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The Burning Bridges of Ubuntu

Posted by Soulskill on from the cry-havoc-and-let-slip-the-forks-of-war dept.

jammag writes "According to this article, 'Whether Ubuntu is declining is still debatable. However, in the last couple of months, one thing is clear: internally and externally, its commercial arm Canonical appears to be throwing the idea of community overboard as though it was ballast in a balloon about to crash.' The author points out instances of community discontent and apparent ham-handedness on Mark Shuttleworth's part. Yet isn't this just routine kvetching in the open source community?"

16 of 346 comments (clear)

  1. So we should ditch Ubuntu and then by bobstreo · · Score: 5, Interesting

    It's back to Debian?

    1. Re:So we should ditch Ubuntu and then by fatphil · · Score: 5, Funny

      It's the obvious "backward" step (and I don't mean that in a negative way, retreating from the dark alleyways MS has led U down is a good thing), but most of the people I know who actually liked U have moved sideways to Mint.

      (As someone who's been on Debian for well over a decade, all I can say is "humbug!" to the lot of them, what with their fancy schmancy integrated desktop environments and wibbly-wobbly-window transitions, and crap like that.)

      --
      Also FatPhil on SoylentNews, id 863
    2. Re:So we should ditch Ubuntu and then by binarylarry · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Does Mint have an independent millionaire sugar daddy supporting it?

      Although I'm not sure if that's a pro or a con right now. ;)

      --
      Mod me down, my New Earth Global Warmingist friends!
    3. Re:So we should ditch Ubuntu and then by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

      It's the obvious "backward" step (and I don't mean that in a negative way, retreating from the dark alleyways [Mark Shuttleworth] has led [Ubuntu] down is a good thing), but most of the people I know who actually liked [Ubuntu] have moved sideways to Mint.

      Mod Parent Up.

      When I first found Ubuntu, I was evangelizing it like crazy to friends and family.
      There it was, the first Linux that I could recommend to one of those "I don't want to understand it, I just want it to work" Windows XP users.
      Sometimes people didn't want to abandon their famliar Windows XP environment.
      Others were happy that their computer was now pratically immune to malware.

      I continued this up until Ubuntu released Unity as the default desktop.
      My mother clicked the button to do a distribution upgrade (I always instructed her to install the updates ASAP), and she called to say "everything changed around on me".
      From that point, I decided that Ubuntu had finally jumped the shark.
      Now that my mom couldn't use it, I could no longer recommend it to anyone.
      I evacuated her data to an external drive, reinstalled the previous Ubuntu, restored her data, and instructed her not to install any updates.

      I had her continue this holding pattern until I discovered Linux Mint on DistroWatch. It was at the top of the page hit ranking, so I gave it a try.
      Here it was again! The new Linux that I could recommend to the "I don't want to understand it, I just want it to work" Windows XP users.
      Even better, since Microsoft totally rearranged everything in Vista / Win 7, nobody was afraid to lose their environment.
      In fact, they loved the fact that Linux Mint was close to the Windows XP they loved and far from the unfamiliar Vista / Win 7.
      That "don't want to change my computer" has only grown with the release of Windows 8.
      Nobody that I know wants to use Windows 8, and everybody to whom I show Mint desperately wants to keep it.

      Now Linux Mint is on my mother's computer, my brother's computer, my best friend's computer, my best friend's boyfriend's computer, my girlfriend's laptop, my girlfriend's daughter's laptop, my work laptop, and my home laptop.
      I'm not sure who else all those people may have sold on Linux Mint, but they love to show it off (especially my girlfriend, to her friends at college).

      I'm sure my story is not unique. Parent is right.
      Those of us who liked the old Ubuntu have moved to Mint.
      And we've taken our friends and family with us.

    4. Re:So we should ditch Ubuntu and then by rtb61 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      What is happening is flavour of the moment in the Linux world is 'Android' and because of that Ubuntu is in the shadows. Rather than fight Android, Ubuntu should embrace Android with an effective USB or wireless remote to enable data input, configuration and synchronisation of Android phones on a full sized desktop screen. Right now the better Ubuntu desktop/notebook plays with Android the more popular it will become, it has a real chance to gain a big chunk of market share by creating a desktop that links well with an Android smartphones and effectively extends it features onto more workable screen real estate.

      --
      Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
    5. Re:So we should ditch Ubuntu and then by Jane+Q.+Public · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I continued this up until Ubuntu released Unity as the default desktop.

      I think this is the main point.

      No, contrary to OP, this is not "just the usual Open Source kvetching." Successful Open Source operations listen to their users. Now it's going its own way even further with Mir.

      Users were happy with Gnome (or KDE). They did not want Unity, and said so.

      By now Ubuntu is too proprietary to be considered "open" anymore. It's not just a Linux distro, but rather it has become its own operating system. That is somewhat contrary to the spirit of Linux. What's next? Its own (proprietary, incompatible) versions of the command-line tools?

    6. Re:So we should ditch Ubuntu and then by armanox · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Users were happy with GNOME 2.x - they hated 3.x. Ubuntu tried to do something about it, which the users didn't like either.

      Personally, I feel like you've captured the spirit of current Linux development. Don't like something? Developers don't care. You don't have a choice. Systemd, GRUB2, GNOME3, Wayland, KMS - doesn't matter, you're getting it whether you want it or not. And the old versions (or previous products) are left to die (until projects like MATE and Trinity form later on, if you're lucky).

      FWIW, I still can't configure GRUB 2 easily. And KMS broke Linux on several laptops that I was still using. Linux does not run well on old hardware, and really doesn't run well anymore (period).

      --
      I'm starting to think GNU is the problem with "GNU/Linux" these days.
    7. Re:So we should ditch Ubuntu and then by c0lo · · Score: 5, Funny

      [...] my girlfriend's laptop, my girlfriend's daughter's laptop, [...]
      I'm not sure who else all those people may have sold on Linux Mint, but they love to show it off (especially my girlfriend, to her friends at college).

      I'm sure my story is not unique.

      Unique? Maybe not, but again not that usual on /. You see, not many of us have girlfriends... at college... with daughters...

      --
      Questions raise, answers kill. Raise questions to stay alive.
    8. Re:So we should ditch Ubuntu and then by denmarkw00t · · Score: 5, Funny

      Or for Slackware

      cd sweetapp
      ./configure --prefix=/usr/local --with-awesome --compile-flags="YEAAAHHH" ... ...
      .
      Error can't find blah, version 2.x
      cd ../
      wget http://blah.someplace.com/source/blah.2.3.4.tgz
      tar xzvf blah.2.3.4.tgz
      cd blah.2.3.4-2013-10-02-0030
      ./configure --prefix=/usr/local ... ..
      make ..
      .
      .
      sudo make install
      cd ../sweetapp
      make clean ./configure --prefix=/usr/local --with-awesome --compile-flags="YEAAAHHH" ... .. ..
      make .. ...
      sudo make install
      sweetapp
      ld_config: Can't link library xoo.o, terminating
      .
      .
      .
      sudo rm -rf /

      Much easiser ;)

  2. Canonical Needs to Make Money by segedunum · · Score: 5, Insightful

    That much has become clear for quite a while now. What's also become clear is they don't know how to do it, what direction they're in and they're unusual recent behaviour is just a bunch of initial death throes.

    1. Re:Canonical Needs to Make Money by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Yes, I feel so locked in, what with my choices of Ubuntu, or Ubuntu Gnome, or Kubuntu, or Lubuntu, or Xubuntu, or any of the many derivatives of Ubuntu that's out there. And it's all just an "sudo apt-get install" away from appearing on my machine. It's smothering, I tell you!

  3. I switched to CentOS and never looked back by rovitotv · · Score: 5, Informative

    The stability of CentOS is great. I don't get all the fancy features but I don't want those anyway as they just get in the way. At work when we need something supported we just use RedHat and pay for the support. Moving development between CentOS and RedHat is totally transparent to me.

  4. Re:No it is not kvetching. by sunderland56 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Ubuntu took a perfectly good Debian and fucks it up.

    Ubuntu took a perfectly good Ubuntu and fucked it up. Luckily, there are distros like Xubuntu - which take the good parts, and leave off the bad parts (aka Unity).

  5. Re:Not every company can act like Apple by mysidia · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Cannonical is another failing company with Steve Jobs/Apple's attitude of "We will tell you what you like, and will like it."

    The attitude can be highly effective ---- but there is one minor important detail: You have to actually be right, for things to work out.

    If your UI turns out to be a turd, then you will go down.

    Seeking innovation is a high-reward, high-risk thing.

  6. Re:Yes, and by greenfruitsalad · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I don't think that's his main target. Shuttleworth is one of the few people (Newell may be another) willing to make fundamental changes to gnu/linux desktop computer to bring it to masses as opposed to just opinionated geekdom. This non-traditional desktop experience is bound to annoy traditional gnu/linux power users who feel their vision is being ignored. What they fail to see is that their vision is not attractive enough for average people.

    I for one welcome canonical's changes. For me, the more they deviate from 'traditional gnu/linux desktop', the better. I want to see how far they can push it and how many fresh ideas they can bring. KDE desktop has looked pretty much the same for the last 10 years. Gnome is getting uglier and less useful with each new version (but I do like that they're starting anew). Windows 8's interface, despite its questionable usability, is fresh and people who have used it for more than 10 minutes in a shop, like it.

  7. Re:No it is not kvetching. by emblemparade · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I agree with your idea, but you got it a bit wrong: Xubuntu it still Ubuntu. I think many people hate Unity (I don't; I just treat it as an "early beta" of an idea that one day might work), but don't realize that things like Xubuntu and Kubuntu are very much still Ubuntu.

    The desktop interface is a *very tiny* part of the OS, really. But it's the first thing most users see, and is crucial for PR.

    I love Xubuntu. Hence, I also love Ubuntu (if not the Unity package) and the great work done by everyone involved.

    Ubuntu should follow the openSUSE way: when you install it, it asks you which desktop you want. There's no realy need for separate distros, IMO.