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David Pogue and Yahoo's "Normals" Problem

Nerval's Lobster writes "In a keynote talk at this year's Consumer Electronics Show (CES) in Las Vegas, David Pogue (Yahoo's freshly minted technology columnist) suggested that the new 'Yahoo Tech' Website — a key part of the company's latest rebranding — would be targeted at 'normal' people as opposed to 'gearheads.' Based on a map that flashed on the giant screen behind him, which showed the 'normals' clustered in the middle of the country and the 'gearheads' restricted to the coasts, it's clear that Yahoo has embraced a divisive strategy that tries to equate Yahoo's brands with some sort of mythical 'middlebrow' audience that exists within clearly defined borders. (During his presentation, Pogue also flashed a slide that made fun of competing tech-news brands: The Verge was rendered as 'The Urge,' for example, while Gizmodo became 'Gizmoody.') The problem is that rigid audience of 'normals' doesn't exist, at least not in the way that Yahoo envisions. Large numbers of well-educated technology consumers — 'gearheads,' in Pogue's parlance — exist all over the country; to say otherwise is like suggesting that Wyoming is 100 percent Republican, or that everybody who lives in Florida hates snow. In other words, Yahoo's approach to tech content isn't merely schismatic; it's willfully unaware of the variety that exists among technology fans."

37 of 213 comments (clear)

  1. What do you expect? by jddeluxe · · Score: 2, Informative

    Anything but douchery from David Pogue?

    1. Re:What do you expect? by khasim · · Score: 4, Funny

      Not just him. Go to that website:
      http://www.yahoo.com/tech/?ref=news

      It's wall-to-wall crap and ads. Literally wall-to-wall. It fills the page with graphics slammed up touching to each other. Up-down-left-right.

      It's what you would get if a douchbag spec'ed out a site.

    2. Re:What do you expect? by i+kan+reed · · Score: 5, Funny

      Reminds me of Windows 8, actually.

    3. Re:What do you expect? by ericloewe · · Score: 4, Funny

      Uses my whole 27" screen? Check.

      Shows more than it would on a phone? No.

      Is it usable? No.

      Does it have any noteworthy content? Not any that I saw before my eyes started hurting and I closed the tab.

    4. Re:What do you expect? by paiute · · Score: 3, Funny

      That's not a website. It's a screensaver.

      --
      If Slashdot were chemistry it would look like this:Cadaverine
    5. Re:What do you expect? by DocSavage64109 · · Score: 2

      Even though it's Yahoo, I checked it out, and with adblock it looks much like a windows 8 screen. It was very visual, and some of the pictures were intriguing, like the 12 foot ramen noodles sculpture.

    6. Re:What do you expect? by multisync · · Score: 2

      I pay to use the Internet already via my ISP.

      I block ads too, but it's a bit of a non sequitur to say that there is no need to support the sites you visit because you pay your ISP for access to the Internet. It's not like you ISP is passing any of that money along to the producers of the content on the sites you visit.

      I pay taxes to local governments responsible for maintaining our roads. That doesn't mean GM owes me a car.

      --
      I don't care why you're posting AC
  2. Lol. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    Nerd website complains that new nerd section in other website isn't nerdy enough. News at 11.

  3. Just catering to their demographics by asmkm22 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    One thing that has really stood out for me in the last 5 or 6 years is just how conservative their readers tend to skew. It's where the Fox News crowd goes. Just read the comments section of any random news story and you'll see what I mean.

    1. Re:Just catering to their demographics by QuietLagoon · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I've seen that trend among my right-wing-leaning friends. For some reason, no matter what you are talking about, they always seem to turn the conversation back to politics. Not just any politics, but more extreme right-wing politics.

    2. Re:Just catering to their demographics by LWATCDR · · Score: 5, Funny

      Actually the amount of vile idiots in the comments of the mainstream news sites is about the same. 95% CNN, MSNBC, and FOX comments are total dung heaps. Frankly they all make Slashdot look like a bastion of polite, openminded, and levelheaded people.

      --
      See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
    3. Re:Just catering to their demographics by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      I believe most of those comments are paid by Republican think tanks. If they can skew the discussion to a far right as possible, over time, you will mold the reader's left vs right barometer.

    4. Re:Just catering to their demographics by OakDragon · · Score: 2, Insightful

      That's funny, I've noticed the same except with my left-leaning friends (and extreme left-wing politics of course). I'm not trying to be facetious, it does seem that way to me. Perhaps it says more about us than them?

    5. Re:Just catering to their demographics by dcollins · · Score: 2

      I agree. The comments at Yahoo take the lead for Lovecraftian mind-melting horror.

      --
      We know where leadership by an anti-intellectual "strongman" who scapegoats minorities and likes boisterous rallies goes
    6. Re:Just catering to their demographics by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Frankly they all make Slashdot look like a bastion of polite, openminded, and levelheaded people.

      Try reading Slashdot at -1. The idiotic vileness is still here, it is just hidden by the moderation system. I have never understood why more sites don't use a Slashdot like moderation system. It isn't perfect, but it is way better than an open spigot.

    7. Re:Just catering to their demographics by internerdj · · Score: 2

      Because they are run by "Normals"?

    8. Re:Just catering to their demographics by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I'm not trying to be facetious, it does seem that way to me. Perhaps it says more about us than them?

      What it says is that those who are on the fringe or lean towards the extreme spectrum of <insert political, religious or other personal point of view here> are frequently proselytizing. They're also trying to find like-minded individuals so they don't feel as defensive as they do when surrounded by those who don't understand the truth about things or who haven't seen the light yet.

      Surround yourself by those who agree with you and you'll always know that you're right.

    9. Re:Just catering to their demographics by jeffmflanagan · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I don't think that normal people post to those sites very often. It's the asshats that MUST impose their worldview on others that you see.

      Not even regular Conservatives are as delusional and hateful as the crazies that post under news stories and use the wingnut tags to spew far-right-wing derp to like-minded imbeciles on Twitter.

    10. Re:Just catering to their demographics by DoofusOfDeath · · Score: 2

      Because they are run by "Normals"?

      As opposed to Brights?

    11. Re:Just catering to their demographics by timeOday · · Score: 4, Informative

      I just googled the Rolling Stone article you alluded to, and I admit it is more leftist than I expected to see. That said, the pendulum swings back and forth. The people pushing the policies leading to todays out-of-control inequality should have looked at some history themselves, and the traction that outright communism was gaining after the Great Depression until some fairly mild measures in that direction (the New Deal) were adopted. Boomers enjoyed the benefits without acknowledging them, and dismantled them (through inadequate funding) in order to line their own pockets, at the expense of the millenials. Now the pendulum is going to swing back a bit. But we aren't going to become the USSR, regardless of anything Rolling Stone says.

  4. More Yahoo nonsense by bigjarom · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I actually got mad while following live tweets of Pogue's talk. But then I thought, "Well, this is going to fail in few months anyway," so then I felt better.

    1. Re:More Yahoo nonsense by Charliemopps · · Score: 4, Funny

      No, the big boxy thing is the hard drive you dolt!

  5. Site Dilution by edibobb · · Score: 4, Informative

    Yahoo Tech is going the route of site dilution, in which each site eventually dumbs down to something in between Gawker, Huff Post, and Fox News. The sites post the same inane, inaccurate stories, such as "supervolcanoes imminent". Uh oh... wasn't that on /. ?

    1. Re:Site Dilution by i+kan+reed · · Score: 2

      The difference that occurred to me: smart users run Adblock. Show the suckers ads, leave the power users to someone else. Coincidentally, this appears to be the Windows 8 strategy too.

  6. I'm both. by queazocotal · · Score: 5, Insightful

    As I suspect are most people.
    I'm a gearhead when considering electronic test equipment.
    I'm more of a prosumer for commodity computer hardware.
    I'm pretty normal for tablet use - I haven't even rooted my nexus 7.
    I'm well below normal about how much I care about cars and TVs.

    The notion that people care equally much about all aspects of a wide field 'tech' is barking mad.

    1. Re:I'm both. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      I don't even want to know I live in a world where people like you are alive!
      I rooted my car, looked under the hood of my tablet, fiddled with the color settings of my CPU and overclocked my TV. And I make my own test equipment, thank you.

  7. Yet by bob_super · · Score: 3, Insightful

    He achieved his goal by making you talk about his company. Free ads.
    Controversy doesn't always sell, but that's the first time in weeks that anyone has talked about yahoo.

  8. Re:I'm confused... by LWATCDR · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I think it is more along the idea of with out the tragic hipster culture. The Verge and Gizmodo are too involved with the lifestyle side of tech. For example when I listen to the podcast "It's a thing" I keep hearing about idiots dressing up like captain Nemo and talking about artisanal hardware. Where I live you just do not see fixie bikes and $300 backpacks. The Verge podcasts is full of never ending negative comments about "Red States" much the same as you hear in the comments on Slashdot.
    So yes I can see the value of a tech site that does not live in the Hipster culture bubble.

    --
    See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
  9. No RSS feed? by david.emery · · Score: 2

    Am I the the last person in the world who uses RSS readers to browse news sites for stories that I actually want to read? After all, 90% of everything is crap and I'm looking for efficient ways to find the 10%.

    The visual clutter on that site is appalling, I thought Pogue had more taste than that.

    1. Re:No RSS feed? by wile_e8 · · Score: 2

      You aren't the last person using RSS, but you and all the rest of the people still using RSS are gearheads, and they don't want gearheads. They'd much rather have the type of people that think Twitter can serve the same purpose.

  10. Tech For People Who Don't Like Tech by dcollins · · Score: 2

    That's one of the most losing business strategies I've ever heard.

    But it's not alone. There's a lot of failed businesses that at some point when down the lunatic path of "But just imagine if the huge majority of people who don't have any use for service X were converted to using service X! We'd be rich!"

    --
    We know where leadership by an anti-intellectual "strongman" who scapegoats minorities and likes boisterous rallies goes
  11. Aren't Yahoo! there already? by DigitAl56K · · Score: 2

    How is this a "rebrand". I'm one of those techie people, and Yahoo! isn't my go-to for... anything, as I suspect it already isn't for most other techie people.

  12. There are different levels of "normals" by ErichTheRed · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I don't know, I think he might be on to something, but the red state/blue state map doesn't make any real world sense. Part of it seems like the typical NYC/California hipster bubble ignoring the rest of the country but the idea might be right.

    Don't forget that in the 70s/80s, only real gearheads/nerds were doing anything with computers. This changed in the 90s with the Internet, and changed even more with smartphones in the 2000s. Now, the camps skew a little differently:
    - True gearheads who want to know every little scrap of technical information about a technology product -- increasingly small percentage
    - "Prosumer" users who like nice tech toys but aren't obsessed with the "how they work" part -- Small pecentage, but more than gearheads
    - "Normals" who use technology on a daily basis and care even less about how it works -- Basically, the same surface area on that map redistributed across the continent

    Part of the reason Apple is so successful is because the iPhone interface is accessible to normals. Everything complex about it is hidden. Android does this to an extent, and different phone/tablet manufacturers abstract the complexity even more. Any normal can pick up an iPhone, use the Facebook app, SMS, tweet, send old fashioned emails, etc. with a very low learning curve.

    It sounds like Yahoo wants to be the 2010s version of AOL -- universally accessible content at the risk of alienating the gearheads, who don't read Yahoo for tech news anyway.

  13. I found the problem by TheCarp · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Yahoo actually thinks it is "targeted" at "gear heads"? ROTFL

    I know some very technical people who have worked AT yahoo. I don't know a single one that actually uses yahoo services (except occasionally for anonymous email accounts) or takes yahoo seriously in any way.

    Yahoo is already, and has been for some time, the default home page of non-technical people above the age of 50. If they are looking for a problem with their targeting it is right there in the fact that they don't realize this....this is already their audience.

    --
    "I opened my eyes, and everything went dark again"
  14. The big problem with his map? by QilessQi · · Score: 4, Interesting

    It's a potentially politically-divisive map from what should be a non-political company. Focus on the US portion for a minute:

    1. He shows the "gearheads" on both coasts in blue, and the "normals" in-between in red. Very much like a current political map of the US, where the majority of the center is red (Republican) and the coasts are largely blue (Democrat). As RLM puts it: maybe you didn't notice, but your brain did. I really don't think the red/blue choice was an accident. A lot of Yahoo management eyeballs would have seen it, thought about it, and approved it.

    2. The map equates the positive term "normal" with red [heartland, Republicans] and the negative term "gearheads" with blue [coastal, Democrats].

    3. The map shows a larger proportion of red areas than blue areas, suggesting that the US is far more "normal" than "gearhead". If it were really meant to show "normal" vs "gearhead" then it's obviously absurd: what about Chicago, Austin, DC, and other major tech centers? But it's certainly appealing for a Republican to look at a US map and see far more red than blue.

    All of which seems designed to position Yahoo as a politically-conservative portal, meant to appeal to people that would prefer to avoid supposedly-liberal web sites like Google. Look at this article to see what I mean:

    http://politicaloutcast.com/2013/04/the-conservative-alternative-to-the-liberal-google/

    I’m talking about Goodsearch. Goodsearch is run by Yahoo, which, against Google, gives comparatively poor search results. But the return for using Goodsearch is that for each search you make, the company donates one cent to the charity or school of your choice.... This is a great conservative alternative to Google, which yesterday, instead of using its daily Google graphic to honor Easter, they used it to honor a day that not only does no one celebrate, but which nobody has heard of: Cesar Chavez Day.

    Ok, maybe I'm reading more into that map than I should, but they certainly opened the door for speculation. :-)

  15. You know what a Yahoo is? by tomhath · · Score: 3, Funny
    From Gulliver's Travels

    A Yahoo is a legendary being in the novel Gulliver's Travels (1726) by Jonathan Swift.

    Swift describes them as being filthy and with unpleasant habits...the term "yahoo" has come to mean "a crude, brutish or obscenely coarse person".

  16. The Perfect Yahoo by TheloniousToady · · Score: 2

    David Pogue is the perfect yahoo. He'll fit right in at Yahoo. Like them, he's constantly pulling stunts that he - and only he - finds amusing. Whether this is pure self-indulgence or just some sort of bewildered misconception of what he thinks the public wants is unclear, but it shows no sign of abating. And even when he comes up with some potentially interesting content, such as his recent NOVA segments, he manages to annoy and alienate the public to the point of making them switch to another channel. Just like Yahoo.