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Internet of Things Demands New Social Contract To Protect Privacy

chicksdaddy writes "Changes brought about by the Internet of Things demands the creation of a whole new social contract to enshrine the right to privacy and prevent the creation of technology-fueled Orwellian surveillance states in which individual privacy protections take a back seat to security and 'control.' That, according to an opinion piece penned by the head of the European Commission's Knowledge Sharing Unit. Gérald Santucci argues that technology advances, including the advent of wearable technology and the combination of inexpensive, remote sensors and Big Data analytics threaten to undermine long-held notions like personal privacy and the rights of individuals."

95 comments

  1. Here's a contract for you by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I reserve the right to disable the network connection and recording capabilities of any device in a public space with sensors capable of detecting or inferring my presence.

    1. Re:Here's a contract for you by Zontar+The+Mindless · · Score: 3, Insightful

      To which the only sane response is, "Good luck with that, Ace".

      --
      Il n'y a pas de Planet B.
    2. Re:Here's a contract for you by Electricity+Likes+Me · · Score: 4, Funny

      So your plan is to go around to a lot of private businesses disabling their security cameras?

      Probably should help yourself to the till while you're at it - you know, compensation for the effort.

    3. Re:Here's a contract for you by sonamchauhan · · Score: 2

      "... with sensors capable of detecting or inferring my presence."

      And in this age of miniaturisation, how do you plan on detecting such sensors ace? By using sensors of your own? Which most probably have similar capabilities?

      Chicken and egg.

    4. Re:Here's a contract for you by Chrontius · · Score: 1

      Do you remember the "Toner Wars" of Neal Stephenson's "The Diamond Age"?

    5. Re:Here's a contract for you by philipmather · · Score: 2

      You know eventually it may boil down to that, I'd guess we'd head to three stereotypes...

      1) Acceptance; Either controlled and managed through educated mastery as much as possible or through uneducated disinterest people engage in and allow themselves to be monitored.
      2) Mediation; Attempting, regardless of success or even feasibility to allow only either partial or non-invasive monitoring.
      3) Rejection; Either active denial (through radio, electronic or electrical jamming, obfuscation or encryption) or significant or total (but not "aggressive") avoidance (such as the Amish).

      The first state would (if not already is) the norm, the second (current norm only through lack of technological means) somewhat futile but could maintain a casual level of privacy, the third would be unusual in the "passive" form and potentially (already is to some extents) illegal in the active form.

      Adopting any single, static position other than total openness or total passive avoidance would seem pointless and/or futile. Any attempt to remain between the two extremes could only be maintained by the ability to shift between all of them.

      --
      Regards, Phil
    6. Re:Here's a contract for you by postbigbang · · Score: 2

      You're right-- these are extremes, and ways to polarize the question instead of attempting more cogent solutions to the problem(s) stated.

      In the strictest sense, you should own all of the information about you that isn't needed to function in a civilized society. We ought to start from there. This, of course, bucks and batters against the very foundations of Google's business model to undermine Microsoft's model. We're not all altruistic, and know that there are sacrifices for using free cloud-based apps (as in cost, rather than code). But few individuals know how much their personal lives and online behavior is digested as data within the business models of varying online organizations. It's all behind the curtains, so to speak.

      Modesty is an actual virtue. I know that doesn't seem very modern, but modesty, humility, and privacy are actually desirable-- and if they weren't, Google et al wouldn't care about your data. But they do.

      Passive avoidance is no longer an option, and so it's up to individuals to guard their sense of privacy thru diligence. I therefore remove your context, and push it back to the individual's sense of propriety, whatever that might be.

      --
      ---- Teach Peace. It's Cheaper Than War.
    7. Re:Here's a contract for you by X0563511 · · Score: 1

      You forgot:
      4) Aggressive denial; physically damaging, vandalizing, or disabling recording devices/systems.

      Which brings me to think about those red-light cameras. How many replacements/cleanings would they go through before they just give up? Assuming the vandal was intelligent enough to not get caught.

      --
      For large sets, this will be our guide even unto death, for the LORD will work for each type of data it is applied to...
    8. Re:Here's a contract for you by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      At least he is making a stand. What are you doing?

    9. Re:Here's a contract for you by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      lol AC talking about taking a stand.

    10. Re:Here's a contract for you by Zontar+The+Mindless · · Score: 1

      A very big difference between "making a stand" and "posturing" there is--something really you learn should, young Jedi.

      --
      Il n'y a pas de Planet B.
  2. Anonymous & Unpopular by Chrontius · · Score: 3, Interesting

    It's getting pretty hard to be an anonymous member of an unpopular minority these days.

    Hell, it took me thirty seconds to figure out how to prove someone plays D&D using Find My Friends and one flaky and/or gullible friend to expose location data. And zero budget. When all your crap is posting to Facebook on your behalf

    1. Re:Anonymous & Unpopular by AmiMoJo · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I think there is a real danger that within a generation or two the concept of privacy will just go away. We will just come to accept that everything is recorded and monitored for our own safety. It's the age old conflict between people wanting privacy but also wanting there to be CCTV footage when someone dings their car.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    2. Re:Anonymous & Unpopular by inking · · Score: 1

      See, I've never had an issue with CCTV. Essentially it's little more than just replacing some guard standing on a wall and watching his surroundings with a different guard who has a few additional pairs of eyes sitting in a room a bit further away. He's always vigilant outside and doesn't enter my room, like a policeman that doesn't enter my room unless I specifically call for help. We had an attempted kidnapping with the intent to rape at my university a year or so ago and eventually the guy got arrested by being caught on CCTV, having his photograph posted all over Facebook and eventually being identified by no one other than his own girlfriend. It's little more than having increased police presence and I've never had any issues with the police in my country, so that's that. Of course other people and people in countries with the police being a bit less friendly would have a different attitude towards the whole issue.

      Having the photographs you send specifically to your friends scanned for your facial features, your emails checked for keywords, your call history recorded and the information that you've specifically sent privately to a person or anonymously to the modern variant of reader's column recorded and traced back to you is none of that. It's more like having the same guard standing over you and watching whatever you do, regardless of where you are, which is essentially little different from the level of surveillance you have in a prison.

    3. Re:Anonymous & Unpopular by X0563511 · · Score: 1

      Basically you are stating (correctly, IMO) that there's a big difference between mere observation, and active searching.

      --
      For large sets, this will be our guide even unto death, for the LORD will work for each type of data it is applied to...
    4. Re:Anonymous & Unpopular by xianzombie · · Score: 1

      Amen to that one. There's a big difference in protecting assets vs this (virtual) panopticon.

      My day job mostly involves installing and maintaining security and surveillance equipment. Usually for government agencies. But what my job entails isn't much different than protecting your home or business with ADT, etc. Just on a large scale and a bigger budget...(and outdated regulations).

      Ie. It's a government facility. There is CCTV in use. There are security systems in use. Entering the installations is giving consent to being monitored, searched, etc. Using their phone system is giving consent to having your calls recorded.

      The same as if your employer has CCTV and the ability to search your possessions on their premises. For the government installations, this is all pretty much a given (and aptly advertised). This, to me seems fine. Much the same way I'm fine with stores having CCTV in and around their buildings.

      The problem areas are with agencies like the NSA that have basically been granted to ability to look at and listen to whatever they want, whenever they want.

  3. the usual empty bloviations by stenvar · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Gérald Santucci – “We need new thinking and new concepts”“ ... What is at stake is the capability of the EU to integrate modern, adequate legal data protection into its socio-technical fabric, i.e. its hardware, software and the many associated protocols and standards that enable and constrain its affordances.”

    Maybe "we" need more than platitudes. Maybe "we" need an original thought instead of bloated, vomit-inducing bureaucrat speak.

    But "we" definitely need to find a new hair stylist, Mr. Santucci.

    1. Re:the usual empty bloviations by macraig · · Score: 1

      I was willing to listen to your particular bloviation right up until the end when you criticized his hair style. Which political office is your ambition?

    2. Re:the usual empty bloviations by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      stenvar, this is the way "enlightened" Euro-Hipsters speaks - from their chateau or where ever...

    3. Re:the usual empty bloviations by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I stopped reading at "whole new social contract to enshrine". Why are there so many people with a bigger vocabulary than brain now a days?

    4. Re:the usual empty bloviations by wonkey_monkey · · Score: 3, Funny

      Head of the Senate Committee on Fabulousness, obviously.

      --
      systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
    5. Re:the usual empty bloviations by jandersen · · Score: 1

      Maybe "we" need more than platitudes

      OK, here's a radical thought for you: perhaps we don't need 'an internet of things'? Personally, I can't for the life of me see why I need my fridge, telly or toothbrush to be directly visible on the open internet. Even if I felt I needed to be able to see what's in my fridge from the other side of the world, I am sure I could do that easily with existing technology.

    6. Re:the usual empty bloviations by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Posting Anonymous because I have moderated:

      One benficial use that I am aware of is using fridges as load balancing on the electrivity grid. Your fridge could cool morethan it needs over night, potentially on cheaper electricity and then cool less than it needs at times of high load on the grid.

    7. Re:the usual empty bloviations by zarthrag · · Score: 1

      I just had to say that out loud ....with a lisp.

      looooooooooooooooool

      --
      Why can't all fpga/microcontroller manufacturers just release free optimizing compilers???
  4. yea, a social contract! by khallow · · Score: 3, Informative

    I think of all the current political terms out there, "social contract" has to be one of the most worthless. It's a "contract" that you "agree" with by not trying to destroy society hard enough. It doesn't actually exist in any concrete form. And the terms of the supposed contract mean whatever the speaker feels they mean at the moment.

    1. Re:yea, a social contract! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Social Contract" isn't exactly a new term. It's at least a few hundred years old.

    2. Re:yea, a social contract! by Mashiki · · Score: 2

      Okay there. You realize that a "social contract" in it's correct terms applies as: Society as a whole gives up specific rights/liberties, in exchange the state provides protection, and other protected rights/liberties. This whole new round of marketspeakish "social contract" stuff is nothing but bunk. What does need to happen is, the classical social contract needs to catch up with the digital era.

      --
      Om, nomnomnom...
    3. Re:yea, a social contract! by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      The EU does tend to legislate to back up social contracts. All it means is that society needs to figure out what kind of relationship with device manufacturers it wants, and then force them to comply with a strong regulator that can intervene if they ignore the spirit of the law.

      Mobile phone chargers are a good example. We decided they were all going to be USB, and now they are.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    4. Re:yea, a social contract! by AlecC · · Score: 2

      I think the "Social Contract" exists, but I agree that it is a problem, but also an advantage, that it is not written down. There is an implicit contract between all of us on how society works: that we give up some freedoms, as do our fellow citizens, in order to make society work. The fact that it is not written down means that we can actually have different views of what is actually in the contract - and privacy is a golden example of that. On the other hand, being unwritten allows it to evolve. Writing things down fixes them, while society changes. A prime example here is the Second Amendment: while not saying it is right or wrong, I am certain those who wrote and passed it did not foresee current firearms technology.

      --
      Consciousness is an illusion caused by an excess of self consciousness.
    5. Re:yea, a social contract! by Anonymous+Brave+Guy · · Score: 1

      Am I the only person thinking that we used to call these social contracts "laws"?

      --
      If you disagree, post your argument. (-1, Overrated) isn't your personal censorship tool for views you don't like.
    6. Re:yea, a social contract! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      a SOCONTRACT? ( /soSHäntrakt/ )

    7. Re:yea, a social contract! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Laws are one of the ways to implement some facets of those social contracts. Free press is another enforcer.

    8. Re:yea, a social contract! by khallow · · Score: 1

      There is an implicit contract between all of us on how society works: that we give up some freedoms, as do our fellow citizens, in order to make society work.

      I'm willing to call it a "cooperation". A "contract" implies things that don't exist here such as explicit terms and agreement to those terms.

      The fact that it is not written down means that we can actually have different views of what is actually in the contract

      Well, as long as we all agree on what that is, that's ok. Else this unwritten contract isn't worth the paper it's written on.

      Writing things down fixes them, while society changes.

      So what? There's no indication here that the cooperative aspects of our society changes. For example, the concerns of privacy haven't changed despite the changes in technology.

      A prime example here is the Second Amendment: while not saying it is right or wrong, I am certain those who wrote and passed it did not foresee current firearms technology.

      I think that's a dubious claim to make. All that has happened is that such firearms have become lighter, more reliable, and have a much faster firing rate. In other words, they've become better at the job they do. That's not hard to predict. And I'm fairly certain that the technology hasn't advanced to the point where original backers would have changed their minds.

    9. Re:yea, a social contract! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think of all the current political terms out there, "social contract" has to be one of the most worthless. It's a "contract" that you "agree" with by not trying to destroy society hard enough. It doesn't actually exist in any concrete form. And the terms of the supposed contract mean whatever the speaker feels they mean at the moment.

      Actually, the term has been very useful. The US Declaration of Independence appeals to the philosophies on what social contract means at the time. Doing so legitimizes the colonies' independence.

      Today, the term is also used by the government to legitimize its own doing. The Constitution is interpreted to mean whatever the speaker (government) means at the time.

      Basically, "social contract" is a useful political term when you want to claim legitimacy (or to accuse others to be illegitimate, justifying you rejecting and disobeying them)

    10. Re:yea, a social contract! by Impy+the+Impiuos+Imp · · Score: 1

      Or a "constitution". "Contract" suggests two pre-existing entities -- the people, and the powerful who lord over them.

      It is born in a world that is already a political philosophy faure. You should start with the people, who create a constitution, which creates a governmemt, with limited, well-defined powers and, explicitely, none others. If they need more, the people can go through a deliberative and deliberately laborious process to grant additional powers. Laborious because most people should agree to fundamental changes, not just a brief, transient 51% majority at the behest of a charismatic demagogue.

      No democracy should ever forget the vote is merely an abstraction of might makes right, and thin majorities are scarcely any more deserving of rule than a large minority. "51%", therefore infinite dictator power, is just another tool for the power hungry rather than some all-enabling social theory justification.

      --
      (-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
    11. Re:yea, a social contract! by pmontra · · Score: 1

      "Contract" suggests two pre-existing entities -- the people, and the powerful who lord over them.

      The existence of a "lord" is accidental. There might be contract between peers with no one more powerful than the others. However I'm afraid that this works better in small communities. Remember that democracy was born in small Greek city states as "direct democracy". Basically everybody switched to representative democracy when the number of people became too large, and a "lord" emerged. The Internet might enable going back to "direct" but who knows how that would work.

    12. Re:yea, a social contract! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Society as a whole doesnt have any rights or liberties, only the members of a society do.

    13. Re:yea, a social contract! by jp10558 · · Score: 1

      I think that's a dubious claim to make. All that has happened is that such firearms have become lighter, more reliable, and have a much faster firing rate. In other words, they've become better at the job they do. That's not hard to predict. And I'm fairly certain that the technology hasn't advanced to the point where original backers would have changed their minds.

      Yes, but I wonder if they were also thinking about the much higher population density and different sort of working situations. It was easy for Star Trek or Vernor Vinge to predict the Internet, but I don't recall them predicting anything like Facebook. And that's only over 40 years...

      Did the founding fathers really deal with or consider single perpetrator mass shootings? The closest thing I could think of would be bombings, and I don't know that the Second Amendment had anything in there about explosives.

      That said, I don't know if they really had the same sort of value of human life either, or concern about dealing with things man to man (i.e. less police or state action and more individuals taking their own justice).

      Would they and do we want to prevent mass shootings? Are we concerned with the murder rate, gang violence etc? Our actions suggest we're OK with it as it is, so I doubt anything will change.

      Of course, if we were that OK with the level of death, we shouldn't be anywhere near as freaked out about terrorism as we seem to be.

      --
      Opera, Proxomitron-Grypen,GPG 0x0A1C6EE3
    14. Re:yea, a social contract! by khallow · · Score: 1

      Did the founding fathers really deal with or consider single perpetrator mass shootings? The closest thing I could think of would be bombings, and I don't know that the Second Amendment had anything in there about explosives.

      They would have been aware of Guy Fawkes and the attempted bombing of the UK Parliament. And it's worth noting here that single perpetrator mass shootings don't actually kill that many people - especially when the would-be victims happen to be armed.

      Of course, if we were that OK with the level of death, we shouldn't be anywhere near as freaked out about terrorism as we seem to be.

      Well, I'm not particularly "freaked out", though I should note that the US has lost about as many people to the 911 terrorist attacks as to single perpetrator mass shootings.

    15. Re:yea, a social contract! by jp10558 · · Score: 1

      Both of your replies were kind of my point. They were aware of Guy Fawkes. Did they condone violence against "innocents"? I think they might have, they did just fight an armed rebellion against their government, and explicitly had the second amendment there to allow similar rebellions in the future.

      My point is that I'm saddened that we will fight so hard to keep open the violent guns part of the constitution, but keep rolling over on the trampling of other amendments in the name of security.

      To paraphrase the matrix badly, what use is a gun when you can't organize for your cause?

      One man alone can't rebel against any tyranny. And if you can't communicate, plan, organize, or the like, you can't overthrow the government. You'll be crushed like in Waco. If King George had the NSA etc - the signers of the declaration of independence would never have gotten started, they would have been disappeared well before they could start a war.

      This is a dangerous world. Some people will be killed. It is sad, but destroying our way of life is a stupid response.

      --
      Opera, Proxomitron-Grypen,GPG 0x0A1C6EE3
    16. Re:yea, a social contract! by Anti-Social+Network · · Score: 1

      It exists in the acceptance and use of economic systems. I mean, what gives money value? Even criminals in the hardcore underground use paper money - because they can use the social contract to their advantage when they possess it (e.g. public goods of real value can be traded for it). All that the social contract means is that you are participating with the understanding that there are rules. What the rules are, and what it means to you, are formed by your associations and the company you keep, as well as who you do business with, and all the terms you negotiate for those relationships (and, naturally, the legal environment in which you are participating).

      We tailor the rules to attempt to eliminate acting in bad faith with varying degrees of success. The fact that some bad actors attempt to twist the underlying concept for some goal does not mean that the basic idea is wrong - it simply needs to be more explicitly defined for public reference, and bad actors punished by the rules of participation.

      --
      Goddammit just when I get my first +5 the Beta rolls out and kills everything
    17. Re:yea, a social contract! by khallow · · Score: 1
      I think my comments kind of weren't your point. For example, you're babbling about "condone violence against 'innocents'" on the basis that someone just fought a war and thought they might need to again.

      We do have many historical examples of violence against innocents, including a few from the US's Revolutionary War. But most war is not of that sort. It's violence that involves innocents, but it doesn't target them. For if it did, there'd be a lot more dead innocents than there have been.

      My point is that I'm saddened that we will fight so hard to keep open the violent guns part of the constitution, but keep rolling over on the trampling of other amendments in the name of security.

      While some people don't place the same importance on every bit of the Bill of Rights or the Constitution, it's worth noting here that people who tend to advocate violating the Second Amendment, tend to advocate breaking other amendments as well. My view is that there's nothing magical about the wording of the Second Amendment (that people had a right to bear arms). Anyone who can misinterpret that bit of law to their own advantage, can do the same for any other bit, such as the vaunted First Amendment.

      One man alone can't rebel against any tyranny.

      Sure, they can. It just means that they're very unlikely to fully succeed. But it is quite possible, for example, to cause far more damage than you can possibly receive. For example, we have two cases in recent years, the 9/11 attacks (which led to all these terrorism responses which you complain about) and the self-immolation death that triggered the Arab Spring (and the downfall of four governments so far). That latter case also didn't start with much in the way of organization. The guy in question apparently made a threat that he would burn himself, then he did it within the hour.

      But that event was enough to knock Tunisia into an uncontrolled state with escalating riots that led within the month to the flight of the long time ruler of Tunisia to whoever would take him. It then spilled over into the rest of the Middle East and North Africa, taking down the governments of Egypt, Libya, and Yemen as well as triggering a nasty civil war in Syria.

  5. Mmm, yeah, social contract by FuzzNugget · · Score: 1

    Because that worked out so well for the rest of the internet.

  6. Even open source has tracking and back doors now. by Animats · · Score: 4, Insightful

    We need to be much less tolerant of things that "phone home" to some headquarters. Or accept remote patches. We now have to assume that anything with a remote patch capability can be exploited.

    You might think open source would be better. It's not. Even the Mozilla Foundation has become squishy-soft on enforcing their own privacy rules. Check out BlockSite, a Firefox add-on which used to just block requested sites. It was bought up by a company called WIPS, which buys up abandoned apps and puts in back-door tracking of every site visited. After a year of pressure from WIPS, Jorge Villalobos at Mozilla caved in and let them install tracking in an existing add-on and auto update it.

    For Linux, Ubuntu pushes an awful lot of updates to supposedly "stable" versions. Is there a back door in there? Is anybody looking?

  7. This will never happen by Comen · · Score: 1

    Its nice thinking and all that, but this will never happen, you might get governments to agree with this even, but Pandora's Box has been opened the vast wealth of information on the internet, and power of controlling it, is too much. When you send anything out in to the world, be it a physical package or ip packets, someone is at the very least going to record who you sent it to and when. Encryption just makes them want to look at that package even more.
    The only way to make sure no one is watching is to not send it out on the public networks, unplug, don't go outside!
    If you want them to tell you they are not watching, they can do that!

  8. Buzzword bingo by phantomfive · · Score: 2
    Here's my attempt from a particularly delicious paragraph from the paper:

    Globalisation
    revolutions
    intellectual framework
    socio-economic system
    intellectual framework (twice!)
    paradigm
    diverse
    at stake
    data driven
    personal data
    (he almost said corporation. But avoided it with company.)

    The paragraph (now guess what it means!):

    Driven by globalisation and technological revolutions, the world is changing fast but the intellectual framework that continues to inspire the current institutions surrounding our socio - economic system dates back to the agricultural and first in dustrial revolutions and the pioneering works of Thomas Hobbes (the “Leviathan” – 1651), Adam Smith (the “invisible hand” – 1776) and David Ricardo (“value comes from labour” – 1817). It is time we realise that a new intellectual framework, a new paradigm, is needed if we are to grasp the diverse complex issues at stake. The idea of connected devices of all sorts chatting away to one another is certainly attractive - most people want to enjoy the new, exciting services that a data - driven future can provide, but at the same time they do not trust companies and governments as regards the collection and processing of personal data.

    --
    "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    1. Re:Buzzword bingo by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      David Ricardo (“value comes from labour” – 1817).

      Also, I'm not sure I would characterize David Ricardo with that quote, I would probably say his philosophy was closer to, "all laborers have value," since everyone can work where they find their competitive advantage (something like that).

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
  9. Wow, just wow. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If the samples being posted here are any indication, I can't read any of it without suffering from fatal government-speak overload. Followed by... the EC has a "knowledge sharing unit"??? What should we infer from that? That other agencies in the EC don't share knowledge, that they have to go therough the KSU if they want to share, or that the KSU is just someplace for the sons and daughters of well-connected officials to go and pick up some extra money over Summer break?

    In any event, it just looks to me like government/academic/power elites are the same everywhere. This paper was obviously not written for us. It was written for their chattering class, so they could say they were at the meeting, so they could say they did something while the martinis and power-point rotted away a few million more brain cells on their way to retirement.

  10. No thanks by c0lo · · Score: 1

    As far as I'm concerned, in my home a single entity that post on /. instead of doing the job that is paid for (that's me!) is more than enough.

    I hereby do solemnly declare that my fridge doesn't and will never have any other option than to keep my food cool. Similar goes for all the other appliances I or will own (mobile phone included: a mobile phone is a phone , no photocam/GPS/gaming console or Internet-enabled-tracking-device... and it better stays this way dam'it, social contract or not).

    --
    Questions raise, answers kill. Raise questions to stay alive.
  11. Same principle as TV-B-Gone by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The parent's suggestion is quite similar in concept to the very popular electronic gadget TV-B-Gone which turns off TVs.

  12. copyright your personal data by bigtreeman · · Score: 2

    "Copyright on My Personal Information, Data and Meta-data"

    All rights reserved
    No part of this publication may be reproduced,
    stored in a retrieval system, or transmitted in any form
    without the prior permission of the publisher (myself),
    nor circulated in any form without a similar condition
    being imposed on any subsequent purchaser/user.

    "My Personal Data"
    ~name
    ~address
    ~phone
    ~credit card details
    ~past purchases
    ~browsing history
    ~emails
    ~various meta-data
    ~location data
    ~log of events of your life

    You would have to have your terms of use of personal data
    very visible and present it to sites before you use their sites.

    Now you hold all this data and anyone wishing to use your data asks permission
    and you grant permission with whatever restrictions you want.

    Using various websites usually allows them to commandeer your data
    through their legal terms of use.

    Whose legal rights would come first ???
    Hopefully yours as you are the primary owner of the data.

    Your data and meta-data is valuable,
    now you can make money from its use,
    or not as you see fit.

    Now you never have to fill in a web form again.
    A web site is given access for a restricted time
    with restrictions on dissemination
    to a restricted subset of your data as you see fit.

    --
    Go well
    1. Re: copyright your personal data by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The problem is that those EULAs usually grant the company all rights and remove all uour rights. And since you really really want to get started with using that application you dont care about the terms... until later. I think it would be an interesting thought experiment having a law that gave each person non-transferable rights to certain information. Slavery is still forbidden, right? so you can put "We own you " in an EULA but it would not hold up in court. What if this was extended to include more aspects?

  13. Here's an idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Don't connect your lightbulb to the internet.

    1. Re:Here's an idea by Dogtanian · · Score: 1

      Don't connect your lightbulb to the internet.

      Yes, seriously... what *really* does this obsession with the "Internet of Things" actually offer us?

      Right now, it comes across as something being pushed by for-the-sake-of-it technological fetishists meeting control freak tendencies, both playing into the hands of authoritarians everywhere.

      --
      "Slashdot - News and Chat Sites Deviant". (Click "homepage" link above for details).
  14. here's your social contract by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    im going to collect all the data i can from all the devices i can reach
    then sell them to whoevers paying
    and disregard everything else.

  15. IOT and utility meters by mcmf · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I have been wondering about this re my utility meters. Currently my teleswitch (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teleswitch) enabled electricity meter is read a few times a year, and these readings are clearly the properly of my provider. However in an IOT world my electricity consumption would be continuously available as part of maximising use of solar or off peak rates etc. But who owns my consumption data? No doubt my provider, who owns the meter, would find somebody to sell it to and equally, various 'security' agencies would insist they had to have full access to it. I am sure that careful examination it of could reveal tons of personal info.

    1. Re:IOT and utility meters by GameboyRMH · · Score: 1

      Just your overall usage level sure could (like what times you're at home, when you charge your EV and how much you put in it, for example) but with modern Smart Grid technology, individual devices are accessible to the power company, opening up limitless possibilities for loss of privacy and greater corporate power.

      The best you could do, while staying on the (smart) grid, would be to use a huge battery as a buffer and "firewall" for the whole house, effectively airgapping your home devices from the Smart Grid. Only the overall electricity usage of the battery would be visible, and that may not match your actual usage too closely at all times. It's as close as you could get to returning to the old system of a monthly usage reading.

      --
      "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
    2. Re:IOT and utility meters by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The best you could do, while staying on the (smart) grid, would be to use a huge battery as a buffer and "firewall" for the whole house, effectively airgapping your home devices from the Smart Grid. Only the overall electricity usage of the battery would be visible, and that may not match your actual usage too closely at all times. It's as close as you could get to returning to the old system of a monthly usage reading.

      Would a 1:1 transformer work for that purpose? Transformers induce current so you are - in a way - "air gapped".

      Maybe something like this:

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isolation_transformer

    3. Re:IOT and utility meters by GameboyRMH · · Score: 1

      That would work as a way to airgap your home devices (putting it between the "smart grid" controller and your house's fuse box) but it would still allow your exact level of electricity usage to be measured live. The battery obscures this by acting as a buffer.

      --
      "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
    4. Re:IOT and utility meters by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Thanks - good point. Flatten the usage curve. I suppose going mostly off grid with solar accomplishes a similar effect.

      Not that *I* am that paranoid but I can forsee a world in which the wrong people access this information to determine when homes are unoccupied.

  16. Internet of Things by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The internet of things is a sad joke. There is no internet of things. There is no demand for it. There is no supply of it. It's all talk.

    1. Re:Internet of Things by unixisc · · Score: 1

      It can't happen until IPv6 is widely adapted. You can't have your garage door w/ an address of 192.168.72.67

  17. ... and in other news by jbrown.za · · Score: 2

    And to demonstrate European commitment to privacy, the plane of Bolivian President Evo Morales was refused permission to fly through the airspace of Spain, France, Portugal and Italy. The plane was later grounded for 13 hours and searched by Austrian police in Vienna. All in pursuit of that terrorist Edward Snowden. Clearly these were the first steps towards "the creation of a whole new social contract to enshrine the right to privacy and prevent the creation of technology-fueled Orwellian surveillance states in which individual privacy protections take a back seat to security and control."

  18. We don't need most of this, but can you opt out? by Anonymous+Brave+Guy · · Score: 2

    OK, here's a radical thought for you: perhaps we don't need 'an internet of things'?

    As it turns out, we also don't need to post our entire lives on Facebook or Twitter or whatever other "social network" is trendy right now. Nor is it necessary to supply them with metadata on every uploaded photo. I don't use these kinds of networks, and amazingly I haven't died yet, and neither has my social life. It'd be nice if they weren't so easily able to capture data about me anyway by encouraging people who know me to supply it against my will, though; there's something very shady about that kind of behaviour.

    Something I've heard a lot recently that's interesting is that the younger generation are actually much less likely to use some of these tools, Facebook in particular, or at least to use it in the manner it wants (real name etc.). This is one of my few comforting thoughts when considering privacy in the age of modern communication and surveillance technologies: the idea that future generations will grow up without appreciating the value of privacy seems to be overstated.

    A less comforting thought is that they might not get a choice anyway. If devices that have no need for this kind of intrusive technology start incorporating it routinely, you can't opt out without giving up a huge amount of quality of life. Worse, many useful tools can inherently be abused to track people: think of monitoring personal location via mobile phone connections or card payments or smartcards used to pay for public transport, or recording vehicle movements via ANPR cameras and automated systems for tolls etc.

    IMNSHO, we need much stronger laws to prevent repurposing of these kinds of data or retaining it any longer than strictly necessary. I think a big part of the problem is that so many people don't even realise what can be done today and how much is being stored routinely without any good reason that there isn't enough political will to drive change, even though if you told people what was happening they might well object.

    --
    If you disagree, post your argument. (-1, Overrated) isn't your personal censorship tool for views you don't like.
  19. Or you could simply give up by gelfling · · Score: 1

    Most of this stuff is targeted at precisely the demographic of people who DO NOT CARE how its used.

  20. Re:We don't need most of this, but can you opt out by stenvar · · Score: 2

    As it turns out, there are many things we don't need to do, but that are nice to do nonetheless. Sharing one's life with one's friends via Facebook falls into that category.

  21. in the future by jsepeta · · Score: 1

    10 years in the future, my scale is going to tell my refrigerator to not open the freezer "to keep that fatass away from the ice cream". so really the benevolence of thinking machines is what bugs me most.

    --
    Remember kids, if you're not paying for the service, YOU ARE THE PRODUCT THAT IS BEING SOLD.
    1. Re:in the future by GameboyRMH · · Score: 1

      Only if the government puts more horrible hackish fixes on the health care system to maintain the same level of disgusting hyper-profitability for the health care industry while just spreading around the costs so it doesn't hit any one person way too hard.

      --
      "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
  22. More government can save us by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Social contract = dirty socialists

    Let the hate flow through you.

  23. Social Contract? by drainbramage · · Score: 1

    If your brain bucket lets you believe your favorite time waster site is following a 'social contract' then yes, this is the route for you.
    If however you have not lost all ability to reason, why would you use facebook et al?

    --
    No brain, no pain.
  24. Re:Even open source has tracking and back doors no by GameboyRMH · · Score: 1

    For Linux, Ubuntu pushes an awful lot of updates to supposedly "stable" versions. Is there a back door in there? Is anybody looking?

    You're asking the question for the wrong reasons. In the Linux world things are intentionally broken up into small pieces (according to the "an app should do one thing and do it well" philosophy) so the number of packages requiring an update is basically meaningless. Firefox is 2 or 3 packages while the QT framework is about 30. VLC with all its codec libraries is probably even more than that. Updating just one application can mean a whole slew of updated packages...or just one, depending on what it is.

    --
    "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
  25. Is this how the Borg got started? Big Data? by eer · · Score: 1

    Hive mind, and all that?

    It's not really possible to "opt out" of public surveillance. Can you imagine the difficulty of claiming the right to "disappear" off of other people's Google Glass (maybe by broadcasting a disruptor signal of some sort saying "ignore me, nothing to see here, move along"?

    And how do you assure privacy to those who deprive others of it, themselves?

    If privacy is outlawed, only outlaws will have privacy...

    New thought really is required. Not sure all the angles can be squared.

  26. No such thing as a 'social contract' by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    There is no such thing as a 'social contract', doesn't exist, never did never will.

    People doesn't own the internet. A notion of taking up a so called social contract, respecting it or even being required to be bound to one is patently false.

    The 'moral' aspect of so called social contracts with a party thought to expect something off someone else generally speaking, that moral aspect doesn't exist at all. There is really no choice and as such there is no moral issue as such, and no contract.

    Contracts are specific things meant to clarify ones involvement in some enterprise by merit of taking part of it, as a willful action and of free will.

    In law, there are even laws that makes null and void any agreement that demand unlawful things.

  27. Define "insanity"? by Shoten · · Score: 1

    Let me see if I understand this correctly: the social contract that *did* exist failed with regard to privacy because private and public entities alike found it was in their best interests to break it, so the solution is to create a brand new one. There are multibillion dollar industries around large-scale analytics for commercial purposes, surveillance for military, intelligence and other purposes, and lots of money to be made by continuing to violate the contract. And for the most part, the overwhelming majority of corporations where this comes into play are all doing it and competing more efficiently as a result...so it's not like market forces have much of an option to go anywhere else. For that matter, a smaller competitor that started up with the goal of respecting the social contract would be at a significant competitive disadvantage. But we should just ignore all that, and just create a new one, instead of moving over to contracts of a more binding nature (like legislation around privacy, perhaps?)

    Um...what?

    --

    For your security, this post has been encrypted with ROT-13, twice.
  28. Think of the children! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    When it comes to childrens privacy there's no problem making effective laws and enforcing them. Politicians, companies, the public, everyone accepts and advocates it.

    Maybe we'll be saved by thinking of the children.

  29. Re:Even open source has tracking and back doors no by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Yes, I agree completely.

    Already, I will not signon to any web page that requires my personal information, nor do I allow any scripts to run. If it does, I simply block the site, and find another.

    Yahoo and Youtube recently started bugging people to enter their cell phone number. I'll stop using a service before I provide that information.

    Many new TV sets and other hardware require an Internet connection before they will work. I got rid mine, years ago.

  30. TPMS by DriveDog · · Score: 1

    To my mind, TPMS is currently the leading candidate for poster child of loss of privacy due to devices leaking my data. Anyone with a little time and knowledge or a moderate amount of money can set up a single or network of detectors to track my car. With a little more time or money, someone could also spoof my tires' TPMS codes, so that my car appears to have been somewhere it wasn't.

  31. Draw the line by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Several people drew the line at Obamacare, which they will not go along with on any level. others will not register or recognize any of the "gun laws" which are all illegal anyways. Some people are talking about going after prosecutors for not doing their jobs.

  32. Re:Even open source has tracking and back doors no by sandertje · · Score: 1

    Well.. Ubuntu nowadays does have quite some tracking. Remember the amazon shenanigans they built in to Ubuntu? You have to manually turn this off. How many casual users do you think know that it is even possible to turn this off? Or Ubuntu One? Or unity lenses? Or who assures me there is no back door in Zeitgeist?

  33. Re:Even open source has tracking and back doors no by GameboyRMH · · Score: 1

    Yeah Ubuntu's jumped the shark, I recommend Mint now (usually with MATE).

    --
    "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
  34. You are doing it wrong.... Use P2P for IoT by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    See http://nabto.com P2P technology for Microcontrollers.

    Connect to your your MCU design from everywhere using same technology as VoIP/Skype etc.

    Since the connection is made directly peer-to-peer end-user is in full control over who can connect and get data for creating a web-interface (via a plugin to keep complexity on the device down) or for data-acquisition...

  35. If you need that ... you are doing it wrong by crgregersen · · Score: 1
    If you need to define privacy rules like that from the political side, it's because your general design is wrong.

    Posting ALL data from devices to a central server based on a timer from the lowest common denominator of the systems needing the data is a simple and very NAIVE design approach of such a system...

    Other methods include using P2P technology as found in VoIP/Skype etc. systems. This way only data-sources that the end-user accept and authenticate can initiate remote data-acquisition. Yes this is possible even on the smallest MCU's.

    /Carsten

  36. Anonymity vs Privacy by chuckugly · · Score: 1

    What we seem to be having is a confusion between the concepts of privacy and anonymity. Things that occur in public are by definition not private, but we have become accustomed to assuming most of our actions are nearly anonymous. This is quickly becoming a poor assumption.

  37. Re:We don't need most of this, but can you opt out by Anonymous+Brave+Guy · · Score: 1

    As it turns out, there are many things we don't need to do, but that are nice to do nonetheless.

    Indeed. My point is not that the above isn't true, merely that there are also stronger needs that are impractical to do without and still live anything resembling a normal life in modern society. Safeguards aren't a luxury at that point, they are a necessity, which conveniently can also protect the things you don't need to do but that are nice to do nonetheless in exactly the same ways.

    --
    If you disagree, post your argument. (-1, Overrated) isn't your personal censorship tool for views you don't like.
  38. Re:We don't need most of this, but can you opt out by stenvar · · Score: 1

    But safeguards against what? Vacation pictures suddenly becoming public? I mean, if you have something to hide, don't put it on Facebook at all. Privacy settings and limited sharing on Facebook aren't for security or actual privacy, they are for politeness. I don't care whether anybody finds out that I'm a libertarian, but I know libertarian postings annoy my Obama-supporting friends, so I don't push those updates on them (and I expect them to spare me the drivel they post supporting Obama and the Democrats). I don't see what additional "safeguards" I need for social networks. I do need and want safeguards for E-mail, IM, text messages, and phone calls.

  39. Re:We don't need most of this, but can you opt out by Anonymous+Brave+Guy · · Score: 1

    But safeguards against what? [...] I mean, if you have something to hide, don't put it on Facebook at all.

    Well, we could start with safeguards against Facebook collecting personal data about you from your friends without your consent. For example, I don't understand how anyone could think it's OK for Facebook to grab and store entire address books, giving them e-mail addresses to match to names. It's obviously rude for friends to give up that information if it was shared in confidence, but that doesn't excuse actively soliciting it on a massive scale.

    Indeed, the scale on which organisations like Facebook and Google aim to collect data is precisely why different standards need to be established to protect the principles and benefits of privacy today. Merely relying on rules and conventions that might have protected us adequately 20 years ago is no longer sufficient in the face of modern mass surveillance, data mining, and automated decision making technologies.

    --
    If you disagree, post your argument. (-1, Overrated) isn't your personal censorship tool for views you don't like.
  40. Re:We don't need most of this, but can you opt out by jandersen · · Score: 1

    IMNSHO, we need much stronger laws to prevent repurposing of these kinds of data or retaining it any longer than strictly necessary

    Perhaps - I just can't see that it will make much difference. The problem is that law enforcement is hugely inefficient - just look at patent as an example: if there were enough competent patent clarks, we would probably not have even 10% of the patents registered that we have today. But there are't enough resources available, so what is basically a good mechanism meant to protect the interests of the clever inventor, has become simply a tool that big corporations use to bully those with less resources. In the same way, more legislation will simply become another way to bully those with less resources.

    I'm not so worried about adverts - over time I have learned to ignore adverts even to the extent of making a point of not buying things that advertised agressively. I don't think I am the only one either.

    It's the same with privacy - of course I don't enjoy the thought that some odious lowlife may be poring over my innermost secrets, but it's just part of life, whether we like it or not. And who knows, maybe one day we find a way to make it either pointless or hideously unattractive - I would imagine ogling me in the nude is already pretty close as it is.

  41. Re:We don't need most of this, but can you opt out by stenvar · · Score: 1

    Well, we could start with safeguards against Facebook collecting personal data about you from your friends without your consent

    Thank you for making such a strong argument that there should not be any further "safeguards" put in place; regulating this would be an unacceptable intrusion on private conduct.

    Merely relying on rules and conventions that might have protected us adequately 20 years ago is no longer sufficient in the face of modern mass surveillance, data mining, and automated decision making technologies.

    You postulate nebulous threats and demonize a couple of companies that have never done you any harm. All of this vitriol against those companies distracts from who you really should be worried about: national governments and their spy agencies.

    In fact, your views about data protection are so naive and distorted that it sounds to me like you might be European, because demonizing private companies while every government agency snoop through their data and giving up every private piece of information is just what they are doing.

  42. Re:We don't need most of this, but can you opt out by Anonymous+Brave+Guy · · Score: 1

    regulating this would be an unacceptable intrusion on private conduct.

    Well, if you really believe that someone should be free to tell anything about anyone to anyone else, regardless of how sensitive the information might be or whether it was provided in confidence, then I guess you and I just have very different views on socially acceptable behaviour.

    You postulate nebulous threats and demonize a couple of companies that have never done you any harm.

    The position I'm advocating here is not specific to Facebook or Google. They are just examples, and I also gave numerous other examples in my very first post to this thread. In fact, my main point here is that while you don't have to use Facebook or Google, there are other activities that are essential to living in modern society but carry similar risks of allowing surveillance as a side effect. If those risks aren't balanced, the system is open to abuse.

    Also, you have no idea whether using Facebook or Google has ever done me, or you, or anyone else any harm. Given all the recent revelations about governmental abuse, anything you ever told Facebook or Google, or anything anyone else ever told them on your behalf, might be used against you in all kinds of ways. There have already been plenty of examples of people being arrested, prosecuted, sued, or otherwise attacked, and in several different countries, because of things they said on social networks or terms they put into search engines. (Some of those cases were probably legitimate, too, though others obviously weren't. I'm not judging the individuals here, just demonstrating the risk.)

    In fact, your views about data protection are so naive and distorted that it sounds to me like you might be European

    Was that supposed to be some sort of insult? I promise you that calling me names and insulting my background doesn't make your argument more convincing to me, and I doubt it's going to look good to anyone else reading this either.

    --
    If you disagree, post your argument. (-1, Overrated) isn't your personal censorship tool for views you don't like.
  43. Re:We don't need most of this, but can you opt out by Anonymous+Brave+Guy · · Score: 1

    It's the same with privacy - of course I don't enjoy the thought that some odious lowlife may be poring over my innermost secrets, but it's just part of life, whether we like it or not.

    Why? If that behaviour is against our moral values, what is to stop us from prohibiting it by law and punishing those who act in socially unacceptable ways?

    --
    If you disagree, post your argument. (-1, Overrated) isn't your personal censorship tool for views you don't like.
  44. Re:We don't need most of this, but can you opt out by stenvar · · Score: 1

    Well, if you really believe that someone should be free to tell anything about anyone to anyone else, regardless of how sensitive the information might be or whether it was provided in confidence, then I guess you and I just have very different views on socially acceptable behaviour.

    We have the same views on socially acceptable behavior. But it isn't the government's business to regulate socially acceptable behavior. When we used to give it those sorts of powers, it used to penalize lots of behavior among consenting adults. It took a couple of centuries to put a stop to that, and we shouldn't start it again.

    There have already been plenty of examples of people being arrested, prosecuted, sued, or otherwise attacked, and in several different countries, because of things they said on social networks or terms they put into search engines

    Yes, those are big problems. Arresting, prosecution, and lawsuits all involve governments and the legal system. Facebook and Google are only revealing this information because governments force them to do so. Telling Google or Facebook not to scan your E-mail for social network information is ineffective, because governments can (and do) just scan those E-mails themselves. So the problem there is with governments misusing the data, not with Facebook or Google.

    Was that supposed to be some sort of insult? I promise you that calling me names and insulting my background doesn't make your argument more convincing to me,

    No, it wasn't supposed to be an insult, it was an observation: your beliefs are similar to European beliefs, and the European beliefs about privacy are wrong and inconsistent. Apparently, my observation was correct. If that insults you, the problem is with you.

  45. Re:We don't need most of this, but can you opt out by Anonymous+Brave+Guy · · Score: 1

    But it isn't the government's business to regulate socially acceptable behavior. When we used to give it those sorts of powers, it used to penalize lots of behavior among consenting adults.

    The behaviour I described before is unacceptable precisely because it is not done with the subject's consent.

    Facebook and Google are only revealing this information because governments force them to do so.

    That may be true for those particular organisations and today, though it's already clear that plenty of commercial organisations have in fact provided sensitive data to governments without any legal obligation to do so. There are unfortunate systematic influences that clearly promote such behaviour in the absence of laws actively preventing it. ("Well, you don't have to give us this data without a warrant, but it'll be a shame for that multi-million dollar government contract you're bidding on if you don't.")

    Moreover, there have already been reports of insurance companies trying to run background checks against applicants via less than clear channels, and then adjusting rates in light of what they find. If you're talking about something like car insurance without which you can't legally drive or health insurance without which you quite literally might not live at all, that is about as serious a privacy concern as I can imagine. This isn't anything that directly involves the government, though of course that government made the law that you need motor insurance to drive and set the policy on how healthcare is funded. And again, this sort of arrangement is likely to become more common, given that it is probably a mutually beneficial deal for all commercial parties involved, unless something actively stops them and protects the individuals whose data is involved.

    No, it wasn't supposed to be an insult, it was an observation: your beliefs are similar to European beliefs, and the European beliefs about privacy are wrong and inconsistent.

    FWIW, you have an interesting idea of "not an insult". I am British, so I am European, though also well aware that there is no single "European belief" on just about any political matter. That said, from my point of view, the European trend for preferring privacy to more liberal freedom of speech seems just fine. In fact, as I get older and hopefully wiser, I increasingly favour the view that strong privacy protection is essential to safeguard many other valuable freedoms, including the freedom to express your own political views and to associate with others who hold similar views, which I claim is self-evidently necessary to maintaining a functioning democracy.

    --
    If you disagree, post your argument. (-1, Overrated) isn't your personal censorship tool for views you don't like.
  46. Re:We don't need most of this, but can you opt out by stenvar · · Score: 1

    The behaviour I described before is unacceptable precisely because it is not done with the subject's consent.

    We agree that it is "(socially) unacceptable". But there is a big difference between "unacceptable" and "illegal".

    That may be true for those particular organisations and today, though it's already clear that plenty of commercial organisations have in fact provided sensitive data to governments without any legal obligation to do so.

    Even if that were true, it is still governments that are abusing that information.

    So, in essence, you want to entrust governments with enforcing data protection laws against corporations in order to keep corporations from giving data to governments because those governments would be abusing that information if they got it. And in order to let governments enforce those new privacy laws, they get even easier access to private data in order to be able to audit it. You don't see the folly in that?

    Moreover, there have already been reports of insurance companies trying to run background checks against applicants via less than clear channels, and then adjusting rates in light of what they find.

    And the problem with that is... what? I like my insurance companies to assess risk well; it lowers my rates and encourages others to behave better. If you have a clandestine drug habit or eat too much trans fats, and that's showing up in your grocery bills, yes, I hope your rates go up; way up, in fact. Why should you be able to socialize the costs of your bad behavior?

    That said, from my point of view, the European trend for preferring privacy to more liberal freedom of speech seems just fine.

    Free speech has nothing to do with anything we are discussing here.

    In fact, as I get older and hopefully wiser, I increasingly favour the view that strong privacy protection is essential to safeguard many other valuable freedoms, including the freedom to express your own political views and to associate with others who hold similar views, which I claim is self-evidently necessary to maintaining a functioning democracy.

    Too bad that you and people like you are undermining our functioning democracy by giving ever more powers to governments, which then promptly turn around and abuse them.

    FWIW, you have an interesting idea of "not an insult"

    What I said before was an observation. An insult is: "you are an ignorant fool". Consider yourself insulted now.