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3D-Printed Gun Bought and Displayed By London Art Museum

Posted by samzenpus on from the print-and-shoot dept.

Sparrowvsrevolution writes "The world's first 3D-printed gun known as the Liberator has been treated as a technological marvel and a terrorist threat. Now it's officially become a work of art. On Sunday, London's Victoria & Albert museum of art and design announced that it's buying two of the original Liberator printed guns from their creator, the libertarian hacker non-profit known as Defense Distributed, and will display them during its Design Festival. Cody Wilson, Defense Distributed's founder, calls the museum's acquisition of the gun a victory for his group: 'It will now be this curated, permanent cultural provocation.'"

36 of 133 comments (clear)

  1. Art by damnal · · Score: 2

    Art is always in the eye of the beholder.

    1. Re:Art by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      Boy, I sure hope I'm never in the eye of a beholder.

    2. Re:Art by meerling · · Score: 3, Interesting

      It is a historical and precedent setting object, not to mention an interesting design. That definitely makes it of value to a Museum of Art & Design. Heck, just about any museum except those that are really specialized.

  2. Why? by O('_')O_Bush · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I'm still not sure what makes 3D printed guns any different or more special than a gun produced with CAD plans and a used CNC machine.

    Good 3D printers are not cheaper or more accessible than used CNCs, and the turns produced are far more dangerous than those produced from small blocks of aluminum and steel.

    Granted, producing the guns may be cheaper (AR parts kit, plus homemade receiver, plus upper would probably cost 700$), but the difference in quality and utility is quite vast.

    --
    while(1) attack(People.Sandy);
    1. Re:Why? by Mr.Zuka · · Score: 2

      I'm still not sure what makes 3D printed guns any different or more special than a gun produced with CAD plans and a used CNC machine.

      It's really a matter of skill. Getting metal to spec, dealing with heating and shrinkage, using a lathe all take skill.
      Loading some plastic and pressing print doesn't.
      Think of it like the script kiddie of gun making.

    2. Re:Why? by internerdj · · Score: 2

      Don't forget a for-profit 24-7 news cycle has to maximize profit not truth. Some things are incredibly worse when their first motive is profit.

    3. Re:Why? by gl4ss · · Score: 2

      It's really a matter of skill. Getting metal to spec, dealing with heating and shrinkage, using a lathe all take skill.
      Loading some plastic and pressing print doesn't.
      Think of it like the script kiddie of gun making.

      printing the gun on sub 8000$ 3d printer has you dealing with getting it to spec, dealing with heating and shrinkage.. much more than it takes skill to buy a shotgun shell, a spring, a nail, a bit of wood and a pipe and to assemble them. and that gun would be re-usable.

      in fact, I don't think he's serious about home guns. if he was then he would be using pipes and home depot parts where it makes sense and printing some other parts. that way you could build a stern clone for sub 100$. now his gun is a media gimmick.

      --
      world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
    4. Re:Why? by drinkypoo · · Score: 2

      I'm not aware of any CNCs that are within the price point of a home user.

      Congratulations, you just triggered a rant!

      Hack a Day put out an opinion piece saying that upcoming patent expiry wasn't going to put 3d printers in hobbyists' garages. They were wrong, sadly, stupidly, wrong. Here's why: They based their argument on the idea that nobody would spend $10,000 for a FDM machine for their home. But that's just stupid, stupid bullshit. People spend way more than that on their hobbies. I know quite a few people with a lot more than $10,000 into their hobbies. There's people out there with more than 10k into a fucking train set! Don't even get started on something like racing.

      By the same token, you're completely off-based on the price of CNC. You can buy a classic 2.5D mill, a real stout one, for about $1500 with a fair amount of tooling. It will probably come with a three phase motor, so you'll need to spend a little more on a phase converter; as a bonus that can also be a speed controller so you don't have to dick around with belts all the time. For another $1500 you can convert it to full CNC operation. So for way less than the price of a mediocre race car, you can have CNC in your garage.

      What a shock, an ignorant anonymous coward

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    5. Re:Why? by PopeRatzo · · Score: 2

      I'm still not sure what makes 3D printed guns any different or more special than a gun produced with CAD plans and a used CNC machine.

      Because "makers" are hip and cool and go to Burning Man. And a guy with CAD plans and a used CNC machine is called a "machinist" and that's not nearly as cool.

      My father was a machinist, a tool-and-die maker for a good part of his life after WWII. But "makers" believe they have invented something new, so making something from a 3D printer that doesn't work is much cooler than making something that works.

      Plus, there is the frisson that comes from doing stuff that involves guns, because guns give some people hard-ons. Put together fruity "makers" and guns in the same story and you get internet gold.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    6. Re:Why? by CastrTroy · · Score: 2

      This gun is not an AK. Not even close. It's probably the equivalent of a zip gun. Those are quite easy to make, and don't require that you have an expensive printer as a starting point.

      --

      Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
    7. Re:Why? by return+42 · · Score: 2

      I'm still not sure what makes 3D printed guns any different or more special than a gun produced with CAD plans and a used CNC machine.

      Good point. I see two reasons for "the authorities" to be more worried about 3D guns. First is (I would guess) CNC is fairly mature and stable, while 3D printing is undergoing rapid development, becoming cheaper, more versatile, more accessible. Second is that a CNC machine is something of a niche application, not interesting to many people, whereas 3D printing can make a much wider variety of things and is therefore potentially of interest to more people. Thus, 3D printed firearms are potentially accessible to many more people, and, with future technology, easier to produce.

    8. Re:Why? by AlecC · · Score: 2

      Can confirm this. My ex-boss makes a $500 tuning accessory for a $24,000 miniature but working steam locomotive. The guy who builds the locomotives is building them in batches of twenty, OK, the locomotive is the main cost of your miniature railway, but you are probably looking at $50,000 for a working setup, for something with no practical use at all. $10,000 for something that makes useful stuff? No problem. I could see the upper end of the steam enthusiasts getting a CNC machine, if it were easy enough to use (not trivial) just for fixing and enhancing their locomotives.

      --
      Consciousness is an illusion caused by an excess of self consciousness.
    9. Re:Why? by ArcadeMan · · Score: 2

      People are idiots and have no knowledge of things outside their little spheres of interest and no desire to learn. - AC, 2013

      Thanks for my new signature.

      --
      Get free satoshi (Bitcoin) and Dogecoins
    10. Re:Why? by CanHasDIY · · Score: 2

      I'm still not sure what makes 3D printed guns any different or more special than a gun produced with CAD plans and a used CNC machine.

      It's really a matter of skill. Getting metal to spec, dealing with heating and shrinkage, using a lathe all take skill.
      Loading some plastic and pressing print doesn't.

      After spending an hour or so this past weekend watching people's 3D printer videos online, I think you're underestimating the challenge of successful, usable prints.

      Sure, it's much easier than learning to mill barrels on a machine lathe, but not quite as trivial as you make it out to be.

      --
      An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
    11. Re:Why? by meerling · · Score: 2

      Currently it's much easier and cheaper to build a zipgun/saturdaynight special/junkgun with parts from the hardware store and regular shop tools than it is to make 3D printed gun. And that's not even mentioning that the non-printed one will probably be more accurate and durable. What the fuss is really about is idiots panicking and trying to make a scene.
      If someone wants to bring up the supposed skill gap, it's pretty much an illusion. Anyone that has the most basic tool use skills could make a zip gun of one form or another. Heck, my mom could make one if she wanted to. As to knowledge of guns, it's not exactly an industrial secret, and besides, at it's most basic, it's a tube with a round inserted in one end with the bullet facing the other, and held steady while a firing pin forcefully smacks the middle of the round, and some kind of grip so it's easy to hold and not get burned. For that matter, the basic principles of guns along with basic descriptive drawings or photos of it's workings are easily attainable on the internet or any dead tree format library. Heck, even the Japanese could get that info, and I'm sure you've heard how anti-gun their government is.

      I merely see the 3d printed guns as a representative of the fantastic and wide ranging possibilities for 3d printing in the future. Someday they may be a near virtual Aladdins Lamp. (Combine an ability to use many different materials simultaneously with a recycling/material bank restocking ability, and the sky's the limit.)

    12. Re:Why? by HornWumpus · · Score: 2

      FYI you don't need a CNC machine to make a zip gun. You need a vice, a drill press and a chamber reamer for you round.

      You don't need a CNC machine to make an AK clone ether. But you will likely buy the barrel.

      --
      John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
    13. Re:Why? by bdwebb · · Score: 2

      http://buildyourcnc.com/

    14. Re:Why? by bdwebb · · Score: 2

      Actually all the patterns for AK receivers are pretty easy to find. After that you need some rudimentary parts (which you can jury-rig easily) and a piece of wood and you can have a working frankenstein AK. One of the primary reasons AKs are so prolific is that they are EXTREMELY durable and EXTREMELY easy to work on.

      A guy I used to know built one about 10 years ago from ~$100 in parts from hardware stores and a steel supply shop...it was ugly as sin and wasn't very accurate but it fired and much more accurately than the printed gun would due to the fact that this was a rifle. He never had the balls to fire it by hand (always behind a barrier with a string tied to the trigger, heh) but I don't blame him one bit.

      Ultimately, it just takes a bit of thought and reverse engineering skill along with the Google on the internet machine and you can easily make a gun. Not to mention the fact that it is easy as shit to just go buy an unregistered, illegal firearm.

  3. So he admits it. by GameboyRMH · · Score: 3, Interesting

    'It will now be this curated, permanent cultural provocation.'"

    So he admits that he's a shit-disturbing troll. I liked it better when they stuck to the Internet and didn't fuck things up for us IRL. Things are a lot harder to ignore or fix there.

    --
    "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
    1. Re:So he admits it. by drinkypoo · · Score: 2

      So he admits that he's a shit-disturbing troll.

      Throughout history, artists have been described as "provocative". Many of these provocative works are now considered classics. One purpose of art is indeed to be provocative. Are you trolling, or just massively ignorant? I don't see a third option here

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    2. Re:So he admits it. by GameboyRMH · · Score: 2

      The third option is that I don't want legally-required DRM on 3D printers.

      --
      "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
    3. Re:So he admits it. by GameboyRMH · · Score: 2

      I'd be fine if he was just 3D printing handguns. I might even want to help him out as a fun experiment. But that's not what he's doing, he's loudly provoking governments into taking action (which he might VERY mistakenly think would be deregulating firearms), stirring up a fight that doesn't need to be fought right now. Do I need to settle on either condoning this provocation or siding with authoritarians? And are you sure he's not working on the side of authoritarianism? He's not fighting for any rights we don't have, what he's doing would work perfectly as a protest for regulation of 3D printers, the only thing missing is a statement of such intent from him.

      --
      "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
    4. Re:So he admits it. by Zimluura · · Score: 2

      I don't think that DRM on 3D Printers is, in any way, feasible.

      The angle I think may be tried in the future: A massive mesh fingerprint database that has to be checked before a design can be printed. easy solutions: hack the driver to always return "no_match_in_database_ok_to_print" or gut 3D printer's brain and wrire an arduino to use its high precision linear actuators and chassis.

      I really can't see that approach working ever. As long as there are computers with programming languages and DC motors you'll have 3d printing. I guess they could try to regulate all computer programming and electronics parts everywhere. so no one will ever be able to build a 3d printer.

  4. So take that, by John.Banister · · Score: 3, Funny

    3D printed ploughshares!

  5. Re:Art??? by gl4ss · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Tell me how a glorified zip gun is considered art?

    it's media art. not art of engineering. not art of revolution. but art of playing the media frenzy.

    you know what non-profit means in this context? that all the money goes for the guy..

    --
    world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
  6. newer by nten · · Score: 2

    If you are referencing doom, d&d actually came first (1975).

    --
    refactor the law, its bloated, confusing and unmaintainable.
  7. Re:Wrong Aproach by wonkey_monkey · · Score: 4, Insightful

    These are 3D printed guns. You cannot just display them

    Of course you can. By your argument the Smithsonian shouldn't have the Wright Flyer on display and should be telling people to fuck off to the airport if they want to see planes.

    --
    systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
  8. Entirely Missing the Point by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Bought a 3d printed gun? The entire point was for it to be printable! If anything, don't display the gun, display a 3D printer in a case continually printing guns, with the finished guns falling into a hopper to be ground down to pellets to be extruded into filament to be fed back into the printer. Now that's art!

  9. Re:Not art by wonkey_monkey · · Score: 4, Insightful

    It's not there to look pretty. It's there because it was the first of its kind. It's in the museum of art and design.

    --
    systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
  10. Giving 3D Printers A Bad Name... by dryriver · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Am I the only one who thinks that these idiots are creating 3D printed guns solely to provoke TPTB into regulating 3D printers? ---- I.e. future 3D printer models you purchase will send any 3D object you print to a remote server, where trained specialists check whether you are - possibly - printing "gun parts" without legal authorization. ------ I think that the crappy 3D guns these people are trying to create give all of 3D printing a bad name. And I'm pretty sure that the big corporations can't wait for 3D printers to be crippled with draconian regulations. Thus one can forget about a future where one doesn't buy a product the conventional way, but rather uses one's home 3D printer to print it out. I hope the 3D guns people stop before they ruin the 3D printed future for the rest of humanity. My 2 Cents...

    --
    Why did the chicken cross the road? Because Elon Musk put an AI chip in its head.
  11. Re:Not art by oodaloop · · Score: 2

    Oh, I'm so glad you're here to arbitrate what is and isn't art! All this time, I had to think of art as being subjective and open to interpretation from the observer, but this is so much easier!

    --
    Tic-Tac-Toe, Global Thermonuclear War, and relationships all have the same winning move.
  12. It is about the printer not the gun. by alexander_686 · · Score: 2

    I think you are missing the point. The point is not that high quality design of the gun – the point is the high quality output of a 3D printer. It is kind of like getting your dog to sing. You don’t listen to the dog for it’s amazing voice, you are amazed that it can do it at all.

    1. Re:It is about the printer not the gun. by alexander_686 · · Score: 2

      In reality I think they chose the gun not because it represented the highest level of art of the printer but because it is controversial and thus will draw people.

      To you point, in a more abstract view, I have a bias in museum for more solid, concert things – to anchor things to a point in time. The dog may have a bad day. Or the dog may be dead so all you get is a stuffed dog. So a recording is better. Would it be cool it see a 3D printer chugging away – Yes. But I would think that would be more of a science museum thing. But I think that is splitting hairs. The gun is a legitimate thing to display – a tangible thing to mark a point in history.

  13. Re:Not art by xaxa · · Score: 2

    The Imperial War Museum (also in London) has three Gyrojets in its collection: http://www.iwm.org.uk/search/global?query=gyrojet&x=0&y=0 .

    But they don't seem to be interesting for their artistic design, which is what the V&A collects and exhibits.

  14. Yet a zip gun is so easy to make by Andover+Chick · · Score: 2

    Why is the 3D gun such a big deal? Granted it is a milestone in 3D printing that a gun can be made. But really what else? Why is this anymore of a terrorist threat than a zip gun? Zip guns are often made in prisons by convicts and, in previous generations, by ghetto kids. All one needs is a strong tube, an improvised firing pin and an actuator (such as a rubber band) to drive the pin into the percussion cap.

  15. Reposting an AC to get this low-cost CNC seen by jeffmflanagan · · Score: 2

    http://www.taigtools.com/cmill.html

    Taig makes a decent little product that can do all but one of the operations on an ar-15 receiver.

    If you want to vastly over complicate a homemade weapon, I'm sure you can find a design that can be milled.