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Reversible Type-C USB Connector Ready For Production
orasio writes: One of the most frustrating first-world problems ever (trying to connect an upside-down Micro-USB connector) could disappear soon. The Type-C connector for USB has been declared ready for production by the USB Promoter Group (PDF). "With the Type-C spec finalized, it now comes down to the USB-IF to actually implement the sockets, plugs, cables, adapters, and devices. The problem is that there are billions of existing USB devices and cables that will need adapters and new cables to work with new Type-C devices. It’s a lot like when Apple released the Lightning connector, but on an even grander scale. Further exacerbating the issue is the fact that China, the EU, and the GSMA have all agreed that new mobile devices use Micro-USB for charging — though it might be as simple as including a Micro-USB-to-Type-C adapter with every new smartphone."
n/t
So, all you folks who thought that it was a great idea for the EU to legislate the "One True Connection" please discuss.
Because - and the Libertards will hate this - the ultimate goal of capitalism is to make bank, not to do useful things. Sometimes the goals coincide, but mostly they do not. In that case, you employ psychology ("marketing") to make people feel that they're getting what they always wanted, when all they're really doing is making you richer.
Here is an example of de rigueur bullshittery.
(And, no, you ideological retards, I'm not a commie.)
You heard me! Screw all of you who think it's a good connector!
One of the most frustrating first-world problems... they keep inventing new incompatible connectors for no good reason (at least for the consumer).
This is genius.
"This new connector, whose only value is that it's reversible, doesn't work on the billions of existing devices. Why don't we include a non-reversible adapter?"
Hell, for extra convenience, just leave the adapter on the cable all the time.
.revelc woh ...
It little behooves the best of us to comment on the rest of us.
what are the advantages that outweigh the currently universal cheap data/power cables?
I know, one more USB connector to have an adaptor for... But this is how the mini/micro and even old USB 'A' should have been from the beginning.
There's nothing worse than having to blind mate USB, and having to flip it four bloody times before it works. (except maybe blind mating 'F' connectors, or sometimes D sub..)
Sent from my PDP-11
One of the most frustrating first-world problems... they keep inventing new incompatible connectors for no good reason (at least for the consumer).
Ahh, quit your complaining and buy the converter like a good rube... It was good enough for Apple!
Where I like the reversible nature and the current capacity of the new connector, I'm frustrated too. I only just now got enough cables to run all the devices I have in all the places I need them and now I've got another cable type to mess with once I switch out the next device. Hopefully the cables won't be as expensive as those Apple lightning, you pay though the nose because we're APPLE, cables. Thanks..
"File to fit, pound to insert, paint to match" - Aircraft Maintenance 101
As an Apple customer, I am quite happy they ditched the "30-pin" connector and went with the reversible lightning connector. One less thing to fiddle with when charging my phone. Nice to see USB picking up the feature, even if it is a couple years later with implementations still not available.
That said, the cable/connector interface on the lightning cables is not nearly strong enough for the insertion/removal force required. It will be interesting to see if the USB design will work better in that regard, as the shield does provide some mechanical latching.
This is today's XKCD - and it's already out of date !
http://xkcd.com/1406/
why do they keep trying to slime beta to me? they are total tards. they don't get what is wrong with beta so without fixing it they keep sliming blaming us. BETA SUCKS and i am not going to tell you why because /. aka Dice Holdings is not open source.
Is there a reason why USB cables can't be shaped like 3.5 mm speaker cables just with more 'stripes'? Then they could be plugged in any direction and they'd be rotate-able.
http://xkcd.com/927/
A dot of white nail polish will mark the proper orientation of a usb connector for approximately 800 units. Manufacturers actually used to spend the extra 2 cents per 1000 units to do this for you. But we buy our shit from china now, and all we have left in the UdotS is people think up ways to screw you just a little more. Because you demand it.
I thought that the third world bought their technology from the first world. Like USB devices...
What do you mean, not strong enough? We've managed to walk an Apple wall wart out of an outlet several times. The lightning connecter stayed connected to the iPad.
Perl Programmer for hire
.. momentarily.
"The greatest lesson in life is to know that even fools are right sometimes" - Winston Churchill
The EU threatened to make a law to unify the charging connector if the mobile phone industry didn't come to an agreement on their own. They did come to an agreement (Micro-USB), so there is no law. That agreement ended, btw, so the specter of a unified connector by law has reappeared, and with wildly differing power requirements and different ways of signalling charge modes, more standardization is indeed necessary.
If you can plug in the USB either way, then there will not be scratch marks on the phone when a drunk tried to plug it in the wrong way. Then his brother might not have tell tale scratches in the phone he borrowed. Then how can Sherlock impress Watson? Bad idea.
sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
Yeah, and you know what also suck? The gas tank on my car which is on only on the left side. I can never remember this and half of the time I'm in the wrong way at the gas station. (Yes, I had to do the obligatory car analogy.)
Seriously, how dumb are we becoming?
So they are finally getting the connector right. After 5 different connectors and almost 20 years they are finally going to fix the USB connector problem (at least most of them). Not only that but they designed with a future awareness that will hopefully prevent the Micro-USB3 nightmare (two connectors in one) in the future.
It's Smaller than every previous USB connection.
It's reversible so you can plug it only one time.
They designed it with the ability to add additional wires in the future as the standard evolves.
The C connector supports USB 3.1 which allows up to 100watts of power transfer (enough to power smaller laptops).
IIRC it's also designed to put less strain on the connection to the circuit board so you won't get the solder flex failure so common with USB.
What they got wrong is it's almost indistinguishable from Micro without close examination. They didn't put in a color or other requirement that would have made the port obvious without close examination, even though it's smaller a LOT of people are going to be trying to plug USB micro connectors into these ports.
All in all I'd say the USB working group finally fixed a few major problems with USB and it's a good standard that will probably eventually replace all A,B,Mini and Micro ports over the next few years. The beauty is finally incorporating 100watt capability, it should be possible to have standard power adapters on laptops that use 1 or 2 USB ports for power eliminating the need to replace your power brick all the time.
Please keep in mind an important aspect of this new cable, it supports 100 watts power transfer. That means most devices, including laptops, can be charged through this one connector. I see that as the best reason to switch, fast charging and universal connector for all my devices. The article glosses over that important detail. It also enables 10 Gbs data transfer.
Look at your fuel gauge in the car. There is a little arrow on it that tells you which side your gas tank is on.
Proof that cables exist in 4-dimensional space:
http://www.smbc-comics.com/ind...
Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent. Polar Scope Align for iOS
Seriously, how dumb are we becoming?
We aren't dumb at all, as evidenced by multiple directionless plugs taking over where annoying plugs held sway before.
That's a lot of pointless time saved in aggregate.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
The USB 3.0 Micro B connector is horrendous design:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U...
Seriously, worst connector ever. Did they really think that abomination would be used on cellphones?
No good reason? Really?
Look on the bright side - with Type-D they'll figure out how to go reversible and genderless and then we'll be done for good.
My God, it's Full of Source!
OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
Work colleague got a new Ford Ranger, the arrow points to the wrong side :-P
Don't they call that Bluetooth?
"Eagles may soar, but weasels dont get sucked into jet engines."
Qi for charging. BT or WiFi for data xfer
Type-C is reversible and genderless. It also is rated to deliver up to 30W. To deliver more than that they would need to make the connector bigger, which phone users wouldn't like.
Work colleague got a new Ford Ranger, the arrow points to the wrong side :-P
That's not the wrong side, it's just that on his Ranger, the arrow points to which side of the pump you're supposed to be on.
In view of recent revelations that USB Security is fundamentally broken, is the new spec just for a connector or does it include any interface implementation of better security? http://www.wired.com/2014/07/u...
The cable connection at the lightning connector has failed on me several times, specifically because the connector stays connected to the device. The removal force exceeds the strength of the cable. Yes, I understand you shouldn't pull from the cable, but the connector body is sometimes too small to get a good hold on.
No more USB superposition?http://i.imgur.com/yyEwOHK.png
And that's on the gas logo.. Which is at the "full" position. My eyeballs are looking at the "empty" position.. The arrow is missing.
At some point in your life you're going to have to go all Zen about it and not care so much.
Only then can you throw those old SCSI cables out.
Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
...security and protection in having the only phone in a house of seven that uses my phone's proprietary data and charger cable. everybody else loses or has their cables 'borrowed'.. but not me.. at least not until i need a new phone.
Look on the bright side - with Type-D they'll figure out how to go reversible and genderless and then we'll be done for good.
Along those lines: the "gendering" (sort of) of USB was deliberate. USB is a master/slave protocol with a host that supplies power and a device that (optionally) consumes it. The cables were designed to prevent people from connecting two hosts together and shorting out their power supplies. The newer USB On-The-Go (OTG) standard allows two hosts to connect using special connectors (micro-AB) to control power switching and a connection protocol for deciding which end is the master, but it's pretty complicated and requires analog voltage measurement. Fun to have on a smart phone, but massive overkill for most devices.
Visit the
The fuel port belongs on the driver's side. Cars with it on the other side are wrong.
(you are probably not old enough to remember cars with the cap under the license plate, I am barely old enough to remember... much less drive one)
No real device actually implement OTG - it's such a complex protocol with HNP and role-switching that very few people bothered. Especially since the real goal for the manufacturer really just wanted USB host support, USB client support, and not worry about HNP or other nonsense.
USB Forum did listen though, as USB 3.0 abandoned the OTG spec. Instead, they have "Dual Role Device" or DRD. Basically it can be a host or client depending on the voltage applied to a pin. No complex HNP or other protocol - the user basically just plugs in an adapter to bring it back to the normal USB A female plug.
OTG was conceived as a way for two people to connect their phones or other devices together and share data - HNP and role-switching as necessary in order to properly handle the transfer. It was all brilliant and everything, but so overly complex with high software requirements. Bluetooth also came around which basically handled all the use cases that USB OTG was envisioning, so in the end, the only real use was to provide USB host mode.
Funny, all my micro usb cables as small marking on one side indicating the "up" side of connector... Newer had any other problem then that damn connector is so damn small. Requires some accuracy to put it in dark to correct spot of phone...
At some point in your life you're going to have to go all Zen about it and not care so much.
Only then can you throw those old SCSI cables out.
Hah, I scrapped 4 cubic yards of collected computer detritus, including at least a dozen different SCSI cables (with some ultraSCSIs) today. Been needing to do that for years. I did shed a bit of a tear over the Amiga stuff, though.
Yes, I donated to anyone and everyone all that I could before I scrapped. But 4 working PCs couldn't even be given away to an orphanage!
As if Mini A, Mini B, Mini C, Micro A Micro B, Micro C, Standard A, Standard B along with all those proprietary plugs weren't enough.
If the current plugs had an obvious up/down, it would go a long way to knowing which way they go. For a phone, up would be the front. For a PC, up would be marked on the plug by a face and side feeling/looking different. Those go up, depending on whether it's a horizontal or vertical socket. Things are market but it's not very visible and not tactile so you know what to feel for. This would fix the problem well enough without changing the mechanical/electrical specification.
Micro-usb claims 10k insertions, as does the new standard. Unfortunately that 10k seems to be assuming perfect alignment. Probably a robot test it. In the real world micro-usb seems quite fragile. I've lost cables, phone, chargers etc. Seems like things average around a year of daily use. Am I just unlucky? Never had problems with usb or mini-usb.
If I can power my laptop and get a network connection (powerline ethernet) over the same cable, that would be really sweet.
If i look at the pictures correctly, the male portion of this interface is in the device, while the cable is essentially 'female' inside? Who's bright idea was this? The male side is much more likely to break.
For the sake of other lazy people, can someone respond to me and answer the following.
What is becoming reversible, just the USB Micro style size or the larger sizes too?
Are we just skipping everything and moving to the one plug at both ends for all USB connections possibly?
If we do move to said plug, what aobut strength? I've seen some mock up pics of the proposed plug, it looks great for a phone, it doesn't look great for a printer / back of a PC - looks quite delicate.
Type-C is [...] genderless.
No it's not.
systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
with Type-D they'll figure out how to go reversible and genderless
The two are mutually exclusive, aren't they?
systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
RTS: Apparently not, although it might be hard to make it obvious which way they can be oriented.
systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
Wrong; if all cars have the cap on the same side it leads to inefficiency at pumps when big vehicles / those too bad at driving to park sufficiently close to the pumps cause queues by having to wait to park on the same side of the pump. Yes, I know that pretty much every pump has a long enough hose that it doesn't matter which side you park on at least with a smallish car, but it still seems beyond some people. Optimally 50% of cars will have the cap on the left, 50% on the right.
The idea is to have an unified Type-C connector every where.
Long term plan is to have on both side, device side (harddisk, tablet, phone) and host side (laptop, power plug, etc.)
(Juste like 6 wired FireWire 400 had the same connector everywhere)
Althought they probably will begin used with A to C cables.
"Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]
The problem is that there are billions of existing USB devices and cables that will need adapters and new cables to work with new Type-C devices. It’s a lot like when Apple released the Lightning connector, but on an even grander scale.
What problem? My existing micro-usb devices won't need adapters, new devices with Type-C connectors will come with Type-C to Type-A cables, and when desktops/laptops start to come with Type-C connectors I'll just buy some new cables.
It's the same situation when micro-usb replaced mini-usb, I don't remember there being a problem on a "grand scale" then either.
Wouldn't you have been better off if they had gone to Micro USB though? It's cheap, ubiquitous, supports full 1080p video without nasty compression and does everything else that the Lightning connector does. Apple could even have added some extra pins for their own functions, like Samsung and HTC have done, while still retaining full compatibility.
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
That may be how OTG was conceived but I never heard of anyone using it that way.
People (including me) use it for USB keyboard, mice, hard disks, flash drives on phones or tablets which also act as removable media to a PC.
blog.sam.liddicott.com
Wrong; if all cars have the cap on the same side it leads to inefficiency at pumps when big vehicles / those too bad at driving to park sufficiently close to the pumps cause queues by having to wait to park on the same side of the pump. Yes, I know that pretty much every pump has a long enough hose that it doesn't matter which side you park on at least with a smallish car, but it still seems beyond some people. Optimally 50% of cars will have the cap on the left, 50% on the right.
It is not about the pump, as the hose is long enough to allow filling cars on both sides of the isle, but about the driver being able to check what is being done to his car on gas stations with full service.
Obligatory XKCD
You still have to rotate it to one of those two angles. What about the other 358 degrees?
How long will it be before the appliance manufacturers and the electricians realize that if they change the plugs on appliances, they can make a bajillion dollars rewiring homes and offices?
At some point in your life you're going to have to go all Zen about it and not care so much.
Personally, I don't care what cable it is. All I really care about is being able to plug in what I need to, when and where I need to.... Well, that and how much all the adapters and cables my devices use cost me.
Well, I suppose that's not exactly true, I do care about my wife not complaining about "all the unsightly wires" I have to keep around so I can get the pictures off the cameras, charge any of the phones we have, sync the various "i Devices" of multiple types and ages and all the various tablets laying about.... It's taking over the house I tell you, and it's a source of marital discord because of course it's MY mess and my fault when I cannot find the right connector to accomplish what ever technical task she needs NOW but doesn't know how to do herself....
"File to fit, pound to insert, paint to match" - Aircraft Maintenance 101
http://d3dsacqprgcsqh.cloudfront.net/photo/6756457_700b.jpg
microUSB does NOT SUPPORT TV OUT.
Sorry, but do not confuse MHL, SlimPort or other "let's hack a micro USB compatible connector" standard with micro USB. MHL and SlimPort (two INCOMPATIBLE standards for video over something-that-appears-to-be-microUSB) are different ways of transmitting the video.
MHL is traditionally converted to HDMI (limited to 1080i60 or 1080p30, MHL 2.0 is required for 60fps support at 1080p) and the MHL-HDMI link is relatively strong. However, it is NOT a part of the HDMI spec - MHL is managed separately and independently from HDMI.
SlimPort is another standard - it's a bit more compelling because it allows for trivial conversion to DisplayPort via an adapter. But it's DisplayPort, and you need a converter (most likely active) to convert it to HDMI.
But you cannot connect a MHL device via a SlimPort cable and expect it to work.
And let's not forget we want a spec to last 10 years. In 10 years we've seen numerous changes to the USB port so you do need a small gaggle of adapters to be able to connect anything to anything. (There's a few popular ones, like micro A and A, but there's also mini-A for the few devices that had them on the host side. On the device side you have B, mini B, micro B. Assuming you ignore USB 3.0, because the 3.0 device side connectors only plug into 3.0 devices). For Apple, you have two cables - a 30 pin, or lightning.
And as someone who has had devices with MHL and moved to ones with SlimPort, it's frustrating because stuff doesn't work anymore. Even Apple at least made a converter to keep old stuff working.
Plus, the microUSB port is awful and unidirectional with it enforced by a flimsy piece of plastic. It won't be more than a day before we hear reports of users who basically broke the thing on their iPhones and iPads.
OTOH, at least there would be some standardization of connectivity - you won't see Android makers putting the USB port anywhere other at the bottom center oriented one way (which happens to be the way Apple chose), so at least Android docking stations would be more than clumsy things that consist of a device holder and a 3.5mm plug to go into your audio jack and a micro USB cable to charge (optional).
We finally got to the point where we have an effective standard and I no longer had to use all the various adapters to be able to plug various devices in. Now Type-C USB comes along to ruin that? Reversibility is a minor advance at best, certainly not enough to be worth giving up having to go back to cable adapters and such.
And its logical conclusion.
I have one right here on my desk. It connects a cheapo (but effective) battery charger to a USB power supply. The charger has an A socket, and it connects to a standard charger via an AA cable.
I keep meaning to superglue it into the charger to prevent someone connecting two of my computers together and something horrible happening.