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One Strike Against No Fly List; More Scrutiny To Come
New submitter MickyTheIdiot writes "The Jurist reports: 'A judge for the U.S. District Court for the District of Oregon ruled Wednesday (PDF) that those placed on the U.S. government's no-fly list have 'a constitutionally-protected liberty interest in traveling internationally by air, which is affected by being placed on the No Fly List.' The plaintiffs in the case are 13 U.S. citizens who were denied boarding on flights over U.S. airspace after January 2009.' Judge Anna Brown hasn't ruled on the constitutionality of the No Fly List yet, and has instructed the attorneys involved to present a roadmap for deciding the remaining issues. However, she has acknowledged that the No Fly List is a major burden to those on the list and they have the right to get that status reviewed."
There are a lot of people coming in here, saying "about time" or something similar. What this attitude fails to incorporate is that the judicial system isn't concerned with unjust policies until they actually create injustice. And even then, an actual judge has to be less terrible than those that created the policies in the first place.
It takes a long time, and is a natural component of how checks and balances work in the US. It's not perfect, and sometimes the bad comes from congress faster than it can be addressed, but this is how things are supposed to work.
Yes, but when you're using statistics to pre-judge people, you aren't confident enough to spend a fortune on addressing the risk they represent, but you're more than comfortable blindly squashing their rights.
From the article:
Judge Anna Brown has not concluded whether the government's use of the no-fly list violated the plaintiffss constitutional rights to due process, stating in her opinion that, "the court is not yet able to resolve on the current record whether the judicial-review process is a sufficient, post-deprivation process under the United States Constitution." Brown has given both parties till September 9 to file a joint status report setting out their recommendation as to the most effective process to ensure that the court may come to a conclusion on the remaining issues
So there are still some big issues to resolve, before the practically inevitable appeals begin.
There will be some tough issues to work through since no doubt some of the evidence in individual cases is classified. Still, there should be some sort of process to have information in one's favor considered. Both sides have a point.
much of left-wing thought is a kind of playing with fire by people who don't even know that fire is hot - George Orwell
Tell us, misleadingly, how the Constitution doesn't specifically mention the right to travel, and then sleazily recast this into the context of coercion of private corporations. You've done it a hundred times before, so get to it.
"They were pure niggers." – Noam Chomsky
Except that it has been proven that the increased screening actually hardly prevents anything at all.
Troll is not a replacement for I disagree.
If the government decides that someone is a threat such that they shouldn't be allowed to fly, then they should be arrested and tried for whatever crimes they're accused of.
If they haven't committed a crime and are simply guilty by association, then they are being punished without a trial. Not being able to fly is a very strong punishment.
Except that it has been proven that the increased screening actually hardly prevents anything at all.
Now why the hell even say this when there is little in the TSA and their fucking ridiculous overreach that would justify their current authority, or even their very existence.
The burden of proof has never really been a burden for any government budget. Ever.
A right to travel implies that you may also choose your means of transport. Because, well, why stop at planes? Bar them from trains, busses or using their own car. If we now just break their legs they can have all the right to travel they want to, but can't use it.
It's a bit like getting the right to free speech and having your mouth glued shut. You may speak... if you find a way to. What value is in a right you cannot execute because the means to use it are taken from you?
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
Israeli also employs racial profiling. This is something the US can't/won't do (officially). Being PC is costing the US quite a bit, both in terms of effectiveness and monetarily.
Only on
Which means either (a) the security measures are easily bypassed even when a person is targeted for extreme scrutiny or (b) the no fly list actually serves a policing or political function, that is, to locate / harass / intimidate / prevent the free travel of / etc. of people who manage to make it on the list. I'm guessing it is the latter, which is depressing, but not surprising. Abuse of power seems to be an unavoidable part of giving people power.
Actually it's both. The screening methods don't work very well and only have the apparent effectiveness they do because no one (competent) is actually trying to destroy/hijack commercial airplanes.
The whole system is basicly Lisa' tiger-repelling rock.
It's always odd to me how some are incapable of using the term 'profiling' without the misplaced prefix of 'racial'.
They engage in profiling. Period.
Profiling comes in many different kinds, shame you are ignoring them.
Example: If you pay cash for a one way ticket an hour before the flight leaves and you are carrying only a carry on bag... regardless of race or nationality, you are going to get a more in-depth look than someone who books 6 weeks in advance with a credit card along with their family and multiple bags.
Help Brendan pay off his student loans
There is no Right to Drive in the US, where driving is a rather a privilege.
The privilege of operating a motor vehicle on public roads, and the right to be a passenger in one are VERY VERY different things.
Similiarly I don't think anyone is especially outraged that the government restricts who can fly a plane. (That would be anyone without a pilots license in good standing, which is most people, including me.) The contentious issue is restricting who can be a passenger in one.
I would like to know how I can drive to Hawaii? Or how I can drive to Alaska without the permission of a foreign government.
The real "Libtards" are the Libertarians!