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Our Education System Is Failing IT

Nemo the Magnificent (2786867) writes "In this guy's opinion most IT workers can't think critically. They are incapable of diagnosing a problem, developing a possible solution, and implementing it. They also have little fundamental understanding of the businesses their employers are in, which is starting to get limiting as silos are collapsing within some corporations and IT workers are being called upon to participate in broader aspects of the business. Is that what you see where you are?"

16 of 306 comments (clear)

  1. Heck yes... by Zelig · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Most of the folks in IT are Operators of Interfaces.

    1. Re:Heck yes... by beheaderaswp · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I think I agree with you. My first IT related job was transcribing sheet music into basic music code back in 1984.

      Since that time I've seen the intellectual capacity of IT workers drop consistently- while their arrogance has increased. It's a function of the field expanding so fast... in order to man departments you have to compromise on quality by hiring for specialties. Also there's the problem of industry certifications. They are not at face value bad... but those with real skills know that the certification is more or less a learning permit- while management considers it a qualification.

      In my day (I'm a year or two from 50) people made their way in IT based on ability. That was the catalyst for the entire industry. It is what built silicon valley and the economic ripples it created.

      The way I see it, we've gone from recruiting people who loved computers and played with them on their own, to hiring people who shop for a career in their educational choices. That's a path to mediocrity. Always has been- always will be.

      --
      Another consultant who stuck it out.

      "We are the Priests, of the Temples of Syrinx..."
    2. Re:Heck yes... by gweihir · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Indeed. There are rare islands of skill and competence, and you always find that in them, people care and actually like working with technology. But most people that go into IT today do not have what it takes and should have stayed away.

      --
      Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
    3. Re:Heck yes... by geminidomino · · Score: 5, Informative

      In my day (I'm a year or two from 50) people made their way in IT based on ability. That was the catalyst for the entire industry. It is what built silicon valley and the economic ripples it created.

      Things weren't a whole lot better then. Sturgeon's law still applies, it's just that IT as an industry has vastly expanded so that 90% is a much larger raw number now.

      Remember about the old joke about the Evil Empire, before Microsoft took the epithet?

      How do you spot an IBM field tech with a flat tire?
      He's the one on the side of the road, changing all four tires to see which one's flat.

      How do you spot an IBM field tech that ran out of gas?
      He's the one on the side of the road, changing all four tires to see which one's flat.

  2. education doesn't work by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Most people think critical thinking is something that "haters" do.

  3. It is just so horrible by Billly+Gates · · Score: 4, Funny

    So horrible that hardly any of the European or American young IT workers are qualified.

    Too bad there was not some way we could get around this problem. You know perhaps get around this and maybe save some money too hmm.

    Just think about how horrible it would be if CIO's and MBAs wrote such an article and published in a well known magazine that they could give to EU politicians and senators on something that needs to be done RIGHT AWAY!

     

    1. Re:It is just so horrible by AK+Marc · · Score: 5, Insightful

      It's not about the Americans being not "qualified" but that a E/CE/CS degree is irrelevant to IT. IT is, in the most general sense, best served by a logic and philosophy/psychology degree. Every problem is solved by a binary decision tree.

      "The computer isn't working." Well, that's hardware or software. If hardware, it's an internal or external fault. If internal, it's a part failure or install failure. If part, replace part. If install, re-seat hardware. Most any problem is a set of questions, each one narrowing down the choices, until the answer is found. The ability to break down problems like that is logic. Knowing what to ask and how to respond is generaly from experience. Dealing with the people that are experiencing the problem, or designing something for them to use is a "soft" skill that a psychology or other "soft" degree might help best with.

      There isn't a good education for IT. It's never been addressed. The few places that teach "IT" generally teach to some specific certification tests, and nothing about how to apply it.

    2. Re:It is just so horrible by Billly+Gates · · Score: 5, Funny

      That can't be true.

      According to HR pc techs need calculus skills as we do differential equations all day and work in polynomial time when working with tickets.

  4. oh by Charliemopps · · Score: 4, Informative

    This is what happens when your field turns from a niche specialist thing where only experts will have a chance to get in... into a field where they're selling degrees during commercial breaks for Jerry Springer. You want the smarts ones, you need to pay for them.

    1. Re:oh by Billly+Gates · · Score: 4, Interesting

      You can. In India.

      The fact that MBAs and CIOs are the ones whining make me always suspicious who of course get quoted in all these articles and probably contribute to them. How convenient this propaganda can now be used and passed around to politicians to increase H1B1 visas as a response.

      Sadly many with years of experience now can be as good if not better than the native ones anyway so go cheap.

    2. Re:oh by kaladorn · · Score: 5, Informative

      I, on the other hand, have had a mixed experience with Indian workers.

      I worked on one team with 3 of them. One was female, the other two male. One of the males had a good business head and presentation and passable technical skills. The other fellow was out of his depth and was compensating by trying to talk over everyone. The gal was the smartest of the lot and new her stuff (the QC side of things) better than either of the male devs, but their cultural propensity to just marginalize or ignore the female (or try to speak for her) meant the best way to let her excel was to arrange interactions with her that did not involve the two indian males.

      On another project I worked on, offshoring a code base for a major US Telco, I will tell you that there were some smart devs (they got what I was presenting) and there were others who struggled and I don't think ever did fathom the complex code.

      Frankly, the Russians I worked with were better as far as offshore resources go - thorough, smart, logical, didn't try to claim what they didn't actually know and figured out a lot of things as required (and did a good job of being thorough).

      I think the only two objections I have overall (as a generalization) to Indian workers are a) tendency to be patriarchal and not listen to and respect females and b) a tendency to say yes to everything when it comes to 'can you do X by time Y?' even if the thing they are agreeing to do is well beyond them. They can't seem to say no or it'll take longer. Everything is yes. We learned that we could not depend on any time estimates and routinely doubled their estimates and sometimes even then had to get in and solve the problems ourselves.

      Any group of devs is going to reflect the amount and nature of their education and their cultural perspectives. Being Canadian, I've had some good fortune to work in very diverse settings with many cultural groups and nationalities. As long as you know who you are dealing with and allow for that, you can work well together.

      In the case of IT work, the skillset required for broader business aspects of that field require a broad knowledge of many technologies, a broad knowledge of business practices, and the business to treat the IT staff less like a cost center and more like a critical piece of infrastructure - provide training, support sufficient time for projects and manpower resources, and to generally not try to get the IT staff to be responsible for everything, all of the time, in all respects, with few or no resources. That's the most common failing in IT departments - how companies see them as an expense and try to minimize that to the detriment of employee quality and their overall business in the long run.

      --
      -- Mal: "Well they tell you: never hit a man with a closed fist. But it is, on occasion, hilarious."
  5. "Get off my lawn" by redmid17 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Is Slashdot linking to Bennett Haselton's dad now?
    If the IT sector were really that devoid of workers with an iota of critical thinking ability, the entire state of IT in the country would be in shambles. Now he does have some valid complaints (ie plenty of Cert WIZARDS!), but the entire article is one giant strawman he constructed. I don't think IT (or at least non H1Bs) is any worse off than any other sector of the US job market. This strikes me as a case of "this new generation sucks a lot" which we roll through every 20 years or so. The WW2 generation said the same thing about the Boomers and Gen X.

    The first track consisted of self-motivated high school and college students who taught themselves the necessary PC skills to get a job, sometimes before graduation. The second was the trade school, which produced droves of "certified" 20-somethings ripe for the picking in the rapidly growing IT field.

    My mileage will vary from most of the people here, but these two sectors make up a small minority of what I've encountered. The first "track" is essentially career service desk folk. They don't really need to think super critically. They aren't paid enough to. The ones who are very good at it end up as Tier-2 or Tier-3 support. They do triage work and respond to critical incidents. They need to know how to diagnose problems and think critically. The second track definitely exists. I've met them. I haven't seen them actively employed for the most part, and those that were employed didn't remain for long.

    The circle jerk in the comments section is pretty hilarious too.

  6. How about employers failing? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful
    Or is anything that costs a penny over a minimum wage too much? What happened to an employer investing as much time into an employee as the employee invests of his own free time? We learn plenty on our own dime just to keep up with the insane fashions in IT, why can't the employer put aside a few hours a month to show us simple IT folk what's going on?

    But I guess we're cheaper if we're terrified, eh?

  7. Outsourcing kills experience by slayer991 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    It isn't education, it's the lack of experience. We've outsourced so many of the entry level jobs, where are the young people supposed to learn? That's the real cost of outsourcing...without an entry-level position and ability to learn how to troubleshoot, there's no place for kids to learn how to do their jobs. Most of the really good systems engineers I know started on the help desk, worked desk-side support and then did infrastructure support (servers/network/storage/security). They understand that their jobs still come down to delivery of solutions to the end-user. They understand that the end-user doesn't care what backend BS broke, it's just that they can't do their job. We're missing that at the mid-level...and most of the really great infrastructure people are in their 40's now.

    1. Re:Outsourcing kills experience by khallow · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It's more than just outsourcing. Most of those young people haven't worked at anything before they enter college and a lot of them don't start working till after they leave college. Going well into your adult life without actually holding any job (even one outside of IT) is pretty destructive just on its own.

  8. Re:Tempora mutantur, nos et mutamur in illis by beheaderaswp · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I more or less agree with your assessment (but I'll eventually disagree ha ha!). My formal education was in music performance. However my hobbies were (and are) computer science, amateur radio, physics and theology. Yes I'm an autodidact. But have studied at two major universities.

    In the realm of critical thinking... a deep theoretical understanding is priceless. Because theory is flexible. But more important in my mind is an understanding of the RFCs behind how all this stuff works. Know them, and you can really troubleshoot. Know them, and you get to be the "pro from Dover" when no other tech can solve a problem.

    With a mass of knowledge- comes the possibility of thinking critically. This is of course assuming the person in question has a mind big enough to form quality theories of their own. The problem isn't always education... it's also quality of the brain. And the larger a field grows, the lower the mean IQ of it's members.

    To illustrate:

    I once watched a recent computer science graduate (A Truly Dubious and Short Lived IT Director) introduce a recursive loop into an Ethernet network, on an unswitched segment, which resulted in (you guessed it) significant portions of an 18 building WAN/LAN system to simply go offline. Explaining to this person why things didn't work was useless. They thought they were an expert (because of the degree). Sadly, all of the information they spouted about the problem was completely correct- except the application of that information.

    You can't really teach people how to apply information, if they cannot build working models which closely match reality. Sure.. anyone can come up with an idea and call it a theory. But can you come up with a theory that works?

    So in a sense, I fall back once again to the idea that the talent pool is diluted. At the same time, the equipment is becoming more and more appliance packaged.

    My solution? I'm looking around for something different to do for the next 30 years. If I can get up to speed fast enough, I'll participate in AMSAT. I'll go back to performing music. Maybe even get a physics degree.

    But I'll be free to be excellent.

    --
    Another consultant who stuck it out.

    "We are the Priests, of the Temples of Syrinx..."