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New Toyota Helps You Yell At the Kids
An anonymous reader writes If you're tired of yelling at the kids without the help of technology, Toyota has a van for you. From the article: "The latest version of the company's Sienna minivan has a feature called 'Driver Easy Speak.' It uses a built-in microphone to amplify a parent's voice through speakers in the back seats. Toyota says it added Easy Speak 'so parents don't have to shout to passengers in the back.' But chances are many parents will yell into the microphone anyway. And the feature only works one way, so the kids can't talk back. At least not with amplified voices. The feature is an option on the 2015 Sienna, which is being refreshed with a totally new interior. It also has an optional 'pull-down conversation mirror' that lets drivers check on kids without turning around."
Off the top of my head: Nissan, Honda, Chrysler, Toyota, Hyundai/Kia.
I have one, and the pickup line at school/camp is almost entirely minivan or minivan "crossovers" marketed as SUVs.
My 2008 Sienna has a "conversation mirror", so I'm not sure why the submitter seems to think they are new.
W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
> ...'pull-down conversation mirror' that lets drivers check on kids without turning around."
Back in the 70's, those mysterious "eyes in the back of the head" that'd always catch you when you were about to yank your sister's pigtails.
This ranks right up there with the dedicated chicken nuggets button on some ovens.
They should implement voice-changing methods. Then you could make your voice super low and booming and be like "THIS IS GOD. STOP FIGHTING."
I agree, it would be more useful the other way around. Turn the van into a "Driver Speak Easy". That would really be helpful to parents.
The minivan suffers a stigma in America today.... It's viewed as a vehicle for moms who need to shuttle the kids and their things around. That hurts sales because even many of the moms who squarely fit into that category don't want to feel like they're defined by that part of their life. They don't want to drive a vehicle around that tells everyone that's what their purpose is on the planet -- especially when so many families are dual-income and they'd like to look more "professional".
It seems it's unavoidable though? As soon as enough people buy a functional alternative to avoid the stigma, they begin putting the same stigma on the alternative choice. Not that long ago, the station wagon held this distinction, and yet now -- driving a station wagon is viewed as trendy in a hipster way!
Honestly though, I think the minivan could enjoy a resurgence in popularity if it was approached from a slightly different angle. Make it *really* easy for all of the seats to fold flat (like "push a button and they all retract into the floor" easy), and market it to the homeowners who currently shop for light trucks! I know I've owned a couple of pickups because they were so darn functional and useful for things like hauling away yard waste or picking up a furniture or appliance purchase, or just helping a buddy move. But their big downside is the lack of any protection from the weather for the cargo, while driving. For 99% of the things I ever hauled around in my truck, I could have used a minivan just as well, if it didn't have seats in the way.
So this is 'news that matters' now? It looks more like astro-turfing for Toyota?
In Japan, Toyota sells a hybrid minivan (the Estima) that uses the Prius drivetrain and is based off the (discontinued in the states) Previa styling:
http://green.autoblog.com/2013/11/07/toyota-estima-hybrid-minivan/
Most of these vans get less than 20-25 MPG, so an offering that gets 40 MPG city (or better) would surely be more compelling than a gimmick megaphone. Hey Toyota, about get your act together and bring your superior automotive technology to the USA instead of this kind of stuff.
My Aunt had a car back in the '50s that had a speed alert buzzer - she'd set it and teld the kids the car could tell when someone was misbehaving - whenever the kids in the back seat started in on each other she'd speed up so it went off. Spooky car that one...
We worked on something just like this years ago (over 10 years ago) at an engineering internship I had at an automotive supplier in Michigan. We had a whole mock-up for an auto show. We put directional microphones in a rear-view mirror and sent the signal through an amplifier to the car speakers. The biggest problem we had to overcome was feedback. It is really hard to amplify someones voice in such a small, enclosed space without horrendous feedback, and feedback at all kinds of audio frequencies. I remember we bought this off-the-shelf commercial feedback killer and mounted it under the dash just for the demo and it even had a hard time killing all the feedback.
While there were 14 manufacturers of minivans 15-20 years ago, there are only five today: Chrysler/Dodge, Honda, Toyota, Kia (with a newly reintroduced Sedona), and Nissan. Still, that's five manufacturers all offering competitive products.
As a father of four minions, I've yet to find an SUV that equals the minivan in its ability to haul six or seven people AND THEIR GEAR in good comfort, all while achieving 25+ mpg. My 2011 Town and Country actually got 27.5 mpg on one tank of gas on a recent 2800 mile trip. My brother's SUV struggles to achieve 18.
Having rented several SUVs on trips, they can seat everybody, but squeezing in the bags is a real challenge.
I sure hope the minivan doesn't disappear. Truly, it is without equal for families up to about 7 people.
Government made them difficult and expensive to buy compared to SUV's, which were classified as trucks (hence a lower gas mileage standard).
"Stigma" had nothing to do with it.
A Darth Vader voice would be more fun for misbehaving kids:
"I find your lack of behaviour disturbing"
"I am your father"
"That was before you misbehaved, now I am altering the deal...pray I do not alter it any further."
"I hope so for your sake, your mother is not as forgiving as I am”
Not good enough... we also traded in the minivan when the kids were a bit older, but our small SUVs only get around 23MPG... I'd traded in my 93 Civic that routinely got over 35MPG, now you don't even get that in a Civic or other small car without it being a hybrid or something... with very few exceptions. I may get a Mazda 3 or 6, though. They get upwards of 35.
I will say this, though, to actually contribute to the conversation about minivans... I had no problem driving one, and felt no stigma about it. All the people buying giant SUVs and justifying it because hey, once or twice a year they may buy a big box item and save on delivery! Or they need to carry a lot of passengers... Our Honda Odyssey carried 7 people a lot more comfortably than any SUV I've been in, and when you needed cargo space it was right up there with the big boys when you folded the rear seat down... even more than a lot of big SUVs; add decent towing capacity and overall better mileage, and the only reason for most people not to get one was the "stigma." Unless you're towing a yacht, or need to go off roading, a good (200hp+) minivan is a much more logical choice.
Stupid sexy Flanders.
... in the art of modern parenting. Finally, the American standard of social discourse, "I'm right because I'm yelling louder", can be brought to the homey confines of the minivan and ingrained on the little darlings early on.
People in cars face forward, in the front I can hear the kids just fine, no problem at all. It really is quite difficult to hear forward facing people in the front from the back. Of course there is a further difference between hearing and listening, but this doesn't sound like the most crazy thing I have ever heard of.
I've rented minivans on business trips (particularly for outdoor field tests of equipment my employer develops). They work very well for our use: surprisingly large cargo capacity in a weather proof bay, flexible reconfiguration to carry either people or equipment between test sites, low floors and true fold-flat seats (compared to many of the SUVs we've rented) making loading easy, car-like handling to suit drivers without large vehicle experience; and wide availability at car rental companies both large and small.
Now, we are talking about renting for a specific purpose for only the duration of that purpose, which is a completely different economic calculation than buying a car for daily use.Nonetheless, I've been convinced that when I do have kids (young children seem to require a frighteningly large amount of support equipment) a minivan will be the way to go. (Certainly compared to an SUV, which would offer similar features in a less convenient shape, or a small car, which lacks cargo.) Of course, this all depends on my finances at that point in time.... I'm not so well off that I can purchase vehicles arbitrarily.
The Odyssey (best selling single model of minivan) has a higher safety rating than almost all SUVs. It gets better gas mileage (28mpg) than almost all SUVs, and absolutely all vehicles with similar passenger capacity (7 or 8 passengers)... Not to mention resale value and reliability rating.
The Minivan is the practical and logical choice... Not to mention, with seats down/out, the cargo capacity is laughably better than an Explorer or other "large" suvs. I can (and have) move a washer and dryer in mine... which is my litmus test for "cargo capacity". (Explorer and Tahoe, which are "large" suvs, cannot fit a washer/dryer, even with all seats folded).
It is fine to hate Minivans, but to pretend they are somehow less practical than an SUV is kind of laughable.
Childbirth is far more dangerous than the risk from any of those things.
W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
I'm sure I saw at least three dozen other commercials last night, anyone want to post an article about those?
The hardest part is multiple kids in car seats, even one rear facing car seat can be difficult to get into many sedans.
Cheap storage VM.
>It gets better gas mileage (28mpg) than almost all SUVs
That isn't very good compared to an SUV (Is that really the best that a minivan can get? I thought there would be at least one outlier that could best an SUV):
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/byclass/Small_SUV_4WD2014.shtml
Those aren't SUVs. They're passenger cars with lift kits installed.
You can't spell "oneiromancy" without "roman".
We have 3 kids in car seats, and an Odyssey.
When we lived in town, it was great. Back then, my only serious gripe with the Odyssey is that if you are running a second set of wheels (e.g. for permanently mounted snow tires), and don't fit a 2nd set of expensive TPMS sensors to those wheels, the VSA (stability control) cannot be defeated via the console switch.
This is a problem because the VSA implementation sucks and is frankly unsafe when accelerating on surface transitions - for instance, when you are waiting on a gravel road and are about to pull onto a paved highway, the VSA system senses differing levels of wheel grip between the wheel on pavement and the wheel still on gravel, and cuts power, precisely when you need maximum power to quickly get to highway speed.
Last fall we moved to a rural area, and now poorly maintained roads (deep snow in the winters until I clear it, deep ruts whenever there are rains) has really shown me the shortcomings of the vehicle. My wife has gotten it stuck 4 times in our first winter.
The Odyssey needs 2 things to be superlative. Air suspension with adjustable ride height (it is a very low vehicle, for ease of entry/exit for small kids), and a proper AWD system.
My wife is now desperately wanting an AWD vehicle. But to get a proper AWD system (e.g. locking transfer case or at least a torsen differential), and the useful seating capacity of a minivan, you need to be looking at full-size truck based SUVs, like the Excursion or Sequoia.
I'm aware that the Sienna comes in an AWD version, but its particular AWD system and ride height doesn't inspire me that they will be foolproof enough to want to make the switch.
Sadly, my wife also refuses to drive a Mercedes G-wagen :)
As an aside, the Odyssey towing capacity isn't really sufficient. It's 3500lbs, and it requires upfitting the vehicle considerably with things that don't come factory - PS cooler, ATF cooler, hitch wiring, etc. (In addition to the actual hitch receiver).
When we were considering camping options, essentially nothing that had enough floor space for a family of 5 could be towed behind an Odyssey.
My opinions are my own, and do not necessarily represent those of my employer.
Among the advantages of owning a minivan is that it becomes easy to carry your own children, plus a few of their friends. You get to know those friends, and listen to your kids' conversations with them. Often, the kids sort of forget you are there and converse "normally". You gain a window into their lives at school you otherwise would never have enjoyed.
Sneaky trick: if you turn on the radio with the fader balanced toward the rear seats, the kids will speak louder without even realizing it.
this is more funny than you know. I have had 2 vasectomies...
It's called 'marriage'.
Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
The planet is overpopulated.
No, the third world is overpopulated. Unless if you live in the third world, I don't see a problem here.
While it is OK to have kids that you can raise, it is just as ok (and serves the greater good) to abstain from having children.
How about telling that to the people in the third world popping out kids faster than they can feed them? Can't they stop having too many kids for the greater good?
Cultural institutions that deride people for remaining childless are completely misguided.
People in rich countries who think that an ever shrinking skilling workforce from low birth rates will somehow be able to support the ageing population are completely misguided when they think not having kids will have any affect on the overall picture of population and that there are no negative economic effects for remaining childless. Tell me, who is going to look after you when you get old? Who is going to pay the taxes to support your services such as doctors and hospitals?
Jesus was a compassionate social conservative who called individuals to sin no more.
It uses a built-in microphone to amplify a parent's voice through speakers in the back seats.
Made me think of the "Better Off Ted" episode, "Bioshuffle" (Season 1, Episode 9):
It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
I have a Sienna. I'm perfectly capable of yelling at my kids loud enough so everyone in the car can hear. Hearing my soft-spoken daughter in the third row is another story entirely. If the radio is on or a window is open, forget it. I'd like this system in two-way mode so she can talk to the driver and front passenger more easily.
They don't tow or go off road well...but a majority of pickup and SUV owners don't actually tow anything heavy or take it off road. The poor off-road ability is actually a plus for the average person--lower ride height brings increased stability and convenience at the cost of less ground clearance). The towing is mostly due to the FWD and lower torque engines--get a bit of tongue weight and some pulling force on the back of a FWD car, and , but that's the price you pay for not having to run the transmission all the way to the back wheels (which gets you your fold-flat seats and low ride height).
It is a shame that they are so ugly and uninspiring...in all honesty, they are the "right" car for a significant majority of people.
Bottles.
Probably. I must be getting too old for slashdot, because I'd rather concede the point instead of arguing until my dying breath over slight nuances of words and corporate governance.
Jesus was all right but his disciples were thick and ordinary. -John Lennon
.Nonetheless, I've been convinced that when I do have kids (young children seem to require a frighteningly large amount of support equipment) a minivan will be the way to go.
Don't buy into the hype. My kid's seven, and we're still doing fine in a 2002 four-door Echo. (They call 'em Yaris these days). And that's counting a week long camping trip this year. Far more important than Massive Cargo Space is simply a back door to get the kid in-and-out of the seat. But what we save in fuel more than pays for the odd time we need to rent a larger vehicle.
Babies need a stroller and a diaper bag - bag goes next to kid, stroller goes in the trunk. (And after about a week you'll get one of those little umbrella strollers for the car because you don't actually need a Baby Suburban Stroller anyway.) Once they're toddler age you're down to just the bag for snacks and such, and that's about the same size as those big purses you see everywhere.
Which (gasp) you don't need to do if you have, say......a minivan.
Which (gasp) didn't exist when I was a child and yet somehow we managed without. The first vehicles recognizable as a modern minivan came on the market in 1984 and I was close to driving age by then. Prior to that you either had a full sized econoline van, a VW mini-bus, a station wagon or a second car. Worked out just fine. Plus since we didn't actually need the extra seating of a minivan 99% of the time we didn't have to waste fuel driving around a lot of extra unused vehicle all the time. We owned an econoline van when I was really little for a while (didn't need the space though which is why we got rid of it) and then we owned a series of coupes and sedans. Never was a problem getting all the people wherever we needed to go. I rode from the Great Lakes down to Florida several times in the back of a VW Scirocco.
And it's still odd that you chuckle at people saying they need a van immediately after laying out reasons why some people need a pickup instead of an SUV.
I said most people who buy pickups do not actually need a pickup. An SUV or a minivan or a station wagon would suit their needs fine. A pickup is a work vehicle. If you don't haul messy stuff that would trash an interior then you don't need a pickup. You may want a pickup but you don't need it.
A minivan is a convenience for hauling a family, not a necessity. Nothing wrong with buying a minivan since they are hugely practical but most of the people who claim they "need" a minivan are incorrect. I think minivans make a lot of sense even for many people without kids but station wagons or SUVs can accomplish most of the same things just fine. Both my parents still own minivans despite me and my sister having been out of the house for several decades now. But they are a luxury, not a necessity for most people who have them.