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Hackers Plundered Israeli Defense Firms That Built 'Iron Dome' Missile Defense

An anonymous reader writes: Brian Krebs reports on information from Columbia, Md.-based threat intelligence firm Cyber Engineering Services Inc. that attackers thought to be operating out of China hacked into the corporate networks of three top Israeli defense technology companies. The attackers were seeking technical documents related to Iron Dome, Israel's air defense system. "IAI was initially breached on April 16, 2012 by a series of specially crafted email phishing attacks. ... Once inside the IAI’s network, [the attackers] spent the next four months in 2012 using their access to install various tools and trojan horse programs on systems throughout company’s network and expanding their access to sensitive files, CyberESI said. The actors compromised privileged credentials, dumped password hashes, and gathered system, file, and network information for several systems. The actors also successfully used tools to dump Active Directory data from domain controllers on at least two different domains on the IAI’s network. All told, CyberESI was able to identify and acquire more than 700 files — totaling 762 MB total size — that were exfiltrated from IAI’s network during the compromise. The security firm said most of the data acquired was intellectual property and likely represented only a small portion of the entire data loss by IAI." Most of the stolen material pertained to Arrow III missiles, UAVs, and ballistic rockets.

184 comments

  1. Tag, you're it! by Tablizer · · Score: 1, Offtopic

    Does that mean Hamas will start rocketing China also?

    1. Re:Tag, you're it! by Opportunist · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Why, did China start to settle on their land, too?

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    2. Re:Tag, you're it! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      Well, perhaps by accident. These things are not exactly accurate, you see.

      Meanwhile Israel continues to strike UN schools (aka refugee centers), water and electricity infrastructure.

      And the US unanimously passes a bill in complete and unquestioning support of Israel, in which they for some reason demand that Hamas discontinue their recently improved relations with the PA.

      It seems the REAL reasons for this relentless bombing of civilians in one of the most densely populated areas of the planet, and now basically an invasion, are becoming clear.

    3. Re: Tag, you're it! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Informative

      There is another side to this that isn't being reported. Hamas are using schools hospitals etc to fire rockets from and telling the public it is their duty to stay and act as human shields. Israel warn I attacks and say to evacuate but Hamas make them stay, to create propaganda which makes you angry and want to support them. Don't be so easily brainwashed.

      There is an EU report on this which I now can't find but these facts exist outside of pro Israel web sites

    4. Re:Tag, you're it! by mjwalshe · · Score: 2, Insightful

      given that china also has problems with Muslim minorities is not that far fetched.

    5. Re:Tag, you're it! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      Oh, then they should also put those minorities in a concentration camp called Gaza.

    6. Re:Tag, you're it! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      nice trolling, its a prison, not a concentration camp!

    7. Re: Tag, you're it! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      That's what Israel tells the world after they bomb schools ....

      Don't let israel brainwash you!

      That's what Israel tells the world after they bomb schools ....

      Don't let israel brainwash you!

      Hello, Mr. Hamas Troll,

      The other day when BBC was interviewing a doctor who was inside a hospital in Gaza, in the middle of the interview two Hamas rockets were fired from the 3rd floor of the same hospital

      The sounds of the rocket firing was heard clearly, and the doctor himself admitted in that live broadcast that two rockets were fired from the hospital

      That broadcast was not sponsored in any way by Israel. It was a BBC broadcast !

    8. Re: Tag, you're it! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Do you have a credible reference for that? Because the closest thing to what you describe that I could find from a google search on "bbc rockets fired from hospital" is

      this

      Israel says rockets have been fired from Basman al-Ashi's hospital, a charge his staff deny completely.

      He said / she said, and therefore meaningless. Certainly no doctor admitting that anything was fired from within a hospital. Much less on screen.

      So... link?

    9. Re:Tag, you're it! by Mashiki · · Score: 2

      Why, did China start to settle on their land, too?

      If you're asking about the Philippines, Japan and S.Korea they'd all answer with yes.

      --
      Om, nomnomnom...
    10. Re: Tag, you're it! by jrumney · · Score: 2

      I saw the segment the GP was talking about. I don't remember it being the third floor, but the doctor certainly admitted it was on the hospital grounds.

      It still doesn't excuse Israel ignoring the targeting said hospital though. At the end of the day, the damage Hamas is doing with those rockets is minimal, and doesn't warrant ignoring the Geneva convention to deliberately target hospitals and schools where they know the civilian casualties will be disproportionate. Yes, Hamas is deliberately using human shields to sway global opinion, but Israel is deliberately giving them exactly what they want.

    11. Re:Tag, you're it! by gtall · · Score: 3, Insightful

      No, just Tibet.

    12. Re: Tag, you're it! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Last I hear, Israel is using people in their all territory (and Palestinian territory forcibly settled by Israelis) as a human shield.

      In fact, I hear every time Hamas fires a rocket into Israeli (and Palestinian territory forcibly settled by Israelis), they are trying to hit a high ranking official of the Israeli government or army, but they miss 99.999% of the time.

      You are of course aware that use of weapons that miss that often is a de facto war crime by failing to make an "effective contribution to military action".

      Nice to know you admit Hamas is fighting in a criminal manner.

    13. Re: Tag, you're it! by Mashiki · · Score: 4, Informative

      It still doesn't excuse Israel ignoring the targeting said hospital though.

      When a group fires from the grounds of a hospital, religious building, or homes, under the geneva convention those buildings automatically become military targets. There is no ignoring the geneva convention, what you've just posted is that hamas is committing war crimes in order to try and sway opinion.

      --
      Om, nomnomnom...
    14. Re: Tag, you're it! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It still doesn't excuse Israel ignoring the targeting said hospital though. At the end of the day, the damage Hamas is doing with those rockets is minimal, and doesn't warrant ignoring the Geneva convention to deliberately target hospitals and schools where they know the civilian casualties will be disproportionate.

      And you'd be wrong. Israel has a duty to protect its citizens first and foremost, and if that means 100 civvies dead on the other side for each Israeli, so be it. It's the same shit we've done here in the US with Iraq and Afghanistan when we call in airstrikes, and it is justifiable.

    15. Re: Tag, you're it! by jrumney · · Score: 1

      When a group fires from the grounds of a hospital, religious building, or homes, under the geneva convention those buildings automatically become military targets.

      There is no such provision in the Geneva convention. If a party finds that the conditions for a hospital, safety or neutral zone are not being complied with, they are required to give five days notice to the party administering the zone of their intention to cease recognizing it as a hospital, safety or neutral zone if its use is not brought into compliance.

    16. Re: Tag, you're it! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      A quick Google search for borei class nuclear submarine will pull up a wiki article about Moscow's new subs which can even strike interior sections of the US, read: Chicago, from deep within Soviet territory. A google news search for that term will bring up news articles showing their plans for ramping up production of the silent vessels and their ultra long range nuclear warheads. Shouldn't we all be more concerned about that?

    17. Re: Tag, you're it! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      5 days so they can fire more rockets & move to another hospital?
      so they can just repeat this over & over and you can never shoot back?

    18. Re: Tag, you're it! by MobyDisk · · Score: 2

      Since you seem the first person who actually might know what these conventions say, can you explain something to me?

      There is all this talk about Hamas using "human shields" and I want to know how that works. Let me make it easy by being extreme: Suppose country A duct tapes babies onto tanks then attacks country B. What response is permitted by country B? Is country A violating the geneva conventions? Would country B violate the geneva conventions if they returned fire?

      I know that example is silly, but I think it is a solid place to start. I keep seeing allegations, videos, etc. of Hamas placing children near rocket launchers. So if Israel responds by destroying those rocket launchers, thus killing the children, who is the war criminal?

    19. Re: Tag, you're it! by erikkemperman · · Score: 1

      ... who is the war criminal?

      I think that the answer, in your hypothetical example, as well as the current Gaza conflict (and the previous three, actually), is both.

      The tragedy is nothing will come of it. A UN report will determine that both sides committed war crimes. Israel will condemn this as anti-semitic, and Hamas will condemn it as depriving them of the only way they have left to resist Israeli military and economic warfare.

      Even looking at root causes is futile, for a conflict this old. So an apparently simple question such as "who broke the ceasefire / truce?". For example, one might argue that it was Hamas, because they fired rockets from Gaza, before the first Israeli airstrike hit. But another might argue Israel, because it never even started implementing the conditions upon which the truce was achieved (settlement freeze, lifting the blockade, ...)

      In any other case, the UN would send in peackeepers. But of course that is not possible here, because of the US' reflexive support for Israel (which, according to some, amounts to US legislators' mortal fear of AIPAC).

      --
      Gosh, thanks. That must be why the other ships call me Meatfucker -- GCU Grey Area (Eccentric)
    20. Re: Tag, you're it! by Type44Q · · Score: 1
      Well, I guess that makes it right; Israel clearly has zero moral obligation to avoid targeting hospitals if the Geneva Convention says it's okay.

      Consider the matter settled.

      (slap!) Your mom told you that you're a smart little boy? She lied; you really ought to shut the fuck up because you're quite clearly an idiot - no offense meant, by the way; it's strictly an observation... :)

    21. Re: Tag, you're it! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      that's when you send in your special forces. if you know there are going to be innocent casualties, you don't bomb the fuck out of the place, as it makes you just as culpable. i guess it would have been okay to bomb the book repository after jfk was assassinated, right? is it also okay to fire rockets at suspected criminals' cars, and if you miss and hit another building, to blame the cars' drivers?

    22. Re:Tag, you're it! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not in the sense of an extermination camp but comparing it with a hostage camp, where hostages were held and killed as reprisals, I could understand if people do that.

    23. Re: Tag, you're it! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You can send in your special forces so you don't end up with nearly as many innocents dying. In fact, these are just the types of scenarios that work well for them.

    24. Re: Tag, you're it! by jrumney · · Score: 1

      Country A is violating the Geneva convention. Country B would not be violating the Geneva convention, provided they are not firing into a recognized hospital, safety or neutral zone. If such an event were to take place inside such a zone, country A would also be violating the Geneva convention by using the zone for military activity. To be clear, Hamas are blatantly violating the Geneva convention. That does not make it right for Israel to do so as well.

    25. Re: Tag, you're it! by realperseus · · Score: 1

      Next thing you know, Hillary Clinton will say that Hamas needs to store and fire rockets from hospitals and kindergartens because they don't have anywhere else to fire them from. Oh wait, she just did.. .

      --
      "Trusting every aspect of our lives to a giant computer was the smartest thing we ever did.." Homer Simpson
    26. Re:Tag, you're it! by luis_a_espinal · · Score: 2

      nice trolling, its a prison, not a concentration camp!

      When you have close to millions in such an enclosure based on religion/ethnic exclusion controlling all borders around it, the difference those two terms begin to blur.

      And no, I'm not supporting Hamas. I think the group is bone-headed idiot and unnecessarily violent. But that doesn't mean I'm giving a pass to Israel on this either.

    27. Re: Tag, you're it! by luis_a_espinal · · Score: 1

      5 days so they can fire more rockets & move to another hospital? so they can just repeat this over & over and you can never shoot back?

      That's what the Geneva convention says. A nation obeys it or does not, that is up to the nation to decide (and live with.)

    28. Re:Tag, you're it! by myowntrueself · · Score: 1

      nice trolling, its a prison, not a concentration camp!

      The concept of the concentration camp was invented by the British in South Africa as a way to 'concentrate the population' of Boers into managed camps.

      Gaza really isn't that much different.

      --
      In the free world the media isn't government run; the government is media run.
    29. Re: Tag, you're it! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why should Israel be obligated to put its soldiers at even more risk because Hamas ignores the rules of war?

    30. Re:Tag, you're it! by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      No, Gaza is more like a Ghetto.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    31. Re:Tag, you're it! by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Why should Hamas care?

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    32. Re:Tag, you're it! by mjwalshe · · Score: 1

      The PRC doesn't bother with the iron fist in a velvet glove its just the iron fist.

    33. Re: Tag, you're it! by mjwalshe · · Score: 1

      which is a war crime.

    34. Re: Tag, you're it! by erikkemperman · · Score: 1

      and if that means 100 civvies dead on the other side for each Israeli, so be it. It's the same shit we've done here in the US with Iraq and Afghanistan when we call in airstrikes, and it is justifiable.

      So be it, huh? Serves those civvies right for having been born in the wrong country? That is an argument which betrays complete moral bankruptcy. And completely overlooks that the war in Iraq was not justifiable to begin with. Certainly it had nothing to do with protecting US citizens.

        The Nuremberg Tribunal ...

      ... called the waging of aggressive war "essentially an evil thing...to initiate a war of aggression...is not only an international crime; it is the supreme international crime, differing only from other war crimes in that it contains within itself the accumulated evil of the whole."

      --
      Gosh, thanks. That must be why the other ships call me Meatfucker -- GCU Grey Area (Eccentric)
    35. Re: Tag, you're it! by beefoot · · Score: 1

      Just in case you don't know, war crime is a term used to legitimize the punishment of the losers after the war ended.

    36. Re: Tag, you're it! by mjwalshe · · Score: 1

      Err no the laws of war go back a long way the first actual trial for what would be considered war crimes was in the 1340's and in ww2 the British did court martial a navy captain for killing helpless sailors - Winston wanted him hung as an example.

    37. Re: Tag, you're it! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Based on years of experiance with in the Joint-Combined SOF community I regret to inform you, that preservation of Civillians isn't likely when you inject a few dozen SOF troops into a Hostile and Civillian heavy environment and have them spend hours in place attempting to resolve an objective (such as search an entire school/hosipital). What you get is a rolling combat through the streets with broad and dramatic fatalities. AKA. Somalia (Delays dut to injury and improper planning, 1K+ Somali millita and civillians killed). This is more of a police style SWAT action, or a door-to-door search, with overwhelming firepower, like the Marines executed repeatedly in Iraq. However LOAC doesn't call for either. It is always permissable to return fire.

    38. Re: Tag, you're it! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Let me reprase that, Isreal has absoultely no legal obligation to avoid targeting a civillian building that is being used to attack them.

      Isreal has absoultely no moral obligation to allow their troops to be harmed without taking action.

      The continous use of otherwise protected civillian buildings by Islamic Fundementalist Groups, as a staging ground for attacks is morally reprehensable.

      I don't condone Isreal, but they are quite justified in returning fire.

    39. Re: Tag, you're it! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I have read the Geneva Conventions. It only applies to its signatories. Israel is a signatory but Palestine is not recognized as a country and is not a signatory. The PLO tried to sign for Palestinians, but the Swiss Government ruled that they did not have standing.

    40. Re: Tag, you're it! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Don't hate the playa, hate the game! Or isn't that how it goes?

    41. Re: Tag, you're it! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      two rockets were fired from the hospital

      So next time there's a school shooting we should nuke the school from orbit?

    42. Re: Tag, you're it! by Mashiki · · Score: 1

      Well, I guess that makes it right; Israel clearly has zero moral obligation to avoid targeting hospitals if the Geneva Convention says it's okay.

      Consider the matter settled.

      One of these days you'll figure out the rest. Remember that in Israel's case, they could level Shifia hospital. It's illegally being used as a hamas c&c structure, but they don't do it.

      I'm sure you'll also have aged in a few years, and realize why your second sentence proves that you're the a-typical liberal who when faced with something they don't like, they revert to ad-homs.

      --
      Om, nomnomnom...
    43. Re: Tag, you're it! by Jeremiah+Cornelius · · Score: 1

      1. Israel can prevent civilian deaths.

      During the course of the past twelve days, Israeli air strikeshave killedover 1000Palestinians—mostly civilians.

      Israelsaysthe deaths are a result of Hamas using ordinary Palestinians as human shields, and the gruesome toll has been met with a shrug.

      It’s an issue thathas come upduring past operations in Gaza.

      Back in 2009, during Operation Cast Lead, the president of the United Nations General Assembly Miguel d’Escoto Brockmann,condemnedIsrael for violating international law in Gaza by targeting civilians.

      Brockmanncalledthe offensive “a war against a helpless defenceless and imprisoned people.”

      “Theviolationsof international law inherent in the Gaza assault have been well documented,” he added, listing collective punishment, disproportionate military force [and]attacks on civilian targets, including homes, mosques, universities, schools.”

      Israel doesn’t have to fire at the civilian targets, it’s a choice that they make. Hamas rockets are broadlyineffectiveanyway—given Israel’s comprehensive network of bomb shelters. Just three civilians in Israel have been killed so far.

      Noting the Israeli military’s “long record of unlawful airstrikes with high civilian casualties”, Human Rights Watch Middle East director Sarah Leah Whitsoncommentedthat Israel “would never accept an argument that any Israeli home of an Israel Defense Force member would be a valid military target.”

      IDF spokesperson Peter Lerner also couldn’t provide any evidence of houses being used to command in control rocket attacks, when directlyqueriedby reporters.

      2. The three Israeli teenswere killed immediately after being kidnapped.

      Investigative journalist Max Blumenthal recently revealed that the Israeli governmentknewthatthe three missing Israeli teens, whowere abductedin June from Hebron in the West Bank, were murdered almost as soon as they were kidnapped. However, this was not revealed to the public, and insteadthe search forthe missing teenagers unleashed to a brutal crackdown on the West Bank.

      Blumenthal says that Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu used outrage around the kidnapping to whip up enough support to justify the aggressive military campaign that has ensued.

      3. Gaza is basically an open-air prison.

      The economic blockade of Gaz

      --
      "Flyin' in just a sweet place,
      Never been known to fail..."
    44. Re: Tag, you're it! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Criticism of Israeli policy is not antisemitism.

      Again.

      Criticism of Israeli policy is not antisemitism.

      Again.

      Criticism of Israeli policy is not antisemitism.

      Repeat as often as needed. You will need to. A lot.

    45. Re: Tag, you're it! by lsatenstein · · Score: 1

      That's what Israel tells the world after they bomb schools ....

      Don't let israel brainwash you!

      That's what Israel tells the world after they bomb schools ....

      Don't let israel brainwash you!

      Hello, Mr. Hamas Troll,

      The other day when BBC was interviewing a doctor who was inside a hospital in Gaza, in the middle of the interview two Hamas rockets were fired from the 3rd floor of the same hospital

      The sounds of the rocket firing was heard clearly, and the doctor himself admitted in that live broadcast that two rockets were fired from the hospital

      That broadcast was not sponsored in any way by Israel. It was a BBC broadcast !

      That's what Israel tells the world after they bomb schools ....

      Don't let israel brainwash you!

      That's what Israel tells the world after they bomb schools ....

      Don't let israel brainwash you!

      If it was the USA in Israel's situation, would they send knocker bombs or pamphlets or make phone calls. I bet you that the USA would have dropped napalm, and would have just eliminated Gaza.

      Want to live with terrorists in your midst, here is a link Here is the funeral of one such terrorist stopped by Israel. The funeral was taking place in Gaza, They failed to remove the suicide belt before the burial.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

      --
      Leslie Satenstein Montreal Quebec Canada
    46. Re: Tag, you're it! by i.kazmi · · Score: 1

      If i remember correctly, in one of the previous conflicts, IDF troops actually did what you described in your hypothetical example (I believe it was a toddler/teenager who'd thrown a stone at a tank) so IMHO, as poorer your own example Israel I'd the war criminal

    47. Re: Tag, you're it! by i.kazmi · · Score: 1

      What other side? Most of the areas claimed for the State of Palestine have been occupied by Israel since 1967 in the aftermath of the Six-Day War, with the Palestinian Authority exercising socio-political administration since 1993 in limited areas (read concentration camps). Despite several dozen UN resolutions demanding the creation of the state of Palestine as a matter of urgency, each single one of those resolutions has been ignored by Israel and instead of returning the areas that technically belong to the state of Palestine, more settlements are created each year, no wonder the Palestinians fire rockets at them. Also, how does the American government justify/demand the imposition of sanctions against any other state when they veto any proposed sanctions against Israel for violating/disregarding UN resolutions is beyond me.

    48. Re: Tag, you're it! by i.kazmi · · Score: 1

      Shouldn't killing Iranian nuclear scientists and rather proudly proclaiming responsibility for the assassination count as terrorism? Just curious

    49. Re: Tag, you're it! by i.kazmi · · Score: 1

      With allies like Israel, who needs enemies? (Does anyone remember Rachel Corrie?)

    50. Re: Tag, you're it! by Jeremiah+Cornelius · · Score: 1

      I?

      I work in his factory.

      --
      "Flyin' in just a sweet place,
      Never been known to fail..."
    51. Re: Tag, you're it! by i.kazmi · · Score: 1

      Friendly fire Jeremiah -.-

      Rachel Aliene Corrie from Olympia, Washington, was an American peace activist and diarist. She was killed by an Israel Defense Forces (IDF) armored bulldozer in a combat zone in Rafah, in the southern part of the Gaza Strip. She had come to Gaza as part of her senior-year college assignment to connect her home town with Rafah in a sister cities project. While there, she had engaged with other ISM activists in efforts to prevent the Israeli army's demolition of the homes of Palestinian people (allegedly to eliminate tunnels used by terrorists to smuggle weapons from Egypt into Gaza).

      Less than two months after her arrival, on March 16, 2003, Corrie was killed during an Israeli military operation after a three-hour confrontation between two bulldozers and eight ISM activists.

      The exact nature of her death and the culpability of the bulldozer operator are disputed, with fellow ISM protestors saying that the Israeli soldier operating the bulldozer deliberately ran over Corrie, and Israeli government eyewitnesses saying that it was an accident since the bulldozer operator could not see her [sic].

      No action was taken by the IDF against the soldier driving the armored bulldozer.

      I an pretty certain that the only reason the world knows of this atrocity is because Rachel (may she rest in peace) was an American citizen. If it were a Palestinian family, they'd just have been just another group of numbers, terror sympathizers killed while Israel was trying to protect the peace.

    52. Re:Tag, you're it! by JakeBurn · · Score: 1

      Except the SA farmers weren't sending thousands of rockets into Britain and aiming them at civilian population centers instead of military or government targets.
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L...
      That's just so far this year. I am in no way absolving Israel for their part in this mess but they didn't just one day decide to lock everything down in Palestine on a whim. Until Palestinians want to live more than they want to hate they will continue to allow their neighbors to fire rockets blindly into Israel.

    53. Re:Tag, you're it! by myowntrueself · · Score: 1

      Yeah I'm sure the schoolkids and babies are also terrorists.

      Just look at the kill ratio to see who is more dangerous to whom.

      --
      In the free world the media isn't government run; the government is media run.
    54. Re:Tag, you're it! by JakeBurn · · Score: 1

      Wait, so just because Israel has modern guided missiles they should just stand by while Palestinians get their killstreak up? So its ok that the Jews have had their schoolkids and babies killed by hundreds of suicide bombs because they have better weaponry? Palestine's mission statement was officially, and still is unofficially, that every single man, woman and child Jew must die. Their suicide bombs, that were officially sanctioned by their government, were not targeting military installations. They targeted malls and public places, during the day when women and children were the most likely targets. Bummer for them that they are too stupid to not fire 50's era unguided rockets at a nation with a modern arsenal.

    55. Re:Tag, you're it! by myowntrueself · · Score: 1

      Its ok, just a matter of time before Israel implements the final solution to the Palestinian problem.

      --
      In the free world the media isn't government run; the government is media run.
  2. I had been afraid to wonder... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Reading everything that has been going on, and the details in the news articles about this system, I have almost been afraid to wonder if/when something like this would happen. I had no idea the whole thing works on WiFi until I read a CNN article. Very scary stuff if folks can find a way to compromise the system.

    1. Re:I had been afraid to wonder... by aliquis · · Score: 1

      In North Korea Kim Jong-Un hacks all the worldÂs military networks in two seconds.

  3. 5% efficacy, steal away by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    It's better as a US grant acquiring system than a rocket system.

    1. Re:5% efficacy, steal away by salimma · · Score: 2

      The reality is probably somewhere in between, so if this is indeed the work of government-sponsored hackers, expect an improved Chinese clone the same way the J-31 looks to be a better performing clone of the F-35.

      --
      Michel
      Fedora Project Contribut
    2. Re:5% efficacy, steal away by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Key words being "looks to be." We might gripe about five million dollar state of the art laser cupholders, but aerospace companies do not skimp on engineering and materials. Plus, you know, there's the whole China not being able to build 100% indigenous aircraft thing.

    3. Re:5% efficacy, steal away by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      While I am sure there's a great deal of espionage going on the F35, I also believe that aerodynamics and "stealthiness" tend to converge into a design similar to the F35.

    4. Re:5% efficacy, steal away by aliquis · · Score: 1

      But.. But..

      The true racists - you know the ones who don't just want to have their country left alone and finance others - would tell you the Chinese simply can't make anything useful! Ever!

      (As they likely did with the Japanese and so on, heck,in the UK people likely still consider their military superior! (OH NO I I DIDN'T?!))

    5. Re:5% efficacy, steal away by umghhh · · Score: 1

      it may just be that the only purpose F35 serves is to cause other gullible nations into arms race trying to build stuff that has no practical value but is expensive like hell. Sort of the way Reagan's star wars were for Russkis.

  4. So why dont... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Why dont these places have malware files spread out in their data files, hide them in a zip file or something.
    So when hackers hack YOUR systems, you get to hack theirs back.

    After all if this started with an email, surely having malware files on their machines must make it easier to hack them..... carefully crafted PDF, JPEG, etc etc etc

  5. And it'll keep happening, again and again... by TWX · · Score: 3, Insightful

    ...until software and systems security is finally taken seriously. That may mean corporate LANs interconnected between sites by leased private fiber, where ther entire computer system for the company is not able to even reach the public Internet. That may mean that users have separate systems, one for internal communication within the company, and one for external communication to outsiders. That may also mean that companies stop allowing anything sensitive on public-reachable computers, and it might even mean that corporate IT departments have to look at hardware that doesn't allow for secure computers to even plug into regular, public networks, and for those 'regular' networks to be highly monitored and partially locked-down as to what IP ranges (and countries) can even be communicated with.

    I can tell you one thing, if such a system were implemented there'd probably be an uptick in efficiency as now it'd be a lot harder to screw around at work. Sure, a lot of people would be really pissed that they can't do non-work tasks at work without using a system seeing such monitoring too, but given that salaries in the defense sector are generally pretty good, that's a tradeoff that one could probably stomach.

    --
    Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
    1. Re:And it'll keep happening, again and again... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I'd bet most companies in the defense sector don't even have the level of security of a typical gaming company making the AAA titles. By the way, the secure systems can't be allowed to access even to the rest of the internal network of the company for such a separation be effective.

    2. Re:And it'll keep happening, again and again... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Watch an old movie someday and you'll see people reading newspapers and magazines when bored at work. That will become acceptable again without the Internet. Also, downloaded podcasts.

    3. Re:And it'll keep happening, again and again... by m00sh · · Score: 2

      I can tell you one thing, if such a system were implemented there'd probably be an uptick in efficiency as now it'd be a lot harder to screw around at work. Sure, a lot of people would be really pissed that they can't do non-work tasks at work without using a system seeing such monitoring too, but given that salaries in the defense sector are generally pretty good, that's a tradeoff that one could probably stomach.

      Except that efficiency does not work that way.

      People screwing around at work is not the cause of inefficiency but a symptom of a hidden larger problem that is causing inefficiency.

    4. Re:And it'll keep happening, again and again... by TWX · · Score: 1

      I'm well-aware that keeping employees busy with enough work and having enough oversight to help keep them on-task is important, but reducing distraction is also important. There's more than one contributing factor to inefficiency. I can suggest remedies for this one.

      --
      Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
    5. Re:And it'll keep happening, again and again... by vux984 · · Score: 1

      I can tell you one thing, if such a system were implemented there'd probably be an uptick in efficiency as now [...]

      As all the SaaS they'd bought into broke completely, half the onsite software that relies on various web services and "phone-home" systems for licensing etc broke, all the B2B tools for everything from tracking/shipping packages to payroll tax tools to JIT supply chain management from their suppliers broke.

      Yeah, there would be a real productivity bump. :)

    6. Re:And it'll keep happening, again and again... by GeekWithAKnife · · Score: 1


      I agree that systems of such sensitive nature need to be isolated but the problem is always how do you do this?
      You could take away so much functionality that you are impeding productivity.

      People bring their own devices, phones are powerful enough to use for many more tasks these days, productivity will not go up. That's a myth.

      If the system in question was on a separate infrastructure, sophisticated and determined attackers will simply infiltrate the new system. Sure, it's an added layer of complexity and thus a bit more secure.

      The real problem is not prevention, it's detection. I can walk into a bank today and leave with a few thousands of dollars. The real questions is, how do I do that undetected? without being caught later?

      Online attacks are unfortunately very easy to mask, the attackers themselves are easily hidden and very hard to catch. IF they knew there's a good chance they are caught later, despite being able to EASILY pull off their intended crime then they'd be an effective deterrent.

      Detection, deterrent. Not more doors & locks.

      --
      A 'singular oddity' is an event that cannot be explained and only happens when you are alone.
    7. Re:And it'll keep happening, again and again... by gtall · · Score: 1

      So, you are going to deter Chinese hackers by outing them in public. Mao is laughing in his grave...and given the millions he caused to die, that's no small feat.

    8. Re:And it'll keep happening, again and again... by GeekWithAKnife · · Score: 1

      Thank you for applying, we will get back to you soon.

      --
      A 'singular oddity' is an event that cannot be explained and only happens when you are alone.
    9. Re:And it'll keep happening, again and again... by Ceriel+Nosforit · · Score: 1

      According to the article, that cause is email.

      --
      All rites reversed 2010
    10. Re:And it'll keep happening, again and again... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ... but reducing distraction is also important.

      Depends on the distraction, because, e.g., looking at pictures of baby animals actually improves the performance.

    11. Re:And it'll keep happening, again and again... by swb · · Score: 1

      So nobody screwed around at work before computers? No bullshitting around the eponymous water cooler, coffee machine, long lunches, etc?

    12. Re:And it'll keep happening, again and again... by ColdWetDog · · Score: 1

      ... but reducing distraction is also important.

      Depends on the distraction, because, e.g., looking at pictures of baby animals actually improves the performance.

      Oh yes, baby! Bring out the animal in me! Yes!

      --
      Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
    13. Re:And it'll keep happening, again and again... by TWX · · Score: 1

      And if e-mail on the corporate internal LAN/WAN never touches the public Internet then even if someone brings in a USB FOB with an infection, it won't readily spread automatically.

      Hence two separate networks.

      If it's that important, then the employees should be able to handle having two separate systems, one for internal use only, one for external use only.

      --
      Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
    14. Re:And it'll keep happening, again and again... by mjwalshe · · Score: 1

      Really have you ever worked for such a company typically you cant even get inside the main buildings for an interview and have you pass at least SC clearance and probably DV (TS Clearance) . And I suspect that that MOSSAD will have standards and enforce them - do you want to tell a real world version of Ziva (NCIS) that you messed up and cut corners with security.

    15. Re:And it'll keep happening, again and again... by mjwalshe · · Score: 1

      Mosad tends to deter people who mess with them with Direct Action or as the MI6 Official history puts it "Bumping Off"

    16. Re:And it'll keep happening, again and again... by m00sh · · Score: 1

      I'm well-aware that keeping employees busy with enough work and having enough oversight to help keep them on-task is important, but reducing distraction is also important. There's more than one contributing factor to inefficiency. I can suggest remedies for this one.

      You think enough work and enough oversight creates efficiency? No wonder you have a distraction problem.

  6. Actors by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I hate actors. They used to want everyone to always be paying attention to them, and now they're stealing military data.

    On the other hand, if employees of movie studios are stealing plans for missiles, then maybe I'd should take another look at my file sharing...

  7. Iron Dome? by rossdee · · Score: 1

    What they need is a ;\'Chesters Mill Dome"

    1. Re:Iron Dome? by antdude · · Score: 1

      And Big Jim! :P

      --
      Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
  8. Because hacking doesn't work that way by penguinoid · · Score: 3, Informative

    Why dont these places have malware files spread out in their data files, hide them in a zip file or something.

    All malware is data until you tell your computer to run it. If you get hacked by careless people, then I suppose having malware that reports them might work, but they'd have to run it or open it with a compromised program, and on a computer connected to the internet.

    --
    Don't waste your vote! Vote for whoever you want, unless you live in a swing state it won't matter anyways
    1. Re:Because hacking doesn't work that way by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No, no, no, don't bring facts into the discussion. Hollywood Hacking is a real thing because we want to make-believe.

    2. Re:Because hacking doesn't work that way by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2010/03/pdf_the_most_co.html

      http://www.wilderssecurity.com/threads/embedded-malware.324071/

      http://blog.zeltser.com/post/23229415724/malicious-code-inside-office-documents

      https://isc.sans.edu/diary/Analyzing+Malicious+RTF+Files+Using+OfficeMalScanner's+RTFScan/14092

      So documents CAN be used to inject malware....

    3. Re:Because hacking doesn't work that way by ruir · · Score: 1

      Or instead if the hackers are running operating systems used by pros, instead of Microsoft...

    4. Re:Because hacking doesn't work that way by aliquis · · Score: 1

      Or instead if the hackers are running operating systems used by pros, instead of Microsoft...

      Like macs! .. ?!

  9. Another day, another compromised system by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Any and all advanced weapons systems are targets for Chinese military. This being the most advanced of its kind in the world with a billion dollar price tag and said to be a precursor to a similar US system, of course the Chinese are going to pursue it. Likely both in replicating and finding holes in it.
    There's big long papers out there spent entirely on the game theory & feasibility of missile defense systems, unfortunately we get to see it all play out in real life with real tax dollars rather than in academic papers.

  10. Meh. by Etherwalk · · Score: 4, Insightful

    China is in a state of de facto war with every military R&D project in the world. Any defense contractor not locked down six ways from Sunday should be punished (or they should get a bonus for best practices.)

    1. Re:Meh. by aNonnyMouseCowered · · Score: 2

      Right. I won't trust a defense contractor whose security gets compromised using phishing emails. If the intrusion is more low level than that (the mythical compromised routers), then they might have a good excuse. If the story is true, and the Israelis aren't just making it up as a cover story or honeypot to attract would-be cyber-attackers from other less technically competent nations (Iran, N Korea, etc), then the defense contractors should be banned from future military contracts.

    2. Re:Meh. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What really amaze me is that these alleged hacked companies are so good to determine it originates from China and so weak to protect themselves !

      And naturally, no decent hacker will ever conceal his identity with the very plausible "Yellow Peril" propaganda.

    3. Re: Meh. by Type44Q · · Score: 1

      THIS. It's like hiring an off-duty cop to provide security for you, and then finding out that he got his ass handed to him by an old lady in a wheelchair...

  11. Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by Applehu+Akbar · · Score: 1, Insightful

    Apparently the Chinese don't think so. Compared to the American liberal arts community of experts on missile defense, they must be sadly misinformed.

    1. Re:Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by Xenkar · · Score: 1

      Perhaps they are looking to learn from Israel's mistakes. "Okay, this doesn't work effectively so we now know what not to waste our time on."

      I just wish my government (the United States of America) would spend the aid money we send to Israel each year on securing our southern border from invaders rather than shooting down bottle rockets from Gaza Strip and the West Bank 5% of the time.

    2. Re:Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How do you go from hackers using a Chinese IP to "the Chinese" ?
      MPAA/RIAA logic?

    3. Re:Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      All the target getting hacked proves is that someone thought the target was worth hacking. It doesn't mean that their [primary] goal was even to pilfer technological data, let alone useful technological data.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    4. Re:Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by aliquis · · Score: 1

      Good enough to catch 90% of the rockets from Gaza.

      Those likely aren't the latest and greatest of rocketry though.

    5. Re:Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      >Reports

      Which ones? You mean there are reports besides Postol's that give the effectiveness at ~5%? Where?

      Also: you're visibly perturbed. :^)

    6. Re:Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      US taxpayers are basically footing the bill for much of Israel's apartheid 2.0 regime. $3M a day, was it? That might have gone some way domestically, for the folks in Detroit for example. But of course that would defeat the purpose, which is to say an enormous funnel of public money into private contractors greedy hands.

    7. Re:Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by Mashiki · · Score: 1

      So, if it's 5% effective, why is it getting 80-90% of all the incoming rockets from Gaza? It appears that the H:M ratio is much higher than that, and it's "smart" enough to figure out which rockets are not going to land in a civilian area.

      That liberal arts community is the same group that's happily pushed nuclear research back 30 years, so they can go fuck themselves, while sipping their latte in their ivory towers, while protesting capitalism.

      --
      Om, nomnomnom...
    8. Re:Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by 1s44c · · Score: 1

      You have a point. That money could have gone to feeding the homeless, upgrading some infrastructure, health care, regenerating Detroit, or a countless number of other things. Instead it's going to help a country that's oppressing its own people Saddam style and indirectly going to feed military secrets to the Chinese.

    9. Re:Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by 1s44c · · Score: 1

      The intercepting rockets likely cost far more than the rockets being intercepted. Good job the US is footing the bill. More upstanding action from the country that called Saddam 'Our kind of guy".

    10. Re:Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Nobody, not even the Israeli's are claiming it gets 80-90% of incoming rockets. But I'm pretty sure you're a shill.

    11. Re:Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by Savage-Rabbit · · Score: 2

      Apparently the Chinese don't think so. Compared to the American liberal arts community of experts on missile defense, they must be sadly misinformed.

      It depends on how you look at it. Iron Dome costs something like 20-30.000 dollars per shot. One of those home built Quassam rockets Hamas uses costs 5-800 dollars per shot, the Grad rockets probably a bit more. It's the same economy as dropping PGMs that start at 15-20.000 per unit (the Hellfire missiles used by the RQ-9 drones cost $110.000 per unit) on five man Taleban guerrilla groups carrying a grand total of 3-4000 dollars worth of equipment (tops). It adds up pretty quickly. If Hamas hoses off enough Quassam rockets the costs start to pile up for Israel but Israel can pay the monetary cost, the political cost of the slaughter happening in Gaza at the moment is another matter and we haven't even talked about the side effects. I was Hamas, now that they can reach Ben Gurion airport, I'd start hosing those rockets off at Ben Gurion in the biggest volleys I could manage. The rockets as such don't do much damage but the cessation of international flights into Israel does, the fact that Iron Dome would probably start to falter under such a load would be damaging to the politicos who sank all that money into it and the fact that Airlines aren't willing to allow their aircraft to fly though a rain of rocket fire to land at Ben Gurion is doing massive economic and political damage. All you need is to saturate Iron Dome and achieve enough accuracy to ensure that a few of rockets reach the airfield perimeter at regular intervals. If you can do that you have effectively obliged anybody flying in and out of Israel to make a stop-over in Cyprus until other arrangements can be made. It would seem increasingly more sensible to just stop this stupid fighting, get over the idea of Greater Israel and make peace with the Palestinians, but that won't happen until Netanyahu and Liberman have conclusively proven that some problems cannot be solved by bombing them and pretty much the same goes for Hamas and their idiotic obsession with destroying Israel. Not that I think that is likely to happen, both sides have been radicalized beyond recovery by their own fanaticism and intransigence.

      --
      Only to idiots, are orders laws.
      -- Henning von Tresckow
    12. Re:Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I don't know how many rockets actually would fall on cities. I read that the iron dome only tries to intercept if it may hit a target. If less than 5% is going towards a target, it may be valid, but somewhat unethical, to say only 5% of fired rockets are successfully intercepted...

    13. Re:Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by DNS-and-BIND · · Score: 1

      oblivious to anything but their point of view, and to be rude little bitches with their fucking ignorance.

      be a fucking cunt

      brain instead of your ass

      worthless twat

      You sure are projecting your fears onto others. Psychological projection is a theory in psychology in which humans defend themselves against unpleasant impulses by denying their existence in themselves, while attributing them to others. For example, a person who is rude may constantly accuse other people of being rude. I can't help but notice the sexist insults as well - what will your friends the feminists think about that? Please be consistent if you're going to be a bigot.

      --
      Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
    14. Re:Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's what i like about conservatives... you can always count on them to be completely oblivious to anything but their point of view, and to be rude little bitches with their fucking ignorance.

      meglon meets his own description of a conservative

    15. Re:Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by aliquis · · Score: 1

      What was worse? Saddam or what they are getting right about now?

      Same? =P

    16. Re:Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by Mashiki · · Score: 2

      Nobody, not even the Israeli's are claiming it gets 80-90% of incoming rockets. But I'm pretty sure you're a shill.

      You're now welcome to live out your life being less ignorant of the world.

      --
      Om, nomnomnom...
    17. Re:Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by Sockatume · · Score: 1

      The US government put a lot of time and effort into spying on the USSR's paranormal operations research, and even replicating some of it at home; it was still almost entirely worthless.

      --
      No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
    18. Re:Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by gtall · · Score: 1

      You mean like the international and American aid Hamas diverted to build tunnels and rockets to attack Israel rather than on schools, hospitals, etc.?

    19. Re:Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by sycodon · · Score: 1

      One report from one professor who had nothing to go on but videos and pictures.

      Typical of folks like you to take something like that as Gospel and build policy around it.

      --
      When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
    20. Re:Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by sycodon · · Score: 2

      So if a Rocket was heading for your ass, how much would you be willing to pay to have it intercepted?

      --
      When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
    21. Re: Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by Type44Q · · Score: 1

      And if it hadn't been, let's say, entirely worthless... are you really so naive as to think that they would have told you about their discoveries?? :)

    22. Re:Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by dave420 · · Score: 1

      No, it's $3m a day. Something about "apples" and "oranges" springs to mind.

    23. Re:Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by Lawrence_Bird · · Score: 1

      Don't assume that it is the Chinese that did this hack (if the details are even true). Attribution is very difficult in the world of cyber crime/espionage.

    24. Re:Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Israel depends entirely on American technology for it's arsenal.
      We probably catch more Israeli spies in America than Chinese spies.
      I have a hard time buying vastly superior performance from Israeli weapons than American counterparts, simply because, without exaggeration, everything Israel have, we gave it to them.
      When everything from raw material, tools, equipment...has Made in USA stamped on it, I'd sooner believe a more advanced ally economy like Germany, UK, France would outperform America.
      Besides, Israel isn't outstanding in anything internationally, and the low information reader is suppose to believe they are world champions in weapons design? I don't think so. Not saying it's impossible, but we do nothing else well EXCEPT weapons? ummm..no.

    25. Re: Gee, isn't Iron Dome supposed to be worthless? by Sockatume · · Score: 1

      I don't understand what that has to do with this conversation.

      --
      No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
  12. Any person responsible for any military data in by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    any nation who puts that data onto a computer that is connected to the internet should be tried for treason by his own country and should be executed. There is simply no valid reason to do this other than to enable your nation's enemies to access your data. This applies just as much to employees of an Israeli firm, an American firm, a Russian firm, a Chinese firm.... ANY nation whose "experts" put any such data onto a system that is attached to the net should EXECUTE such traitors as quickly as possible.

    I'm a non-partisan hater of foolishness and treachery.

  13. Pr0n by meglon · · Score: 1

    Helluva lot of trouble just to hide their porn.

    --
    Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
  14. Yea-uh but it's China by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If they build it, it will break soon after.

  15. Why? by Berkyjay · · Score: 2

    How is it that companies dealing with sensitive information can store these sensitive files on a network exposed to the outside world? It would seem to be a fairly cheap and such a small inconvenience to have a separate network of machines that are completely walled off from the outside.

    1. Re:Why? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How is it that companies dealing with sensitive information can store these sensitive files on a network exposed to the outside world? It would seem to be a fairly cheap and such a small inconvenience to have a separate network of machines that are completely walled off from the outside.

      Who says they're on an externally accessible network? Maybe the payload was carried to the sensitive computers on USB sticks? Maybe that printer driver they used was tainted? Maybe now whenever they transfer files to USB from those sensitive computers some extra data is written to some unused blocks at the end of the device and is picked up by the connected computers.
      Security in the digital age is really fucking hard.

    2. Re:Why? by hey! · · Score: 1

      Air gapping the sensitive information is one of those things that looks easy on paper but runs afoul of the fact that people don't like to work that way. It's inefficient. It's not like people have *two* jobs, one sensitive the other not. They have one job in which sensitive bits are intertwined with regular bits, so in practiced people tend to cheat and do *some* sensitive work on the non-sensitive network.

      Even if the users are unrealistically conscientious about never doing anything sensitive on their non-secure PCs, this intertwining of sensitive with ordinary information means that you can probably deduce a lot from apparently innocuous data. Imagine you discover the following information from poking around on an engineer's "non-sensitive" computer:

      (1) He is exchanging email with certain university researchers setting up face to face meetings.
      (2) He has downloaded datasheets for several families of exotic electronic components.
      (3) He has telephone appointments in his calendar with salesmen from Unobtanium Corp.
      (4) His browsing history shows he's been reading up on certain mathematical topics on Wolfram Alpha.

      Now put this all together and another expert in his field might be able to deduce a lot more than you'd expect than if you looked at any one of these factors. The interconnected nature of an engineer's work means that if you remove all the sensitive bits it leaves a hole of a characteristic shape.

      --
      Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
  16. I don't get it! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I still don't understand why sensitive documents are on computers connected to public networks. They need to set up private networks with cold connected lines, not public vpn.

  17. Canada hacked too by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The NRC in Canada also got hacked into. The only technology file stolen was a genetic engineering project to make maple syrup sweeter. :)

    1. Re: Canada hacked too by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Mmmmm, maple syrup!

  18. Re:They were in their system for four months?!?! by Opportunist · · Score: 1

    It's easy to stay hidden once you're in. You'd be absolutely amazed how many companies have very strict rules at the entrance but if you manage to get past, there's little more than token security inside.

    --
    We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  19. Two computers is too expensive and cumbersome by dutchwhizzman · · Score: 1

    Most managers wouldn't want people to have two computers on their desk, since hey, they can save 50% on desk top systems by merging them. As long as system admins do their work, nothing could go wrong, right? I'm a penetration tester by trade and no matter where I go, even thin clients and virtual machine setups aren't properly separated.

    People trust way too much in technical capabilities of devices and underestimate the ingenuity and perseverance of intruders to circumvent or penetrate those devices. Sneakernet to transfer data from and to the internal network(s) and not using VLANs for separating them isn't too bad if implemented properly. Computers are way cheaper than people. They are way cheaper than technical solutions to keep networks separated including their maintenance. They are way cheaper than having an incident where your internal IT is compromised. It just looks more expensive on the desktop, which is the only place non-security people tend to look.

    --
    I was promised a flying car. Where is my flying car?
    1. Re:Two computers is too expensive and cumbersome by mpe · · Score: 1

      Most managers wouldn't want people to have two computers on their desk, since hey, they can save 50% on desk top systems by merging them. As long as system admins do their work, nothing could go wrong, right?

      The "air gapped" approach may well involve even more system admin work. Since both "secure" and "insecure" networks need to go to the same desks. Even if they have completly different cabling runs and cabinets. Then there's the issue of things like "sneaker net". Even someone plugging cables into the wrong place "accidentally".

    2. Re:Two computers is too expensive and cumbersome by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sure there is still the good old "sneaker net", "HW keyloggers" and bad plugging problems, but these problems only exist if the attacker is in the place not if he is a the other side of the world. EVERY system is completely insecure once the attacker can access it physically. Air gapping work very well against distant attackers.

    3. Re:Two computers is too expensive and cumbersome by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you are having an issue like that, then you should have the knowledge and technical know how to change the connectors with something non standard. Say for example, take the ethernet port and replace it with an 8 pin DIN connector. No chance of that being plugged into the wrong network accidentally.

      (Yes, I used a DIN as it comes to mind, but it could have issues, as other things use it, you could make a completely different connector for it if you wanted.)

    4. Re:Two computers is too expensive and cumbersome by ColdWetDog · · Score: 1

      If you are having an issue like that, then you should have the knowledge and technical know how to change the connectors with something non standard. Say for example, take the ethernet port and replace it with an 8 pin DIN connector. No chance of that being plugged into the wrong network accidentally.

      (Yes, I used a DIN as it comes to mind, but it could have issues, as other things use it, you could make a completely different connector for it if you wanted.)

      All you have to do is to wire the Ethernet cables differently from standards (and color code them lest hours of amusement and consternation ensue).

      --
      Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
  20. Bullshit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The actors compromised privileged credentials, dumped password hashes, and gathered system, file, and network information for several systems.

    And yet, they didn't properly cover their tracks? Just how exactly would you find out that someone has dumped password hashes a few months since the incident? Sure, that's first thing to do for anyone who just got access to interesting target, but how would you prove it with 90-100% certainty?

  21. US Support by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    US support of Israel and their defense industry is a cheaper way to develop weapons. And also funnel public money into Republican campaign contributions.

  22. This is a good thing. by satuon · · Score: 1

    If those attacks continue, and if they cause damage, people will start paying attention and will change the way their OS is secured. I think that the Android OS has it right - no user-generated files should be executable in any way, including scripts. You have 2 partitions - one that is executable, but only admins can write to it, and one that the user can write in, but nothing is executable there.

  23. Even worthless system are worth a lot by aepervius · · Score: 1

    If you can see how it was done, see what the flaw is, and improve on the flaw. A worthless system is a system which was tried and which you can learn from without trying yourself. That means million dollar of R&D spared. Plus not all part of the system will be worthless.

    --
    C. Sagan : A demon haunted world:
    http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0345409469/
    visit randi.org
    1. Re:Even worthless system are worth a lot by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      that would be a failed system, not a worthless system

  24. Re:They were in their system for four months?!?! by 1s44c · · Score: 1

    The old design was always strong firewalls between the network and the Internet and nothing else. A lot of companies really believe that a stateful firewall will somehow prevent windows users running god knows what malware on their web connected desktop machines. Plus there are all the laptops and other devices staff plug straight into the core network. Plus VPN connection bridging the firewalls.

    Computer security in most companies is a joke. That, apparently, includes defense contractors.

  25. Antisemitic hackers by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The people who did this are obviously antisemitic.

  26. Re:They were in their system for four months?!?! by ruir · · Score: 1

    Not really, the old design was an air gap, a small network without outside connectivity at all.

  27. Technology transfer by lagomorpha2 · · Score: 1

    So Chinese hackers stole American technology from Israel? You mean Israel didn't just sell it to the Chinese this time?

    1. Re:Technology transfer by mpe · · Score: 1

      So Chinese hackers stole American technology from Israel? You mean Israel didn't just sell it to the Chinese this time?

      Alternativly it was a US (or Israeli) competitor covering their tracks by pretending to be from China.

    2. Re:Technology transfer by dbIII · · Score: 1

      That time around 2000 with the tank targeting system was a true moment of black comedy when after that US technology was supplied from Israel to China it was mass produced and on-sold to Iran.
      However blaming "Israel" for that one is like blaming the USA for Charles Manson - criminals exist and the thing was apparently stolen.

    3. Re:Technology transfer by Savage-Rabbit · · Score: 1

      That time around 2000 with the tank targeting system was a true moment of black comedy when after that US technology was supplied from Israel to China it was mass produced and on-sold to Iran.
      However blaming "Israel" for that one is like blaming the USA for Charles Manson - criminals exist and the thing was apparently stolen.

      It's a bit more than that, Israel helped China with air to air missiles (as in license production of the Python-3 which was a quantum leap for the PLAAF) and other guided weapons and is also alleged to have helped the Chinese develop sophisticated fighter and AWACS radars, had a hand in the design of some of the latest generation of Chinese fighters and sold them a whole bunch of other technology to do with miniaturized cooling units, Electro-optics, UAVs, and sophisticate sighting systems. A lot of this technology originated in the USA and was paid for by John Q Taxpayer.

      --
      Only to idiots, are orders laws.
      -- Henning von Tresckow
    4. Re:Technology transfer by dbIII · · Score: 1

      Yes there is that one and the French Mirage Jet way back, but that specific one I mentioned ruffled enough feathers to result in the US Senate spending a bit of time on it.

    5. Re:Technology transfer by lagomorpha2 · · Score: 1

      Truly, Israel is our greatest ally. Well... the US might be Israel's ally but have they ever been ours?

  28. Microsoft Iron Dome? by lippydude · · Score: 1, Insightful

    "AI was initially breached on April 16, 2012 by a series of specially crafted email phishing attacks"

    Just who in their right minds keep 'secret' files on a Windows computer?

    1. Re:Microsoft Iron Dome? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      What does 'specially crafted email phishing' attacks have to do with Windows?

      Convincing someone to alter settings on their machine, download a file, or process some request has little to do with the OS in question.

    2. Re:Microsoft Iron Dome? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      LOL not this sad wanker again.

    3. Re:Microsoft Iron Dome? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      "AI was initially breached on April 16, 2012 by a series of specially crafted email phishing attacks"

      Just who in their right minds keep 'secret' files on a Windows computer?

      People who use CAD/CAM design tools that run on Windows.

      Besides, the initial phishing attack was simply to get their foot in the door. After that they start poking around other systems (like attacking printers, which have operating systems on them which are hardly ever updated). Also, remember that Target was breached via their HVAC network.

  29. Same Old Vulnerability by some+old+guy · · Score: 1

    So these were "carefully crafted" phishing attacks, eh? Wow, go figure. This is just another high-profile example of a basic security truism: as long as people with insufficient security awareness (and common sense) have access to data, said data is vulnerable. Once again, the weak link is between the chair and the keyboard. It always will be.

    --
    Scruting the inscrutable for over 50 years.
  30. exfiltrated? by cascadingstylesheet · · Score: 1

    "withdraw (troops or spies) surreptitiously, especially from a dangerous position."

    1. Re:exfiltrated? by raymorris · · Score: 1

      > withdraw (troops, DATA or spies) surreptitiously, especially from a dangerous position

      The term is commonly used in info sec.

    2. Re:exfiltrated? by cascadingstylesheet · · Score: 1

      > withdraw (troops, DATA or spies) surreptitiously, especially from a dangerous position

      The term is commonly used in info sec.

      OK, but it's an odd neologism.

      All told, CyberESI was able to identify and acquire more than 700 files — totaling 762 MB total size — that were exfiltrated from IAI’s network during the compromise.

      I guess you could "exfiltrate" files that you put on there ... though given the nature of files you'd probably just delete them. But you wouldn't "exfiltrate" someone else's files.

      If infiltrating is putting your own stuff in, then exfiltrating would be taking your own stuff out, logically. But language isn't always logical, sure.

  31. Mmmm by nospam007 · · Score: 2

    Looks like they could use an irone dome for their network too.

  32. Just doing their job, right? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    To quote the excuses of all those NSA apologists:

    The Chinese spying agencies are just doing what they are supposed to do, right? What's there to complain about? These are military targets, it's not like they are spying Cisco for Huawei's benefit here (not to say they aren't also doing that).

    Aren't everyone else doing the same thing? You are fool if you think the Russians, Germans, French, Japanese, Australians, etc, are not all doing it.

  33. Re:They were in their system for four months?!?! by Archtech · · Score: 1

    But you can't have an air gap in the 21st Century... employees would be cut off from Facebook and Twitter, and that would deny them their human rights.

    --
    I am sure that there are many other solipsists out there.
  34. Re:They were in their system for four months?!?! by dbIII · · Score: 1

    a stateful firewall will somehow prevent windows users running god knows what malware on their web connected desktop machines

    In the old days such machines were considered potentially hostile and not allowed on the same network as the production/process line machines. Sometimes you'd have something on both networks to carefully feed apropriate information to the potentially virus ridden machines that were used to type up reports.
    Now we've got malware far beyond the dreams of those "paranoid" days yet things are left wide open - so what do you expect when another report comes out of outsiders stealing the crown jewels?

  35. BS by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I call BS. The article is way too specific. Even if true, hackers are entering everybody's systems all the time; this is just cherry picking. The real goal is to imply: "The Chinese are backing the Palestinians". The Chinese are bad guys, so obviously...

  36. Yo ho, yo ho! Plundering we go! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Yo, ho, yo ho, a pirate's life for me. We pillage, we plunder, we rifle, and loot, drink up me hearties yo ho! We kidnap and ravage and don't give a hoot, drink up me hearties yo ho!

  37. Oy vey.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    At this point I don't care what happens in the Middle East. With all the fighting and stuff going on there and other places I look up to the heavens and ask for a big space rock to smack us good so nobody would have to worry about anyone elses invisible man anymore on this planet. Seriously a species who puts so much value in invisible friends to kill each other over doesn't deserve to leave the planet.

  38. Know your meme by Taagehornet · · Score: 1

    In Soviet Russia military networks hack you!

    1. Re:Know your meme by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In Soviet Russia, Borat watches you!

    2. Re:Know your meme by aliquis · · Score: 1

      Yet another Soviet America joke.

      You're doing it wrong :)

  39. Because... by mrmangosir559 · · Score: 1

    Some idiot within their company clicked on "Naked pictures of...." or you've won $2,500,000. It's having someones desktop or laptop on the same network as the important R&D network and having crappy M$ products protecting important information. If these people can develop defence systems, they can take something oscure open source OS and make it the system they use.

  40. Akin to Fukishma by xdor · · Score: 1

    If the Japanese can't manage nuclear power, who can? If the Israelis can't defend against Chinese hackers, who can?

    (Definitely blew away my misconception. I had no idea anyone in Israel was dumb enough to use a Microsoft product on their network.)

  41. Re:They were in their system for four months?!?! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So why don't you put an additional computer for 500 units of your local currency on their desks ? Too expensive ? Yeah. The beancounters determined that the secrets per employee are worth less than 500 units (dollars or any other insanely inflated unit).

    Which is obviously shitty thinking, but that is how it is done.

  42. Someone must be lying by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
  43. YES!!!1 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    FUck yes!!!

    Free Palestine!!

  44. Re:Israel have murdered over 1,000 civillians by mtthwbrnd · · Score: 0

    Din't call me a lib* you dumb homo. Fucking Anonymous Coward talking to me about waving dicks around. If you think you are a big man then use your real name.

  45. Israel Uses Palestinians as Human Shields by Jeremiah+Cornelius · · Score: 1

    Survivors of massacre in Khuza’a say Israeli forces used Palestinians as human shields

    Khuza’a is a village in the very eastern part of Khan Younis adjacent to the border fencein the southern Gaza strip. Its farmers have faced death almost on a daily basis in the past 7 years as Israeli gunfire has become the norm along the buffer zone between Gaza and Israel.

    Following the Shuja’iyehmassacre, Israeli forces invaded Khuza’a withaerial strikes targeting any moving object. Survivors recall with horror thatseemingly heavy random tank fire led to the killing of dozens, injuring dozens others.

    Over 150 of its residents were arrested by Israeli forces. Most of them were released, others are still in detention. Rescue calls were made live on the local radio stations, as many residents were besieged in their homes, unable to leave. Those who managed to leave came under fire as they were fleeing.

    Ayman Abu Toaimah, 32, a resident of Khuza’arecalls,“As Israeli invading troops advanced to the village they besieged it and used residents as human shields. When the Israeli army arrested people and then released some of them, they were told they are free to go back to the village, but as they were fleeing they came under fire and some of them shot dead. These people were used as human shields.”

    Abu Saleem, 56, a resident of Khuza’aechoedAbu Toaimah,“Israelis claim that Hamas is using us as human shields– how? This is a lie, we do not see fighters in the streets. It’s them, the Israelis who used us as human shields in Khuza’a and Shuja’iyeh. They turned our houses into military posts, terrified residents in the houses. They attacked innocent civilians with their bombs, and missiles, they attacked chicken farms, they burned our crops, they have no mercy.”

    What happened in Khuza’a was a massacre. Civilians were killed in their homes and while they were fleeing. Even ambulances were not immune. Paramedics report that Israeli forces stopped ambulances that were trying to reach casualties and tried to arrest a number of wounded. Ambulances came under fire despite the coordination by the International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC). Scenes of dead bodies scattered in the streets reminiscent ofthe Sabra and Shatila massacre that took place in two Palestinian refugee camps in 1982 have begun to leak out of the village.

    Abu Ali Qudail a resident of Khuza’a said: “When the ICRC told us that ambulances are waiting usat the entrance of the village from the western side, about 1,000 people rushed to leave their homes, some of which were used as a hideout for Israeli forces. As people were leaving they were surprised that the ambulances were not there, and as we were waiting tank shells rained down on our heads.”

    Many people were killed, many others injured. Survivors say they could not help the wounded, many were still under the rubble, homes were destroyed and the smell of smoke and bombs was everywhere.

    Abu Ali Qudail continued: “I was watching members of my family dying in front of me, some of them were torn to pieces. Rami, Ibrahim, Alia, Haj Abed died..we had to leave them behind, as soon as we reached one of the Khan Younis schools we entered it to seek shelter but it was very crowded with people who fled their homes. It’s hard to see people dying and you do not know what to do. One of my relatives’ homes were struck while they were inside.”

    As the all-out Israeli assault on Gaza entered its 19th day, John Kerry announced from Cairo that he proposed a one week ceasefire, but Israel’s PM Netanyahu refused the offer and only agreed to a 12-hour lull.

    Ma’an News reports on one family thatfled Khuza’a andwas then killed by an Israeli missile strike in Khan Younis as the ceasefire went into effect:

    Minutes before a 12-hour

    --
    "Flyin' in just a sweet place,
    Never been known to fail..."
  46. "Velvet Glove?" - Israel Murders Babies by Jeremiah+Cornelius · · Score: 1

    Zionism == Fascist Genocide
    "Children killed in their sleep by Israel"

    Israeli military fire hit a United Nations-run school in Gaza today, killing at least 20 people and injuring an estimated 90 people. The school under attack, called the Abu Hussein girls’ elementary school, is located in the densely-populated Jabaliya refugee camp.

    The United Nations Relief Works and Agency (UNRWA), the group that serves Palestinian refugees, issued a stern statement placing the blame for the attack on the Israeli army.

    “Last night, children were killed as they slept next to their parents on the floor of a classroom in a UN designated shelter in Gaza. Children killed in their sleep; this is an affront to all of us, a source of universal shame. Today the world stands disgraced,” said UNRWA Secretary General Pierre Krähenbühl. “We have visited the site and gathered evidence. We have analysed fragments, examined craters and other damage. Our initial assessment is that it was Israeli artillery that hit our school, in which 3,300 people had sought refuge.”

    Krähenbühl added that the Israeli attack violated international law, and that UNRWA had informed Israel of the location of the school 17 times. The Palestinians who were sheltering there had been told by the Israeli military to flee their Gaza neighborhoods, only to be hit by Israeli shells at the place they thought would be safe. An estimated 240,000 displaced Palestinians are being sheltered in UNRWA facilities.

    Israeli army spokespeople claim that Palestinian fighters fired from near the school–a claim they have frequently made when confronted by their attacks on civilians.

    It was the second time in two weeks that an attack on a UN school caused deaths. Israel denies it hit the UN school in Beit Hanoun it bombarded last week, though Gaza-based journalists like The Daily Beast’s Jesse Rosenfeld have cast doubt on those claims, writing that the evidence appears to indicate Israeli fire hitting the area. The attack killed 16 people. UNRWA spokesman Chris Gunness said last week that three other UNRWA installations had been fired on by Israel, injuring five Palestinians in one incident.

    UNRWA has also had to contend with Palestinian rockets being stored in schools that were abandoned. But there is no evidence that the schools hit by Israeli fire have rockets in them.

    The attack on the UNRWA school in Jabaliya came after another night of heavy Israeli bombardment. The Gaza Ministry of Health said that over 70 Palestinians were killed since midnight. That brings the death toll to well over 1,200 Palestinians, the vast majority of them civilians.

    Israel declared what it called a “humanitarian window” for four hours today–but also said it would continue to operate militarily in areas where soldiers were already firing. Hamas called it a declaration meant for the media and did not halt its fire. Israeli shells killed at least five Palestinians during the “humanitarian window, Ma’an News Agency reported. And another Israeli attack on a market in the Gaza neighborhood of Shuja’iyeh killed at least 15 people.

    --
    "Flyin' in just a sweet place,
    Never been known to fail..."
  47. Re:Israel have murdered over 1,000 civillians by mtthwbrnd · · Score: 0

    Some spineless cunt has marked this as troll... another anonymous cowardly aggressor: Must be eligible for an Israeli passport.

  48. Re:They were in their system for four months?!?! by ruir · · Score: 1

    He is being ironic with the "human" rights. Nevertheless, in banks and other settings, it is an huge liability to connect to anything else then your corporate network. Think about reverse tunnels, botnets and malware.