Charge Your Mobile Device With Fire

mmm... by girlintraining · 2013-10-02 13:07 · Score: 4, Insightful

Guessing it uses the peltier effect. Well, I see three problems here, which is probably why it's on Kickstarter and not in a t-mobile store. First, if you overheat it, your goose is cooked. Second, it looks like the solution to the overheating problem is to use water. Third... fire + water + electronics generally end badly. Usually because water causes fire which kills electronics, but really, any combination of the three usually ends badly.

Just buy a solar panel like a normal person; Don't risk it tipping over and killing your (likely) only means of communication in the wilderness. And while you're at it... buy a shortwave radio. They're cheap, low power, have long range, and you can easily run/charge them with a hand crank in minutes. And unlike a cell phone... many models are made to be waterproof and the simplicity of the design means they likely could even survive an EMP from a nuclear weapon. I'd rather have one of those in my "oh shit" bag than some complex contraption like this...

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Re:mmm... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 13:18 · Score: 5, Funny

Yes but less you forget, fire + water+ electronics + earth + wind + heart equals Captain Planet!
Re:mmm... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 13:32 · Score: 0

And while you're at it... buy a shortwave radio. They're cheap, low power, have long range, and you can easily run/charge them with a hand crank in minutes

Shortwave broadcasting has been declining drastically worldwide. When it has been losing its audience to the internet and many businesses are only concerned with the bottom line, cutting out shortwave broadcasts is an appealing way to save money.
Re:mmm... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 14:23 · Score: 0

And lest you forget yourself, you can make a do-it-yourself version yourself if you are really handy yourself or if you're good at making things yourself.
Re:mmm... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 15:01 · Score: 0

fire + water + electronics generally end badly
They have these things called wires that allow you to keep your phone away from the fire + water.
Re:mmm... by VortexCortex · 2013-10-02 16:20 · Score: 1

And while you're at it... buy a shortwave radio. They're cheap, low power, have long range, and you can easily run/charge them with a hand crank in minutes.
::Yawn:: Where's my coffee? Yep, I catch anyone using my percolator firewood for their cell, we're going to have problems. Oh, hey, Genius: The sun's not up, so use the handcrank dynamo for the phone. Derp. Fuck it, I'm going back to bed, this is dumb. Wake me when the government reboots.
Re:mmm... by lxs · 2013-10-02 18:36 · Score: 1

Oh but I do remember Earth Wind and Fire. Especially the twenty-first night of September. We were dancing the night awaaaaay...
Re:mmm... by mestar · 2013-10-02 19:02 · Score: 2

"...water causes fire..."
Those firemen bastards!
Re:mmm... by Hognoxious · 2013-10-02 22:37 · Score: 1

... using a 3D printer, of course.

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Re:mmm... by pyster · 2013-10-02 23:15 · Score: 0

http://www.biolitestove.com/campstove/camp-overview/features/
It works just fine, and took forever to come to market. Its on kick starter because not every good idea can get funding. Sounds like you are nay saying just to nay say.
Re:mmm... by geekoid · 2013-10-03 02:23 · Score: 1

"Kickstarter and not in a t-mobile store"
it's on Kickstarter becasue they need funding before going into production.
Do you think their is a production fairy that just waves her wand and you shit it made?
". First, if you overheat it, your goose is cooked."
So? that's true if you misuse pretty much any product
"Second, it looks like the solution to the overheating problem is to use water."
Yes, like every other way to generate electricity
"Third... fire + water + electronics generally end badly. "
No it doesn't.
"I'd rather have one of those in my "oh shit" bag than some complex contraption like this..."
You consider the complicated? seriously?
This is a device the converts waste heat into electricity. Heat you going to create anyways. The device is light weight.
"Just buy a solar panel like a normal person;"
More expensive, heavier and more fragile. And who are you to define normal?
"; Don't risk it tipping over and killing your (likely) only means of communication in the wilderness."
Are you really that lame? DO you use paper phone? YOU could dump that little water an pretty much any phone and it will still work.
You're the sort of person who think everything that can be invented has been invented.
Stupid short sighted dimwitted hater.

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Re:mmm... by geekoid · 2013-10-03 02:30 · Score: 1

When you do use that firewood, you use it's 'waste' heat. It's not coffee OR charging , its coffee AND charging.

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Re:mmm... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-03 03:31 · Score: 0

Solar panels cannot charge your device at night when you've made camp. During the day, while you're hiking with your phone for GPS, solar panel doesn't work so well either. You don't seem to understand that this device is for backpackers and hikers.

fire + water + electronics generally end badly
Maybe for you. I regularly eat a meal by candle light with a glass of water and my phone on the table. Nothing has happened to my phone. I guess I'm super coordinated.

Usually because water causes fire which kills electronics
Weird. I've never observed this phenomenon where water causes fire.
I can't believe you people modded this ignorantly conceited post to 5, Insightful. You should be ashamed of yourselves.
Re:mmm... by mcgrew · 2013-10-03 04:42 · Score: 1

Guessing it uses the peltier effect.
Looking at the photo, I can't see any other way it would work. But I'd rather see a generator powered by a Stirling engine. I don't know why they're not on the market. Maybe this is more dependable because there are no moving parts?
Third... fire + water + electronics generally end badly.
Well, fire and water usually results only in wet unlit fuel (depending on the fuel), and it looks like there's only maybe a cup of water in the thing, and your device is nowhere near the fire or water. TFS makes it sound like you heat this thing with your campfire, but the picture in TFA looks like that would be impossible. It's fueled by some sort of bottle with fire at the top.
Just buy a solar panel like a normal person
Well, this looks far more compact than a solar panel, it will work at night, and may possible be less expensive to buy.
Don't risk it tipping over and killing your (likely) only means of communication in the wilderness.
It isn't going to ruin your phone by tipping over. If it tips over, it just stops charging the phone. Just right it, refill the spilled cup of water, and relight your bottle.
And while you're at it... buy a shortwave radio.
+1 for being nerdy, but ham radios have a couple of problems. First, you have to get a license. Not hard these days since you no longer have to know Morse code (that's the only thing that kept me from getting one as a teenager, I could never memorize) but impossible for a non-nerd, impossible even for some slashdotters. The second problem is that you can only talk to people with other ham radios unless you have a third party intermediary. I can call almost anybody with a cell phone.
And unlike a cell phone... many models are made to be waterproof
My Kyocera Edge Android phone is waterproof; submersible in a meter of water for half an hour. That's one reason I bought it, two previous phones were killed by water, one falling in a toilet and one being caught in a downpour at a George Thorogood concert. After that concert I always kept a baggie in my pocket for emergencies, I no longer have to. I'm sure it's not the only waterproof phone on the market.
the simplicity of the design means they likely could even survive an EMP from a nuclear weapon.
I think if an EMP kills your phone you have bigger problems than a nonfunctioning phone.
But the other thing is... why? You won't be carrying this thing on a horse or motorcycle, and if your car's anywhere nearby you can charge your phone from it. That's how I kept my phone charged when a tornado completely destroyed my neighborhood's electrical infrastructure in 2006 (cell phones were the only phones that worked; the utility poles and cables and wires were all blown away).

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If you want one right away... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 13:08 · Score: 5, Informative

There's at least one similar product out that has been available for well over a year: BioLite Camp Stove - http://www.mec.ca/product/5031-449/biolite-campstove/?f=10&q=USB%2Bstove

Re:If you want one right away... by Dan+East · 2013-10-02 13:55 · Score: 2

I was also going to point out the BioLite stove (direct link to the product on their site). I see a couple advantages of the BioLite already. It doesn't consume / require water, and can operate off of a wide variety of fuels (little sticks and leaves and stuff) since the combustion takes place in its own combustion chamber. The Biolite appears to operate off a smaller heat source (and thus less fuel) because of the efficiency of burning the fuel in a controlled manner, instead of merely sticking it over flame you have to produce and manage manually in some way.

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Re:If you want one right away... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 13:56 · Score: 0

Thinkgeek sells something similar.
Re:If you want one right away... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 13:58 · Score: 0

Yes, I have one, works really well as a stove. The power is a bonus.
Re:If you want one right away... by drgould · 2013-10-02 14:42 · Score: 1

There's also the PowerPot.
Re:If you want one right away... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 15:26 · Score: 0

Or build it yourself :
http://www.instructables.com/id/Charge-Your-Cellphone-Using-Wasted-Heat/
Re:If you want one right away... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 16:59 · Score: 0

Cooking using the biolite leaves a lot to be desired, IMHO. It's a nice novelty product, but it's not as practical as thought it would be. On the bright side, with this you can use any stove type (it seems to be quite a lot cheaper as well).
Re:If you want one right away... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 19:56 · Score: 0

Was also about to point this out:
http://www.maplin.co.uk/biolite-campstove-787851
Re:If you want one right away... by DrXym · 2013-10-02 20:53 · Score: 1

I think Biolite looks like a more practical solution - provided someone is able to collect twigs off the ground or carry hexamine tablets or whatever around with them. This FlameStower thing may work but it's clearly very inefficient and comes with its own problems, namely the stove can't be used while someone is charging their phone and the whole set up looks fiddly. Maybe a better option than either would be to buy a solar panel that attaches to a backpack, a few spare batteries and a second emergency phone.
Re:If you want one right away... by geekoid · 2013-10-03 02:32 · Score: 1

OTOH, I can't quite bring myself to buy something from a site that says:
"Forget the fuel. " right next to some fire wood.
Hello?

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Re:If you want one right away... by geekoid · 2013-10-03 02:42 · Score: 1

"namely the stove can't be used while someone is charging their phone"
false.
" Maybe a better option than either would be to buy a solar panel that attaches to a backpack, a few spare batteries and a second emergency phone."
ah, so you read nothing, have no experiences.
HInt: Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt -- Abraham Lincoln

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Re:If you want one right away... by DrXym · 2013-10-04 01:14 · Score: 1

I suppose someone could build a tower of things over their stove in order for cook and charge at the same time but it would be obviously impractical and dangerous. And if you think it's a bad idea to take some spares an emergency phone and a solar charger than having the luxury of sitting around for a stove and device a phone to charge then it's you who is the fool.

BioLite by scbrent · 2013-10-02 13:12 · Score: 5, Informative

Not sure why someone would back this rather than support BioLite, who have already gone to market: http://www.biolitestove.com/

Re:BioLite by drinkypoo · 2013-10-02 13:19 · Score: 1, Interesting

biolite's store doesn't work even with scripts enabled (I don't permit google analytics, and a lot of people have designed their sites to fail if you do that, so fuck them sideways) and TFA isn't loading so I guess I won't bother to support either of these incompetents.

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Re:BioLite by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 13:21 · Score: 0

The only reason I could see is if it is significantly more efficient than the biolite stove. I didn't RTFA to see if they offer any stats on this. From what I've heard, the biolite stove will basically take you all day to charge an average smart phone.
Re:BioLite by scbrent · 2013-10-02 13:29 · Score: 1

You could be right about that (charging time) - I'm thinking more in terms of topping off a battery or keeping something running rather than doing a full charge. BioLite had a cool demo setup at Maker Faire, and their position seemed to be that the USB power thing was more of a value add than the main selling point of the stove (clean burning and compact).
Re:BioLite by sjwt · 2013-10-02 14:00 · Score: 1

Could be because
a) the store link on their page doesn't seem to work
b) Its $129 vs $80
c) the FlameStower seems to lit a max output of 3W vs 2W

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Re:BioLite by paramour · 2013-10-02 14:49 · Score: 2

Because it weighs 7oz as opposed to 33oz, is a fraction of the size, and has the same power output (2W at 5V, continuous). True, the BioLite is also a stove and this isn't, but there are many high efficiency light weight stoves that should work with FlameStower, or apparently an open campfire if you're in a place where that is permitted.
If you're car camping or day hiking you may not think saving over a pound in pack weight is important, but then again you probably don't need a USB recharger either. For multi-day back country hiking lots of people pay attention to this level of weight difference (not just the ultra-light types).
I have no connection to the FlameStower people, other than considering getting one.
Re:BioLite by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-03 00:59 · Score: 0

Could be because
a) the store link on their page doesn't seem to work
b) Its $129 vs $80
c) the FlameStower seems to lit a max output of 3W vs 2W
2W PROVEN OUTPUT
vs
3W CLAIMED OUTPUT (for a vaporware device, at least at this point)
fixed that for you...
Re:BioLite by Russ1642 · 2013-10-03 02:12 · Score: 1

Thing's been on the market for years. Why can't editors or posters do the tiniest bit of research before declaring that something is NEW?

Another One by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 13:19 · Score: 0

another one? This isn't a new idea and if you have a quick look on instructables you can find many DIY instructables, I don't see this as being any better and isn't any more efficient the the DIY's.

You can charge with fire today by starburst · 2013-10-02 13:21 · Score: 3, Interesting

You can purchase a BioLite camping stove that has USB charging today. We have one at our office for emergency off the grid charging. In our test we recharged an iPad and and iPhone.

Re:You can charge with fire today by snowraver1 · 2013-10-02 13:59 · Score: 1

Next time, you should just buy a ups or power inverter for your car...

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Re:You can charge with fire today by evilviper · 2013-10-02 14:14 · Score: 1

And what's the first thing you'll be unable to get in a power outage? That's right, gasoline.
Sticks and twigs tend to be more plentiful, since you can't run your car on it.

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Re:You can charge with fire today by Prof.Phreak · 2013-10-02 14:34 · Score: 2

Hmm... an array of BioLites... & Tesla car... sticks & twigs propulsion!

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Re:You can charge with fire today by adolf · 2013-10-02 15:03 · Score: 1

The camp stoves are cool: A buddy of mine has one. Probably is a useful thing for camping, but I don't think I'd care to have one around the house or office.
My own emergency charging rig is simpler, in that it does not require fire: A small, cheap solar panel, and a cheap OEM microusb car charger that is happy with up to 24V.
For night-time use, I also keep an inexpensive jump-start pack charged and ready. It can keep phones charging for a long, long time, or can run small power tools from an inverter in a pinch. I have a 12V CFL light with a long cord that I keep in the car for emergencies, and it will keep that thing going strong for hours.
I can also recharge its SLA battery from the solar panel.
We were without power for a week in June 2012, as was much of the region. It was an interesting time finding/wrangling fuel, dealing with a heat wave, trying to minimize use of a generator, and trying to keep the food (and the beer) cold....but charging phones, day or night, was never a problem with the above kit.
More recently, I've picked up an inexpensive USB backup battery. It's a cute little gizmo, and there are many others like it. This one is special because it has a solar panel of its own (which is nearly-worthless except to prevent self-discharge), and has an adjustable voltage output: I can set it to 12V and power a home router-box or a switch or some other small thing.
And each part of the kit is also useful by itself, for other things (the USB battery lives in the car, and it's been very useful to save a dying Droid more than once: I can charge my Droid 4 from near-flat to full at least twice from it).
A camp stove with a 5V USB socket really only seems useful for camping, since fire is required. And without tallying it all up, I'm inclined to say that my kit (solar panel, one big battery, one small battery, and an adapter) is cheaper and more versatile.

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Re:You can charge with fire today by fustakrakich · 2013-10-02 15:29 · Score: 2

Speaking of Tesla, You can char them with fire also... oh, chaaarrrge...

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Re:You can charge with fire today by adolf · 2013-10-02 15:29 · Score: 1

Hmm... an array of BioLites... & Tesla car... sticks & twigs propulsion!
Isn't steam power easier?
That said:
Folks in Germany were using sticks & twigs propulsion on their cars during the war, when petroleum was unavailable to them, using the same internal combustion engines that they had run on gasoline previously. Google "Wood Gas" for more.
It goes something like this:
1. Make a vehicle-mounted anaerobic wood burner to smoulder wood in.
2. Feed the resultant oxygen-deprived flammable gas to the carburetor, where it mixes with air and becomes even more volatile.
3. Spark happens, ignition occurs, pistons move, crank turns.
4. Run errands, deliver sheep to market, etc.
I suppose that, depending on construction, you could also get charcoal as a by-product. This can be used in a primary chamber to heat the wood gas-generating secondary, or maybe cook a meal once you get back home. Or, you know: Sell it.

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Re:You can charge with fire today by adolf · 2013-10-02 15:48 · Score: 1

One of the first things that happened in the June 2012 power outage here, which lasted a week, was that the corner gas station brought in a huge portable genset and had it wired to their building. It didn't go off-line again, and operated more-or-less normally (one of the refrigeration compressors died, but the beer was still cold, so they moved the milk and cheese and other perishables over to the beer cave and everyone was happy).
Meanwhile, headline topic is "charge your mobile device with fire." I don't know about your car, but mine will keep a mobile device running for a very long time (at least a week, in my testing) and still be able to start, with the car battery recovering fully in 30 minutes of idling (faster if driving).
How much gas does that use? Unless you tend to run on empty, I might hasten to say: In a developed country, not enough to care about. Even with a temporary gasoline shortage, chances are good that you'll be using the car periodically anyway to go get more food from the grocery store that is has their own generator, or from the Red Cross encampment, or whatever, and the battery can be recharged at that time.
In a longer-term outage (weeks/months), it still doesn't matter much, as long as you've still got enough gas to go "acquire" more ammunition and gasoline.
YMMV, but I've got a very conservative month worth of mobile-device charging sitting in the driveway at all times without doing anything special.

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Re:You can charge with fire today by bored_engineer · 2013-10-02 17:03 · Score: 1

. . .introducing the first Kickstarter to show up after Tesla begins selling their SUV.
Re:You can charge with fire today by evilviper · 2013-10-03 06:36 · Score: 1

the corner gas station brought in a huge portable genset
That's the rare exception, NOT the rule. Read about any disaster, even routine ones like hurricane evacuations, and you'll find innumerable stories about gas stations being shutdown.

I don't know about your car, but mine will keep a mobile device running for a very long time (at least a week, in my testing) and still be able to start,
If you've got a second car, or just a second car battery, and a full tank of gas... fine. But if not, you're taking a huge chance, and HOPING your car will start when you really NEED it. You might have had good luck, but try it in the worst case, needing to start your car late at night, in the middle of winter, with a freezing car battery, and your results may be very different.
With your cell phone charger drawing a couple amps, you could potentially run your car battery empty in a single night, if your charger or phone misbehave at all... Something simple like leaving a navigation app running in the background could do it. A cheap junk charger left plugged in might do it. etc.

Even with a temporary gasoline shortage, chances are good that you'll be using the car periodically anyway to go get more food from the grocery store [...] and the battery can be recharged at that time.
You're seriously underestimating the impact of life after a "disaster", and seem to be assuming a small scale, short-term blackout.
In any case, the electricity from your car is NOT "free". Every watt you suck out has to be replenished by burning more gasoline. Even if you need to drive somewhere, you WILL burn more gasoline to charge up your depleted battery in addition to the trip. And with car alternators being designed to only just barely supply enough power for your cars electrical system in the normal usage case, any higher drain can cause breakdowns, as anyone who has installed a powerful after-market car stereo can attest to.

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Re:You can charge with fire today by adolf · 2013-10-03 06:57 · Score: 1

I don't know what to tell you, then, especially if you think a cell phone charger draws "a couple amps." That's 24 Watts in, for a maximum of 5 Watts out. The remaining 19 Watts must be dissipated as heat within the charger itself: What you describe is a fire hazard, not a cell phone charger.
My compact car has a 140A alternator and a rather large battery.
It's not my fault that people buy cars that barely work.

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Re:You can charge with fire today by evilviper · 2013-10-03 09:05 · Score: 1

The remaining 19 Watts must be dissipated as heat within the charger itself: What you describe is a fire hazard, not a cell phone charger.
Because so many night lights spontaneously burst into flames?
And nobody would EVER buy a terribly inefficient $2 no-name Chinese made cell phone car charger...

It's not my fault that people buy cars that barely work.
Recommending activities that'll leave other people stranded in an emergency, due to your own ignorance of automobiles and electronics, is ENTIRELY your own fault.

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Re:You can charge with fire today by adolf · 2013-10-03 23:54 · Score: 1

Heh. Yeah, because night lights are just like car chargers, AND one or more of them are able to violate the law of conservation. Right?
Tell you what, since you're clearly the superior one: Go find thyself a 20 Watt resistor. It will be a large thing. Feed sufficient current through it that it is dissipating 19 Watts.
Wait a few minutes, and check again: Make sure it's still dissipating 19 Watts now that it is warmed up.
Touch it. It will be hot.
Now wrap it in non-ventilated plastic with poor thermal conductivity (such as is the ABS plastic that is common on cheap Chinese goods) and leave it in your car, such as is the housing for a car charger.
Good luck!
If cheap $2 Chinese car chargers were this bad (which is to say, as bad as you say that they are), indeed: Nobody would buy them. They'd get sick of putting out the fires.
Fortunately for everyone, and as proven daily by millions of users of cheap Chinese car chargers, it's very cheap to make a switching power supply of reasonable efficiency.
But even if they were using a simple and somewhat cheaper linear regulator they'd STILL not be as inefficient as you claim (about 7 Watts of waste heat, instead of the 19 Watts you claim).

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Re:You can charge with fire today by evilviper · 2013-10-04 02:22 · Score: 1

Fortunately for everyone, and as proven daily by millions of users of cheap Chinese car chargers, it's very cheap to make a switching power supply of reasonable efficiency.
Except, of course, the cheap ones are NOT SPSes.

instead of the 19 Watts you claim
You might want to remember that you're the one that pulled that number out of your backside, not me.

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Re:You can charge with fire today by adolf · 2013-10-04 14:00 · Score: 1

Except, of course, the cheap ones are NOT SPSes.
All the cheap ones I've had apart are. (We used to buy cheap Chinese charging adapters for less than $2, and mark them up to $30 with a "lifetime warranty." Surprisingly few ever came back, and most of those were issues related to cables or connectors.)

You might want to remember that you're the one that pulled that number out of your backside, not me.
Nope, I'm pretty sure that was you: You're the one who said a car charger draws 2 amps. 2A @ 12V = 24 Watts.
Meanwhile, it is reasonably common for mobile cell phone chargers these days to be able to deliver 1A at 5V, or 5 Watts.
24-5=19, last I checked.
And mind you: I was being conservative with your number. A car that is running might be somewhere between 13.8 and 14.4V, it takes some non-zero amount of time for a lead-acid battery to come back to resting voltage, and there are a great number of car chargers out there that can only do 500mA at 5V.....
But if you want me to be as hysteric and flippant about it as you seem prone to doing, we can run the numbers in their worst-case scenario based on your bad assumption of a 2A draw.
*shrug*

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Re:You can charge with fire today by evilviper · 2013-10-04 15:02 · Score: 1

All the cheap ones I've had apart are.
So you immediately admit to extremely limited experience, and yet that doesn't prevent you from mouthing off on a topic you know little about.
Of course I knew that when you were pretending you knew anything about car electrical system... Actually, it was probably long before that, when I added you to my foes list, however long ago.

Meanwhile, it is reasonably common for mobile cell phone chargers these days to be able to deliver 1A at 5V, or 5 Watts.
I'll take you 3 seconds on Amazon to find car chargers that draw and output more than that... But you prefer to play dumb. (At least, I assume you're PLAYING). And you're going to great lengths to stress this one point (that you're still wrong on, and which can't possibly redeem your foolish idea) after I pointed out all the innumerable other errors in your previous statements. A mighty attempt at backpedaling, indeed.

But if you want me to be as hysteric and flippant about it as you seem prone to doing
I never understood why people try to deflect their own mistakes and incompetence by name calling, and generally being argumentative fools. I've been around long enough not to be bothered by such things, and anyone else reading through this discussion can easily see the whole thread, and will know exactly who is the one continually spouting utter nonsense.

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Re:You can charge with fire today by adolf · 2013-10-04 15:07 · Score: 1

Yep, you sure are the same evilviper that I had discourse with awhile back.
Do you have friends?
Also, where do you live, crazy Internet person?

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Re:You can charge with fire today by adolf · 2013-10-04 15:58 · Score: 1

I'll take you 3 seconds on Amazon to find car chargers that draw and output more than that...

Did you mean "It'll?"
Anyhow, you're right! There are higher-output chargers. Of course these require more input power than those with lower output. None of them draw 2A @ 12V.
But a cellular telephone can only draw so much total power (in terms of Joules or kiloWatt-hours or horsepower-fortnights or whatever) before its battery is charged, and then they tend to sip current. On a week-long scale, which seems to be the premise for your disjointed attacks, they're all about the same, and again none of them draw "a couple amps".
And there are few devices which an actually accept and use this additional current: Indeed, many devices require special tricks to get them to draw more than 500mA at 5V, but I won't hold that against you because the total energy to charge the battery and operate the device is the same either way.
Nonetheless, apparently, modern mobile devices are smarter than you are.

I never understood why people try to deflect their own mistakes and incompetence by name calling, and generally being argumentative fools. I've been around long enough not to be bothered by such things, and anyone else reading through this discussion can easily see the whole thread, and will know exactly who is the one continually spouting utter nonsense.
You called me incompetent, first. Later on, I described your commentary as flippant and hysteric, but not before I praised your obvious superiority.
So: Best case in the "name calling" game: Pot, meet kettle. (You're the pot.)

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Re:You can charge with fire today by adolf · 2013-10-04 16:12 · Score: 1

And, again, where do you live, crazy Internet person? I still want to do my own independent research to see if your actual, documented local water issues are any match for your bark on /..

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Re:You can charge with fire today by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-04 19:41 · Score: 0

If you think a cheap charger operating from 12V to a 5V output is going to be a linear one, your are quite - let's put it mildly - uneducated. That waste heat needs to dissipated, and that's expensive. MUCH more expensive than a cheap switching design.
Re:You can charge with fire today by evilviper · 2013-10-06 08:03 · Score: 1

None of them draw 2A @ 12V.
You sure didn't look much.

But a cellular telephone can only draw so much total power (in terms of Joules or kiloWatt-hours or horsepower-fortnights or whatever) before its battery is charged, and then they tend to sip current.
Yup. UNLESS: "your charger or phone misbehave at all... Something simple like leaving a navigation app running in the background could do it."
Your reading comprehension skills are shining as much as ever.

You called me incompetent, first. Later on, I described your commentary as flippant and hysteric, but not before I praised your obvious superiority.
I said nothing flippant nor hysteric. Instead I explained in great details why your suggestion could get people killed. I called you incompetent because you made it extremely clear that you are. Suggesting emergency procedures that could get people killed is about the worst possible thing that can be done on /. yet you make no excuses nor apologies for it.

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Re:You can charge with fire today by adolf · 2013-10-06 17:57 · Score: 1

I looked for 3 seconds, just as you suggested. Didn't find one.
Maybe you can point my in the direction of one of these phone chargers that draw 2A @ 12V, since they're apparently very common. Perhaps I'm just not looking in the right place.

"your charger or phone misbehave at all... Something simple like leaving a navigation app running in the background could do it."
Presumably, the purpose of emergency charging is to charge the phone and get it back into the user's hands, not to see how quickly it can kill a car battery if left unattended for long periods.

I said nothing flippant nor hysteric. Instead I explained in great details why your suggestion could get people killed. I called you incompetent because you made it extremely clear that you are. Suggesting emergency procedures that could get people killed is about the worst possible thing that can be done on /. yet you make no excuses nor apologies for it.
You've never been flippant nor hysteric on these pages? Well enough then - if you want to be that way, I guess I'm not incompetent, either.
It's not like I'm writing "Adolf's Fool-Proof Guide to Disaster Survival" here, nor is it as if I am the Earth Czar and everyone must follow my lead. I'm under no order to write for the lowest common denominator of stupid.
Indeed I think you hold my prose to a mighty high standard for a random pseudo-anonymous person on a website that anyone can write on. In this context, I have nothing to apologize nor excuse myself for.
Meanwhile, in an emergency: Obviously, it is important to know how to use the tools you have. Charging a phone from a car can be good use of available tools. If gasoline is in short supply, the car is in bad shape, or whatever, other methods may rise in prominence according to local conditions, including conservation.
Myself, I have multiple devices that are capable of charging a cell phone, off grid, scattered around the house, including an adequate solar panel. I could go for a few weeks, hunkered down in the house, with mildly-conservative mobile phone usage before I would -need- to venture outside to find some other method of charging a phone (be it a car, or direct sunlight). I also keep some gasoline in the shed, which gets rotated to stay fresh enough to be useful. I maintain my car so that long periods of idling are not an issue for it. And I have other air-cooled gasoline-fired things which generate 12VDC which are designed to idle for hours on end. And I have a gas stove, and I keep extra propane on hand for the grill in case both the gas and the power go out at the same time. I also have PEX plumbing that survives freezing very well, know how to let a faucet drip, live just a couple of blocks from a water tower, and know how to dress for cold weather (even if the cold happens to be indoors), and how put everyone into one room of the house to stay warm. I can charge batteries during the day using the sun, and run lights with them in the evening. I can do a lot of things with the crap I've got laying around here.
But excuses? Nope, sorry: I ain't got none of them. Ain't got no apologies, neither.
And please remember, flippant Safety Nazi, that TFA is about a camp stove that charges devices using an open fire: At least the most potentially-unsafe of any of my methods use internal combustion instead.
It's a neat device for camping. It seems like a lousy device for unexpected emergencies: There are better, cheaper, or more widely-available things to use unless having an open fire (to cook supper with, or gaze at, or whatever) is the primary goal.
Meanwhile, one thing that a lot of people always have on-hand is a car, that has a large battery, with an appropriate charging adapter already in it, and a means of recharging its own battery using a consumable energy source called "gasoline" which may or may not be a precious entity at that time.
That is all.

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Thermovoltaic cell... by midifarm · 2013-10-02 13:26 · Score: 1

Couldn't you just use the heat from direct sunlight?

Re:Thermovoltaic cell... by sjwt · 2013-10-02 14:02 · Score: 1

Thermovoltaic works on the difference between hot and cold, you will get much more power on a few hundred degrees difference rather than 10 degrees

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Re:Thermovoltaic cell... by midifarm · 2013-10-02 14:32 · Score: 1

I was thinking like desert or throw a magnifying glass in front of it.
Re:Thermovoltaic cell... by bored_engineer · 2013-10-02 17:06 · Score: 1

Sunlight isn't reliable. Fire from a small stove, or a few dry twigs, or even moss can be counted on with planning, though.

Just think... by klingers48 · 2013-10-02 13:29 · Score: 3, Funny

...Of how many iPhone charges you could get out of those pesky rainforests...

Re:Just think... by caseih · 2013-10-02 15:08 · Score: 1

But ironically, burning wood to charge your phone is pretty close to carbon neutral, at least if the entire world isn't doing it and deforesting the planet in the process. Provided the fire is from dead wood in a healthy forest, this is completely carbon neutral. Big ifs, sure. But combustion is not always a bad thing.
Re:Just think... by bored_engineer · 2013-10-02 17:09 · Score: 1

. . .from dead wood in a healthy forest. . .
. . .or from wood in a well-managed forest. . .

So much serentiy by jmhobrien · 2013-10-02 13:29 · Score: 2

This will make it more convenient than ever to leave civilisation behind when I go camping.

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Re:So much serentiy by TangoMargarine · 2013-10-03 01:42 · Score: 1

Tell them I ain't comin' back

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Re:So much serentiy by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-03 02:26 · Score: 0

Burn the land and boil the sea

Efficient by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 13:32 · Score: 1

If it's using the seebeck effect (opposite: peltier effect) it's not efficient.

Re:Efficient by Dereck1701 · 2013-10-02 14:13 · Score: 2

Does it need to be? True sitting there and running a torch/burner or having a campfire specifically for this device would be idiotic. But fire in one form or another is pretty normal in a camping setting. Simply setting this device next to an already active heat source isn't going to effect what it is already doing, and your going to get a little extra use out of that heatsource at the same time. Seems to be a win/win to me. Though I do think it needs a bit of a redesign, having an open water source next to electronics is a bad idea. Enclosing it somehow (similar to a cloths iron?) and maybe getting the USB connector a little further from the heat source would seem prudent.

water defers to fire? by foobar+bazbot · 2013-10-02 13:36 · Score: 2

using the thermal deferential between the fire and water

News for nerds, homophones that matter?

Re:water defers to fire? by Qzukk · 2013-10-02 13:43 · Score: 2

You must show proper difference to the editors!

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Re:water defers to fire? by bored_engineer · 2013-10-02 17:12 · Score: 1

The parent to your post is good. Your post, however, made me laugh out loud. Thanks.

Here's How I would Do It by EMG+at+MU · 2013-10-02 13:37 · Score: 1

I would boil water over a fire to create steam, I would feed the steam through a turbine that would turn a rotor in an magnetic field, and then that would charge some caps and other charge storing circuitry and ultimately feed to a VR circuit that feeds the battery. Probably could be done for less than $5. Disclaimer: I'm not an EE

Re:Here's How I would Do It by Dereck1701 · 2013-10-02 14:05 · Score: 2

Microturbines have been researched for years, I don't think there has been one (known, quite a bit of the research has been military) design that wasn't horribly inefficient, maintenance intensive, and prone to failures. If they can ever do it I'm sure they will replace many applications, but despite many claims to have achieved it there have never been any production runs that I am aware of.
Re:Here's How I would Do It by EMG+at+MU · 2013-10-02 14:16 · Score: 1

Darn. And here I was pretty sure I invented something without moving from my desk chair.

This oversight might have somthing to do with my lack of "EEness". I am but a lowly firmware engineer.
Re:Here's How I would Do It by confused+one · 2013-10-02 14:26 · Score: 1

turbine small enough and sturdy enough for camping use, and light enough to spin under low pressures you could generate would be at least 10x your price estimate. The VR circuit (DC-DC) alone would eat your $5 budget.

Terribly inefficient by evilviper · 2013-10-02 13:51 · Score: 3, Informative

Peltiers are terribly inefficient in the best case. The only one I've seen that makes sense is a wood-stove heat circulating fan, since the fan does double-duty.

If you want to recharge your batteries or phone off-grid, you really can't do better than solar. Here's a $20 charger that'll charge batteries from and to USB, or from solar. Only thing it's missing is a tiny white LED for backup flashlight use:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0042Z14FO/

Or you can go a little cheaper if you don't want the USB functionality, and prefer more flexibility:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0098SWJUE/

Both will give 4 AA batteries an 80% charge in a day of sunlight, which is enough to charge your phone from zero. If you need faster charging than that, you'll need to spend a bit more. Something like this 7 watt panel should suffice:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00CJJ4OUW/

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Re:Terribly inefficient by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 19:07 · Score: 0

One cannot rely on sunlight. When you're outdoors and need that little bit of extra juice, it's usually dark and bad weather.
Re:Terribly inefficient by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-03 02:30 · Score: 0

Then get one with a built in LED light and use that to charge it, duh!
Re:Terribly inefficient by evilviper · 2013-10-03 06:11 · Score: 1

One cannot rely on sunlight.
At least on EARTH you can. Yes.

When you're outdoors and need that little bit of extra juice, it's usually dark and bad weather.
Then you pop-in those AA batteries you've been solar-charging and use them. If you don't have enough power stored, then you didn't plan very well, and either aren't carrying enough battery capacity, or got too small of a solar panel for your needs.
You seem to think you're going to light a candle and charge your cell phone in 5 minutes... In fact peltiers will provide you a TINY trickle charge (far less than a cheap and tiny solar panel; even with a raging inferno to power it), and will require just as much pre-planning and coordination to ensure you don't run out of power when you need it.

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I'm a big fan of... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 13:54 · Score: 1

The Power Pot as an alternative. I like the idea of charging my GPS while cooking dinner or boiling water for coffee in the morning. http://www.thepowerpot.com/

Re:I'm a big fan of... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 16:54 · Score: 0

Why as an alternative? This seems to accomplish the same thing at a fraction of the weight and cost.

But don't by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 13:57 · Score: 0

do what this kid did: http://www.wsbtv.com/news/news/local/boy-severely-burned-after-cellphone-explodes-fire/nbDgG/

solar by confused+one · 2013-10-02 14:29 · Score: 1

This is going to be horribly inefficient and eat up your camping fuel supply. Just stick one of the numerous available solar panel kits on your backpack...

Spam by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 14:55 · Score: 0

Uhh... Why not link to the kickstarter page directly? I tapped a link and ended up redirected to pr0n...

It doesn't scale down well by dbIII · 2013-10-02 14:56 · Score: 1

Really small turbines have the problem that friction etc consumes a far more significant amount of the output than really large turbines. The seebeck effect in thermocouples and presumably this thing does scale down to small sizes without large losses so eventually there is a crossover point where it makes far more sense than a tiny turbine.

Igne Nexus Renovatur Integer by Michael+Woodhams · 2013-10-02 15:09 · Score: 1

My Nexus will be fully recharged by fire.

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Re:Igne Nexus Renovatur Integer by viperidaenz · 2013-10-02 17:15 · Score: 1

Not really, it provides a nominal power output of slightly less than a standard USB port. About 1/4 of the wall charger your Nexus came with.
Re:Igne Nexus Renovatur Integer by Michael+Woodhams · 2013-10-02 18:35 · Score: 1

Sigh. This is what I get for making a joke which will primarily be appreciated by alchemist techies.

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40k by darthdavid · 2013-10-02 15:41 · Score: 1

Did anyone else immediately think of LasGuns from 40k?

efficiently captures excess heat by citizenr · 2013-10-02 16:03 · Score: 1

0.5% efficiency

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Or just a battery. by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 16:16 · Score: 1

You can get a battery the size of a wallet that will recharge the average smartphone half a dozen times with ease. I have one, it's great. I mean, why the fuck would you need to charge your smartphone half a dozen times when camping, wouldn't you be missing the point of something at that point?

* As for those who are bound to wonder why you would even have it, for some people it's their only camera (I don't understand these people) and fuck you, that's why. I like my phone.

Re:Or just a battery. by bored_engineer · 2013-10-02 16:45 · Score: 1

Although you're posting as AC, you make a decent point to which I would like to see a riposte.
Have you ever climbed Denali or Everest or Chimborazo? I can bet that the folks who do today will love having longer-term charging power.
Looking at it, I bet it weighs 4 or 5 oz. I've not attempted any of the mountains I've mentioned, but I like outdoors and live in Alaska. I've trekked for as long as three weeks and don't trust *phones nor GPS devices for trips like that, but wouldn't mind one for a backup. This, or something like it, would make a trustworthy secondary to my primary map and compass if the weight is right.
Re:Or just a battery. by bored_engineer · 2013-10-02 16:51 · Score: 1

oops. I just noticed that RobinEggs says that it weighs 7 oz. I still view this as a favorable weight, given that I can put it over the fire of my choice.
Re:Or just a battery. by Joce640k · 2013-10-02 21:33 · Score: 4, Informative

Although you're posting as AC, you make a decent point to which I would like to see a riposte.
Have you ever climbed Denali or Everest or Chimborazo? I can bet that the folks who do today will love having longer-term charging power.
The folks who do it today have things like this: http://www.amazon.com/Innovative-Digital-Hand-Crank-Emergency-Charger/dp/B0089QB2KY/ref=pd_sxp_grid_pt_0_2
They're more reliable than fire in a strong wind (strong winds occasionally happen on Everest, and I should know, I've climbed it 16 times).

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Re:Or just a battery. by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-03 00:51 · Score: 0

Do you actually think this thing will provide any appreciable power output? There's a reason it doesn't state the power output, it is probably lso low it would useless for actually charging your device any real amount.
I'm starting to the kickstarter is becoming a suckers bet...
Re:Or just a battery. by TangoMargarine · 2013-10-03 01:37 · Score: 1

Except you can't actually call anybody from the world's tallest mountains...they don't have a cell tower on Everest, do they?

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Re:Or just a battery. by countach44 · 2013-10-03 02:01 · Score: 2

Except you can't actually call anybody from the world's tallest mountains...they don't have a cell tower on Everest, do they?
Apparently, there is coverage
Re:Or just a battery. by geekoid · 2013-10-03 02:28 · Score: 0

Do they? If you actually did climb Everest, you should no that energy is precious and calories are important. A device that requires you to manually crank takes calories. How would you wind that while wearing gloves?
and Everest is a cake walk today. IT about 1 step removed from just selling tickets and having a guid on hand to take you to the next camp. Yawn.

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Re:Or just a battery. by supermank17 · 2013-10-06 17:08 · Score: 1

16 times? Interesting. So you're a sherpa then? Because Dave Hahn currently holds the record for the most ascents of Everest by a westerner, and he's only done it 14 times. Heck, at 16 ascents you must be a pretty famous sherpa at well, as the record for most ever ascents by anyone is only 21.

Many advantages of FlameStower over BioLite by RobinEggs · 2013-10-02 16:20 · Score: 4, Informative

The BioLite is 2 lbs 1 oz; the FlameStower is 7 oz. Using most canister stoves, you could carry stove, over a week of fuel, and the FlameStower for 8oz less than the BioLite.

You can use the Flamestower where you're not allowed to gather fuel, when there's nothing to burn, or when everything is too wet to burn. One or more of those things is true in tons of national parks, wetlands, deserts, mountains, etc.

The FlameStower is starting at $80 and could still come down; the BioLite is $129.

I've seen at least 3 posts that just said: "Why, you could just get a BioLite?", 1 that pointed out the advantages of the BioLite, and none that pointed out advantages of the FlameStower.

I'm quite disappointed that a group of people who laud critical thinking and informed opinion are so unimaginative about this device's usefulness, and speak as if quite uninformed about the practical necessities of backpacking / survival equipment.

Re:Many advantages of FlameStower over BioLite by bored_engineer · 2013-10-02 16:59 · Score: 1

You are spot on. I made a close guess on the weight above, and didn't make the point quite as well as you do. Where weight counts, when you're not living out of the house or the car, FlameStower is much better than BioLite. Weight is precisely why I've not already bought a BioLite.
Re:Many advantages of FlameStower over BioLite by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 19:32 · Score: 0

but when you have a biolite, you don't need to bring a gas burner. The weight of a gas burner with one extra gas cartridge is about the ssame as the weight of the biolite.
Re:Many advantages of FlameStower over BioLite by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-03 00:56 · Score: 0

And the power output of Biolite sucks. (looks to be about .5 amp)
FlameStower will probably be worse...
Re:Many advantages of FlameStower over BioLite by geekoid · 2013-10-03 02:33 · Score: 1

Lets not forget the BioLite is also your stove. ANd it's designed to use local fuel(sticks and what not)

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Re:Many advantages of FlameStower over BioLite by JesseMcDonald · 2013-10-03 06:26 · Score: 1

The PowerPot is a bit heavier than the FlameStower (12 oz) and almost twice as expensive ($150), but otherwise it appears to have the same or better advantages over the BioLite as the FlameStower and is already commercially available. It's only 30% the weight of the BioLite and can supply a standard full-rate smartphone charge (5W, vs. FlameStower's 2W) over USB from any external heat source. You can even boil water or cook with it while it's generating electricity, which addresses concerns about using up cooking space on your campfire or camp stove.

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Kind of cool by Trogre · 2013-10-02 16:33 · Score: 1

Does anyone know how these work? Does it use a Peltier thermoelectric generator? I assume the water acts as a heatsink for the "cooling" side.

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I had to configure a blackberry today by FuzzNugget · 2013-10-02 16:34 · Score: 1

And something to do with fire definitely came to mind, but it nothing to do with charging the battery.

originality fail by viperidaenz · 2013-10-02 17:13 · Score: 3, Interesting

www.thepowerpot.com
It may cost more ($149) but it provides twice the power and is already commercially available.

I'm sure there are more around, but that was the first one google found.

Here's how I would do it by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 17:55 · Score: 0

I'm only a day-hiker, so I just make sure the phone is charged before I go out. It's no good in a lot of wilderness areas anyway. If I were out for several days on remote trails I'd invest in one of the many fine emergency beacons. You hit a switch and it sends out a signal via satellite. You'd better be DAMNED SERIOUSLY IN NEED OF HELP when you hit that switch. Guys with helicopters may go in the air, and unless you seriously need evac, you're gonna have some splainin' to do. You might have to cough up $thousands for making them fly for frivolous reasons.

If you want to update your FaceBook status from the back country, you're doing it wrong.

If you can't haul enough batteries and/or charge solar during the day then we're getting into some edge cases. For light, you're probably going to be using a lantern in those edge cases anyway. There are thermal devices like this you can clamp onto lanterns, which apparently are hot enough to generate power too.

Bit of a tangent by Justpin · 2013-10-02 19:48 · Score: 1

But it reminds me of a VERY old game captive. When one of your androids was low on batteries you could as a last ditch attempt use fire to recharge your battery partially.

Real nerds... by aaronb1138 · 2013-10-02 20:13 · Score: 1

Real nerds get a Stirling engine (built from kit acceptable) and hook it up to a DC motor from an RC car to act as a generator. Voltage regulation to 5 V or 12 V via a simple resistor network is similarly acceptable.

Re:If you want one right away: Biolite by advid.net · 2013-10-02 20:41 · Score: 4, Informative

Cooking using the biolite leaves a lot to be desired, IMHO. It's a nice novelty product, but it's not as practical as thought it would be.

Well, I used Biolite for 6 weeks (total), drawbacks are :
- need *dry* wood (using not so dry wood pieces needs full power position and dry pieces mix)
- need *small* pieces of wood (set up a workshop aside the kitchen to cut wood)
- need to be fed constantly, 30s-45s intervals is a good timing, each time lift the saucepan to drop the wood
- can't simmer, power is medium or high, not low
- efficient mobile phone charging can be optimized but this is tricky

However I'm fine with that and I continue to use it, it's still fun and usefull.

We already talked about that on /. a few weeks ago.

-1, Flaming by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 21:36 · Score: 0

I heard that throwing your iPhone into fire makes it fireproof.

My 2 cents by drolli · 2013-10-02 21:56 · Score: 1

If ites really about power everywhere, use a hand generator. In Japan i bought one for 3000Yen, with radio, pocket light, a charging port, and a buzzer (in case you are somewhere in the rubble after the earthquake its much easier to turn on the buzzer than to shouth all the time). Dont remeber if it charged USB back then, but had connector for all usual phones in Japan.

http://www.amazon.com/CUTEBEAT-TY-JR11-waterproof-charging-TOSHIBA/dp/B005FB4CG2/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top

Otherwise if you insist in using heat:

a) small temperature difference (thats why they need the water) -> small efficiency. If you have no effective way of cooling the required temperature rises, thus making it less a reuse of unused heat but more a normal generator

b) if its a normal generator, then an open flame is the least efficient way of using the heat. Internal flames are much better

deferential? by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 23:10 · Score: 0

Oh wait. This is Slashdot. Home of Slashdot's editors.

The BioLite has an advantage too. by DigitalReverend · 2013-10-02 23:47 · Score: 1

It exists in production and is available for purchase.

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this is a fucking thinkgeek advert by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-02 23:56 · Score: 0

fuck you dice.

Crazy Arthur Brown says... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-03 00:37 · Score: 0

I AM THE GOD OF HELLFIRE, AND I BRING YOU...

A grossly inefficient way to charge your sodding iPhone.

Pedal power FTW by jimbodude · 2013-10-03 00:51 · Score: 1

Pedal powered generators have been used to power remote communications for a long time: http://www.antiqueradio.com/traeger_pedal_07-99.html That's possibly better than wasting your camp fuel to achieve a charge. Maybe the trick is not to charge the phone, but to run the generator when you need the phone, as these pedal powered radios were operated.

Finally! Perpetual charging. by LoRdTAW · 2013-10-03 01:53 · Score: 1

Awesome! Now I can charge my Dell laptop using my Dell laptop. http://explodinglaptop.com/laptops.php

oops by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-03 02:53 · Score: 0

I saw the headline "Charge your mobile device with fire", and I thought the topic was the Tesla fire:

Originality Filter for Kickstarter by TheSkepticalOptimist · 2013-10-03 03:22 · Score: 1

I am going to do a Kickstarter project. Create an originality filter for Kickstarter.

Perhaps before you throw money at this project, realize this is nothing new or novel:

http://www.homehardware.ca/en/rec/index.htm/Outdoor-Living/Seasonal/Outdoor-Lighting/Solar-Light-Sets/Warm-White-LED-Candle-Lantern/_/N-ntmjw/R-I3635216

Whether you are charging LED's or cellphones, the concept is already invented.

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Charging with fire.. by Anonymous Coward · 2013-10-03 04:36 · Score: 0

Brings whole new meaning into the term "Kindle Fire".

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