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New Type of Star Can Emerge From Inside Black Holes, Say Cosmologists

Posted by Soulskill on from the cross-black-holes-off-your-list-of-good-hiding-places dept.

KentuckyFC writes "Black holes form when a large star runs out of fuel and collapses under its own weight. Since there is no known force that can stop this collapse, astrophysicists have always assumed that it forms a singularity, a region of space that is infinitely dense. Now cosmologists think quantum gravity might prevent this complete collapse after all. They say that the same force that stops an electron spiraling into a nucleus might also cause the collapsing star to 'bounce' at scales of around 10^-14cm. They're calling this new state a 'Planck star' and say its lifetime would match that of the black hole itself as it evaporates. That raises the possibility that the shrinking event horizon would eventually meet the expanding Planck star, which emerges with a sudden blast of gamma rays. That radiation would allow any information trapped in the black hole to escape, solving the infamous information paradox. If they're right, these gamma rays may already have been detected by space-based telescopes meaning that the evidence is already there for any enterprising astronomer to tease apart."

17 of 193 comments (clear)

  1. Its own weight? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Black holes form when a large star runs out of fuel and collapses under its own weight

    Isn't actually it's own gravity? The weight would increase with the gravity, doesn't it?

    1. Re:Its own weight? by suutar · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Sort of yes. "...under the force of its own gravitational attraction" would be more precise, I think. Gravity is a force, and weight is the measure of the gravitational force on a particular item. But it's common to think of weight as the force of gravitational attraction itself, and it's shorter to type.

      And yes, as it collapses and the distance from particle A to the center of mass of the rest of the star decreases, the force of gravitational attraction (weight) increases.

    2. Re:Its own weight? by camperdave · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I don't get black hole evaporation. Suppose a proton/anti-proton pair gets created at the event horizon and the proton falls in. Hasn't the mass of the black hole increased by one proton? If the anti-proton falls in, it will meet another proton and annihilate it (assuming conditions within the black hole still allow this), but with no way for the energy to escape, isn't it the same as increasing by the mass of the anti-proton (which is the same as a proton)?

      I propose we try the experiment with whomever is supporting this switch to Beta.

      --
      When our name is on the back of your car, we're behind you all the way!
    3. Re:Its own weight? by suutar · · Score: 4, Informative

      As I understand it, that's almost exactly it. The catch is that the universe is now 2 protons heavier than it was, and it can't keep them. "Normally" the proton and antiproton would recombine and annihilate and it would be gone, but now that they're separated that can't happen. So the black hole's mass gets debited 2 proton masses. So the final result is that the hole is down 1 proton mass and the rest of the universe is up 1 proton mass.

    4. Re:Its own weight? by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 4, Funny

      But how can the black hole's mass go down when particles are being added to it?

      Because the mass of that particle, and the particle that escaped, came from the black hole. So there is a net loss of mass. But the probability of this happening is so low that an immense number of eons are needed to evaporate a black hole, and the time required goes up with the cube of the mass. A solar mass black hole may take approx 10^66 years to evaporate. That is because its gravity sucks almost as hard as Slashdot Beta.

  2. In before the Fuck Beta Burst by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    So decaying black holes might be another source of gamma ray bursts? Interesting hypothesis. I suppose this would permit a big old star to bounce between being a black hole and a neutron star, depending on the rate of incoming material.

    So, do I have to point out the obvious that the /. beta is horribly user-hostile to keep this from getting modded -1 insightful?

    1. Re:In before the Fuck Beta Burst by i+kan+reed · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Yes, you do. Beta is terrible and ignoring it clearly isn't making it go away.,

  3. What the TFS means: by TigerPlish · · Score: 5, Insightful

    What TFS really means is that out of the suck generated by Beta, a new site will emerge, free from corporate cocksuckery.

    Beta: Only slightly better than Facetwat.

    --
    The "Civilized World" jumped the shark ca. 1973.
  4. Re:Beta Sucks! by Ben4jammin · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I usually try to stay on-topic, but this is a deserved exception.

    I logged in, perused some of my old comments just for nostalgia and will be logging out for at least the remainder of the proposed boycott period.

    I just wanted to say that it has been awesome being part of the Slashdot community. You guys are awesome. I have lost track of how much I have learned about different topics that I never would have learned were it not for participating in Slashdot discussions.

    I hope to see you on the other side...with Beta existing only as a memory of an epic fail.

  5. Beta solved the information paradox by cheese_boy · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Slashdot's Beta has proved that it is possible for information to be sucked in and never get out.

    WTF is up with article titles that only the first 3 words are visible because of the huge font used?

    Slashdot beta - the artificial blackhole created by Dice that Slashdot will be sucked into

  6. Re:Information paradox? by DeadDecoy · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I think information is used in it's most abstract sense. Any particle or wave signals that that approach the black hole get consumed. I.e. when we look at it, we see nothing because light is absorbed. I'm probably wrong, though, and someone who studies the topic might be more apt at providing an explanation. Personally, I wonder what this means in terms of the second law of thermodynamics. When a black hole consumes energy and releases a Planck star, do either events reduce the entropy of the system?

  7. Re:I'm wondering... by dysmal · · Score: 4, Funny

    ...if a star can emerge from Slashdot Beta. That shit is a black hole of user interface hell.

    There is no gravity. BETA just sucks that hard!

  8. Beta problem is a financial one by mu51c10rd · · Score: 5, Informative

    Dice released their 4th quarter filing...and it does not cast Slashdot in a good light:


    Slashdot Media was acquired to provide content and services that are important to technology professionals in their everyday work lives and to leverage that reach into the global technology community benefiting user engagement on the Dice.com site. The expected benefits have started to be realized at Dice.com. However, advertising revenue has declined over the past year and there is no improvement expected in the future financial performance of Slashdot Media's underlying advertising business. Therefore, $7.2 million of intangible assets and $6.3 million of goodwill related to Slashdot Media were reduced to zero.

    Looks like running AdBlock on Slashdot and turning off ads may soon be the cause of their demise...

    1. Re:Beta problem is a financial one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The never-ending story.

      Popular website gets known for its high, loyal, repeat traffic count, perhaps needs funding to maintain services due to increasing demand. Investors start to take notice - MBA marketing types equate loyal, repeat traffic with high Nielsen ratings of old media, convince big holding company to invest $$$ based on business plan for "leveraging" loyal, repeat traffic to site to sell other goods/services (MBA-speak: "monetization"). Doesn't work out, popular website not meeting projected profit goals. Loyal, repeat traffic not interested in any goods/services, not interested in being "leveraged", only interested in doing what they were doing (usually having something to do with "fun") before big holding company stepped in. MBA marketing types make last ditch effort to save face by reworking popular website, particularly toward goal of increasing "leverage" toward selling other goods/services (i.e., "monetization"). Loyal, repeat traffic revolts due to lack of "fun" and contempt for other goods/services (i.e., "monetization" at the expense of "fun"). MBA marketing types hold their ground to save face, changes are made permanent. Loyal, repeat traffic drops off. Popular website shows greater and greater losses to the big holding company. MBA marketing types sense the ax falling, jump ship. New MBA's advise big holding company to cut losses (i.e., "restructure"), shut down formerly popular website, but maintain all ownership to IP rights related to formerly popular website (you know, just in case it might be worth something some day). Loyal, repeat traffic cast adrift. Formerly popular website reduced to nostalgic memory of when web was fun. World less fun.

      and repeat for each and every cool thing that ever became popular simply due to being fun, capsized by the weight of disinterested investors with uninformed, unrealistic profit expectations.

  9. I'm going to use my deductive reasoning here... by Guy+From+V · · Score: 3, Insightful

    And say I think that most of the community thinks Slashdot Beta sucks.

  10. Re:Beta Sucks! by toshikodo · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I'm posting this from Opera 12. I think that tells you what I think of /. Beta.

    --
    No volcanos here
  11. Re:I'm wondering... by egcagrac0 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    If there is a force that can prevent the total collapse of a star into a singularity, there is hope that we can harness such power to escape from beta...