Water Discovery Is Good News For Mars Colonists

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Water Discovery Is Good News For Mars Colonists

Posted by timothy on Thursday September 26, 2013 @07:40AM from the especially-the-thirstiest-ones dept.

astroengine writes "By now, we probably all know that there was once significant quantities of water on the Martian surface and, although the red planet is bone dry by terrestrial standards, water persists as ice just below the surface to this day. Now, according to a series of new papers published in the journal Science, NASA's Mars Science Laboratory rover Curiosity has found that the Mars topsoil is laced with surprisingly high quantities of the wet stuff. And this could be good news for future Mars colonists. 'If you take a cubic foot of that soil you can basically get two pints of water out it — a couple of water bottles like you'd take to the gym, worth of water,' Curiosity scientist Laurie Leshin, of Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, N.Y., told Discovery News."

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water bottles like you'd take to the gym? by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-26 07:45 · Score: 4, Insightful

I know that US public education is going to hell, but do we really need articles to explain what a pint is?
1. Re:water bottles like you'd take to the gym? by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-26 07:48 · Score: 5, Funny
  
  Pint, quarts and gallons are US measurements. In my region, we use milk jugs. We added the conversion to water bottles for heathens outside the US who haven't been educated in how to properly measure liquid.
2. Re:water bottles like you'd take to the gym? by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-26 07:58 · Score: 3, Funny
  
  Yes. I'm not american and I have no idea how big a pint is. Can I get that in litres please?
3. Re:water bottles like you'd take to the gym? by Anonymous+Codger · 2013-09-26 07:58 · Score: 4, Funny
  
  Lousy explanation using lousy measures ... if your audience can't understand standard units, just say what fraction by weight would be extractable water.
  And if they don't understand fractions?
  
  --
  No sig? Sigh...
4. Re:water bottles like you'd take to the gym? by radarskiy · 2013-09-26 08:01 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  A fraction by weight of a quantity specified by volume? Brilliant...
5. Re:water bottles like you'd take to the gym? by MiniMike · 2013-09-26 08:07 · Score: 5, Funny
  
  water bottles like you'd take to the gym
  These comparisons are ridiculous- how can we know the amount of water indicated without knowing which gym we're taking it to, or what kind of workout we'll be doing? Is it aerobics? Weightlifting? Spin class? Are we just pretending to work out while ogling attractive people? Treadmill? We would need different amounts of water for each of these! Please provide information in units we can actually use.
6. Re:water bottles like you'd take to the gym? by strength_of_10_men · 2013-09-26 08:27 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  'If you take a cubic foot of that soil you can basically get two beer glasses-worth of water out it'
  
  I think that's pretty much an international standard, right?
7. Re:water bottles like you'd take to the gym? by pla · 2013-09-26 09:01 · Score: 5, Funny
  
  Pint, quarts and gallons are US measurements. In my region, we use milk jugs. We added the conversion to water bottles for heathens outside the US who haven't been educated in how to properly measure liquid.
  
  Heathens??? Pot, meet kettle. All the "civilized" countries use metric nowadays - decijugs, centijugs, millijugs, and so on.
  
  / And the same units work for bra sizes, too!
8. Re:water bottles like you'd take to the gym? by gandhi_2 · 2013-09-26 09:19 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  The average American kid probably knows better what a pint is better than what a gym is, or what kind of bottle you'd bring to one.
  
  --
  THL phish sticks
9. Re:water bottles like you'd take to the gym? by Zero__Kelvin · 2013-09-26 09:43 · Score: 2
  
  "I dunno, you'd say "the amount you'd drink with a big mac"."
  So in your universe a pint is about 32 to 42 ounces?*
  
  * I don't "Supersize" my order, but many do.
  
  --
  Guns don't kill people; Physics kills people! - John Lithgow as Dick Solomon on Third Rock From The Sun
10. Re:water bottles like you'd take to the gym? by pla · 2013-09-26 14:58 · Score: 2
  
  Best "woosh fail" of the week!
  
  So, you clearly didn't make it to the 12th word... I'd guess you probably made it 10, but possibly only 4.
  
  Do tell - How short of an attention span do you have?
11. Re:water bottles like you'd take to the gym? by deviated_prevert · 2013-09-26 18:21 · Score: 2
  
  "I dunno, you'd say "the amount you'd drink with a big mac"."
  So in your universe a pint is about 32 to 42 ounces?* * I don't "Supersize" my order, but many do.
  That only applies if the Martian soil is made of quartz. However if the Martian soil is actually made of anything else it will yield two American pints per cubic foot. Which is why I prefer the British pint in the first place because is closer to a half of a German liter which is larger than an American 26er which is closer to a paltry ripoff 750ml of French plonk.
  Come up to Canada if you really want to get confused, order a full pint of some real beer and then think about how Milwaukee is ripping you Americans off. This is what will most likely cause the first Martian Colonial revolution. Which we wil wind up calling the "Martian Tea Party Revolt" They will be arguing like crazy and shooting each other right from the start about the size Martian pints in the soil instead of building a new cooperative society with health care. I would not even be surprised if the actually take guns along with them contributed by the NRA for the purpose of Martian Colonial security.
  
  --
  This message was not sent from an iPhone because Peter Sellers really was a deviated prevert without a dime for the call
12. Re:water bottles like you'd take to the gym? by qc_dk · 2013-09-26 21:08 · Score: 2
  
  Thus the 32 to 42 oz.
  OMG. 42 Australias of water? That's insane.
That's a whole lot of dirt, but... by Penguinisto · 2013-09-26 07:46 · Score: 5, Interesting

If you couple it with water/fluid recycling techniques, you stand a good change of doing well.
I find it strange that they would focus on just drinking water in the summary, when water will give you fuel and oxygen as well, and will likely be the greatest byproducts of this type of mining.

--
Quo usque tandem abutere, Nimbus, patientia nostra?
1. Re:That's a whole lot of dirt, but... by roc97007 · 2013-09-26 10:29 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  Less than 1/1000 of common water is dissolved oxygen. Common air is about 20% oxygen. You would need around 200 pints of water for 1 breath of air. The water on mars probably contains even less dissolved oxygen.
  Electrolysis to split the water molecules into oxygen and hydrogen is very energy expensive. Oxygen is very easy to compress and ship in tanks. Water is difficult to compress, and is heavy and difficult to ship.
  Being able to source drinking water from Mars is much more important and practical than trying to use that water for anything else.
  I suspect that an established, long-term colony on Mars would be more interested in splitting water for oxygen and fuel than shipping air from earth. But I agree that this may not be terribly practical with current technology. I've seen solar powered electrolysis rigs, but the output is comparatively tiny. Perhaps that there fusion power that I hear tell is (still) 50 years away might provide a solution. Fuse hydrogen to generate the energy required to split water molecules for more hydrogen fuel and oxygen to breathe.
  Of course, another way to turn water into oxygen is grow things with it.
  
  --
  Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
How much is that in shot glasses? by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-26 07:46 · Score: 5, Insightful

I thought since a certain missed orbital maneuver, people talking about Mars had agreed to only use metric...
1. Re:How much is that in shot glasses? by Russ1642 · 2013-09-26 08:06 · Score: 5, Funny
  
  No. We agreed to use imperial only. Didn't we? Oh, shit! I have a phone call to make.
2. Re:How much is that in shot glasses? by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-26 08:14 · Score: 3, Informative
  
  I thought since a certain missed orbital maneuver, people talking about Mars had agreed to only use metric...
  Scientists studying Mars have only used metric for decades. American reporters only use imperial units. If you don't translate for them, they nearly always mess up the conversion. As far as that failed orbital maneuver, it was the defense contractor that use imperial units. As I said before, NASA and the scientists have used metric exclusively for a very long time.
3. Re:How much is that in shot glasses? by Antipater · 2013-09-26 08:59 · Score: 2
  
  As long as you trust your eyes and common sense you're generally ok as well. Regarding that "certain maneuver" mentioned above, it was NASA who refused to correct course, despite their own (not mixed-up) sensors telling them that the probe was coming in too low.
  Even properly converted and labeled units are no match for stupid management.
  
  --
  Everything is better with chainsaws.
4. Re:How much is that in shot glasses? by osu-neko · 2013-09-26 09:21 · Score: 2
  
  American reporters only use imperial units. If you don't translate for them, they nearly always mess up the conversion. As far as that failed orbital maneuver, it was the defense contractor that use imperial units.
  Um, no, definitely not. Very few people in the US use imperial units. They tend to use US customary units. If you used imperial units, especially when talking volume, you'll confuse the heck out of everyone, since that's one of the areas where US customary units are quite different from imperial units.
  
  --
  "Convictions are more dangerous enemies of truth than lies."
Let me be the first to point out by erikkemperman · 2013-09-26 07:48 · Score: 2

Water Discovery Is Good News For Mars Colonists
Well, duh.
Now beer, that would be news!

--
Gosh, thanks. That must be why the other ships call me Meatfucker -- GCU Grey Area (Eccentric)
1. Re:Let me be the first to point out by gstoddart · 2013-09-26 07:53 · Score: 2
  
  Now beer, that would be news!
  If you have yeast, hops and barley ... you can make your own beer if there's water there.
  Red Planet Ale sounds tasty.
  
  --
  Lost at C:>. Found at C.
2. Re:Let me be the first to point out by internerdj · 2013-09-26 08:07 · Score: 4, Funny
  
  Yeah. I'm pretty sure the discovery of martian yeast would be big news on its own.
Re:burns the eyes! by ehack · 2013-09-26 07:48 · Score: 2

Yes, my foot probably contains about two pints of water.

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This is not a signature.
Great, let's send plants by NewWorldDan · 2013-09-26 07:52 · Score: 4, Interesting

Ok, next step, let's find some plants that might be able to grow there. Let's make Mars a green planet. I think that's really the next step, can we take a desolate planet and make it remotely suitable for life. I'd like to do the same thing with Venus, which I'm sure will be much more of a challenge.
1. Re:Great, let's send plants by seven+of+five · 2013-09-26 08:09 · Score: 5, Informative
  
  I take a lichen to that idea...
2. Re:Great, let's send plants by MiniMike · 2013-09-26 08:10 · Score: 4, Funny
  
  I generously offer as the first plant to go to Mars a sample of the very hardy crabgrass found in my yard. I'm sure it will do fine there.
3. Re:Great, let's send plants by HeckRuler · 2013-09-26 09:54 · Score: 4, Informative
  
  Magnetism, actually. The magnetosphere (all the best names have been taken by old discoveries, btw) keep solar winds from stripping away the atmosphere of a planet. That and, you know, gravity to keep the air stuck to the surface.
Imperial Dilemma by Reliable+Windmill · 2013-09-26 07:53 · Score: 2

I love how the dilemma of what units to use is highlighted by mixing feet, pints and the generic gym water bottle units. The Imperial system has dumbed Americans down to the point where they can only understand measurements by comparing distances, sizes, weights and volumes to things like football fields, elephants, bowling balls and water bottles.

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Signature intentionally left blank.
Re:Colonists will be great. by TheCarp · 2013-09-26 07:54 · Score: 4, Insightful

Not just a matter of values but of fear of risk. Risk tolerance has become quite low and seems to just be getting worst as the place gets safer and the perception of the world gets smaller.

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"I opened my eyes, and everything went dark again"
Oblig by SrLnclt · 2013-09-26 08:03 · Score: 4, Funny

Oblig XKCD
Re:burns the eyes! by GameboyRMH · 2013-09-26 08:09 · Score: 4, Funny

Witch! It's 13.5 minas to the hogshead!*
*I spent way too much time working that out.

--
"When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
Not everything must have "practical value." by mosb1000 · 2013-09-26 08:42 · Score: 3, Insightful

space is an endless money/resource sink with no practical value
Not every human endeavor must have "practical value." You must be a lot of fun at parties. I'm just kidding, you obviously don't got to parties because they are an endless money/resource sink with no practical value.
Pint by Kozar_The_Malignant · 2013-09-26 08:48 · Score: 2

Pint is how you order beer, preferably an Imperial pint.

--
Some mornings it's hardly worth chewing through the restraints to get out of bed.
Yes by TheSkepticalOptimist · 2013-09-26 08:54 · Score: 2

Because finding water on Mars was their greatest challenge.

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I haven't thought of anything clever to put here, but then again most of you haven't either.
While this is good news, they still need to be by portforward · 2013-09-26 08:59 · Score: 2

very careful. They need to make sure that they bring plenty of appropriately sized filters or else something bad can happen.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Waters_of_Mars
Ratio seems too high by Anonymous Coward · 2013-09-26 11:27 · Score: 2, Interesting

You can all do the maths (yes, I said "maths", not "math") yourselves, but one cubic foot of anything is about 27 litres in volume. Two pints is about 1.2 litres, so the soild is apparently saturated with water in a ratio of 25.8: 1.2 (25.8 + 1.2 = 27). That seems like an awful lot of water for a presumably desert-dry planet, so I'm calling bullshit on this.
Re:Lets not forget Mars' Ice Caps... by SternisheFan · 2013-09-26 15:17 · Score: 2

Thermodynamics of terraforming
The overall energy required to sublimate the CO2 from the south polar ice cap is modeled by Zubrin and McKay.[1] Raising temperature of the poles by four Kelvin would be necessary in order to trigger a runaway greenhouse effect. If using orbital mirrors, an estimated 120 MWe-years would be required in order to produce mirrors large enough to vaporize the ice caps. This is considered the most effective method, though the least practical. If using powerful halocarbon greenhouse gases, an order of 1000 MWe-years would be required to accomplish this heating. Although ineffectual in comparison, it is considered the most practical method. Impacting an asteroid, which is often considered a synergistic effect, would require approximately four 10-billion-tonne ammonia-rich asteroids to trigger the runaway greenhouse effect, totaling an eight degree increase in temperature.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terraforming_of_Mars