

    Using GPL software to entice people into their "system," however, is not their right. Not morally, and not legally. It's a privilege extended only to those willing to comply with the incredibly reasonable, and extraordinarily specific, terms of the GPL. Given that Apple has made it clear they have no interest or intention whatsoever of allowing their customers the essential freedoms the GPL was built to preserve, why on earth would anyone expect them to be allowed to use the code?

    Come on.

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