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BMW Unveils the Solar Charging Carport of the Future

cartechboy (2660665) writes "The carport hasn't changed much over the years. Made out of wood, aluminum or steel, they are simple structures meant to cover your vehicle from the elements. BMW has just revealed a concept carport that takes these structures into the future. Made out of bamboo and carbon fiber, this concept carport features solar panels that harvest the sun's energy and use it to charge your BMW i-vehicle. "With the solar carport concept we opted for a holistic approach: not only is the vehicle itself sustainable, but so is its energy supply," explained Tom Allemann of BMW Designworks USA. "This is therefore an entirely new generation of carports that allows energy to be produced in a simple and transparent way. It renders the overarching theme of lightweight design both visible and palpable." The entire thing is quite beautiful, and could be the way to make not only charging your electric car sustainable, but also building your carport."

31 of 165 comments (clear)

  1. How long? by SpaghettiPattern · · Score: 2

    How long would it take to charge your car with a 15ft x 20ft panel? Hours? Days? Weeks?

    (Is it just me or does BMW make an incredible effort at failing to design pretty cars?)

    --

    I hadn't the slightest objection to his spending his time planning massacres for the bourgeoisie... (P.G. Wodehouse)
    1. Re:How long? by Calinous · · Score: 2

      Assuming a slanted roof (oriented to south), you'd get at most 3500W from the device. In an 8-hour day, with some 60% total efficiency, you'd get some 17 kWh. That would be enough for the i3 I think.
            This thing would be advantageous if it would keep the car in the shade during summer, and clear of snow in the winter. A garage would be better, though. And maybe setting the solar panels on the house is either too expensive, impossible, ...

    2. Re:How long? by Firethorn · · Score: 2

      It looks to be using 24 panels in a 6x4 configuration.

      'Standard' 250W panels are 40"x65", giving my 20'x22', so 'close enough', especially if you slant it a bit.

      Assuming ideal, that's 6kw. More realistically 3kw in most areas, about 43kwh per day. About 129 miles of electricity at 3 miles per kwh.

      --
      I don't read AC A human right
    3. Re:How long? by AmiMoJo · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The point is not to rely on solar for charging exclusively, the point is to add some up-front cost in exchange for a lower running cost. You are spending tends of thousands on the car port, perhaps with a dedicated high speed charger, so you might as well throw in a little more and harvest all that free sunshine too.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    4. Re:How long? by donaldm · · Score: 3, Insightful

      It looks to be using 24 panels in a 6x4 configuration.

      'Standard' 250W panels are 40"x65", giving my 20'x22', so 'close enough', especially if you slant it a bit.

      Assuming ideal, that's 6kw. More realistically 3kw in most areas, about 43kwh per day. About 129 miles of electricity at 3 miles per kwh.

      Sounds good on paper, however unless the person who uses this is a night worker the whole array is pretty much next to useless since most day workers would have taken their electric car to work and only return to park under their now non functioning solar car port once the sun has gone down. Of course if we consider the weekend the electric car could be recharged during the day unless the driver has decided to take the car to say a shopping centre. So I think I would be fairly confident to say that with regard to recharging the electric car most of the charging would actually be from the mains.

      Instead of spending money on a car port just to power their car it is more practical to feed the solar power back to the grid and/or powering devices that require power during the day. This is not to say that the car port is a waste of money but like anything that is solar powered some thought is required on the best use of the device.

      --
      There ain't no such thing as proprietary standards only proprietary formats. Standards are by definition open.
    5. Re:How long? by RabidReindeer · · Score: 2

      I'm reasonably certain that the carport solar cells don't jack directly into the car. Solar input fluctuates too much, so at a minimum, you'd need charge controllers. Most likely, also fixed batteries, to allow for the fact that people are more likely to be away from home when the sun is out.

      I still like the idea, though. Even if it wasn't a 100% solution, it reduces overall grid requirements. Plus it takes energy that would otherwise either heat up the carport or reflect into the greenhouse and put it to practical use.

    6. Re:How long? by AmiMoJo · · Score: 2

      Even if the owner doesn't use that energy to charge their car they can feed it back into the grid to offset what they take out at night. might even get feed-in tariff. Alternatively it could be a business buying the PV to reduce its energy costs and provide a nice perk to employees.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    7. Re:How long? by CrimsonAvenger · · Score: 4, Insightful

      This thing would be advantageous if it would keep the car in the shade during summer, and clear of snow in the winter. A garage would be better, though.

      This thing would only be advantageous if your electric car spent its daylight hours at your house.

      In other words, largely unused. Most of us drive to work in the daytime, drive home in the evening, and our car stays home (with us) overnight. Not as much sunlight as you might expect at night....

      --

      "I do not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"
    8. Re:How long? by jklovanc · · Score: 2

      I know it's a crappy deal because the electricity you sell back is somehow worth much less than the electricity you use,

      It is worth less because someone has to pay for the infrastructure to transmit that electricity around and the backup capacity that would kick in on cloudy days. When you buy electricity you are not just purchasing electron but the all the infrastructure to support making sure you always get what you want. Energy produces sell at a wholesale price which is much lower than the retail price. People who sell to the grid at a lower price than they buy from are just being treated like any other electricity producer.

    9. Re:How long? by dj245 · · Score: 2

      This thing would be advantageous if it would keep the car in the shade during summer, and clear of snow in the winter. A garage would be better, though.

      This thing would only be advantageous if your electric car spent its daylight hours at your house.

      In other words, largely unused. Most of us drive to work in the daytime, drive home in the evening, and our car stays home (with us) overnight. Not as much sunlight as you might expect at night....

      Another poster came up with a figure of 30kW-hr per day input to the car (considering efficiency and hours of sun, etc). In my area, that's worth about $3.6 per day. I have 52 weekends off per year, plus 11 company holidays, and 15 days vacation. If my car sits at home for 1/2 of those days, that's 65 days of charging or $234. I would consider a payback period of 5 years to be a reasonable investment for car-related equipment, so for me, the maximum the device could cost is $1170 in order to be a worthwhile investment (ignoring time value of money). I doubt the price will be so low. Even if the BMW is the "commute car" and I use a different car on weekends/holidays (BMW always parked at home when not working), the benefit is only $2340 over 5 years.

      However, a lot of people are retired, or stay at home mom/dads, or work from home. For them, it could make a LOT of sense. The US labor force is only roughly 1/2 of the population. Although many people not in the labor force would not be in the market for a BMW, the market is still probably very large.

      --
      Even those who arrange and design shrubberies are under considerable economic stress at this period in history.
    10. Re:How long? by mythosaz · · Score: 2

      It's less than that. The BMW i3 has a 22 kWh battery, and only under the most deal circumstances are you ever going to charge the whole battery every day, which will at most be about $2/day.

      More realistically, my Leaf, which we drive more than the national average - and which has a battery size and MPGe almost identical to the current BMW i3 - uses about $25/mo in electricity, which you could presumably charge using this system if things went well.

      [Or, you could offset residential electricity to the same $25, since your total used electricity is mostly fungible.]

      Amway, that's $300/year max.

  2. Cute but somewhat pointless... by JaredOfEuropa · · Score: 2

    ..., a qualification which usually applies to "concepts". It's a nice idea to charge your car using solar panels, but if you're commuting, your car will not be sitting in that car port during the most sunny hours of the day. Besides, you can put those solar panels anywhere; choose the most efficient spot, which isn't necessarily the carport roof. Also: simply laying down solar panels on a flat roof is inefficient; you'll want to mount them at a 30 or so degree angle facing south.

    --
    If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
    1. Re:Cute but somewhat pointless... by KingOfBLASH · · Score: 2

      While it does have some kinks to work out, consider:

      1. While those working at the equator will indeed have the car at home when it's mostly dark out, a sizeable population of those well-to-do enough to afford cars live far enough north (or south) of the equator that their car will be home for quite a number of daylight hours.

      2. Quite a number of people work from home these days. In this instance you WOULD be home the hours you're working.

      3. Of those not working from home, a large portion are business owners or work in a small company where you might decide to install your carport at work, and be able to do that.

      4. Companies offer company cars to some employees, why not add a carport to the work parking lot?

      5. Big companies like Apple just LOVE environmental initiatives, if this became big, you'd have them rolling these out on campus (I'll leave for another discussion whether it's out of altruism or PR concerns or...?).

      6. The key point is cost savings. If people save enough money with this, companies would install these and RENT them to their emplyees. Let's say you save $20 / gas a week, and these things last for 10 years before breaking down. That's $10k in saved money by employees. If they are cheap enough, say $5k an installation, you have a situation where the employer could rent them back to employees.

      7. (In relation to point 6) Gas prices only go up, and technology only gets better. If it doesn't make financial sense now for some, it probably will in the future (and this is something that will take years to roll out anyways).

      8. (In relation to point 6 & 7) Your costs are not everyone's costs. For instance, when I drove in Europe gas costs for me were $200+ a week commuting (even though I was relatively close, due to very high gas prices). At that rate, our earlier calculation would be a savings of $100k over a 10 year period. If my employer won't rent me one, I'm sure I can find saavy business owners around the block to come to an agreement for rental of space for an installation. Sign me up!

      I could go on, but I hope I've made my point. :D

  3. Read the fine print by Firethorn · · Score: 2

    If you read the fine print, it's a grid-tie system, it feeds the electricity to the house/grid for net metering if a car isn't sucking down all it can provide and more.

    Anyway, is "functional art" mean to be a euphemism for "ugly as sin"?

    It's also not to my taste, but I can see somebody liking it. It has more 'soul' than conventional painted beams would.

    --
    I don't read AC A human right
  4. Math check by Firethorn · · Score: 4, Informative

    Double checked my math. More like 22 kwh, or 66 miles worth of electricity a day.

    --
    I don't read AC A human right
    1. Re:Math check by Kokuyo · · Score: 2

      According to a technical sheet I just googled, this BMW has a 18.8 kWh battery... so those 10 kWh are more than half a "tank".

      Considering that solar panels aren't high maintenance (I believe?), one could argue that it's a step in a good direction.

    2. Re:Math check by Mr+D+from+63 · · Score: 2

      22kWh/day really is your best case scenario.

      6.8kWh/(m.day) in Arizona on a tilted plane gives you about 2500kWh/(m.y) With a performance ratio of 90% for your PV installation, you can get 2250kWh/(kWp.y) of electricity.

      Your answer is about in the right ballpark, but the method is in error. The chart which shows up to 6.8kWh/m2/day (for SE US) reflects actual solar energy, not electrical. Solar cell conversion efficiency is about 20%, resulting in about 1.36 kWh electric/m2/day. Considering the 6.8 is really that max possible, and there are electrical losses through the inverter, you could expect about 1 kwh-e/m2 If the panel area is 440f2=40m2, you could get as much as 40 Kwh-e/day. That is a generously high number. If you start with a more realistic 5.8kWh/m2/day and less than optimal conversion efficiency, the result is closer to 35 Kwh-e/day.

      If you assume the setup is made of 24 x 250W panels, that's 6KW capacity. Assuming 5 equivalent "full sun" hours per day average (a generous number), you can get about 30KWh-e. I'd go with 30Kwh-e/day. One could easily come up with a much loser estimate if one wanted to be conservative in that direction.

    3. Re:Math check by BlackPignouf · · Score: 3, Informative

      My method is just fine, thank you very much. I happen to work at a german research center on solar energy.

      The performance ratio takes all losses in consideration (cable, MPP, inverter, shadowing,...) and isn't dependent on either the area (which is 27m2 for this carport, BTW) or the efficiency (about 15% for this carport).

      With the performance ratio, you can convert solar irradiance (in kWh/m2.year) directly into specific yield (in kWh/kWp.year).
      This carport has 3.6kWp capacity, and seems to be developed by Solarwatt.

    4. Re:Math check by BlackPignouf · · Score: 3, Informative

      Take a look at the units for solar irradiance and specific yield.
      They are *not* the same.
      The 20% cell efficiency (or anything between 0.05 and 0.44) is included in the conversion between m2 and kWp : e.g. you need 5m2 of PV modules at 20% for 1kWp.
      Performance ratio and cell efficiency are different notions. Performance ratio can theoretically be higher than 100%.
      http://www.photon.info/photon_...

    5. Re:Math check by BlackPignouf · · Score: 3, Informative

      Sorry if I wasn't clear.
      I don't need to assume *any* cell efficiency, since this information is irrelevant.
      The only needed information to calculate the energy yield are :
      *) Solar irradiance
      *) Nominal power
      *) Performance ratio

      Two 3.6kWp pv installations will produce the same energy yield for a given performance ratio, independently of their cell efficiency (i.e. size).

  5. Beautiful? by Hypotensive · · Score: 2

    I suppose beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but to this beholder it looks like something that would drive property values down, not up.

    1. Re:Beautiful? by Lumpy · · Score: 4, Funny

      Spoken like a true BMW owner.

      --
      Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
  6. Good idea... with still a missing link by geogob · · Score: 3, Insightful

    As I am currently looking into buying an electrical car, I was considering doing (almost) exactly this : Installing solar cells on the roof of the house to charge the car. It wouldn't even take that much solar cells; 20 square meters would charge the car in a reasonable amount of time. Free energy, right?

    While considering the idea, a fundamental problem stuck me: Most of the time when the Sun shines, the car isn't parked at home. It is either parked in front of my office or, when I'm not working, I'm driving somewhere else, enjoying the Sun that could have charged my car. The solution to this issue was to add batteries to the concept, in order to store the Suns energy as I am away and transfer this energy back to the car at night when I am home.

    Considering the car has a capacity exceeding 20 kWh, the battery solutions becomes extremely expensive - as expensive as the car itself actually (if not more). Without the battery, it's a nice expensive systems that will produce a lot of power when I don't need it. It's always possible to sell back the excess power to the utilities, but you get a loss let out of it this way and it makes your life quite complicated.

    Forgetting this fundamental limitation, after doing a lot of calculation, it turned out that it would take over 20 years to amortize; and I doubt the battery system would last 20 years under the kind of stress it would be put too (nearly daily full deep cycles). And this is assuming the normal electricity prices. In fact, the charge stations are highly subsidized and your are basically paying the price large industry would pay for electricity. Suddenly your amortization period goes up over 40 years.

    It's not (yet) worth it, although the technology is actually there and ready.

    Conclusion : Power accumulation solution in the 20 - 40 kWh range are too expensive and power is too cheap.

    1. Re:Good idea... with still a missing link by Lumpy · · Score: 3, Insightful

      So hook the solar cells into a syncing inverter and drive your electricity meter backwards. Use the power company as your battery.

      --
      Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
  7. I was curious how big this would have to be by Solandri · · Score: 2

    A typical sedan gets about 30 mpg. Figure the average car travels 15000 miles in a year, or 41 miles per day on average. That means it burns 1.37 gallons of gas each day.

    A gallon of gas has about 120 MJ. Gasoline engines are about 25% efficient, so the 1.37 gallons of gas consumed represents 123.3 MJ lost as heat, and about 41 MJ of energy used to push the car each day.

    Charging a battery is about 75%-85% efficient; call it 80%. Realistically you'd need another battery to sit at the carport charging (leaving the car parked there all day to charge means you can't drive it). This battery would also help even out the cloudy days with the sunny days. So since you're charging from battery-to-battery, you're hitting this 80% efficiency loss twice. Electric motors are about 90% efficient (that's peak, but then so is the 25% efficiency for an ICE). So for an EV to put 41 MJ into pushing the car, it needs 41/(.8*.8*.9) = 71.2 MJ sent to the carport's battery.

    PV panels generate about 150 W/m^2 peak. Multiply by the average capacity factor for the U.S. of 0.145 to get 22 W/m^2 on average. Multiply by 24 hours and you get 1.9 MJ/m^2 per day.

    So to charge your typical sedan EV entirely with solar power to drive it 41 miles per day, your carport would need 71.2/1.9 = 37.5 square meters of solar panels. Or 404 square feet for those in the U.S. That's a mighty big carport.

    1. Re:I was curious how big this would have to be by fche · · Score: 2

      "Multiply by 24 hours and you get 1.9 MJ/m^2 per day."

      You can multiply it with any number you like, but you won't get much sunshine at night.

  8. Will never work.... by Lumpy · · Score: 2

    As if a BMW owner will live in a place with a "car port" and not a garage.

    No the 20 something working at walmart that is driving the beat up 325i does not count.

    --
    Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
    1. Re:Will never work.... by MrMarkie · · Score: 2

      I hate to burst your bubble but I'm a BMW owner who doesn't own a garage and my car is not of the beat up variety.
      It's not like a BMW is that expensive anyway.

      --
      /M
  9. Something I've often wondered by necro81 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I spent a few months living in Arizona some years back. I lived in an apartment complex where most of the space between the buildings was the carpark. The most coveted spaces were the ones that had a sort of awning or overhang, so that the car was out of direct sunlight. It made a huge difference in how hot the car got.

    As an engineer, seeing this vast swath of paved-over space (more than an acre all told), some of which was itself covered with structures specifically intended to block the sun, I thought to myself: why in the hell don't they just cover the entire carpark, and cover it with solar panels, to boot? The complex could advertise itself as having all-shaded parking (and commensurate higher rent) and reduce its net electricity consumption. In sunny Arizona, such a project could have paid for itself in less than a decade; today, the economics are even more favorable.

    My question is: why isn't this (grid-tied, solar panel-shaded parking lots) done by every piece of commercial real estate in sunny climes? You make greater use of a resource (land area), the tenants' cars end up cooler (you can charge higher rent for that), it has a more or less guaranteed return in a reasonable time span, and reduces operating expenses (lowered electric bills). See, for instance, the western parking lot at the Googleplex headquarters. Why isn't this done everywhere?

  10. Re:yea by GameboyRMH · · Score: 2

    Google's bus system works better because it runs on a monster budget compared to public transit. Not because it's more clever or efficient. They're just willing to dump healthy sums of money into giving their employees a ride to work, because they have so much money they don't really know what to do with it (which is why they came up with Google X labs way back when - to find new things to do with the money).

    --
    "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
  11. Re:Battery Swapping by mythosaz · · Score: 2

    I'm pretty dumb. Can you come help me do the oil and coolant change in my Leaf?