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Seattle Passes Laws To Keep Residents From Wasting Food
schwit1 writes The new rules would allow garbage collectors to inspect trash cans and ticket offending parties if food and compostable material makes up 10 percent or more of the trash. The fines will begin at $1 for residents and $50 for businesses and apartment buildings. "SPU doesn’t expect to collect many fines, says Tim Croll, the agency’s solid-waste director. The city outlawed recyclable items from the trash nine years ago, but SPU has collected less than $2,000 in fines since then, Croll says. 'The point isn’t to raise revenue,' he said. 'We care more about reminding people to separate their materials.'"
Even for the samzenpus failure machine, this article is terrible. In this case, the headline is a complete fabrication that does not reflect the reality of the article it links to or the ordinance passed by Seattle City Council. Sure, samzenpus is a hacktacular idiot who has many times before posted various rallying calls for conservatives to come have a circle-jerk here at slashdot, but this is even terrible for him. Will his next posting to the front page be about the "latte salute" from Obama?
Samzenpus, isn't it time you go find a job you're qualified for? You certainly aren't qualified as an editor, even at this website. Fox News might be hiring... or maybe townhall.com?
Damn_registrars has no butt-hole. Damn_registrars has no use for a butt-hole.
Why does the headline pretend that it does? Didn't the person who posted this bother to read the article before passing it through to the front page?
And what does it have to do with technology?
Damn_registrars has no butt-hole. Damn_registrars has no use for a butt-hole.
I really thought that was *my* bin I was dumping all that waste food into.
I am Slashdot. Are you Slashdot as well?
Coffee grinds alone probably make up 10%
Cost of inspection: $100; violator: 1 out of 10; penalty collected $1; smell, mess and the process: priceless.
What next...they dictate how much soap you use when you shower? Where will they stop? Could they limit sex in Seattle...I mean sex uses energy...and it *might* be wasting energy...which is food, therefore...in order to prevent the wasting of food...sex is outlawed!
If people end up with too much food waste; they'll find other ways of disposing of it. Like fly-tipping it.
it works where i work.
Next step : check if people use to much toilet paper by analyzing every toilet flush content.
I suppose the Seattle garbage Nazis will pay people to inspect what flows out of my sewer pipe next.
Have gnu, will travel.
The carrot instead of the stick of the law should be tried first: offer rewards for reporting rather than spankings for not. Laws like this just clog up police departments and courts, and probably increase insurance rates for trash collection companies.
Table-ized A.I.
BTW I was living under so called communism many years and I had actually more freedom than today. Regulations were not strictly followed... This is staggering...
How many communists voted for this ordinance?
Maybe they could streamline the whole process and have members of the public be required to serve on sorting duty at the dumps, kind of like jury duty. I mean it's for the environment so who cares that it's at the behest of a for profit company?
From the article:
"The council vote to pass the new composting measure was a unanimous 9-to-0. No public hearing was required."
"The average reporter we talk to is 27 years old......They literally know nothing." - Ben Rhodes
How many communists voted for this ordinance?
From the article:
"The council vote to pass the new composting measure was a unanimous 9-to-0. No public hearing was required."
"The average reporter we talk to is 27 years old......They literally know nothing." - Ben Rhodes
If you disagree with the city, you can just take it to court each time. Even the court fees (if they bill them there, they don't where I am) don't cover the city's cost of employing the prosecutor to collect that $1. I expect someone who dislikes this rule to purposely collect a couple hundred dollars in fines and take a week off work to defend them all.
He kept passing laws to stop New Yorkers from eating food, (with a more fluid definitions of "food" and "eat" of course. :-)
sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
I was in Seattle recently. The guys who pick up the compostable garbage were driving around listening to classical music.... turned up loud so you could hear it over the sound of the truck engine. Not your typical garbage collectors.
Yes, the headline is a pathetic attempt to ring the bell for the conservative Pavlovian dogs to make them salivate all over slashdot. The implication of the headline is that it is about people wasting edible food by throwing it in the trash. Actually it is about compostables (food or otherwise) being placed in the trash steam headed to the landfill rather than the composting station.
"He took a duck in the face at 250 knots." -- William Gibson, Pattern Recognition
Mod this up more. The other night I just about swore off Slashdot when I saw some idiot political clickbait. Something to do with justifying old fucks hating of Japanese. This place has jumped the shark, it's more of a comedy site than a tech news site.. and it does a poor job at either.
So, is the 10% limit by weight or volume?
And how are the trash collectors supposed to determine whether it's 9% or 11%?
Oh, and are they going to be opening plastic garbage bags to check the contents? Or are plastic garbage bags already illegal in Seattle?
"I do not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"
Good use for anyone that is involved in this.
Then you might want to start by using it on yourself. Because you are involved in this. You became involved when you said "I don't like keeping all this crap on my property. I think I'll pay someone else to take it away for me".
I'm a pretty big critic of fellow environmentalists who get carried away with authority, sometimes actually doing environmental harm in the pursuit of theory (e.g. ROHS, removal of recycled content lead from circuit boards, replaced with tin mined from Indonesian coral islands, oy vey. Like replacing plastic with "organic, natural" baby seal pelts).
However, in defense of the enviros and the article posted on /., organic waste really is a pretty cutting edge activity. A century ago pig farmers actually collected significant amounts of food waste, and until very recently the Egyptian Zabaleen community (Coptic Christians) ran a hugely successful organic waste collection system in Cairo. It was a fairly recent innovation to put recyclables and organics and junk into "landfills" and incinerators. It's legitimate to study public policy and efforts to achieve more sustainable cities.
When I was in charge of a state recycling program in the 90s (MA DEP), however, I found that rewarding positive behavior got better publicity than "fines" for not recycling. We ran a "recycling lottery" in Somerville where they'd choose a household at random and if they had their recyclables out, they got $200. It generated the awareness the Seattle fine is trying to achieve without the Drudge-Report-iness. It's also easier to backtrack if the whole thing turns out to be a mistake, if you've given out prizes for affirmative behavior instead of fines.
Gently reply
I always find it kind of weird that people who live in cities expect the government to collect the trash to begin with.
How many communists voted for this ordinance?
From the article:
"The council vote to pass the new composting measure was a unanimous 9-to-0. No public hearing was required."
That does not address party membership of the voters.
Single stream is more efficient. Dump most stuff and split it up at the far end.
No sir I dont like it.
Well, none, but one Socialist did.
I already compost all of my food waste, most of which goes into my garden. What little there is, anyway. I spent too many years nearly starving, so usually when we cook (which is about 98% of what we eat) it goes through 3 cycles of leftover re-hashes until it's all gone. What can't be used immediately gets frozen and used later. My wife and I live on 60$ a week for groceries, which includes all toiletries, paper products, and cleaning goods. Learn to compost and make use of your food intelligently and responsibly - life is cheaper, and better for the environment. And a proposal like this one will do exactly nothing to your life.
businesses aren’t subject to any composting requirements.
Food can sit in a garbage can for a week before they come by.
How do they tell the difference between wasted food and food that was thrown out because it was spoiled and unsafe to eat to start with?
The article is spot on and it's from SeattleTimes not from some blogger. For Example, NYC garbage get's shipped to other States which costs the city $1+billion a year, no where to put all that garbage, well some still ends up in the bronx. Yup, people eat like fucking pigs in this country producing so much waste especially from leftovers just sitting in the refrigerators until it's ready to be thrown out. People really need to live below their fucking means if we are to get rid of this trash problem. But I suspect the majority of garbage comes from processed foods(plastics, bottles, wrappers, etc...) made by nestle and pepsi to name a few. I live on salads, soups, home made French fries, and 2 times every 2 month's meat. But, 1 - 2 meals a day, not starving.
A vital detail that those outside the city (and many within it) don't know - and of course won't get from the inflammatory OMG! NANNY STATE! headline/summary - is that the City of Seattle doesn't have a local landfill. Hasn't for many years; there's no nearby space. Instead, all garbage is loaded onto train cars - hundreds of them a day - and sent by rail to a landfill in rural Oregon, about 250 miles away. That was the cheapest alternative for the city, even though it involves paying twice (once to transport it, and again to the landfill operator). But it's still expensive.
.
Given that it's in the best interest of the City _and_ its ratepayers to reduce the amount of landfillable waste (aka number of train cars) in favor of more economic alternatives; specifically, recycling and composting, both of which are able to be handled within a few dozen miles of the city, at much lower cost than the landfill trains. The alternative is to have even more and longer trains and higher rates for garbage for everyone.
.
Kind of the opposite of a nanny state; this is pure and simple economics. If the spectre of a few $1 fines for the few residents who can't be bothered to separate their greasy pizza boxes into another bin makes everyone's garbage rates lower, then I'm all for it.
That isn't even the dumbest thing Seattle did this week.
RTFA, all shall be revealed
No way has the USA turned in to a fascist easter state since last I was there!
If I am paying them to pick up my garbage, it's going to be MY terms. I'll just stop payment and let the trash build up.
That does not address party membership of the voters.
We're talking about Seattle's City Council, so: all Democrats except for one Socialist.
Day after it went into effect I installed an industrial garbage grinder, Now everything goes down the sewer and into the ocean. Food, compostable, newspapers, bottles,cans, everything.
You can encourage me to do something and i'll probably go along with it. Force me to do something, i will resist with every atom of my being.
Another idiot who didn't read TFA or TFS. Par for the course, this is Slashdot after all.
Horrible story title. Actually, you can waste food all you want, but you have to place it in compost bin. I still think it's a dumb law. Landfill disposal rates should be set high enough to compensate for city costs and adverse environmental impact. People would then have incentive to reduce non-recyclable waste in all kind of ways, not just by sorting.
I still have no idea why so many people have problems with sorting trash.
It is such a stupidly simple thing. Not to mention passive.
Paper? Put it with paper. Glass, in glass, metals, metal, etc.
So SO hard, my arms broke just thinking of doing such amazingly complex things.
I bet these people find it hard to rip paper containers in half to store them better in the trash as well. I bet these awful people put entire empty boxes in the trash, taking up so much space just with AIR.
Sickening how lazy people can be these days.
I can make a meal, clean any preparation and put things in the trash correctly all at the same time more or less.
It isn't exactly rocket surgery.
seattle legalized meth this week too... so what.
who banned driftwood bonfires to combat global warming.
I suspect that people will litter or put items in a neighbors trash to avoid penalties. For example if you get a sack of spoiled potatoes and fear a fine would you put them in your trash? Maybe a hole in the back yard or a toss in the local pond will happen. Some laws cause more grief than relief.
Hopefully none of that stuff is building up to eventually clog your drains -- which would then possibly cost thousands to fix. It could be a cutting off nose to spite your face situation.
Will Government also pass laws that will force us to eat our vegetables?
Oh wait, they already do that in public schools. The children will be properly trained when they reach adulthood.
Politicians and activists are so good at ignoring unintended consequences.
Where are people supposed to keep all these separate bins in their kitchen? My count says they have four: paper products, aluminum/plastic (hopefully these can be commingled), unrecyclable plastics/cloth, food scraps. This doesn't even address the bins you have to have to hold "hazardous items", like your batteries, fluorescent bulbs, paint, etc. in other areas of your home.
How do they separate this "compost" stuff from the plastic bags you have to keep it in? Or do they expect people to keep vermin-encrusted bins in their home?
What's the answer?
Gamingmuseum.com: Give your 3D accelerator a rest.
go slit your fucking wrists communist nigger loving fucktard
- bricko
I like to be frugal and not waste food.
And I don't really like raccoons or people going thru my trash.
I just hope, the city doesn't want to make it a crime to feed the homeless.
I have friends that share our leftovers with anyone we know needs the help.
If that makes us criminals, there are enough of us, to declare us a terrorist organization.
Making it a crime to help those in need, Now that sounds like terrorism.
burn your food before tossing it.
So zero communists, then. Why didn't you just say so?
A hair brain idea. Do they seriously expect the garbage collector to figure out percentages?
What were the politicians smoking when they came up with this law?
"I haven't read this law and am therefore ignorant of its actual content, but I'm comfortable making predictions about its ability to withstand a court challenge based on an inflammatory Slashdot summary! Why yes, I do huff paint daily, how did you know?"
. . . it seems the law is not intended to go after residents who "waste food." It is intended to go after residents who put significant amounts of food into the trash bin instead of the food/yard waste bin, the same way it already went after people who were throwing away large amounts of recyclable glasses or cans.
do it at a station, don't put that work on residents.
It's easier, faster, more accurate, and doesn't piss people off.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
"I have not read it .."
Then STFU.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Why am I arguing with myself?
We've been telling you to STFU for years now and that hasn't slowed you down one bit. What makes you think you're gonna change anyone's mind?
Time for a spike of in-sink garbage disposal sales!
Chicken leg quarters were on sale, so we cooked a bunch of them in the oven. We ate the chicken meat, and we made a soup from the pan drippings, but we now have a big pile of chicken bones.
I picked a whole bunch of apples off the ground from the home orchard. Since they have been on the ground, I peel them before eating them. Also, I haven't quite "turned the corner" in controlling the Apple Maggot Fly, so portions of the apples start rotting. I cut those part off, which generates even more food waste. That apple waste should not go in a home compost pile as it would just breed more apple maggot flies. Don't know of the hardiness of the larvae and pupae of this breed of fruit fly in a municipal composter. But if I had a home orchard let alone had apple maggots in it, in the State of Washington I would have already been lined up against the wall.
So I fill up a curbside bin with cooked chicken bones and apple peels, without the benefit of using a plastic grocery bag as "primary containment", besides, such bags are contraband too, and just brew a smelly mash of these items as I accumulate them in the bin in the week prior to garbage day.
Ewwwwwwww!
Are we supposed to read the articles? Shit. I've been screwing this up for years.
I'm not an expert, but I play one on slashdot.
The reason why you had "more freedom than today" was because you knew to keep your mouth shut. If you started openly ranting about it like you are now doing on Slashdot, you'd quickly found out just how free you were... and you knew that, so you didn't.
In this case, though - you can complain as loudly as you want; you can find other like-minded people and organize; and you can vote out the politicians who enacted this law, if you actually have a majority. Or you can just move to another place, and, strangely, you don't even have to ask permission!
Does the requirement to compost extend to marijuana? If you throw your stems out with your trash (as well as all the leaves and crap that are byproducts of growing your own), will you be subject to fines?
Hey, this is actually a concern there.
This is a hacked account, for which the owner can not be held responsible.
I suspect that the law actually has more to do with the incredibly vindictive, recent initiative to completely outlaw homelessness within American cities. This is another means of criminalising dumpster diving.
In MA, we're so supposed to put invasive species in the trash instead of compost.
No, I will not work for your startup
Why am I arguing with myself?
No, I'm not!
"Yes, well, it sounds delightful. I can't wait to start pawing through my garbage like some starving raccoon!"
uh - this article got it all backwards ..
the fine is if you dont compost -- you can waste all the food you want, as long as you put it in the compost bin.
Finally! A sensible, on-topic posting!
Keep thinking like an engineer/ systems person, how do they plan to compost it? What equipment will be used and at what cost? Will this be loss like recycling in NYC? Once they have this compost, what happens? Can they sell it to any of the farmers in Seattle? Are there any such farms?