St. Patrick's Day, March Madness, and Steve Jobs' Liver

Many Americans are probably rubbing their temples and wandering around with a bit of a post-St. Patrick's day hangover. Reader theodp writes with a sobering statistical consequence of traditional heavy-drinking holidays: "Keep in mind that this time of year has traditionally been very good to those awaiting organ transplants, including the late Steve Jobs, as Walter Isaacson explained in Jobs: 'By late February 2009 Jobs had secured a place on the Tennessee list (as well as the one in California), and the nervous waiting began. He was declining rapidly by the first week in March, and the waiting time was projected to be twenty-one days. 'It was dreadful,' Powell recalled. 'It didn't look like we would make it in time.' Every day became more excruciating. He moved up to third on the list by mid-March, then second, and finally first. But then days went by. The awful reality was that upcoming events like St. Patrick's Day and March Madness (Memphis was in the 2009 tournament and was a regional site) offered a greater likelihood of getting a donor because the drinking causes a spike in car accidents. Indeed, on the weekend of March 21, 2009, a young man in his mid-twenties was killed in a car crash, and his organs were made available.'"

Comments

Fortunately for Jobs

[Snufu]

Organ donation was open source.

Re:Fortunately for Jobs

[buchner.johannes]

If it were GPL, every recipient would be required to pass his organs on upon his death. And the organ would perpetually be passed on, because organs want to be free.

Actually not just the organ he received, but all his organs, because the other components require the one received. Although I guess you can argue a generic API.

Re:Fortunately for Jobs

[bigwheel]

GPL Sounds reasonable. In order to receive organs from other donors, you must also consent to be a donor.

Re:Fortunately for Jobs

[tlhIngan]

Assuming organs could be copied of course, but that's the usual silly things you see when people try and compare code to real world objects.

Well, in this case, it's livers. And livers have a very stunning capacity of self-replication. It's quite fortunate that such a vital organ to life is so robust - it has extensive self-repair capabilities, it can regenerate missing parts, etc. That capability is often used to turn one liver into multiple (if the patients don't need full functionality immediately), or to remove cirrhosis in its early stages. (Heck, it takes a LOT to get liver cirrhosis)

Truly the liver is an organ we cannot live without, is extremely vital to all bodily functions in some way, but also includes so much in the way of self-repair that damaging it takes a lot of time and effort (e.g., alcoholic) or well pronounced liver disease.

Re:Fortunately for Jobs

[cayenne8]

Well, in this case, it's livers. And livers have a very stunning capacity of self-replication. It's quite fortunate that such a vital organ to life is so robust - it has extensive self-repair capabilities, it can regenerate missing parts, etc. That capability is often used to turn one liver into multiple (if the patients don't need full functionality immediately), or to remove cirrhosis in its early stages. (Heck, it takes a LOT to get liver cirrhosis)

In that case, I almost think I'd like Keith Richard's liver...I mean, if it is STILL working to this day, it has to be superhuman.

God I hope he donates his body to science when he does someday, finally go. Whatever genes he has for survival need to be studied and learned from.

Lord, if we started a stem cell line from him now, we could likely have almost immortality for most of the earth!!

Re:Fortunately for Jobs

[imikem]

If I recall correctly, Steve Jobs was diagnosed with a less-common, and somewhat less deadly form of pancreatic cancer, which partly explains his longer survival. It also makes his choice of "treatment" more puzzling and tragic.

Re:Jobs didn't promote the cause of organ donation

[i kan reed]

As someone who respects Gates' post-wealth philanthropy, finds Apple products to be over-marketed while uninteresting technically, and loves poetic justice:

I don't think you can expect every human being in society to be personally responsible for every kind of problem that exists. There's just not enough time in your life.

Had he not waited. . .

[smooth wombat]

until the last second to begin real treatment, things might have turned out better.

Instead, Jobs abandoned common sense and reason in favor of hocus pocus, "alternative" crap which did absolutely nothing to help his condition and may in fact have contributed to its severity.

There's a reason real medicines are tested and "alternative medicine" isn't. If they weren't alternative, they would be listed as medicine, used every day and give tangible results.

Re:Had he not waited. . .

[kimvette]

FWIW there are plenty of herbs which do work for specific ailments or enhance certain bodily functions, but unfortunately the real benefits of a handful of herbs are associated with a whole lot of bullcrap and hype such as homeopathy (where it is claimed a "molecular imprint" becomes stronger/more effective the more you dilute it, such that there may not even be any of the specified compount present in the vial), and is also associated with the likes of anti-vaxxers.

The biggest problem with herbal remedies is there are few scientific studies done to back up the claims, and most of the herbal remedy vendors of course are probably very disinterested in backing such studies, and the homeopathy vendors (the makers of those little vials which have "30x"/"60x"/"240x"/etc. numbers on them) know what they're selling is false hope/snake oil/bullshit so they certainly would not back formalized peer-reviewed studies.

But, there are herbs (garlic for example) which can help fight certain sicknesses and lower cholesterol, herbs (ginseng) which can tweak your metabolic rate, herbs (cannabis, chaparral, milk thistle, and others) which help fight cancer (NOT as a primary treatment but in addition to chemotherapy, cyberknife/radiation, etc), herbs which can increase lactation (goats' rue, fenugreek, anise, blessed thistle, fennel), and so on. But trying to sort out the legitimate from the nonsense is difficult at best due to the lack of formalized studies; one only has anecdotes to go by.

To rely only on herbal remedies was indeed foolish in Jobs' case. As it is only 20% last beyond one year with treatment. Last week I lost a friend to pancreatic cancer - he did herbals in conjunction with chemo and lasted four and a half years after diagnosis (his prognosis was 3 months when diagnosed). He improved for a bit, then got much worse when he decided he had enough and quit all treatments (western medicine and herbal, including cannabis), then got back on after it metastasized, and then from there it was a rapid progression of the cancer.

Pancreatic cancer is no joke - people like Steve Jobs (Apple Computer), Richard Wright (Pink Floyd), Luciano Pavarotti (Operatic tenor), Patrick Swayze (actor) all go to prove that all the money in the world can't save you.

I lost two friends to pancreatic cancer in the last year in a half and in both cases it was partly their fault for getting false hope and quitting treatments when their tumors were down to "almost" nothing. Please don't screw around with herbals or at minimum don't rely on just herbals - see an oncologist and maybe, just maybe you'll be among the 4% that beat it. I will always wonder if my friends could have ultimately beaten it.

Ultimately the best treatment is risk management: don't smoke, manage stress properly, eat few to no processed foods, don't overload on refined carbs, and get plenty of exercise. Preventive measures are free and far more effective than any treatment after the fact but even then it doesn't guarantee you won't get stricken with it.

Re:Had he not waited. . .

[Anubis IV]

So, it's worth noting that the liver transplant being discussed in the summary was a success and he went on to be CEO again for the next few years, overseeing the launch of the iPad and iCloud (which it sounded like he had some major high hopes for, but which has so far come up remarkably short). He later died of pancreatic cancer, and you're quite right about him not seeking proper treatment in time.

Re:Had he not waited. . .

[chihowa]

This seems to be a common failing among people who are good at manipulating other people into doing what they want. They conflate the ability to direct other people into fulfilling their wishes with the ability to make things happen by force of will (not realizing that their "power" only applies to things that people can actually change). It's probably confounded by the legions of yes-men who surround these people and further distance them from reality.

Re:Had he not waited. . .

[Assmasher]

I agree; however, I don't think it's always a case of "yes-men" because people like Jobs can be very persuasive - although I'll admit that this type of behavior results in something equivalent to the "yes-men" syndrome. Hell, it's the basis of Scientology. People are often more than happy to be sheep, it takes the weight of responsibility off their shoulders.

Re:Had he not waited. . .

[tverbeek]

He fell victim to his own reality distortion field.

Re:Had he not waited. . .

[the eric conspiracy]

One thing to be aware of is that there is more than one type of pancreatic cancer. The most common type (95%) is very aggressive and by the time it is detected in most people it is too late. 5 year survival of stage 1 cases is only 12%.

The other type (5%) creates slow growing or even benign (neuroendocrine) tumors. This is what Steve Jobs had. 5-year survival of stage 1 cases is 61%.

Steve Jobs delayed treatment by going off on alternative medicine until the cancer advanced to stage IV. At that point survival rates are 15% or so.

Basically Steve committed misguided suicide. Who ever advised him in this foolish escapade should be in jail.

Re:Had he not waited. . .

[squiggleslash]

Nobody's saying that there aren't herbs that can't help. Asprin is found in a variety of natural sources. But here's the thing, the reason why Asprin isn't an "alternative medicine" is simply this: it's been subject to some double blind tests, and found to work.

That's it. That's all. The moment a mix of freshly squeezed orange juice, oregano, and that cheese-like substance you found under your toaster, gets tested (and found to work) against specific ailments it ceases to be an alternative medicine.

Re:Had he not waited. . .

[TheCarp]

> Steve Jobs would likely be alive today if he had undergone treatment by modern scientific medicine
> instead of woo bullshit.

so we should put that in the Pro-herbs collumn then?

Re:Had he not waited. . .

[LordLimecat]

Making bad decisions and giving bad advice is not and should not be a crime, unless you are a practicing doctor or lawyer.

Jobs made his own decisions, theres no need to blame someone else as if he was not a grown man capable of doing all of the necessary research. For whatever reason people today have a really tough time with the idea of "personal responsibility"; Jobs had a responsibility to consult with medical professionals and make good decisions about his health.

Jobs DID promote the cause of organ donation

[Anonymous Coward]

How clueless you are.
He did indeed promote organ donations. Actively.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BhKzyAoiTJE

http://www.tuaw.com/2010/03/19/steve-jobs-helps-push-organ-donation-legislation/

http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-news/ci_14710654

http://www.forbes.com/sites/velocity/2010/04/20/how-steve-jobs-got-sick-got-better-and-decided-to-save-some-lives/

Need more evidence?

Re: Jobs DID promote the cause of organ donation

[Anonymous Coward]

He promoted it in the very public keynote while introducing new iProducts. How much more public should it be??? His Cali law endorsement was also all over the country in the newspapers. Again, it couldn't be more public.

It's YOUR fault, not his, that you haven't taken notice.
It was not his obligation to personally call you to inform you about the donation law promotion.

Re:Just natural selection weeding out the stupid

[ericloewe]

"Sometimes" is a bit too often for my taste.

Now, if we could open a "Drunk Car Racing Track", I'd be all for it.

Re:Jobs didn't promote the cause of organ donation

[tbuddy]

Other than the $52 million to hospitals. He promoted organ donation heavily after receiving his much like Michael J Fox did with Parkinson's and Christopher Reeve did paralysis.

March liver season

[srussia]

Sure, the quantity is great, but the quality not so much...

Irony?

[linear a]

Wouldn't you expect St. Patrick's day to *reduce* the overall number of livers available.

Re:Jobs is rich - why not do a deal for an organ?

[plopez]

Great Free Market solution! If you hadn't posted anonymously I would have given you the "Obvious Simple Common Sense Libertarian Post" Award. It is people like you who made America what it is today!

Re:Jobs didn't promote the cause of organ donation

[bitt3n]

Christopher Reeve did paralysis.

Christopher Reeve didn't so much as raise a finger to promote awareness of his condition.

Just make organ donation the default

[dwheeler]

One big improvement would be to make organ donation the *default* when obtaining a driver's license in the US. That way, people could opt out, but most people just "accept the default"... and then far more organs would be available to save the living.

Re:Just make organ donation the default

[bill_mcgonigle]

It's not cool to assume that you have a property right in somebody else's body if they don't object, but the same ends could be achieved by giving priority to organ donors and their dependents based on years on the organ donor list. We already do this for living donors.

The ultimate problem is that such competing systems can't be put into place, even to test them - the high priests of the medical cartel tell us what they think is the best system this season and everybody else has to follow it or face being caged for going against the gods (err, surgeons - even they make the same mistake).