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The NSA Is Looking For a Few Good Geeks

Posted by Soulskill on from the searching-for-the-next-snowden dept.

itwbennett writes "Dan Tynan noticed something curious when he was reading a TechCrunch story (about Google's mystery barges, as it happens). There was a banner ad promoting careers at the NSA — and this was no ad-serving network fluke. Tynan visited the TechCrunch site on three different machines, and saw an NSA ad every time. In one version of the ad, a male voice says, 'There are activities that I've worked on that make, you know, front page headlines. And I can say, I know all about that, I had a hand in that. The things that happen here at NSA really have national and world ramifications.'"

28 of 388 comments (clear)

  1. world ramifications... by arthurpaliden · · Score: 5, Insightful

    "The things that happen here at NSA really have national and world ramifications."

    Like making the rest of the world distrust and hate the USA.

    --
    Undetectable Steganography? Yep, there's an app fo
    1. Re:world ramifications... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      Darn, I missed the ads cause of my adblocker.

    2. Re:world ramifications... by kthreadd · · Score: 4, Funny

      "The things that happen here at NSA really have national and world ramifications."

      Like making the rest of the world distrust and hate the USA.

      They actually do quite a lot of other things as well there, like research into improving cryptography for example.

    3. Re:world ramifications... by SirGarlon · · Score: 4, Interesting

      There's a podcast interviewing former NSA officer Brian Snow that was recorded before the Snowden leaks, and provides some valuable perspective on what the NSA does. I am probably going to get modded and/or flamed to oblivion for saying this, but listening to that podcast made me believe that not everything the NSA does is bad.

      --
      [Sir Garlon] is the marvellest knight that is now living, for he destroyeth many good knights, for he goeth invisible.
    4. Re:world ramifications... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The Nazi war machine contributed to a several engineering accomplishments in history. Does that make World War 2 any less bad?

      Not being evil (or not 100% evil) is not an excuse for allowing evil people to take advantage of a seemingly unstoppable tool.

    5. Re:world ramifications... by number11 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I am probably going to get modded and/or flamed to oblivion for saying this, but listening to that podcast made me believe that not everything the NSA does is bad.

      Of course not. Very few things in life are all black or all white. The NSA is like the neighbor who poisons any dog that comes onto his property, and you're pretty sure he shoplifts, but if you need a hand hoisting an engine or a ride to the store, he's always willing to help.

      That doesn't mean he shouldn't be locked up, though.

    6. Re:world ramifications... by JohnFen · · Score: 4, Informative

      In the context of the NSA's activities, my answer is "the fourth amendment."

    7. Re:world ramifications... by epyT-R · · Score: 4, Informative

      The NSA is supposed to spy.. just not on civilian americans.

    8. Re:world ramifications... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

      No, you would not. Once upon the time, I worked for an organization named "Department of the Citizens' Safety". It was in a different time, in a different country, and I had not had a chance to say no - I knew computers, a few Western languages, and had passed (or failed) a bunch of IQ and psychology test. I had barely gotten my first star, and had only a few missions under my belt when the government fell, and I found myself out on my ass, forbidden from holding any government jobs at a time when the only legal jobs were either government, or you had to create them yourself.

      I'm fine now. I am neither dead, nor in organized crime, the way three quarters of my colleagues ended up. I know, now, that I was working for some pretty evil people, and what I was doing was pretty evil. I have pretended being a priest, and wiped my ass with the secret of confession, I have infiltrated literary clubs, and framed the most brilliant of their members for not-so-petty crimes, and I even killed in the line of duty once. It's all in the past, and I'm not even bothering to hide my IP - if you find out who I am, I'll just tell you that I was making shit up - on the internet, no one knows you are a dog.

      That said. Never in my life, not before, not since, had I felt that my life was so simple, that what I was doing was so right, that I was going to bed with such a clear conscience. And of course, never have I felt as powerful and untouchable, but that's a much easier state to achieve.

      When you work for this kind of organization, there is a support structure, a camaraderie, an atmosphere that insures that you are either out before you actually start, or that you are happy and confident with what you are doing, and the only real people are your colleagues. Well, at least it was for me, then. But I doubt the US NSA is testing, vetting, training and supporting their personnel less than my old country did in the late eighties.

    9. Re:world ramifications... by rk · · Score: 5, Informative

      It doesn't say it directly, but one of the big reasons that some of the people responsible for the constitution didn't want the Bill of Rights was for that reason: They didn't want those to be interpreted as the only rights people had. To placate that argument is why the 9th amendment exists. It turns out that those people were exactly right because many make the assumption those are your only rights, even WITH the 9th amendment in place.

      Courts have repeatedly held that there is a de facto right to some level of privacy, regardless of its lack of constitutional enumeration, in part because it's highly implied by several of the amendments, especially the 4th.

    10. Re:world ramifications... by WWJohnBrowningDo · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The choice isn't between having the NSA or flushing that $10 billion down the toilet every year. The choice is between having the NSA or increasing the NASA budget by 50%. The choice is between having the NSA or better endowing social security. The choice is between having the NSA or paying down the national debt.

      You're right, not everything they do is bad, but what little good they have done is trivial compared to what $10 billion should have contributed to our society each year.

    11. Re:world ramifications... by Somebody+Is+Using+My · · Score: 5, Informative

      Just an important reminder:

      The US Constitution does not GIVE us rights. It enumerates areas where we allow the government to infringe upon our rights for the good of the nation. The first ten Amendments define some of our inalienable rights but are not a complete listing. Just because the right of privacy is not mentioned is not to imply it does not exist and cannot be claimed.

      While I am sure most people on this site (and probably the poster to whom I am responding as well) are aware of this, I feel it is still an important distinction to be made. Our language dictates our thoughts and actions; let's be clear on this very important matter. We live in an era when there is an increasing belief that our governments have rightful sway over all aspects of our lives and are the source of all corporal power. This is in direct contradiction to the intent of the so-called "Founding Fathers", where the freedom and liberty of the individual were paramount and were only sacrificed - by the individuals - for the advantage of the common weal.

      That is, the direction of power is from the people down to the government, and not the other way around. The people dictate, not the politicians. We willingly give, they do not grudgingly grant. Take and hold onto your rights; they are yours from birth, not a gift bestowed upon you by self-important men.

    12. Re:world ramifications... by fliptout · · Score: 4, Funny

      Way to insta-Godwin this discussion.

      --
      A witty saying proves you are wittier than the next guy.
    13. Re:world ramifications... by interkin3tic · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I feel like you could apply this as a meta argument: not every godwin instance is bad.

  2. i wonder... by ganjadude · · Score: 5, Funny

    why the NSA would need to seek out new team members, you would think they already know who the brightest and best are from the data collected!

    --
    have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
  3. Good geeks? by jez9999 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    At this point, no "good" geek would work for the NSA.

    --
    == Jez ==
    Do you miss Firefox? Try Pale Moon.
    1. Re:Good geeks? by Fwipp · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I like this post, because I can't tell if it means
      "No honorable person would work for the NSA"
      or
      "Anyone applying to the NSA is out to betray them."

    2. Re:Good geeks? by gstoddart · · Score: 4, Insightful

      At this point, no "good" geek would work for the NSA.

      Define 'good' and define 'geek'.

      If you think there aren't people who work in the tech field who will say "I'm totally in favor of this, because it protects us from the terrorists", you're likely sadly mistaken.

      Geeks aren't some uniform group of people who all believe the same things. Reading Slashdot should show you that quite readily in about 2 minutes.

      Many of us might say "yeah, not on your life", but I bet almost as many might say "sure, I'm in, sounds fun".

      --
      Lost at C:>. Found at C.
    3. Re:Good geeks? by Galatamon · · Score: 4, Informative

      Pretty sure you're thinking of Von Braun.

    4. Re:Good geeks? by metlin · · Score: 4, Insightful

      You're an idiot.

      That was von Braun, for one. For another, Oppenheimer was aghast at the destruction caused by the atomic bomb (he quoted the Bhagvad Gita, "I am become Death -- the destroyer of worlds." after the Trinity Test) and actively campaigned for non-proliferation.

      If anything, his sympathies towards the other sides caused him to be a martyr to McCarthyism. Hell, even von Braun commented that, "In England, Oppenheimer would have been knighted."

      Oppenheimer is the poster child for how scientists have little control over the political consequences and use of their discoveries, and how the political institutions would happily discard them once they're wrung dry.

  4. The logical deduction is that the ads are fake by cruff · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Given that the NSA is recording everything, and probably has broken all your encryption keys, you would think the NSA would already know who to target for employment. Thus the obvious conclusion is that these ads are fakes or honeypots.

  5. Not worth my time. by Anon-Admin · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I looked into the NSA and the CIA. neither pay anywhere near what the private sector pays. Both want to pump you up on "Doing your national duty", "Serving your country", and/or "Protecting your fellow Americans"

    If they want IT talent, they need to pony up the cash.

  6. Hello ... by PPH · · Score: 4, Funny

    ... my name is Ted Stowden. I'd like some information on a career in your fine organization. No need to send me anything. I know which server its on.

    --
    Have gnu, will travel.
  7. Any SysAdmin positions? by komodo685 · · Score: 5, Funny

    I know this former SysAdmin in Russia who had to resort to tech support FFS. Already has clearance. He'd be just what you deserve.

  8. Old joke... by jayveekay · · Score: 5, Funny

    If you want to apply for a job at the NSA, just pick up the phone. Any phone.

  9. Give me a break. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    They actually do quite a lot of other things as well there, like research into improving cryptography for example.

    Seriously? Improving it as in finding holes that they can exploit and tell no one else about? Or spending millions on research into how to create holes they can hope to get included as encryption standards?

    From the link above:

    The N.S.A.'s Sigint Enabling Project is a $250 million-a-year program that works with Internet companies to weaken privacy by inserting back doors into encryption products. This excerpt from a 2013 budget proposal outlines some methods the agency uses to undermine encryption used by the public.

    1. Re:Give me a break. by lgw · · Score: 5, Insightful

      President Carter make a rule that the CIA can't employ unsavory characters as local operatives (e.g., we can't have an actual terrorist as a mole in a terrorist organization). Our human intelligence took a nosedive and never really recovered. Maybe it's time to fix that (if we haven't already), and just live without the NSA for a while.

      I've said it before but: defund the NSA, fire everyone, bulldoze the buildings, and let it serve as an example to other agencies about overreach. Sure, loss of SIGINT will be a problem, but the NSA has become a bigger problem. End it, and start over once you're sure it's really gone.

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
  10. Re:America by icebike · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Enough advertising overcomes any negative consequences of your actions.

    Pretty much this.!

    By "owning" it in advertising and public speeches and press releases, they hope to pull a "Toyota" maneuver.

    (When Toyota was facing run-away vehicles and brake problems with spectacular crashes, they began an ad campaign touting their safety. They are still at it today with a drumbeat of ads telling how safe their cars are and totally ignoring the massive recalls they were forced into. I suspect Toyota learned the technique from Iomega which did the same thing in the face of their Famous Click of Death drive series).

    I predicted this some months ago. I suspect going forward they will just start saying in effect: "Yeah, we read your mail. Get over it." Now that its out in the open, they will become bolder and brasher, and no mere legal barriers will stand in their way, (not that they ever did). There are just enough useful idiots out there that believe this is a "good thing" that the NSA will probably get away with this tactic.

    Technical solutions are going to have to be devised, better encryption, multi-path routing, etc. And instead of welcoming their contributions, crypto developers are going to have to understand that they can't be trusted.

    --
    Sig Battery depleted. Reverting to safe mode.