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Bioethicist At National Institutes of Health: "Why I Hope To Die At 75"

Posted by samzenpus on from the end-of-the-line dept.

HughPickens.com writes Ezekiel J. Emanuel, director of the Clinical Bioethics Department at the US National Institutes of Health, writes at The Atlantic that there is a simple truth that many of us seem to resist: living too long renders many of us, if not disabled, then faltering and declining, a state that may not be worse than death but is nonetheless deprived. "It robs us of our creativity and ability to contribute to work, society, the world. It transforms how people experience us, relate to us, and, most important, remember us. We are no longer remembered as vibrant and engaged but as feeble, ineffectual, even pathetic." Emanuel says that he is isn't asking for more time than is likely nor foreshortening his life but is talking about the kind and amount of health care he will consent to after 75. "Once I have lived to 75, my approach to my health care will completely change. I won't actively end my life. But I won't try to prolong it, either." Emanuel says that Americans seem to be obsessed with exercising, doing mental puzzles, consuming various juice and protein concoctions, sticking to strict diets, and popping vitamins and supplements, all in a valiant effort to cheat death and prolong life as long as possible. "I reject this aspiration. I think this manic desperation to endlessly extend life is misguided and potentially destructive. For many reasons, 75 is a pretty good age to aim to stop."

11 of 478 comments (clear)

  1. The WHO by gbjbaanb · · Score: 5, Insightful

    "hope I die before I get old".... until I get old, that is, and then I expect to scrap life along as much as humanly possible.

    1. Re:The WHO by Mr+D+from+63 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      We'll see how he feels when he's 75.

    2. Re:The WHO by amiga3D · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I can't say how I will feel at 75 but already at 55 I'm thinking that I'm not all that desperate to live forever. What's the point of living when their is no real enjoyment? When it hurts to get out of bed and you can't go and do what you want when you want? When you aren't living but just existing and waiting to die? I can see his point easily enough. I'm pretty sure that if I get cancer after 70 I'm just going to start the bucket list. I don't want to be 90 laying in bed waiting for someone to come change my diaper.

    3. Re:The WHO by CrimsonAvenger · · Score: 5, Interesting

      My parents are both 75+.

      And still doing fine.

      Yeah, they've slowed down a bit, and have some aches and pains they didn't have 20 years ago. But they still walk the dog a mile or so each day. And Dad still mows five acres (give or take, the treeline could have moved some over the last decade) of his yard weekly.

      I think this bioethicist bozo is forgetting that "75" is life expectancy at birth. If you make it to 75 today, odds are good you've got another decade or two in you*. And if you're born today, by the time you're 75, you should have four or five decades left*.

      * barring unpredictable things like terminal cancer, of course.

      Note that my wife's parents were both born in the early 1920's, and both lasted into this decade. Arguably, they'd have both been better off to have died a year earlier than they did (in both cases, their last year was pretty bad), but that still meant 85+ good years starting from before the Great Depression....

      --

      "I do not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"
    4. Re:The WHO by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 5, Insightful

      My thoughts exactly. He'll change his mind.

      Quite likely, especially since his basic premise is wrong. Many people get dementia as they age, but many others don't. It is not inevitable. I know bright, active people in their 90s. We are making a lot of progress at understanding the causes of Alzheimer's and other debilitating diseases of old age. His future may not be as bleak as he imagines. On the other hand, he may already be losing his grip on reality, since he believes that American are "obsessed" with exercising, and doing mental puzzles. A quick glance at obesity rates, and reality TV popularity, should disabuse him of that belief.

    5. Re:The WHO by nucrash · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I was thinking about Larry Ellison being 70 and still wanting to work and in fact, actually wanting to take a position where he can continue to be creative instead of one handling the day to day business.

      At the same time, my Grandfather passed away last year at age ninety-one. He was weeks away from being ninety-two. When asked about how old he wanted to live, he responded, "My dad lived to be ninety-two, and I think that's a good age, so I want to be ninety-two."

      Towards the end, he was being despondent and spent most of his days sleeping. There were times where he would be lucid and say some fantastic things, but for the most part, I could tell he was ready to go. He had lived a good life. Many of us in the family felt that he was due as he lived his last year in a nursing home and didn't really want to even do that.

      I do think that quality of life should be included in decisions to prolong life. Terry Schaivo was a case where there was nearly zero potential to improve her life. Other times, I sense that some of these hospital administrations are doing what they can to bilk insurance companies in order to extend a person's life regardless of the eventuality of their passing. Not to sound completely inhumane, but if a person is going to continue their existence by suffering, are we being humane by prolonging their existence.

      There are some cases, like with Stephen Hawking, where an individual wants so much to contribute to the world that they want to exist. Because of this, there should not be any hard limit put in as far as a person's life to which we should consider ending health care.

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      Place something witty here
    6. Re:The WHO by avgjoe62 · · Score: 5, Interesting
      My Dad suffered from Lewy Body Dementia at the end of his life. Early on with the disease he had days he was OK, other days he would see and talk to people that weren't there.

      On one of the days when he was doing OK I told him that he was suffering from dementia and that he was talking to people that weren't really there. He was surprised and asked me to repeat that. When I confirmed that on his bad days he was talking to people that weren't really there his response was, "Well, at least I'll never have no one to talk to."

      --

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    7. Re:The WHO by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      Holy fuck is this WRONG and it's not funny at all.

      I worked in a dementia ward and I would not wish that on my worst enemy. It is a truly, staggeringly horrible way to go out. You don't know about the confusion, the pain, the mental trauma this disease causes, do you/ You dont just slip into a blissful state of forgetfulness, you are in a world of torment as your mind fucks you over.

      Dementia is a very distressing, traumatic disease and the reason I support assisted suicide. There are things worse than death and dementia is one of them - the piss poor jokes about dementia serve to cover up the horror that patients truly experience. And it is horror, why do you think dementia patients are drugged to the gills?

  2. I agree, 100% by NitzJaaron · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The thought of living to an age where I can no longer contribute anything of value to society, while simultaneously becoming a drain to those I love - both emotionally and financially - is not appealing to me at all.

  3. Only 5 years of retirement by irrational_design · · Score: 5, Insightful

    If I'm lucky I'll be able to retire by 70. 50 years of work and then 5 years of retirement? That sucks.

    1. Re:Only 5 years of retirement by ceoyoyo · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Enjoy your life, don't wait for your retirement. I don't see an especially good chance of ever being able to retire. Plus there are a lot of things I want to do while I can comfortably walk for eight hours a day, see, hear and smell well, and take a hit or two.