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US War Machine Downsizing?

mrspoonsi writes "BBC Reports: 'Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel has unveiled plans to shrink the U.S. Army to its smallest size since before World War Two. Outlining his budget plan, the Pentagon chief proposed trimming the active-duty Army to between 440,000 and 450,000 personnel — from 520,000 currently. The U.S. currently spends more on defense than the combined total of the next 12 countries, as ranked by defense spending.'"

13 of 506 comments (clear)

  1. Drone Occupation by Jeremiah+Cornelius · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Of Planet Earth is near completion.

    The rest can be sub-contracted.

    --
    "Flyin' in just a sweet place,
    Never been known to fail..."
    1. Re:Drone Occupation by FlyHelicopters · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The drone pilots at Nellis (Las Vegas) end up with PTSD like field soldiers do.

      While true, that is only because the screening program for that job weeds out abnormal people. Normal people simply don't want to kill other people, either in person or via remote control.

      However, such people do exist... Once the military figures out that they can get socially maladjusted people to fly the drones, they'll have no problems, because such people couldn't care less about killing "ragheads" or whoever the "bad guy of the week" happens to be.

    2. Re:Drone Occupation by Immerman · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Actually I've heard the PTSD can be even worse - the human brain is apparently not that well suited to killing people 8-to-5 and then going home to the wife and kids who can't relate at all.

      On the other hand fully autonomous killing machines are currently being field-tested, and especially when there are no friendlies on the ground I fully such things to be deployed in a big way within a decade or two. And then we'll see just how ugly and expansionist the US war machine can really be.

      Fully autonomous programmer-drones on the other hand I don't expect to see any time soon.

      --
      --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
    3. Re:Drone Occupation by l0ungeb0y · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Since the bar for invasion of another sovereign state is already set fairly low, what future transgression will be enough when no dead heroes need to return home

      I thought it was common knowledge that since the fall of the Berlin Wall, the US Gov't has been waging an escalating war on Private Citizens culminating in the last few year in new and improved ways to conduct mass surveillance, removal of their rights to a trial and killing them in drone strikes.

      No more pussy-footing around with stupid attempts at tyranny like saying "We Need to Suspend the Constitution for the War on Drugs" like Bush I stated to the nation. Now days we just call it "National Security" while we have a drone blow up a car carrying a US Citizen because he's a suspected terrorist sympathizer or wipe out a bunch of people attending a funeral because "intelligence sources confirmed a number of terrorists were likely to be present"

    4. Re:Drone Occupation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      ...while we have a drone blow up a car carrying a US Citizen because he's a suspected terrorist sympathizer ...

      There isn't much real doubt about Anwar al-Awlaki .

      Leaving aside this US citizen's extrajudicial execution (which his family repeatedly attempted to have the federal courts address before he was killed), I am presuming you felt his teenage son was worthy of the killing that was administered to him too?

      "Let's start killing people without trial, who haven't even killed anyone themselves. And then let's not get worked up when we kill US citizen minors, either," said no one reasonable.

  2. But will they shrink man-hours? Spending? by hey! · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Or are they just privatizing more military functions?

    --
    Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
  3. Re:Time to end the military industrial complex by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I hope this news means we have finally heeded his warning and are moving towards dismantling the military industrial complex.

    No. That is not what is happening. Almost all the proposed reductions are to fighting troops. Almost no cuts are to the bloated defense bureaucracy that make up the core of the MIC's revolving door. Hagel wants to reduce the muscle while protecting the belly fat. He is going about it all wrong anyway. Rather than trimming a little here, and a little there, it would be much better to completely eliminate a few big misguided programs. Killing the trillion dollar F-35 boondoggle would be a great place to start.

  4. Makes sense. Its just the Army. by ClassicASP · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I'd me more surprised if it were the marines or the navy seals being downsized. The Army is a lot of bulk manpower that just sits around for the most part and maintains control of areas that have already been seized from the enemy via the attacking efforts of the marines. Advancements of technology means drones and stationary automated turrets can do a lot of that defending work I'd imagine. Just gotta have some protected folks around to maintain control and change the batteries every now and then. Probably way more affordable than actual people. The marines and seals on the other hand can't be so easily replaced by a machine.

  5. Re:Time to end the military industrial complex by TWX · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Did you mean JSF, not JSOC?

    The A-10 is on the chopping block, as is the U2. What I don't get about the elimination of those is that one has proven itself extremely cost-effective in close-quarters ground support (as in using bullets, rather than relying on rockets and bombs) and extremely durable when taking fire (flying back with a wing missing) and the other has been extremely effective for quick-turnaround intelligence.

    Both programs are effective in the kind of engagements that we've found ourselves in during the last couple of decades and both are paid for. It's maintenance only, as opposed to development.

    --
    Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
  6. Re:Time to end the military industrial complex by drinkypoo · · Score: 4, Insightful

    for a lot of teenagers, the military is the only way into what resembles a middle class lifestyle.

    And that is why we are so warlike — we encourage it generation by generation. Maybe it's time to grow up and learn to cooperate.

    --
    "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
  7. Re:End the MIC? by sjames · · Score: 4, Insightful

    You don't get to blame SS for that though. It had nothing to do with the baby boom or anything else. Through careful planning, SSA had it all covered until Congress busted the piggybank so they could cut taxes for the wealthy and pay for all that bumbling in Afghanistan and Iraq.

    Given that, it is perfectly reasonable that any military cuts and new (or reinstated really) taxes for the wealthy should go towards putting the money back where it came from.

    The responsible people are Congress for ordering SSA to make the loans. If it makes you feel better, I FULLY support your call for the responsible congressmen to spend some time in jail.

  8. The Air Force brass *never* wanted the A-10 by perpenso · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The Air Force brass *never* wanted the A-10, the A-10 was virtually forced upon them. There has never been a moment in time since the A-10 first flew that they were not trying to be rid of it.

    My understanding is that A-10s undergo a lot more mechanical stress during training and combat than B-52s and that the A-10 fleet is seeing a lot of micro-fractures in key structural areas. They have been cannibalizing old planes in storage but that source is just about dried up. They are at the point where they will need to manufacture new components, major components like wings. This is letting the brass finally get their way.

  9. Re:Time to end the military industrial complex by drinkypoo · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The US isn't particularly warlike.

    Who told you that, and why did you believe them? Check our our body count and our military expenditure, and look into how many conflicts we've been in per decade as compared to other nations, and get back to me.

    --
    "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"