Africa, Clooney, and an Unlikely Space Race

MightyMait writes "There's a plan underway to build a space agency run by African nations, and there is a (non-fictional) George Clooney connection. This BBC article details the history of space exploration in Africa as well as current efforts. Quoting: 'To Western eyes, it may seem rather inappropriate to launch space programs in sub-Saharan Africa, where nearly 70% of the population still lives on less $2 a day. Yet Joseph Akinyede, director of the African Regional Center for Space Science and Technology Education in Nigeria, an education center affiliated with the United Nations Office for Outer Space Affairs, says that the application of space science technology and research to "basic necessities" of life – health, education, energy, food security, environmental management – is critical for the development of the continent.'"

Comments

send Clooney to space

[Anonymous Coward]

Good, it's about time someone did some non-fictional space travel. Might as well be Clooney.

Re:send Clooney to space

[Thanshin]

Is there any space travel at all in gattaca?

I vaguely remember many shots of rockets leaving but no space.

And if KSP has taught me anything it's that having a nice and pretty rocket in the first stage doesn't mean in second stage you won't become a large ball of fire an debris.

Re:send Clooney to space

[fuzzyfuzzyfungus]

No actual space travel, just the heartwarming story of how the guy with the life-threatening cardiac defect subverted screening procedures in order to endanger the entire mission, and all his crewmates, on a months-long journey to some other planet in the solar system.

It's a triumph of the human spirit, or something.

Re:send Clooney to space

[Silpher]

In fact KSP teached me more than any documentary about space travel... period.

Re:send Clooney to space

[Thanshin]

I wholeheartedly agree and if I had anything to say on the matter, planting a flag on each planet would become part of the elementary physics curriculum.

Re:send Clooney to space

[TrekkieGod]

No actual space travel, just the heartwarming story of how the guy with the life-threatening cardiac defect subverted screening procedures in order to endanger the entire mission, and all his crewmates, on a months-long journey to some other planet in the solar system. It's a triumph of the human spirit, or something.

That's a misunderstanding of the story. Vincent likely didn't have a heart condition. He got discriminated his entire life because his genetic profile said his DNA indicated he had a 99% probability of developing a fatal heart condition. He could be the 1 person in 100 with that DNA marker who never develops said heart condition, but in their society nobody was willing to give him a chance.

What he did was legitimately endure GATTACA's physical tests, spend an entire childhood swimming out farther and farther away from shore with his brother, and beat his life expectancy of 30.2 years. Everything indicating he had no health problems.

Re:send Clooney to space

[khallow]

Everything indicating he had no health problems.

Or if he actually did have such problems, they weren't going to show up in the next few months. It's also worth noting that a society that hardcore about eugenics and authoritarianism wouldn't be above lying to get more people to genetically tailor their offspring. I wager that blowing past his expected lifespan like that was probably an indication that the prediction was proganda nonsense in the first place.

Personally, I found the story rather bizarre. It's nice that you're genetically perfect. But you won't be after a few months exposure to deep space radiation.

The hero is precisely the sort of person they would send instead of the shiny people. He's healthy enough to serve and not going to get any worse genetically by Gattaca standards. And he'd be far cheaper because of the huge bias against employing such people.

Re:send Clooney to space

[chihowa]

Vincent likely didn't have a heart condition.

I thought the treadmill scene, where his erratic heartbeat plays instead of the 'metronome' and he runs to the locker room clutching his chest, was supposed to show that he actually did have a heart condition.

Human spirit and all, I think the mushroom was right. At the very least, he was living on borrowed time. Not cool.

Re:send Clooney to space

[cayenne8]

Actually, I'm thinking this is just an excuse to set things up for Somali Pirates in Space!!!

Re:send Clooney to space

[TrekkieGod]

I thought the treadmill scene, where his erratic heartbeat plays instead of the 'metronome' and he runs to the locker room clutching his chest, was supposed to show that he actually did have a heart condition.

I interpreted that scene as showing he was exercising beyond his ability. Remember, his "borrowed ladder", Jerome, was a swimming athlete before the accident. Vincent had to make himself not only meet the physical requirements, but also had to look like he had the conditioning of an athlete. So if I figured he always ran far in excess of what he had to, while making it seem like it was easy, using Jerome's recorded heat beats.

I don't think their intended message was that you could heal yourself from heart attacks if you had willpower. The way I interpret that scene wasn't Vincent with a heart condition, it was Vincent exhausted after far exceeding his actual conditioning. It fits with how he approached the swimming competitions with his brother. Save nothing. If he's not collapsing, he's going to keep running.

Re:send Clooney to space

[ultranova]

Personally, I found the story rather bizarre. It's nice that you're genetically perfect. But you won't be after a few months exposure to deep space radiation.

I imagine the idea here is that genetically perfect implies phenotypically perfect. It doesn't do so in real life, of course, even if we ignore the difficulty of defining perfection, since gene expression is affected by your environment - indeed, simply reading this message causes your brain cells to change it. I think the problem is that people hear that genetic code is a set of instructions and think about a book rather than a program (which, in itself, is a suspiciously familiar metaphor - when all you have is a hammer, everything starts looking like the back of someone's head and all that).

Re:send Clooney to space

[chihowa]

The hero is precisely the sort of person they would send instead of the shiny people. He's healthy enough to serve and not going to get any worse genetically by Gattaca standards. And he'd be far cheaper because of the huge bias against employing such people.

I'm not so sure of that. We pick our shiniest people as astronauts and we have relatively few of them. Really, with his myopia and the (putative) heart condition, he would have a hard time making astronaut selection today.

Anyway, the radiation issue was presumably solved in some way. They boarded the ship in pressed suits, so it's clearly not going to be that rough of a ride (although the contacts he's wearing are going to get a little uncomfortable after a few months).

Re:send Clooney to space

[khallow]

which, in itself, is a suspiciously familiar metaphor - when all you have is a hammer, everything starts looking like the back of someone's head and all that

But that was one of the problems with the Gattaca universe. Everything was viewed through the lens of attaining genetic perfection. Going into space and being exposed to DNA-damaging radiation is precisely the sort of thing that this society would be pathologically afraid of.

I think a deeper plot could have explored issues like this - how the leaders of space development want the cream of society to do the work in space, but becoming increasingly thwarted by this growing paranoia. Perhaps older astronauts are shunned because of their loss of genetic perfection and status. Maybe some of the public believes space radiation can be caught from someone exposed to it.

The grand ironies would be yet another demonstration of the profound ignorance of the allegedly superior breed of human and the fact that unmodified humans such as the protagonist would continue to be excellent choices just due to having far less to lose, but are deliberately being screened out by perverse and illogical ideologies from one of the most important jobs that they could be tasked with.

Re:send Clooney to space

[TrekkieGod]

But that was one of the problems with the Gattaca universe. Everything was viewed through the lens of attaining genetic perfection. Going into space and being exposed to DNA-damaging radiation is precisely the sort of thing that this society would be pathologically afraid of.

True, but another aspect of the movie involved the reason for their obsession with genetic perfection. They believed a person's worth could be accurately measured by their genetic makeup, and therefore wouldn't trust somebody like Vincent to be able to complete the mission. He might be cheap in the sense of how much they would have to pay him, but that would be dwarfed by the cost of a failed mission if they send an incompetent person up.

The grand ironies would be yet another demonstration of the profound ignorance of the allegedly superior breed of human and the fact that unmodified humans such as the protagonist would continue to be excellent choices just due to having far less to lose, but are deliberately being screened out by perverse and illogical ideologies from one of the most important jobs that they could be tasked with.

I think the ignorance you're talking about was demonstrated, at least twice. There was an arrogance, a cognitive dissonance in the conversation director Josef had with detective Freeman:

Director Josef: "Bodies, with minds to match. Essential as we push out farther and farther."
Detective Freeman: "Yet, you still constantly monitor performance.
Director Josef: "You have to ensure the people are meeting their potential."
Detective Freeman: "And exceeding it?"
Director Josef: "No one exceeds his potential."
Detective Freeman:"If he did?"
Director Josef: "It would mean we did not accurately gauge his potential in the first place."

Here director Josef admits that it's possible to inaccurately gauge someone's potential. The problem with their society isn't that the genetic tests aren't correct, it's that they can't account for everything. Physically and mentally Jerome was superior to Vincent, and would have made a better Gattaca astronaut. However, Jerome had no motivation, no drive. He couldn't put in the work that's necessary to prepare yourself for the mission. He got his swimming silver medal because he train hard enough, didn't push himself to his limits. And when he realized his genes weren't sufficient to make him the best, he didn't care enough to do the work necessary to improve, instead he chose to try to kill himself. Vincent didn't have the advantages, but he was willing to do what others weren't. Maybe Jerome would have had to put in half as many hours studying as Vincent did, but Vincent wasn't afraid of putting in the time. Jerome would have breezed through the physical training requirements at Gattaca, but Vincent didn't mind pushing himself so hard that he'd collapse in the end. But while their society, and director Josef in particular, admitted that lack of drive was enough to cause a gifted individual to not achieve his full potential, they failed to recognize that an abundance of drive could make up for the lack of genetic advantages in another individual. They refused to test whether they had inaccurately measured someone's potential.

The real irony is that Josef, above all, should understand this. When he was being questioned by the police regarding the murder he proudly explained, "take another look at my profile. You won't find a violent bone in my body." Yet, his drive to ensure the mission he was planning would go ahead was sufficient to overcome that predisposition to non-violence and he was able to commit murder. It shouldn't surprise him that some people, like Vincent, would have the drive to compensate for something they were missing in their genetic profile.

Joseph Akinyede

[Anonymous Coward]

I am Joseph Akinyede, director of the African Regional Center for Space Science and Technology Education in Nigeria.

Having consulted with my colleagues and based on the information gathered from the Nigerian Chambers Of Commerce And Industry, I have the privilege to request your assistance to transfer the sum of $47,500,000.00 (forty seven million, five hundred thousand United States dollars) into your accounts. The above sum resulted from an over-invoiced contract, executed, commissioned and paid for about five years (5) ago by a foreign contractor. This action was however intentional and since then the fund has been in a suspense account at The Central Bank Of Nigeria Apex Bank.

We are now ready to transfer the fund overseas and that is where you come in. It is important to inform you that as civil servants, we are forbidden to operate a foreign account; that is why we require your assistance. The total sum will be shared as follows: 70% for us, 25% for you and 5% for local and international expenses incidental to the transfer.

The transfer is risk free on both sides. I am an accountant with the Nigerian National Petroleum Corporation (NNPC). If you find this proposal acceptable, we shall require the following documents:

(a) your banker's name, telephone, account and fax numbers.

(b) your private telephone and fax numbers —for confidentiality and easy communication.

(c) your letter-headed paper stamped and signed.

Alternatively we will furnish you with the text of what to type into your letter-headed paper, along with a breakdown explaining, comprehensively what we require of you. The business will take us thirty (30) working days to accomplish.

Please reply urgently.

Best regards,

Re:Joseph Akinyede

[Applehu Akbar]

Do I get a timeshare in Cabo as part of the deal?

Agreed with Akinyede

[Anonymous Coward]

When you have tens of millions in abject poverty, a few billions won't change their fate. Better to use it to advance your technological prowess and the spill over from that can eventually help the poor.

Re:Agreed with Akinyede

[Anonymous Coward]

More specifically where it can help is in job creation. Where do you spend those billions? If you import resources and labour it's not going to help you, but if it's all spent at home (and Africa has plenty of resources and labour awaiting training) you're pumping a lot of money into the market while pulling people out of poverty. Those people then have more to spend which means the rest of the economy gets a boost. The problem Africa has had until now is very little investment and what there is (mining etc) tends to be exploiting their resources for the gain of foreign companies, so they haven't seen that happen before. I don't know whether it'll work as well has they hope, but I can certainly follow their reasoning.

Re:Agreed with Akinyede

[Cryacin]

Um... no... See "Broken window fallacy"

Re:Agreed with Akinyede

[LoRdTAW]

The proposal for building an African space agency sounds too good to be true. Most likely it will go into the pockets of corrupt government officials and contractors who won't get anything done and the project will be scrapped afters years in an artificial limbo.

I would say its better to put the money into getting people fresh water, sewage treatment, waste disposal and training/equipment for sustainable farming. They have to learn to crawl before they can walk.

Re: Agreed with Akinyede

[JWW]

This is not the broken window fallicy. They don't have any windows to break.

It's not like they had functioning rockets and threw them out so they could fix them.

Re: Agreed with Akinyede

[khallow]

But they do have windows to break. Public funding comes from somewhere, either present or (more likely) future taxpayers. Those taxpayers are buying rockets (or more likely, rocket theater) - that's the "broken window", the economic activity that they're forced to fund.

Re:Agreed with Akinyede

[khallow]

And lets say something does happen (the end) which could be at anytime then this was a waste anyway, they'll be few if anyone left with any knowledge, or skills to keep it going.

Unless those people happen to be somewhere else where the bad stuff isn't happening.

Re: Agreed with Akinyede

[JWW]

That's not what the broken window fallacy is about.

Its not about generalized government spending. It about breaking things that are fine to spur on stimulus by spending money to fix the things that were broken.

Re: Agreed with Akinyede

[khallow]

Its not about generalized government spending.

It is when the pretext as in this case is to stimulate an economy.

Re: Agreed with Akinyede

[MightyYar]

They aren't talking about pissing money away. They are investing in infrastructure that does not yet exist. Infrastructure spending often brings multiple returns on investment. If the US passed a bill to spend a 100 billion dollars repairing bridges and tunnels, it would not be an example of "the broken window fallacy".

Re:Agreed with Akinyede

[TangoMargarine]

Were going to be around for a couple billion years and the race will adapt to whatever is thrown at it.

Two words: Extinction-level Event. Hence why we need to be able to get off the planet. Even assuming that doesn't happen for billions of years (wasn't there that hypothetical big asteroid that killed the dinosaurs? How many billion years ago was that?), you're assuming we won't have comprehensively fucked the environment in the next couple hundred years.

Take care of the shit going on first, then worry about space.

So basically, we're never ever going into space again. Okay then.

Re:Agreed with Akinyede

[TangoMargarine]

You'll have to forgive me if I don't take the survival of the human race as flippantly as you do...

The number that survives an ELE is irrelevant, as long as they are able to form a stable reproductive pool.

Re:Agreed with Akinyede

[Lord Apathy]

I would say its better to put the money into getting people fresh water, sewage treatment, waste disposal and training/equipment for sustainable farming. They have to learn to crawl before they can walk.

I've been saying that for years. Instead of spending limited resources on pie in the sky programs that never go anywhere, the money should be spent on projects that will have a long term benefit. But for some reason people think that every village must have a space program and every mud hut must have 100 jiggabit internet.

What africa needs is serous cultural and political reform. The leaders need to realize they are responsible for the people. An the common people need to get over the rape culture they have and stop looking for the next hand out from the west. In short, they need to get their shit together and solve their own damn problems.

Re:Agreed with Akinyede

[ultranova]

Um... no... See "Broken window fallacy"

Broken window fallacy only applies to idealised conditions of a perfectly efficient market that utilizes all available resources 100% at all times. If that condition is not met - for example, if a window maker can't find a new job fast enough to avoid falling into poverty and possibly triggering a cascade effect at that, or if you need to keep one available for emergencies yet the prevailing culture doesn't allow you to rise taxes to support a public retainer - then breaking windows can actually be the best available option.

More generally, the concept of a fallacy does not apply to economics, which is applied psychology rather than logic. "Under the most rigorously controlled conditions of pressure, temperature, humidity, and other variables, the organism will do as it damn well pleases."

Re:Agreed with Akinyede

[TangoMargarine]

Hence it would probably be a good idea to establish some sort of colony off-planet.

Re: Agreed with Akinyede

[khallow]

They are investing in infrastructure that does not yet exist.

What would this "infrastructure" do that would have any value for Africa? Merely putting things in space need not have positive value, especially if they hit other objects in orbit. And as I noted, the money would be taken from other areas.

Re: Agreed with Akinyede

[MightyYar]

Commercial launches would bring in foreign money, for one thing. African companies that depend on space assets would be able to go to a local source, for another.

Re: Agreed with Akinyede

[khallow]

Commercial launches would bring in foreign money, for one thing.

How does this help them attract commercial launches? I think having a stable and relatively non-corrupt legal environment would do much more.

Re: Agreed with Akinyede

[MightyYar]

I'll tell you what can't help them attract commercial launches: no space program whatsoever.

Re: Agreed with Akinyede

[khallow]

I'll tell you what can't help them attract commercial launches: no space program whatsoever.

But again, how is having a space program better in this regard than not having one. Some of these countries have an advantage in that they are close to the equator and have some other quirks of geography. The rest don't. In those cases, they just shouldn't be trying.

It's a standard comparative advantage argument. Find what you're good at doing and do that. Don't try to do what others are already doing far better and more aggressively than you can ever do.

Re: Agreed with Akinyede

[MightyYar]

I can't say whether it is a sound investment or not - only time will tell. I just am certain it is not an example of the broken window fallacy.

No, do not believe him!

[cripkd]

Guys, this is a scam, do NOT reply to him!
Mr Joseph Akinyede, if that's your real name, I have already contacted the police and they are on their way!

Re:No, do not believe him!

[Cryacin]

But... I sent him little Johnny's college fund!

Re:No, do not believe him!

[gl4ss]

I'm the real Joseph and this guys spamming is making it hard for me to find a contractor for my Sub Saharan Space Rocket(SSSR) program that I have been given the budget of 50 million dollars (50.000.000 US$) for.

If you can find someone to pay the Tender Fee of ten thousand dollars(10,000 $US) for the Liberian Aegis Bank Limited fees regarding this budget, we are authorized to pay you a maximum consulting fee(tax free under provision 123 of the SSSR contracting contract) of 650 000£ into an account of your choosing.

Please Contact as soon as possible, PO BOX 87877676(Road Twelve, Staden 1, 00300 Sweden).

Re:No, do not believe him!

[khallow]

It's totally not a scam. He used three significant digits!

Great for African telco prices

[AHuxley]

This will be very positive for regional telco prices. As more efforts like Regional African Satellite Communication Organization (RASCOM) move forward, Africa will enjoy much lower call cost and more bandwidth.
As Ethiopian jet maintenance shows, Africa will enjoy the benifits of its own space science technology advancements over time.

Re:Great for African telco prices

[Charliemopps]

Have you ever flown ethiopian airlines?

Here's a pic from my trip:
Our Trip

Re:Space exploration is critical for Africa now?

[Rosco P. Coltrane]

Sure, $2/day is relative and can mean anything. Our grandparents lived a healthy life on about the same amount but due to inflation the dollar became worthless.

I'm not sure what you're trying to demonstrate here. Your grandparents lived on $2 a day when $1000 bought you a car. Today's starving africans live on 2 of today's dollars, when $1000 buys a wing mirror. Your point is...?

The poor will always be with us

[flyingfsck]

Poverty is the oldest profession...

Re:The poor will always be with us

[Thanshin]

Poverty is the oldest profession...

I disagree. Poverty is very unnatural. Many natural professions predate even the possibility of poverty: Hired muscle, Prostitute, Priest, Slaver.

Re:The poor will always be with us

[VortexCortex]

Poverty is the oldest profession...

I disagree. Poverty is very unnatural. Many natural professions predate even the possibility of poverty: Hired muscle, Prostitute, Priest, Slaver.

This begs the question. Are the apes not poor by human standards? If we gave them jobs wouldn't they be impoverished prior, and haven't they been since before humans had jobs? Additionally: Have you never considered the first Hired muscle, Prostitute, Priest, and Slavers took up the job because they were too poor not to turn it down?

Re:The poor will always be with us

[Thanshin]

No, they are not. Poverty is an artificial construct that depends on a previous one, which is property.

An ape can't be rich nor poor, as he has no property. The first thug, whore, shaman or slaver, did the "job" in exchange for something other than property. Be it protection, food or pleasure.

Re:The poor will always be with us

[khallow]

Poverty is the absence of possessions.

If there are no such possessions to not have, then there wouldn't be poverty by that definitioin. Having said that, I'd say that poverty is the condition of having to spend most of one's time and resources satisfying basic wants such as food and shelter. That would make apes poor.

Re:The poor will always be with us

[DRJlaw]

Yes it does.

Collins English Dictionary
beg the question
      a. to evade the issue
      b. to assume the thing under examination as proved
      c. to suggest that a question needs to be asked the firm's success begs the question: why aren't more companies doing the same?

Webster's College Dictionary
Idioms:
1. beg the question,
      a. to assume the truth of the very point raised in a question.
      b. to evade the issue.
      c. to raise the question; inspire one to ask.

The English language is a living language where meaning is defined by its general users, not solely by logicians. You've already lost. Deal with it.

Re:Space exploration is critical for Africa now?

[flyingfsck]

The thing is, they can and do live on 50c a day, but you cannot. The whole situation is different there. I'm not saying that living on 50c a day is pleasant, but if you would try to live on that, you would die of starvation within 10 days or so, but they will still be there and be happily making even more babies to live in even worse conditions later.

Wow, really?

[cripkd]

Meta-whoosh!

Re:Wow, really?

[VortexCortex]

What you have to ask yourself now is: What if the first woosh was the actual meta-woosh.

And just like that I invented the quantum woosh pair. The entangled meta woosh states now exist in super positions of themselves.

Re:Wow, really?

[thomst]

Posting to undo an inadvertently-incorrect moderation. Still getting used to the "glide" feature on my Synoptics touchpad. I meant to moderate VortexCortex's comment +1 Funny.

Re:Wow, really?

[nu1x]

The whoosh is in the ear of the listener.

Re:Wow, really?

[Walterk]

My theory is that it's whooshes all the way down.

Re:Wow, really?

[xevioso]

Ah, but now the real question... what if his name is Joseph Akinyede and he is NOT a scammer? And his post is the REAL DEAL!!!

Re:Space exploration is critical for Africa now?

[Thanshin]

Anyone can live on 50c/day, as long as they are there.

It's common for backpackers to discover after a while in Thailand that they can live for 1€/day and decide that their plan to stay as long as money allowed made no sense, as a simple call to their parents for a tiny bit of money would pay them another year there.

Crazy

[AndreyWelsh]

Space research should become private business.

Re:Crazy

[Applehu Akbar]

A few years ago, nobody thought the idea of poor nations skipping wired telephone infrastructure to go directly cellular would work either. This effort may lead to similar surprises.

that adjustment is included. Rice 8 cents per serv

[raymorris]

You're mistaken, it really is $2 / day, exactly like if you lived on $2 / day. You THINK you'd starve. In fact, you'd find out rice is 8 cents per serving. Potatos are slightly more. You've probably bought ramen noodles at 12 cents. You can eat on 30 cents per day. You're not eating at Olive Garden or drinking Starbucks, but you're eating.

At that, some people in Africa DO starve because they don't jhave the 30 cents per day. You could live off three packs of ramen per day, so can they - it's exactly the same. The only difference is that you and I complain about overdone pizza, they would rejoice over the same pizza.

Giving everyone $2/day:

[tlambert]

Giving everyone $2/day:

1.033 billion people * $2/day * 365 days/year = $754 billion

That's assuming that, because of local scarcity, the influx of cash doesn't just inflate the cost of everything, leaving everyone in exactly the same place they are today, only unable to afford food next year.

About the best aid we could possibly send to Africa would be to hire a bunch of Academi assassins to take down the corrupt politicians who are causing food aid to rot on the docks while the people the politicians want to oppress starve so that they can't rally sufficient effort to stage a violent overthrow of their corrupt governments.

Re:Giving everyone $2/day:

[tlambert]

"...hire a bunch of Academi assassins to take down the corrupt politicians..."

Maybe we should do a kickstarter?

Re:Giving everyone $2/day:

[AndreyWelsh]

who cares.... I would invest my petty cash into space research.

Re:Giving everyone $2/day:

[Trepidity]

The assassination thing gets tried now and then, but assassinated leaders have a habit of being replaced by other leaders, who are not always better. Sometimes, instead, they're replaced by multiple would-be leaders and a civil war, also not necessarily better.

Re:Giving everyone $2/day:

[Silpher]

Oh you mean economic hitman..? Yea that worked wonders in the past..

Re:Giving everyone $2/day:

[upside]

Food aid is a poisonous gift. You might feed a bunch of people, but it undercuts the livelihoods of local farmers, and just creates dependency on handouts. Disaster relief is one thing, but without a transition plan towards self sufficiency it is almost worse than nothing.

http://www.globalpost.com/dispatches/globalpost-blogs/rights/commentary-dependency-hinders-development

I saw a documentary about the aid industry in Haiti, and it was quite disgusting. Local builders and plumbers living in tattered tents without proper sanitation, just living on hand me downs from aid agencies whose interest was already focusing on the next disaster. Real aid would help the locals help themselves, not pay for aid industry fat salaries and materials manufactured in the donor countries.

http://edition.cnn.com/2013/10/09/opinion/where-does-aid-money-really-go/
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/9545584/Poverty-barons-who-make-a-fortune-from-taxpayer-funded-aid-budget.html

The first B in BBC stands for British, right?

[madenglishbloke]

So how come someone from the UK isn't allowed to access that page? FTA: We're sorry but this site is not accessible from the UK as it is part of our international service and is not funded by the licence fee. It is run commercially by BBC Worldwide, a wholly-owned subsidiary of the BBC, the profits made from it go back to BBC programme-makers to help fund great new BBC programmes. I can sort-of understand non-UK readers being prevented from seeing things paid for by the License Fee, but UK residents being prevented from reading something NOT paid for in that way? **facepalm**

Re:The first B in BBC stands for British, right?

[madenglishbloke]

Okay, that's weird - /. just screwed up my formatting...

Re:The first B in BBC stands for British, right?

[Eunuchswear]

Okay, that's weird - /. just screwed up my formatting...

You must be new around here.

TFA

[Patch86]

Well, I just learned something new today. Even though TFA is BBC, and I am UK, I'm actually region-blocked from viewing it!

BBC Future (international version)

We're sorry but this site is not accessible from the UK as it is part of our international service and is not funded by the licence fee. It is run commercially by BBC Worldwide, a wholly-owned subsidiary of the BBC, the profits made from it go back to BBC programme-makers to help fund great new BBC programmes. You can find out more about BBC Worldwide and its digital activities at www.bbcworldwide.com.

If you are looking for health, technology, science and environment news in the UK, please visit:
Health, Technology, Science and Environment.

You'd think they would just show me the page alongside whatever advertising they deem to be appropriate for their commercial service, but I guess there must be some arcane rule in their charter which prevents that.

Bureaucracy can be a strange beast.

IT IS THE BRITISH WAY !!

[Anonymous Coward]

And that sir or madam is the problem !! First wrong side of the road !! Blimey !! Whatever that is !! Second is paying for a license to own a telly or trying to hide from the triangulators looking for scofflaws !! B;imey !! Third is living on an island that if it were not for the American Gulf Stream would be colder than a witches tit !! BLIMEY !!

Africa needs space

[XB-70]

When I was a kid in the 60s, we had an African student stay with us. He was studying climatology. He was also fascinated by space. After graduation he returned to his home country. Using the information he had acquired, he collected satellite data on weather conditions (which was very advanced thinking for that time). He went into the country-side and advised local farmers of impending droubts, locust infestations and floods. The first year he did it, they were, at best, dismissive. When he went back to them after his forecasts has proved correct, they eagerly listened to him and it changed the agrarian economy. He also advised fishermen of temperature changes off-shore indicating optimal times to fish. This allowed local fishermen to get out to the fish before the huge Japanese trawlers came and took everything.

He went on to have his own department at the local University.

Of course, because of his good work, his nation rewarded him with threats to the lives of himself, his wife and his family so I won't state his name or other information about him here.

Re:Sounds like politicing to me

[Phydaux]

Because space-age technology may be able to give them clean drinking water?

United Nations thinks it's a good idea

[tomhath]

Yet Joseph Akinyede, director of the African Regional Centre for Space Science and Technology Education in Nigeria, an education centre affiliated with the United Nations Office for Outer Space Affairs, says that the application of space science technology and research to “basic necessities” of life – health, education, energy, food security, environmental management – is critical for the development of the continent.

Yea, send more UN money. I'm confident that the leaders of those countries will spend it wisely.

Re:United Nations thinks it's a good idea

[hawkfish]

Yet Joseph Akinyede, director of the African Regional Centre for Space Science and Technology Education in Nigeria, an education centre affiliated with the United Nations Office for Outer Space Affairs, says that the application of space science technology and research to “basic necessities” of life – health, education, energy, food security, environmental management – is critical for the development of the continent.

Yea, send more UN money. I'm confident that the leaders of those countries will spend it wisely.

You mean give it all to the plutocrats? After all, that is the American way!

Re:Might sound racist....

[Anonymous Coward]

Why would pointing out the corruption of African govts be racist? It is a testament to the degree of indoctrination suffered by many westerners that they feel the need to carefully examine any negative statement involving blacks in any context for possible racial insensitivity. A crook is a crook. Africa didn't invent (well, maybe Africa did, depending on human origins) and doesn't have a monopoly on political corruption. The white countries of the west are wealthy and function well because they developed the cultures and institutions that create wealth and provide security in body and property for the individuals in those countries. There is no reason to feel guilty about coming from a well-functioning society and no reason to feel guilty about pointing out how screwed up other countries are. Such attitudes of excessive self-examination can lead to self-loathing which will inevitably result in Detroit.

Only to the fools

[morgauxo]

" it may seem rather inappropriate to launch space programs in sub-Saharan Africa, where nearly 70% of the population still lives on less $2 a day"

Only to the fools.

A space program creates jobs, develops technology and gives people somethig to be proud of and aspire towards. It will always be easy to count the money that goes into any space program but the benefits and money coming out will outweigh the cost. It's harder to count that though so the fools will always be around holding manking back.

I don't care what you are working towards, wherever you set your goals you will almost always fall a little short. If their goal is just to provide everyone the minimal basics, food, clean water and shelter then they will fail to do even that. If their goal is to make continual progress and achieve great things the outcome will still be less than the goal but the basics will be more than covered.

We don't need to convert populations living off of $2 into populations living off of $3. We need to convert them to healthy, prosperous and advancing communities everywhere and in every way.

Re:Only to the fools

[morgauxo]

>>So, in your view, the best expectation to promote in Africa is for them to let other countries tell them how to run their countries? What is that really teaching Africans?

Isn't it mainly African leaders setting these goals?

>>Western societies are still more stable and wealthy than societies in any other region.

And declining. If the decline continues roles will reverse. Go ahead, argue all day as to what the future will bring.

>> The unemployment in the West is largely a result of economic surplus and generous welfare systems.

Well, that's your take. Prove it.

>> The manufacturing jobs lost by the US were lost because the business climate in the US has become hostile.

People fought hard to get a fair wage for a fair days work. Before that living conditions in the US really weren't much better than in the East. The fact is a few business leaders will always take everything they can get and give as little as they can get away with. You can argue that the US has swung too far against business if you want but the fact is that it was the opening up of markets to imports from where people do NOT get paid a fair wage, where worker safety and health is not a concern of management and most people are pretty miserable. We do not want to live that way. Just look at FoxConn, their employees don't even want to LIVE! Nobody should live that way.

>> >>Also the US continues to waste over $600 billion/year on pointless military expenditures
>> Opinions vary as to military uses and priorities
>> All countries must provide for their own security either by maintaining an appropriate military...

I don't know what the author of the parent comment believes but he did not state that military expenditures are pointless. His statement doesn't even say that ALL US military expenditures are pointless. He only states that the US spends money on military expenditures that ARE pointless. From the perspective that what a government obtains from it's people should be spent to the benefit of those people I agree. Unless... I can expect a check in the mail from whoever is getting all that Iraqi oil now....

Re:Only to the fools

[JamieIanMacgregor]

I'm wondering if they could even fence off an area without someone ripping it down and trading it in for cents on the dollar? there is a big enough problem with this sort of thing where I'm from so I cant imagine Nigeria being any better.

Re:that adjustment is included. Rice 8 cents per s

[Megane]

12 cent ramen? Ewwww, that's the crap stuff. I'll keep splurging on the 16.7 cent Maruchan ramen, thank you very much.

Re:Quote

[drinkypoo]

I think Africa has larger issues to deal with first, before sending someone into space...but that's just my viewpoint

Investment in space investment in Africa (which is a big place) is also investment in infrastructure in Africa, because you can't achieve it otherwise.

Re:that adjustment is included. Rice 8 cents per s

[MightyYar]

Thanks, you saved me from having to post that.

I'd add that things like cooking fuel are cheaper in the US as well. Where you'd have a problem, though, is housing. The governments in the US do not tolerate the same sorts of shanty towns that exist in Africa.

sigh

[koan]

"'To Western eyes, it may seem rather inappropriate to launch space programs in sub-Saharan Africa, where nearly 70% of the population still lives on less $2 a day."

To everyone's eyes.

The USA has saved a lot of money.

[Vitriol Angst]

We've saved a lot of money not REALLY bothering with space -- not really being serious about it anymore. Instead we've got this REALLY IMPORTANT deficit, but it doesn't exist when bailing out banks and being in really expensive wars hiring contractor mercenaries for ten times the regular soldier.

And so we've kind of become less inspired, less a beacon of hope and progress, less interesting.

Wasting money on inspiring children, on basic research and on people always pays for itself. The alternative is to horde and grow less.

Re:The USA has saved a lot of money.

[Teancum]

We've saved a lot of money not REALLY bothering with space -- not really being serious about it anymore. Instead we've got this REALLY IMPORTANT deficit, but it doesn't exist when bailing out banks and being in really expensive wars hiring contractor mercenaries for ten times the regular soldier.

I will agree that the USA is no longer being serious about going into space (with the exception of a bunch of starry eyed entrepreneurs who are being taxed into oblivion once it becomes profitable). As for saving money, I would dare say that expenditures for spaceflight have never been higher. Most of the spending on space at the moment comes not from high profile things like landing on the Moon, but instead on a bunch of three lettered acronymed agencies who have a budget that far outspends anything NASA has ever dreamed of having. NASA is not only but one of several space agencies in the U.S. federal government, they aren't even the largest any more. There is reason to think they may not even be #2.

Equator

[GuB-42]

Several countries in Africa are traversed by the Equator, which is a good place for launch facilities.
Maybe that's the idea.

Re:that adjustment is included. Rice 8 cents per s

[flyingfsck]

Housing - exactly. In most of Africa, housing is basically free, since they steal the building materials and the electricity, coal or oil. That is the main diff between say Alabama and Nigeria.

Zambia did it in 1964

[citizenr]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M9Do3dz9TR0

Solar power sats?

[whitroth]

So, are they considering putting up solar power satellites, and beaming really cheap power down?

                  mark

PS The environmental impact study on SPS was done in the US... in the late seventies. No one's willing to front the money....

Re:Space exploration is critical for Africa now?

[Teancum]

One of the little told aspects of Ted Kaczynski (aka the Unibomber) is that he was able to live and thrive on very little money. He had a small cabin in Montana and was almost completely self sufficient.... living in a first world economy no less. Admittedly that also helped keep him "off the grid", and was one of the reasons why he was so hard for the FBI to trace, but living on just a few hundred dollars per year is still possible to do even in America at the current value of a dollar. Not easy, and like Kaczynski you would need to grow your own food, hunt, and slaughter your own animals needed for food, but it is possible.

The problem is the overgeneralization that anybody living this lifestyle is similarly deranged and needs to be imprisoned before they go and kill a dozen people.

Africa, I don't care what you do

[holophrastic]

Just stop begging me for money with disease-riddled children, starving, with bugs on their faces, and open wounds, on the food network. Basic farming never needed the space age. I'll give you as many seeds as you like. Grow'em, or walk until you can. It's been decades of your begging. I just don't care anymore.

Re:SAY WAT?

[Lord Apathy]

Yes, yes, there is always one of you in every crowed. People that want to excuse every negative thing about africa. Want to put the blame and the responsibility to fix it every where but where it belongs.

You probably are just like bono and want to pour endless amounts of money into fixing something that its not our responsibility to fix. You probably think ever culture has value and is great.

Yeah, heard it all before. So by all means lets continue to pour endless amounts of money down the cesspit that is africa while dissolving the governments and the people of any form of responsibility to help themselves. At least you will be able to sleep better knowing its all everyone else fault but the poor little africans.

Re:Sounds like politicing to me

[JeffAtl]

Clean drinking water is already a solved problem.