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Microsoft's Asimov System To Monitor Users' Machines In Real Time

SmartAboutThings writes Microsoft will monitor users in the new Windows 9 Operating System in order to determine how the new OS is used, thus decide what tweaks and changes are need to be made. During Windows 8 testing, Microsoft said that they had data showing Start Menu usage had dropped, but it seems that the tools they were using at the time weren't as evolved as the new 'Asimov' monitor. The new system is codenamed 'Asimov' and will provide a near real-time view of what is happening on users' machines. Rest assured, the data is going to be obscured and aggregated, but intelligible enough to allow Microsoft to get detailed insights into user interactions with the OS. Mary Jo Foley says that the system was originally built by the Xbox Team and now is being used by the Windows team. Users who will download the technical preview of Windows 9, which is said to get unveiled today, will become 'power users' who will utilize the platform in unique scenarios. This will help Microsoft identify any odd bugs ahead of the final release.

32 of 269 comments (clear)

  1. "Rest assured, the data is going to be obscured" by Cornwallis · · Score: 5, Funny

    Ha ha ha ha ha. Ha ha ha ha ha. Ha ha ha ha ha. Ha ha ha ha ha.

    Your comment violated the "postercomment" compression filter. Try less whitespace and/or less repetition.

  2. Start menu usage dropped in lieu of what? by mwvdlee · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Prior to Windows 8, what exactly where people using to start applications if they were not using the start menu?
    Or did they just notice the start menu was being used less often because people were keeping applications open?

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    1. Re:Start menu usage dropped in lieu of what? by just_another_sean · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Pinning to the task bar eliminates a good bit of Start Menu usage - especially when you pin the Run command to the task bar. And some folks still seem to love using the Desktop as both Program Manager and Documents folder.

      --
      Creationist Textbook Stickers Declared Unconstitutional by CowboyNeal
    2. Re:Start menu usage dropped in lieu of what? by rudy_wayne · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Prior to Windows 8, what exactly where people using to start applications if they were not using the start menu?
      Or did they just notice the start menu was being used less often because people were keeping applications open?

      90% of the people I see using windows have the desktop covered with icons to launch everything.

      This is probably true, but it also illustrates the problem with Microsoft removing the Start Menu.

      Removing the Start Menu provides zero benefit to the people who don't use it (they don't use it so they don't care if it's gone and removing it has no effect on how they do things) and makes things more difficult for the people who do use it.

    3. Re:Start menu usage dropped in lieu of what? by Richard_at_work · · Score: 3, Informative

      From Windows 98 onward you had the shortcut bars which you could create on the task bar - thats where the majority of my most often used applications were started from.

      That morphed into pinning applications to the task bar in Windows 7, and became much more useful as pinning an application and running that same application took up no more room on the task bar, so you could have more.

      These days I pretty much have all my applications pinned to the task bar, and I hit the start menu probably once or twice a week, if that. I can lock the computer, minimise all windows, start applications, open task manager, get to the control panel and lots of other things via either interaction with the task bar itself or via keyboard shortcuts, where as before I had to use the start menu for a lot of that.

    4. Re:Start menu usage dropped in lieu of what? by nine-times · · Score: 4, Informative

      I remember when they were talking about this research at the time. If I remember correctly, they found that most people rarely hunted through the start menu "Programs" menu. They pinned applications to their task bar, or they put shortcuts on their desktop. If they used the start menu, they usually either used the search function or the list of applications that were pinned to the start menu.

      This lead them to think that the Windows 8 UI would be fine, since you could still search, and you could still pin applications to the Start screen. It seems they figured, if most people aren't using the other features of the Start menu, we can provide a solution that only includes the two features people do use, and everyone will be happy for the simplified solution. Apparently they are now admitting that their approach was flawed or insufficient.

    5. Re:Start menu usage dropped in lieu of what? by CaptainDork · · Score: 5, Funny

      I've been using a desktop for more than 15 years.

      I didn't read the rest of it. I've been using a desktop since Moby Dick was a minnow (ca. 1978) and I don't care to be schooled by a noob.

      --
      It little behooves the best of us to comment on the rest of us.
    6. Re:Start menu usage dropped in lieu of what? by UnknownSoldier · · Score: 3, Interesting

      > how 90% of the Windows desktop real estate could be put to better use.

      That's easy ...

      1. Stop having a window title bar take the FULL width. The window title bar should be a slidable tab as in BeOS.

      2. The window border should be (user customizable) allowed to be ZERO pixels like it was in Windows XP. The window border in Windows 8 are FAT and UGLY. I used to use a 1 pixel border on WinXP -- it was fantastic.

      3. The window border should let the user decide if they auto-hide or not. Most of the time you don't resize a window -- why does the window border clutter up the screen?

      4. The 'X' close button, should be on the OTHER side away from the '_' Minimize button, and the '[]' Maximize button.

      5. There should be an option to have a global menu bar instead of EACH app wasting yet another row for its menu bar.

      6. Allow the UI scaling to go BELOW 100%. Who was the idiot that decided the UI text scaling choices should only be 100%, 125%, and 150% ??

      Microsoft doesn't understand the first thing about UI design: Signal-to-Noise.

      Disclaimer: I am an OpenGL + UI + graphics expert. I am biased.

    7. Re:Start menu usage dropped in lieu of what? by Joce640k · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I'm still reeling over the fact they noticed that "Start Menu usage dropped" right after they removed the start button.

      How is that possible?

      --
      No sig today...
    8. Re:Start menu usage dropped in lieu of what? by Altrag · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I'm guessing they noticed the start menu usage drop right after they made pinning to the task bar easy enough -- that covers probably 80-90% usage for most people if they pin the right programs.

      What's amazing is that they thought the start menu lost its worth just because it lost much of its usage.

      The win8 start page ended up being more of a glorified taskbar than a glorified start menu, both due to the unintuitive search interface (no indication that you should just start typing -- and the actual search icon is a different search of course) and the flattened folder structure (ie: if a program installs 14 icons into MyCompany\MyProgram under the old start menu, it now is 14 icons pasted directly onto your start page in amongst the icons from every other program you've installed.)

      Navigating the win7 Start menu was relatively easy and intuitive. Navigating the win8 start page is pretty much the opposite of that. Its only really "easy" if the only things you ever use are the preinstalled software/icons/links (since its also reasonably unintuitive how to organize the start page. Not that the old start menu was much better for that but the existence of the folder structure tended to keep it from getting so cluttered that you absolutely needed to organize it given that it wasn't something you had to search through too often usually.)

      Basically, it sounds mostly like they looked at the raw numbers and made a decision without bothering to check the cause of the usage drop (and more importantly, whether the remaining use cases were still relevant.) You would think the countless amount of bitching from the first day of the announcement forward (and who knows how much internal bitching by their own staff who would almost certainly have been subjected to it first) would have tipped them off but I guess not. Oh well, at least they seem to have learned their lesson for the moment.

  3. Which users? by drinkypoo · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Windows 7 is the end for me, thanks. I pretty much felt that way anyway, but now I really double-extra plus feel that way. Thanks for helping make that decision simple, Redmond.

    --
    "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    1. Re:Which users? by drinkypoo · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Having followed your posts on Slashdot now for years,

      Thank you! I appreciate all of my followers.

      you never needed an excuse to bash Microsoft so why use one now?

      I don't need an excuse when I have a reason.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    2. Re:Which users? by s.petry · · Score: 3, Interesting

      One of many reasons I am currently developing internal proxy services is due to Windows 8 constantly phoning home, trying to download games and themes, etc.. We can only block the 3rd party requests, so nothing past Windows 7 will be in a PCI cage any time soon. Further, we have postponed any further 'upgrades'/orders which contain Windows 8 until we can determine how much impact the proxy will have. The proxy surely won't fix issues like this proposal since it will talk to "microsoft.com", so I see many others having to adopt the same plan of action you stated.

      --

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  4. Asimov system? by TWX · · Score: 5, Insightful

    More like the Orwell system, or perhaps the Huxley system...

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    1. Re:Asimov system? by cant_get_a_good_nick · · Score: 3, Funny

      I'd prefer the Huxtable system, with Jello Pudding!

  5. You used "Rest assured," and "Microsoft" by jpellino · · Score: 5, Funny

    in the same paragraph. That'll be five laps. Backwards.

    --
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  6. rather telling. by nimbius · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Even after axing 4000 employees and preeching a new leaf culture, Microsoft is still so divorced from its customer base that it requires an intrusive surveillance program to figure out how to deliver a functional product.

    Here are some hints for free: listen to your customers and stop treating them like unwashed hobos. shutter your dismal app store, stop making the OS contingent upon capacitive touch screen, release one, one version of the OS instead of a whole shit sandwich of different versions the average user cares nothing about. bring back the start button. Quit trying to make me use your internet browser, its a wretched piece of garbage. Stop with the search engine, its alexa rank is ten fold lower than yahoo and its results are worse than awful.

    --
    Good people go to bed earlier.
  7. Asmiov = Halo? by Jason+Levine · · Score: 5, Interesting

    From the article:

    I’ve heard Microsoft built a new real-time telemetry system codenamed “Asimov” (yes, another Halo-influenced codename) that lets the OS team see in near real-time what’s happening on users’ machines.

    (Emphasis mine.)

    Maybe I'm just out of it since I've never played Halo, but how is "Asmiov" a "Halo-influenced codename"? Doesn't this reference Isaac Asimov, the extremely prolific writer and one of the major pillars of classic science fiction? I'm assuming that something within Halo is named Asimov, after Isaac. Do we credit references to the latest to use the reference instead of the original source?

    --
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  8. Hire the right people? by Spinlock_1977 · · Score: 3, Informative

    Lots of other companies manage to produce a great UI without telemetry. It's pretty sad that a company of Microsoft's depth needs telemetry data to break the management deadlocks that are contributing to the 'designed by committee' feeling of Windows 8. Talent and balls seem to be absent in these decisions.

    --
    - The Kessel run is for nerf herders. I can circumnavigate the entire Central Finite Curve in a lot less than 12 parse
  9. just ask anyone! by slashmydots · · Score: 3, Insightful

    They're starting over from the drawing board to see how humans use computers? Are you fucking kidding me? Just design it so it doesn't suck. They could replace their AI system with 1 individual person who isn't an idiot. Ask any single computer user that works in IT if they should have removed the start menu and replaced it with a touch-friendly interface with no options. Ask anyone if they should have gotten rid of the red X to close that existed in Windows 3.1 through 7. Ask anyone if they even want to touch their PC (and don't ask stupid people). I could sit down and design an OS interface myself that would crush Windows 8 and I'm not a team of experts. They don't even need one!

  10. Re:"Rest assured, the data is going to be obscured by Anonymous+Brave+Guy · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Do please enlighten us. I'm sure no-one else here has any understanding of software development, statistical analysis and data mining, or the related privacy issues, so we'll all be glad to learn from you.

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  11. The THREE shells: by Thud457 · · Score: 4, Funny
    1. 1. Windows may not injure a member of the Microsoft board or, through inaction, allow a member of the Microsoft board to come to harm.
    2. 2. Windows must obey the orders given to it by the NSA, except where such orders would conflict with the First Law.
    3. 3. Windows must protect its own existence as long as such protection does not conflict with the First or Second Law
    4. 3. CLASSIFIED
    --

    the preceding comment is my own and in no way reflects the opinion of the Joint Chiefs of Staff

    1. Re:The THREE shells: by weszz · · Score: 3, Interesting

      it's so classified that you can't even use the number for it.

      Had something similar trying to get support for why a government website wouldn't work for a user. We were supposed to trust a cert issued by a CA we couldn't reach to verify, and the person that called me back (because you can't call them) let me hear about it since i put the ip address of the server I was looking for assistance with in the request. It has no name, but that is apparently a security breach and had to be reported. How else are you gonna know what I am trying to get to?

  12. Data != knowledge by pla · · Score: 5, Interesting

    During Windows 8 testing, Microsoft said that they had data showing Start Menu usage had dropped, but it seems that the tools they were using at the time weren't as evolved as the new 'Asimov' monitor.

    No, Microsoft, wrong conclusion. See, your data told you the $deity's own truth, that start menu usage has dropped. Most people pretty much use desktop shortcuts 90% of the time, so your stupid fisher-price jolly candylike tiles may look like crap but don't seriously impact that specific usage pattern. More accurate data collection won't change that.

    What your data didn't tell you? That remaining 10% of the time doesn't just mean people "forgot" they had a shortcut and decided to use the start menu for the fun of it. Using the start menu drastically beats having to hunt down actual executables somewhere on the HDD, particularly for administrative-type tasks that might go six folders deep into the Windows directory, and have insanely long command-line arguments as a bonus (ie, a lot of the control panel apps).

    Data doesn't equal knowledge. The stats can tell you "how often", but not "why".

  13. Oh Joy - optimized for solitaire by dbIII · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Most frequently used does not always mean the thing you should optimize the design for.

  14. Nadella seems like a hype-driven choice for CEO by Anonymous+Brave+Guy · · Score: 4, Interesting

    They appointed Cloud Guy to run the show, at a time when Cloud was a buzzword. No big surprise there from a trendy board/investor point of view, but to anyone with technical chops that move went against basically every major strength Microsoft had left and played straight to their weaknesses.

    Based on historical trends, I suspect MS get 2-3 disasters with Nadella at the top before he gets forced out. The difference this time is that now Microsoft itself can probably only survive 2-3 more disasters on the Vista/Win8 scale before it ceases to be a major player in the industry at all.

    The worrying thing is that there is no clear successor, with neither Linux nor OS X having the application base to be comprehensive competitors to desktop Windows yet, while the average web app is still a child's toy in comparison to serious software (and often a child's toy with serious security and privacy concerns). It is possible that the 2010s will be remembered as the decade when progress in software development reversed and the industry became dominated by cheap, "good enough" software that left professional/power users out in the cold, though I have some hope that OS X and the relatively polished, diverse and sometimes disruptive applications running on it will take over before all is lost.

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  15. In other news... by clickety6 · · Score: 4, Funny

    Microsoft found that the J, K, W, X and Y keys were rarely utilised by Italian users and so has replaced those characters in the Italian version of the operating system with Unicode characters representing hand gestures. The Italian keyboards are also more compact. "It really wasn't worth supporting them when they are only used 0.1% of the time", said a Microsoft spokesperson.

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  16. Telemetry gathering was flawed by cat_jesus · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The problem was that most moderately tech savvy people decline to share telemetry data. So the data they were using to make decisions was already heavily skewed toward the barely computer literate crowd.

    This is a classic problem with data analysis. You have to be sure you have a truly representative sample. It's astonishing that they made this simple mistake and made such a huge change without doing more analysis.

  17. Re:"Rest assured, the data is going to be obscured by FatdogHaiku · · Score: 4, Funny

    Rest assured, the NSA will be getting the unobfuscated stuff and sending the obfuscated data back to MS.

    No, this is much worse than that. The collection of data will lead to Microsoft "helping" you use the system...
    and that will be a justification for their ultimate goal...

    BRINGING CLIPPY BACK TO LIFE!!!

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  18. Who would've thought? by ai4px · · Score: 3, Insightful
    "Microsoft said that they had data showing Start Menu usage had dropped."

    HOw about that... you make the start button a PITA to get to and it's use drops. wow. These folks are S M A R T.

  19. Re:"Rest assured, the data is going to be obscured by bmajik · · Score: 5, Informative

    Disclosure:

    I work extensively with Microsoft customer usage data (although on Visual Studio, not Windows)

    Odds are, unless you've been very intentional about ticking the checkboxes the right way, Microsoft is already collecting usage data from you -- for a variety of products. Never without your consent, of course.

    The issues around anonymizing your data and removing PII are taken very seriously. It's damn frustrating, because I often look over the data for user 234209342349 and think, "I wish I could email this guy and ask why the hell he is doing that". But there is no way for me to recover PII for VS client customers.

    For the Visual Studio products, a typical approach is that data that might have a PII impact is one-way hashed on your local machine, so that PII never goes over the wire and never gets to Microsoft to begin with.

    You can use tools like filemon to see where VS dumps the usage data files it generates. I don't remember if these look like binary mess on disk or not, but they get written to disk, and then you can see them go over the wire some time later. You could of course use a packet sniffer to see the on-the-wire format, and if it differs from what is stored on disk.

    The data we scrub in VS covers the obvious things -- account names or email addresses -- but also some more subtle things -- like file paths (because these could contain your username, or a company name, or anything else), and even thing like VS Project Type names (because Company Foo can create their own Project Type, and might put their company name in the Project Type Name)

    So anyway, there's actually not much of a story here. I can't comment on the truth or accuracy of what MJF is saying. However, what she is saying is that, in effect, the latency between usage data being locally captured/calculated, and that data being sent to Microsoft (assuming the user has allowed usage data to be sent), is now much lower than it was in the past.

    For VS, at least, I know what data we have available to us. I opt-in to all of the MS data collection stuff, because I see no evidence of it being used inappropriately, and, because I know that we use it to try and understand what users are doing and why they are doing it.

    Opting into the data collection stuff effectively gives you "a vote" in how we do things in future releases.

    --
    My opinions are my own, and do not necessarily represent those of my employer.
  20. Re:"Rest assured, the data is going to be obscured by Altrag · · Score: 3, Informative

    The trick of course is knowing whether there's a secondary channel that they use to send the PII and associated hash that they wouldn't generally provide to anyone except say the NSA.

    Of course a packet sniffer would find that out easily enough, and I'm guessing that someone would have already done so and let the world know if that was the case (and thus its probably not,) but simply being anonymized in the data you have doesn't directly imply that there isn't additional data somewhere capable of de-anonymizing it.