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Feinstein and Rogers: No Clemency For Snowden
Ars Technica reports, probably to no one's surprise, that U.S. elected officials are unlikely to start seeing Edward Snowden as a righteous whistleblower rather than a traitor to the U.S. government. From the article:"[Sunday], the chairwoman of the Senate Intelligence Committee, Dianne Feinstein (D-CA), and her House counterpart, Mike Rogers (R-MI), both emphasized there would be no mercy coming from Washington. 'He was trusted; he stripped our system; he had an opportunity—if what he was, was a whistle-blower—to pick up the phone and call the House Intelligence Committee, the Senate Intelligence Committee, and say I have some information,' Feinstein told CBS' Face The Nation. 'But that didn’t happen. He’s done this enormous disservice to our country, and I think the answer is no clemency.'"
He'd be kept quiet one way or another.
"f what he was, was a whistle-blowerâ"to pick up the phone and call the House Intelligence Committee, the Senate Intelligence Committee,"
Those thugs continue to support government spying on citizens. Whistleblowing does nothing unless it's brought to the attention of someone who both cares and is in a position to do something.
BTW, Mike Rogers is complaining that "Federal data hub threatens privacy," with regard to the Federal Data Services Hub, a component of the health insurance exchanges created by Obamacare, but supports the NSA. He's a disingenuous hypocrite.
"National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
he and others did and were ignored or worse prosecuted.
http://articles.washingtonpost.com/2013-06-09/world/39856622_1_intelligence-powers-single-point
Does anyone actually believe that if he had gone to the Senate or the House that anything would change, that the concerns would have been addressed?
he had an opportunity - if what he was, was a whistle-blower - to pick up the phone and call the House Intelligence Committee, the Senate Intelligence Committee, and say I have some information
Plausible deniability by Congress. "We didn't know". It's like Reagan and Iran-Contra. People said he didn't know. I figured there were two possibilities. Either he knew or he didn't, and I'm not sure which was worse.
So what exactly are the phone numbers for the House Intelligence Committee and the Senate Intelligence Committee, so that, you know, future whistle blowers can call them up, and not end up like Snowden?
'He was trusted; he stripped our system...' Snowden could claim exactly that against the NSA. This is beyond the pot calling the kettle black.
I hadn't the slightest objection to his spending his time planning massacres for the bourgeoisie... (P.G. Wodehouse)
"Weâ(TM)ve done this enormous disservice to our country, and he's exposed us for that."
" ... pick up the phone and call the House Intelligence Committee, the Senate Intelligence Committee, and say I have some information,' Feinstein told CBS' Face The Nation."
You mean the House and Senate Intelligence Committees didn't know about this already? Aren't they in charge? Don't they make the rules? Didn't they say, and aren't they still saying, that it's all legal? In what alternate universe would Snowden think telling the intelligence committees would change anything.
Feinstein thinks we're all ignorant idiots.
Especially channels amenable to spying on US citizens, we would never have heard of Snowden or the spy programs. If he had then tried to publish via other means, neither would his family.
At the risk of Godwin:
If you were, say, a German administrator learning about the death camps and being absolutely appalled, reporting it to any senior Nazi official wouldn't do much good.
This shows how messed these people are. Of course he was a traitor to the government. But he and no one else owes loyalty to the government. The fact that these people believe that they, personally, are owed loyalty says far more about them than it does about Snowden. If he's a traitor then the question is if he was a traitor to the country and it's citizens.
I'm inclined to go with "no".
SJW n. One who posts facts.
How is this fucking authoritarian fascist even sort-of, possibly, slightly representative of the views of the majority of Californians?
Someone get those call logs! I bet he called and nobody listened!
--
# Canmephians for a better Linux Kernel
$Stalag99{"URL"}="http://stalag99.net";
There is a lot more that Snowden has not released yet. He is wisely using the drip, drip, drip method of disclosure so the press and public have time to digest each successive piece of information. Before it's done, it will become clear that the House and Senate oversight committees were either derelict in their duties or complicit in illegal activities. They either knew or they didn't. Either way, eventually they will be the ones asking for clemency.
"He took a duck in the face at 250 knots." -- William Gibson, Pattern Recognition
Every time Rogers opens his mouth he says that the intelligence committee was fully briefed and that they knew what was going on. What Feinstein and Rogers are implicitly admitting is that Snowden didn't just blow the whistle on the NSA. He blew it on the intelligence committee too for not doing their job of oversight.
Its just silly to think he should have reported to them that they were corrupt and/or incompetent.
When information is power, privacy is freedom.
Feinstein knows full well that this country doesn't have a functioning justice system. If we did, she'd be behind bars herself.
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
The disservice was done by the secret courts, the spooks and the "state within". They got caught, and in the long run, that can only be a huge service to the country. Who knows, they might even eventually come up with foreign policy that doesn't piss a lot of people off, thus making the whole apparatus for mitigating it unnecessary.
The US population have a very simple standard.
politician.traitor = (politician.party != self.party);
We have a big thank you to Snowden for making us aware of what is actually going on behind the scenes. As a result, I've taken extra security precautions. I don't really know whether or not they will do any good but suffice it to say that I'm taking it more seriously. And, by the way, the old argument, "If you have nothing to hide, you need not worry" is bullshit. Look at the innocent people that get wrapped up in the Criminal Injustice System.
Why exactly do they get to have a say in this? Why are we even listening to them?
Feinstein and Rogers are the two key figures responsible for most of these violations in the first place. They are the ones who tacitly sanctioned wholesale violation of the constitutional right against unreasonable searches. Yet their opinion on Snowden's guilt is somehow all over the news. It's amazing that the press is quoting Rogers' preaches on how Snowden has broken the law and needs to be persecuted, when both of these bozos voted to grant retroactive immunity for warrantless wiretaps they've sanctioned under earlier administration. As far as I am concerned, asking for their opinion is like asking a robber on what to do with a good Samaritan who stopped the robbery.
No clemency for Feinstein and Rogers.
The cart has run away with the horse. It doesn't matter what they do now, he's a popular hero whose reputation is growing as fast as popular discontent/outrage is growing against the tactics of the NSA and the failures of the administration to stop it or even come clean about who knows what and when.
This is a huge problem for the government - once the popular hero becomes truly a hero, their every effort to try him or bring him to justice deepens the hole they're in, and god help the US government if Snowden goes to jail - he'll immediately become a demigod.
They should use this as a wake-up call and change tactics or hopefully even policy. But it doesn't seem like that's going to happen.
Run, Snowden, run.
If this were Usenet, I'd killfile the lot of you.
In the meantime Feinstein is busy pushing a new bill through Congress. It will not only legitmize NSA spying on everyone but also impose even harsher penalties for anyone who dares speak out. Despite of majority of citizens now being clearly against it (despite of all bullshit and propaganda thrown at them by corporate media). I know it makes many Americans angry but I don't see much difference between civil liberties in US and China right now, the only one being that US regime is far superior in concealing itself behind "freedom and democracy" mirage.
It's not mutually exclusive.
"..as a righteous whistleblower rather than a traitor to the U.S. government."
'The government' is not the same thing as 'the country'.
Snowden is..
...a righteous whistleblower.
...a traitor to the U.S. government.
...not a traitor to the US and its people.
blindly antisocialist = antisocial
As long as American Nazis are in charge.
Please make a note of it.
Truth isn't Truth - Guliani
Snowden is a freaking hero just Like Manning. Snowden knew the shitstorm he was going to step into when he did what he did.. And contrary to the liars in the government what he released did not risk anyone or "aid the enemy" unless the American public is by their definition the enemy..
The fact that they all are trying to play it down and it's working because americans in general are stupid as a box of rocks and are not screaming at the top of their lungs in the streets about this is proof.
I am pretty disgusted with my fellow citizens and how they happily give up their rights for the sake of fake security...
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
Especially channels amenable to spying on US citizens, we would never have heard of Snowden or the spy programs. If he had then tried to publish via other means, neither would his family. At the risk of Godwin: If you were, say, a German administrator learning about the death camps and being absolutely appalled, reporting it to any senior Nazi official wouldn't do much good.
And it didn't for those who naively did tried to do this. Case in point, John Rabe, a Siemens employee in China saved the lives of tens of thousands of Chinese civilians in during the rape of Nanking. He was rewarded with a gag order upon his return to Germany for embarrassing an ally. Post war he was brutally interrogated by the NKVD and then by the British and died in abject poverty sustained by money and food donated by the people of Nanking. Rabe he was one of the lucky ones. Many altruistic individuals who saved lives during WWII ended up being punished by their own countries for what they did.
I can't think of a case in recent history where the actions of a single individual have had such far-reaching, global consequences. At the very least awarding Snowden the peace prize would be a political black-eye for the Obama administration and would help to cast these lickspittles and apologists and other assorted voices of Sauron as being ethically retarded. It would also go towards repairing the prize's failing reputation, especially in light of the 2009 award.
I'm going to come out right now and say it: Snowden is a fucking hero. However pure or impure his intentions were, the fact remains that a lot of very powerful people are now having to go into damage control and make excuses and otherwise cover their asses. It remains to be seen whether this will have long-lasting political ramifications. Although, given that the American political system is fundamentally corrupt - the political parties are basically two sides of the same filthy coin - I have my doubts.
There was no disservice done to me from what Snowden released, if the governments honestly didn't know they were being bugged they are too stupid to last.
In fact, no matter what you think of Snowden it's pretty clear that our "security" services are incompetent, so he did us the favour of clearly exposing that.
In addition, the rhetoric coming from the likes of Feinstein and her ilk (Bloomberg, Schumer, etc) is what really concerns me.
"If any question why we died, Tell them because our fathers lied."
It all depends on your breadth and length of view.
... Proper disclosure: I'm not an American.
Over the past months and the near future, Snowden is definitely causing USA damage.
In the long run though, he just might help to make the world a better place... and at a huge personal sacrifice no less. In my book that's the definition of a hero!
America is NOT supposed to be China.
We have laws that declared doing these actions are illegal.
From the things I've read, Singapore has better social services.
"What in the name of Fats Waller is that?"
"A four-foot prune."