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Security Collapse In the HTTPS Market

CowboyRobot writes: HTTPS has evolved into the de facto standard for secure Web browsing. Through the certificate-based authentication protocol, Web services and Internet users first authenticate one another ("shake hands") using a TLS/SSL certificate, encrypt Web communications end-to-end, and show a padlock in the browser to signal that a communication is secure. In recent years, HTTPS has become an essential technology to protect social, political, and economic activities online. At the same time, widely reported security incidents (such as DigiNotar's breach, Apple's #gotofail, and OpenSSL's Heartbleed) have exposed systemic security vulnerabilities of HTTPS to a global audience. The Edward Snowden revelations (notably around operation BULLRUN, MUSCULAR, and the lesser-known FLYING PIG program to query certificate metadata on a dragnet scale) have driven the point home that HTTPS is both a major target of government hacking and eavesdropping, as well as an effective measure against dragnet content surveillance when Internet traffic traverses global networks. HTTPS, in short, is an absolutely critical but fundamentally flawed cybersecurity technology.

16 of 185 comments (clear)

  1. So offer a cost effective replacement by brunes69 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Yes HTTPS is flawed. Name one protocol that is not.

    Unless someone can offer a cost effective replacement (IE one that can be deployed and scaled into without breaking existing technology) then the best approach is to continue and fix the flaws as they are found.

    The solution to a problem is not always "throw it away and re-write it". In fact the longer you are around in technology, the more you will realize that this is hardly ever a good idea.

    1. Re:So offer a cost effective replacement by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      As with all security, your requirements depend on your threat model. What are you trying to protect against?
      I suspect most of us just don't want thieves stealing our bank passwords, social security numbers, or credit cards.
      HTTPS is probably sufficient for that.
      If you're trying to make sure the NSA can't get at data of yours that it wants, you need something else. What that is, I don't know.

    2. Re:So offer a cost effective replacement by philipmather · · Score: 5, Funny

      Spock. I win.

      --
      Regards, Phil
    3. Re:So offer a cost effective replacement by jellomizer · · Score: 4, Funny

      Paper disproves Spock

      --
      If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
    4. Re:So offer a cost effective replacement by ArhcAngel · · Score: 4, Funny

      Please don't put IE in a post recommending a security replacement for the web. It scares me.

      --
      "A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it." - K
    5. Re:So offer a cost effective replacement by CastrTroy · · Score: 5, Interesting

      And it's the wrong solution. The solution is that I shouldn't have to send my credit card number to every retailer I want to do business with. The credit card companies and banks should have set up a system long ago so that I can send money to a retailer without having to divulge my private information to a non-trusted third party. Paypal offers something which is halfway in between. I can pay people without having to send them my credit card info. Unfortunately, I have to trust PayPal. It would make much more sense for the bank to be in control of this, since they have all the information anyway, and I would hope that they know how to keep it secure.

      --

      Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
    6. Re:So offer a cost effective replacement by NatasRevol · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Sounds like you just listened to the Apple Pay part of their announcement at the beginning of the month.

      --
      There are two types of people in the world: Those who crave closure
    7. Re:So offer a cost effective replacement by hey! · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Yes HTTPS is flawed. Name one protocol that is not.

      TELNET. Of course "flawless" means "meeting its design goals," it doesn't mean "suitable for any application."

      --
      Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
  2. locks, doors, ... by silfen · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Every lock, every door can be attacked and broken. It's no different with protocols. We don't stop locking our bikes or cars just because a government soldier with an M16 can shoot the lock open.

    1. Re:locks, doors, ... by CopaceticOpus · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Physical locks still need to be broken manually, one door at a time.

      When it comes to https, all locks can potentially be opened at once, remotely, with the click of a button, and with no sign of intrusion. It's hardly the same.

  3. Problems with TLS and PKI by NotInHere · · Score: 4, Insightful

    goto_fail is just a bug like every else. Its a major bug, yes, but its "only" a bug. There are more systemic issues.

    PKI is broken. Diginotar was just one indident we know of. CAs can secretly give everybody any cert they want. We need a system where the CAs need have to publish their certs, and which itself can't forge. Certificate transparency only centralises this "tree of trust". We still need to give the tree a ground to stand on. This can be achieved by gossip protocols. With all these measures, we don't need CAs anymore. CA is a multi-million dollar industry, they won't like being obsolete.

    Third point: Microsoft. They haven't added usable perfect forward secrecy until april 2014.

    Fourth point: the users. They don't care, or other things are more important to them (stability, etc): Most of them don't update their browsers regularly. I don't critizise clicking away security warnings.

  4. broken implementation! = bad protocol by raymorris · · Score: 5, Informative

    OpenSSL's heartbleeed bug was a bug in openssl, a buffer overrun that didn't really have anything to do with ssl. A similar bug in any other server software would be approximately as bad. Where https protocol specified a ping, openssl instead leaked the contents of arbitrary memory locations .

    Apple's goto bug was Apple's bug. Again, little to do with the protocol. Ssl/tls/https didn't fail here, the company failed to implement https.

    The one "fault" of the protocol in the cited cases could be that it isn't brain-dead simple. Since the standard isn't idiot-proof, idiots can screw it up.

  5. Folks.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    It's not HTTPS that's insecure, it's the current certificate authenticity chain.

    Eliminate that chain, work out a public exchange and verification program (something akin to bittorrent for
    gpg signed certificates from other people you trust.) and plug that in in place of the current certificate authority
    model and you're set.

    This does of course require you to have people you trust who have some way to verify they got the 'original'
    copy of the certificate, and doesn't preclude using the equivalent of modern certificate authorities if desired.
    It simply provides 3rd party verification if something appears to be up.

    If you need a good example of how this might be carried out, look up 'WASTE', then imagine combining that with slashdot's rating system utilizing the old Kevin Bacon skit about 6 degrees of separation. That should provide secure peering with a layer of trust model that would dwindle the farther away from you a 'trusted individual' is positioned. It's not as 'cheap' in terms of cpu, disk space, or memory requirements as the current system, but it would be harder to exploit than the current centralized system.

    1. Re:Folks.... by Curunir_wolf · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Mod parent up. While the poster's solution may not be the right idea, he's absolutely identified the problem: profit-driven central authority.

      --
      "Somebody has to do something. It's just incredibly pathetic it has to be us."
      --- Jerry Garcia
  6. HTTPS is not flawed by Aethedor · · Score: 5, Insightful

    From a technological point of view, it's a good protocol. It works and when implemented correctly, it's very secure. However, a PKI is not much about technology. It's mostly about organisation. In other words, it's not about PK, but all about I.

    And that's were most things go wrong. Yes, Heartbeat was about technology, but people who paid attention moved away from OpenSSL a long time ago. There are more than enough alternatives. GnuTLS and PolarSSL for example. Apple's gotofail was also about technology, but name me one piece of software that is 100% bug free.

    The real problem with HTTPS is how it's organized. When I install a browser (or get one via the OS), I also get a shit load of CA's which I'm supposed to trust. CA's from China, Turkey, Taiwan and other countries from which I don't even speak the language. I will never need a certificate from one of those CA's, because I will never need a secure connection with any website protected by their certificates. If the people from Iran were wise enough to realize that they don't need Diginotar because they don't speak Dutch, they would never be at risk because of Diginotar's epic failure. The first thing I do when installing a web browser is get rid of all the irrelevant CA's. Just to be sure, just to be safe.

    And that's what's wrong with HTTPS. That's what needs to be fixed. Trust shouldn't be imposed by a browser maker. Trust should be earned.

    --
    It doesn't have to be like this. All we need to do is make sure we keep talking.
  7. Re:Technical flaws are beside the point by timeOday · · Score: 4, Informative
    Give the article some credit, that is largely what it is about:

    To evaluate both legal and technological solutions, an understanding of the economic incentives of the stakeholders in the HTTPS ecosystem, most notably the CAs, is essential. This article outlines the systemic vulnerabilities of HTTPS, maps the thriving market for certificates, and analyzes the suggested regulatory and technological solutions on both sides of the Atlantic. The findings show existing yet surprising market patterns and perverse incentives: not unlike the financial sector, the HTTPS market is full of information asymmetries and negative externalities, as a handful of CAs dominate the market and have become "too big to fail." Unfortunately, the proposed E.U. legislation will reinforce systemic vulnerabilities, and the proposed technological solutions are far from being adopted at scale. The systemic vulnerabilities in this crucial technology are likely to persist for years to come.

    Most all the responses I see to this story so far are kneejerk response to the summary, not very relevant.