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Update: Raspberry Pi-Compatible Development Board Cancelled
An anonymous reader writes "Anyone who might have been interested in the miniature Raspberry Pi compatible board mentioned here a month ago should know the board has been cancelled due to problems sourcing the Broadcom SoC. Given the less than welcoming response from the rpi community to the board's release, there is speculation as to why Hardkernel is having trouble buying the chip.
... need i say more. Who in their right mind would make anything with a broadcom chip.
There's a wide and robust SoC community out there. You people who keep pushing the Pi in our faces are doing a disservice to the larger progressive community.
I used to work at Sun Microsystems and had to deal with Broadcom chips in the servers. In order to get access to Hardware Reference Manuals, I almost was compelled to sign away rights to my 1st *and* 2nd born. Broadcom does not want anyone to be able to write drivers to their hardware ever, unless you pay them a huge royalty.
I've worked with Broadcom chips in some circumstances in my job as an embedded software engineer. It's seldom been pleasant.
They won't even talk to a little player, or anyone else who is unlikely to place an order for large numbers of chips. I know of tier-2 telecommunications equipment companies - well-known names - who were turned down by Broadcom. Even if you are a big player, technical support is even harder to get. They make you sign NDAs for every little thing. I saw this becoming an issue with the Raspberry Pi when it came out a few years ago as there was no documentation for the graphics hardware.
It's just the way they do business. I think they're about volume rather than margin. They're not even vaguely interested in enthusiasts or small scale jobs.
My favourite supplier is Freescale. They make almost all their documentation and software public, and you can buy their chips singly in the channel if you want. I have a suspicion that Intel (who are showing in interest in this market) and Atmel would probably also be very helpful.
Best advice to a small project like this is very much as follows : don't bother with Broadcom. They don't want your business.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
Eben Christopher Upton is a Technical Director and ASIC architect for Broadcom. He is also a founder and former trustee of the Raspberry Pi Foundation, and now CEO of the Raspberry PI trading company.[4] He is also responsible for the overall software and hardware architecture of the Raspberry Pi device.[5][6]
a) The response in the linked thread was quite welcoming, most hoping for some competition.
b) The most likely answer is that ogdroid couldnt muster up a large enough order for SoCs so broadcom said 'nah'. The only way RPI got around this was having a broadcom employee on their team.
c) The *rumor* is that RPI pressured broadcom into not selling the chips, which was started by someone on a competitor's blog.
Here's what one person said about it:
What I don't like about this project is that they simply use all the work (software development) of the foundation and the RPi community to sell their product. They call it "compatibility" but in fact it means: let other people do all the work and we make money from it.
Someone is new to open source/designs I see. Arduino has a bazillion knockoffs that are compatible yet they still seem to be doing okay. Unless RPi isn't an open architecture - in which case, why do we advocate its use?
Because that way they'd have sold a lot more.
Hardkernel wasn't using Broadcom SoC anyway?
The linked article makes it pretty clear they were basing it on Samsung Exynos SoCs - who *cares* whether or not Broadcom would source them parts, if they weren't even using Broadcom in their design?!? This is like using a Motorola 6502 in a design, and then claiming that Intel wouldn't sell you 8008's ... what the hell?
for the rhombus-tech project i also contacted broadcom, to ask for access to one of their chips (this was before the raspberry pi). i can confirm that, just as other people are reporting, the conversation basically indicates that broadcom as a company doesn't wish to make money.
To round up comments so far:
"Nasty Nasty Broadcom"
"Pi is bad because it uses Broadcom"
"You can't use it for "education" because you can't get the graphics datasheet and the works are encased in a blob."
Yet the Pi IS a cheap and flexible general purpose computer and depending on your educational perspective you don't NEED access to low-level information. Its also important to remember that the Pi originated as Eben Uptons home project consisting of a wire-wrapped board containing an Arduino processor to create a simple programmable study computer before the move was made to the Broadcom chip to improve performance and flexibility. There's no need to invoke charges of conspiracy or even cronyism.
All we see here is the typical slashdot kneejerk response to all things Broadcom. There may be cases where this might be valid, but not as far as the pi is concerned.
Other small computing modules exist. Use one of those if it fits your particular need and quit whining!
And I predict the carton box will become a great collector's item. The arduino also has a great contender.
No manufacturer wants to sell in small lots. If I called up Intel directly and said I want a hundred of anything, their salesman would laugh at me too. That's what distributors are for. They buy in volume and sell to the little people. Or other board makers that bought more than they need and want to unload some. Looking at Alibaba.com right now I can see more than one, likely in the latter category. Available in any quantity Hardkernel would likely want to buy, and at a price point that should make the boards doable at their current selling price.
I have a hard time believing that their discontinuing the board is linked in any way to Broadcom's refusal to sell to them directly. I would be more inclined to believe they didn't get the interest they thought they would, and that the RPI community's antipathy towards them has given them cold feet.
Sorry, but it's not "you're a pal and a cosmonaut", it's actually "you're a pal and a conflagrant". This is, of course, a subtle allusion to how smoking hot these ladies are.
Can someone please Rule 34 Estelle Getty for us? It would be a service to humanity.
From my reading, Hardkernel has some other, unrelated boards that use the Samsung. They wanted to release a board which would be software compatible with the RPi, and that would mean using the Broadcom SOC.
Using your analogy, it would be as if a company who previously made products with Motorola chips wanted to release a PC-compatible system to run Windows. Intel and AMD wouldn't work with them , so they had to cancel their planned x86 product.
MOS made the 6502, not Motorola.
More reality-distorted Apple "History".
why do we advocate its use?
Why do people rave about it? Because it's cheap.
Forget all the principled arguments: free software, "for the children", pretty coloured boxes, or hackability. The only reason people buy Pis is the price. The only thing that most of them do is them load XBMC and then brag to their friends how they got a $99 media player for fifty bucks.
We're all tarts: chasing after the cheapest price and free-est stuff. Nobody really cares whether the software is FOSS, the hardware is open source or if the PCB is made out of panda skin. If it low on the $$$$'s it's top of every geek's wishlist.
politicians are like babies' nappies: they should both be changed regularly and for the same reasons
There's plenty of other low-cost embedded systems that use Linux.
I think you mean to say 'the only reason Slashdot geeks buy Pis.' Schools buy them, or assign their students to buy one, for use in the classroom. It's a computer designed around education, not for geeks. The whole package includes not just a SBC with a barebones Linux image. It includes curriculum, and a community of educators who know how to teach using it.
But would a shill advise the reader that "Other small computing modules exist. Use one of those if it fits your particular need..."? :-)
Does anyone really care about another failed attempt?