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Obama Seeks New System For Rating Colleges
PolygamousRanchKid writes "Targeting the soaring cost of higher education, President Barack Obama on Thursday unveiled a broad new government rating system for colleges that would judge schools on their affordability and perhaps be used to allocate federal financial aid. But the proposed overhaul faced immediate skepticism from college leaders who worry the rankings could cost their institutions millions of dollars, as well as from congressional Republicans wary of deepening the government's role in higher education. The new rating system does not require congressional approval, and the White House is aiming to have it set up before the 2015 school year. But Obama does need support from Congress in order to use the ratings as a basis for parceling out federal financial aid. In addition to tuition, schools will also be rated on average student loan debt, graduation rates and the average earnings of graduates. Under Obama's proposal, students attending highly rated schools could receive larger grants and more affordable loans."
What is the median salary, divided by total cost of education, one year and five years after graduation? That is really the main thing a prospective student needs to know. Everything else is window dressing.
So long, and thanks for all the Phish
Where is the actually written bill?
He loves going place to place and telling that audience what they want to hear and then passing the actual work to Congress who he knows won't/can't do it.
I'm neither a Congressman nor a Republican, but you can put me in the 'wary of deepening the government's role in higher education' column. So far their meddling in the marketplace has led to an inflation rate for higher education not only several times higher than the general inflation rate - but even higher than the 'skyrocketing healthcare cost' inflation rate we are alway hearing about.
Wary?!? Ha!
Cost of tuition has often been linked to a reduction in State Funding, you don't need to be a Republicrat or Democan, but a mathematician to figure it out. Also, helps to read the news.
Ha ha. So rich, I'm going to remember this one.
Every time I saw tuition go up when I was in school it followed cuts in public education funding. Out here in California, the tuition at UC and CSU has gone up quickly because the state is trying to get its own budget under control after running deep into the red while that stupid actor was elected and re-elected by people who thought a tough talking actor with no experience at all in any government office should reside in Sacramento for 8 years.
Ha hum damn. Going to take us a long time to pay off that mountain of debt, sorry UC and CSU.
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
Then governments have no choice but to make it free and widely available to anyone on demand.
College costs are due to the easy borrowing as a perverse consequence of trying to make college easier for people to afford. As with a car loan, nobody wants to pay $2000 for a fancy radio, but an extra $35/month, sign me up!
8% a year? No problem...on my loan! Sign me up!
The way to reign this in is to deny government backing for cheap loans to any college that increases costs more than 2% this year. And keep that up for 10 years to drag relative costs back down vs. inflation.
All these loudmouths in charge of colleges who throw up their hands and say hey don't know why, the liars will sort things out quickly.
Perverse incentives are perverse.
(-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
Every time I saw tuition go up when I was in school it followed cuts in public education funding.
Did you ever link it to the availability of easy student loans?
No, it was stated right in the announcements, published in the news. We would hear $500 M to $5 B being cut in announcements from the Governor's Office or California Department of Education - usually with a breakdown of what % would affect State of California colleges and universities as well as K-12 education, including Special Education, Early Childhood, Class Size Reduction and so on. There was quite a bit of paring of staff, but it couldn't cover it all, so tuition went up and students grumbled, protested and those unfortunate to be on the bubble had to drop out.
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
Since a degree is primarily a qualification, its importance lies in its scarcity. It used to be since many people didn't finish high school, a high school diploma had meaning, it was a qualification. Well, then it was decided that -everyone- should have a high school diploma and curriculum gets dumbed down to the point that any person not in a vegetative state can easily obtain a high school diploma, it stops being a qualification. So naturally people looked for the next higher qualification, a college degree, when this idea that everyone should have a college degree (which, believe me is certainly taking hold) the classes start to get dumber and dumber and suddenly a college degree stops being a qualification. Soon employers are looking for your master's degree...
Taxation is legalized theft, no more, no less.
Want the potential of college without the risk of massive debt due to picking the wrong major or flunking out?
Try Oregon's new College tuition bill "Pay Forward" (bill passed, but not yet implemented). The government pays for the full cost of tuition over 4 years. You pay them 3% of your salary for 24 years. Is it more expensive for the student? For good jobs, sure. But it gives a peace of mind that you aren't going to be hurt too badly financially, and reduces the penalty if college just didn't work out for you.
The proposotion sounds like a mask for lowering the standards. Sweden is already in this path. Results droop and they cannot admit the real reason because of politics. So the culprit must be the system. Everyone suffers and the esteem of educational institutions drop when they MUST take and pass students of ... let's say, lesser capabilities, in name of multiculturalism.
USA is fast becoming a social democratic european style hellhole.
'Once scientists, even the dim-witted social scientists, get muzzled, the Western Civilization is finished.' - oldhack
And a whole generation of unpaid bloggers for Huffington Post and Salon rise up........and take the bus to the Temp Agency.
There is absolutely no shortage of wealthy foreign students who will happily pay full rate for a US education so they can take it back to their own country and make it more competitive than the United States in the global economy.
Option 1 leaves out students who are plenty smart, but just goofed around in high school. Option 2 makes university degrees worthless.
First of all, you're comparing an Australian government propaganda site--excuse me--an Australian government site that's sole purpose is to show off what a good idea it is to come to Australia to study to a list of "topuniversities." There's a difference.
Secondly, an Australian bachelors degree is only three years versus four for the US. From my admittedly limited experience, Australian degrees tend to be more trade-oriented than most traditional US universities, so again, the difference is probably not as bleak as you make it out to be.
Finally, correct me if I'm wrong, but the majority of Australian universities are public and heavily subsidized (so again, compare apples to apples, publics to publics). Australian professor salaries are also lower, and Australian professorships are more akin to civilian servant positions. Professors in the US--august representatives of the academy--are basically their own social/political/economic class.
The best--or most expensive, depending on your take!--universities in the US probably cost in toto about 60k a year right. There are a LOT of families that can afford that without dipping into savings and without blinking an eye. The last figures I saw are that around 20% of all American families make 100k or more a year. The most expensive colleges are still really expensive, but there is a HUGE diversity of colleges in the US from junior colleges and community colleges, to small liberals arts, to big state publics, to privates research institutions, etc. Given the tremendous wealth in the US and the availability of cheap, easy to get government money, why NOT raise tuition? With very few exceptions (see Antioch), colleges and universities hardly ever go out of business or have trouble filling seats.
To be fair, you guys generally vote yourselves lower taxes and more services on a daily basis. You kinda deserve what you've done to your state via stupidity in direct voting.
Persistent Volume manager for Kubernetes - https://github.com/dwimsey/openshift-pvmanager
Want the potential of college without the risk of massive debt due to picking the wrong major or flunking out?
Try Oregon's new College tuition bill "Pay Forward" (bill passed, but not yet implemented). The government pays for the full cost of tuition over 4 years. You pay them 3% of your salary for 24 years. Is it more expensive for the student? For good jobs, sure. But it gives a peace of mind that you aren't going to be hurt too badly financially, and reduces the penalty if college just didn't work out for you.
I assume there's a provision for if the student moves out of state or out of the country.
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
Before grants and guaranteed college loans, colleges could only charge what the students could afford. I myself graduated from a big 4-year state college in the 80's for a total cost of $21k, and I was an on-campus student.
Now we have grants and the ability to take out tens of thousands of dollars... per year... for tuition. All an adult student has to do is sign his or her name, and it is like free unlimited money for all the education you can eat.
How can anyone be confused by the idea that colleges will adjust their cost by the amount their customers can afford to pay? This is econ 101, here. When these stupid adult children can afford $50k to get their art history degree, why do you think a college won't increase their price to accommodate the sucker windfall?
Want to watch the price of college plummet? Remove all loans. We'll return to the days of "only the rich can afford college/not fair!", but at least the stupid will not be graduating under a mountain of debt from which they will never be free. The truly academically gifted and motivated will get scholarships no matter how poor they are.
At this point, he's got such a huge back log of other things and such a huge investment in other things that reforming higher education is really not something anyone is going to cooperate on. As in anything, there are entrenched interests.
The president should spend what time he has left finishing the things he's started. Very little new he attempts at his point will be accepted or catch on.
The first term is where you push these things. And the second term is where you cement them. Well.... finish what you've started and stop creating new programs and ideas for entirely unrelated issues that in most cases are no great matter.
I've decided to stop wasting my time responding to AC trolls/sockpuppets... so if you want a response from me... login.
So students going to lesser schools will be fucked with less affordable loans? WTF?
How about the government just STOP guaranteeing student loans (which can't even be discharged in bankruptcy). Get the fuck out of the system, it's the loan program that has driven up tuition rates for 25 years. When I went there were several students who worked to pay their own way. As hard as that seems to do back then, it must be nearly impossible today, so they get loans and then get fucked for life. Same thing happened with subsidized housing, all that did is drive up home prices to the point of a bubble that crippled the economy for years. Just fucking stop meddling.