Slashdot Mirror

← Back to Stories (view on slashdot.org)

Mozilla Launches Browser Built For Developers

Posted by samzenpus on from the made-just-for-you dept.

HughPickens.com writes "Mozilla announced that they are excited to unveil Firefox Developer Edition, the first browser created specifically for developers that integrates two powerful new features, Valence and WebIDE that improve workflow and help you debug other browsers and apps directly from within Firefox Developer Edition. Valence (previously called Firefox Tools Adapter) lets you develop and debug your app across multiple browsers and devices by connecting the Firefox dev tools to other major browser engines. WebIDE allows you to develop, deploy and debug Web apps directly in your browser, or on a Firefox OS device. "It lets you create a new Firefox OS app (which is just a web app) from a template, or open up the code of an existing app. From there you can edit the app's files. It's one click to run the app in a simulator and one more to debug it with the developer tools."

Firefox Developer Edition also includes all the tools experienced Web developers are familiar with including: Responsive Design Mod, Page Inspector, Web Console, JavaScript Debugger, Network Monitor, Style Editor, and Web Audio Editor. At launch, Mozilla is starting off with Chrome for Android and Safari for iOS. and the eventual goal is to support more browsers, depending on what developers tell Mozilla they want, but the primary focus is on the mobile Web. "One of the biggest pain points for developers is having to use numerous siloed development environments in order to create engaging content or for targeting different app stores. For these reasons, developers often end up having to bounce between different platforms and browsers, which decreases productivity and causes frustration," says the press release. "If you're a new Web developer, the streamlined workflow and the fact that everything is already set up and ready to go makes it easier to get started building sophisticated applications." Mozilla released a teaser trailer for the browser last week.

74 comments

  1. too late by mnt · · Score: 0

    i already gave up on ffos development (because of the bad tool quality) a year ago.

    1. Re:too late by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not that I care about FxOS, but why does your opinion matter now, given that you gave up a year ago? And for that matter, what makes you personally so important to the discussion?

    2. Re:too late by narcc · · Score: 1

      If you think FFOS development is bad, I'd hate to see what you think about Android development!

      --
      Required reading for internet skeptics
    3. Re:too late by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Just for the record, I just today quit FFOS development because of mnt's comment.

    4. Re:too late by lkernan · · Score: 1

      Just for the record, I just today quit FFOS development because of mnt's comment.

      I joined just so I can see why you are all quitting..

    5. Re:too late by mnt · · Score: 1

      If you think FFOS development is bad, I'd hate to see what you think about Android development!

      Android development is why i quit my job and moved on to something more sane.

  2. Re:Dupe. by halivar · · Score: 2

    I thought so too, but it's not. They link the previous announcement in TFS; this is the actual release.

  3. I like the idea.. by canadiannomad · · Score: 1

    I just kinda wish it was Chrome that came out with it.. In general I just prefer the layout of their development tools. I'll definitely give this a try though.

    --
    Hmm, the humour and sarcasm seem to have been be lost on you.
    1. Re:I like the idea.. by machineghost · · Score: 1

      This, except the part about giving it a try. Firebug revolutionized everything when it first came out, but it's failed to improve in the way Chrome Developer Tools ... and Firefox's own developer tools have remained far behind both the entire time.

      After ignoring the web development community for so long, I have a hard time seeing myself ever going back to Firefox unless they get some *seriously* rave reviews.

    2. Re:I like the idea.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Then your opinion is worthless. How could you know that they're still far behind if you haven't even tried them lately? It's kind of hard to care about whether you ever use Firefox again if that's your attitude. You might as well just be shilling for Google at this point.

  4. Chrome for Android and Safari for iOS? by ArcadeMan · · Score: 3, Interesting

    So, they're running Android and iOS on your computer to run the same binaries as those platforms? If not, it's only emulation and when someone says they're emulating another browser the result is usually not worth it and nowhere close to the actual results on the other platforms.

    --
    Get free satoshi (Bitcoin) and Dogecoins
    1. Re:Chrome for Android and Safari for iOS? by Microlith · · Score: 1

      So, they're running Android and iOS on your computer to run the same binaries as those platforms?

      Of course not. But, of course, you have to find something to hate on. Mozilla can do no right.

      If not, it's only emulation

      Which is a decent first step.

      when someone says they're emulating another browser the result is usually not worth it and nowhere close to the actual results on the other platforms.

      Yep, and only an idiot would rely on the results of emulation and not engage in on-target testing.

    2. Re:Chrome for Android and Safari for iOS? by BZ · · Score: 4, Informative

      > So, they're running Android and iOS on your
      > computer to run the same binaries as those
      > platforms?

      No. "They" are allowing you to connect your Android or iOS device to your computer (likely via USB), then debugging the on-device browser using the Firefox debugger running on your computer. That way you're debugging the thing you actually want to debug, but using the same developer tools you're using for your other debugging, and which therefore you're already familiar with.

    3. Re:Chrome for Android and Safari for iOS? by tlhIngan · · Score: 1

      So, they're running Android and iOS on your computer to run the same binaries as those platforms? If not, it's only emulation and when someone says they're emulating another browser the result is usually not worth it and nowhere close to the actual results on the other platforms.

      I think it's more like remote viewing. You're running the real browser on a real device attached to your computer. The tools basically shove your code into that browser, capture the output, and then send the output back to your PC for display and debugging.

      As in, you need an iOS and Android device to test with anyways tethered to your PC.

    4. Re:Chrome for Android and Safari for iOS? by tepples · · Score: 2

      So you still have to buy an iPhone, an iPad, an Android phone, and an Android tablet to test on them, unless you're on a Mac with a running iOS Simulator and a way of simulating multitouch input. And according to this page, the connection to Safari for iOS does not work on Windows, and an essential Linux component has to be built from source.

    5. Re:Chrome for Android and Safari for iOS? by BZ · · Score: 1

      > So you still have to buy an iPhone, an iPad, an
      > Android phone, and an Android tablet to test on them,

      Sure. The point here is to allow you to use the devtools of your choice, not to create a test environment.

    6. Re:Chrome for Android and Safari for iOS? by unrtst · · Score: 1

      So you still have to buy an iPhone, an iPad, an Android phone, and an Android tablet to test on them...

      1. If you're doing any serious development, you should have this already
      2. If your'e not very serious, then the andriod or ipad you personally use will be fine. For iPhone/iPad/etc testing, there is already a requirement to have something running Mac OSX + it's dev tools, or to own an i*thing* = no change here.

      ... and an essential Linux component has to be built from source.

      Oh no! They're expecting developers (the target audience) to *gasp* build something from source!!!

      Come on, there has to be more legitimate things to complain about!

    7. Re:Chrome for Android and Safari for iOS? by tepples · · Score: 1

      If you're doing any serious development [vs.] If your'e not very serious

      Then the question becomes one of making the transition from what you call "not very serious" to serious. Say a hobbyist web developer has developed a web application that he thinks will help him cross over from hobbyist to professional. Once he has something working on PC browsers and Android browser, where should he get funding to join the fruity ecosystem in order to test it on fruity machines before making it public? One could add "not yet tested on iPad; feedback is welcome" to the release notes, but that would just cause someone to claim that anything that doesn't support iOS from day one must be "half-assed".

      They're expecting developers (the target audience) to *gasp* build something from source!!!

      Knowledge of web development tools doesn't imply knowledge of native application development tools, nor vice versa.

    8. Re:Chrome for Android and Safari for iOS? by linuxrocks123 · · Score: 1

      Android makes their simulator (slow as it is) available for free, and it works on everything. iPhone wants you to buy a Mac so you can run XCode.

      I'm not going to spend money to improve another company's ecosystem. I'll code to standards and test with WebKit. Beyond that, Apple can suck it.

      --
      vi ~/.emacs # I'm probably going to Hell for this.
    9. Re:Chrome for Android and Safari for iOS? by rHBa · · Score: 1

      ... and an essential Linux component has to be built from source.

      They're expecting developers (the target audience) to *gasp* build something from source!!!

      Knowledge of web development tools doesn't imply knowledge of native application development tools, nor vice versa.

      For most Windows users with knowledge of web development tools I'd generally agree but I'd have thought most Linux users (with knowledge of web development tools) would be fine doing a quick configure/make/make install.

  5. Filling a hole by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If this stuff is mostly concerned with Java for the browser, it's probably the first application I've ever seen directly intended for JavaScript implementation.

    1. Re:Filling a hole by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're a pal and a JavaScript cosmonaut.

  6. Re: Dupe. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Everyone needs to breathe in oxygen or they will die! Take a breath!

  7. I kinda noticed it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    when my Firefox decided to stop starting at all.

    Sure, I guess I need to be a developer to fix it now.

    Whatever their plugin management does, it can and should do better.

  8. Not going to happen by NaCh0 · · Score: 0, Flamebait

    Sorry Mozilla, you have poisoned the well for many developers. The whole Brendan Eich situation and your cowering to the social justice warriors makes me not only avoid your products, but actively remind people that you are a sleazy political organization first, with a browser tool far second. Google's heart isn't much better but at least they have tact in their public relations.

    1. Re:Not going to happen by Microlith · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The whole Brendan Eich situation and your cowering to the social justice warriors makes me not only avoid your products, but actively remind people that you are a sleazy political organization first, with a browser tool far second

      Yeah, how dare an organization that is, essentially, politically minded in the first place take a principled stand for acceptance, respect, and equality instead of falling on Eich's sword for him.

      Also:

      social justice warriors

      Yeah, fuck them for even thinking about changing the status quo. People should just accept their lot in life, even if that means they get shit on for no good reason. Just so long as you don't have to care!

      Google's heart isn't much better but at least they have tact in their public relations.

      Yeah, a better organization would defend bigotry and turn a blind-eye towards abusive behavior. /s

    2. Re:Not going to happen by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Don't pretend that Google wouldn't have done exactly the same to Eich.

    3. Re:Not going to happen by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Whom did Brendan Eich abuse?

    4. Re:Not going to happen by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      But why did they wait so long before they got rid of Barack Obama for his unacceptable views?

    5. Re:Not going to happen by RoLi · · Score: 0

      social justice warriors

      Yeah, fuck them for even thinking about changing the status quo

      The media, the politics - the whole power-structure just loves these self-hating sick social justice warriors. They ARE the status quo.

    6. Re:Not going to happen by OhPlz · · Score: 1

      He has a right to his beliefs, same as everyone else. An organization like Mozilla should be especially careful not to take sides on politics. Now they can legitimately be seen as a social justice organization. They now have a record of using someone's personal information against them. Who knows what person will be their next target or whether or not they'll use their software products to snoop on whom they perceive to be the enemy. There were plenty of people on the left who didn't like what happened because it is very much counterproductive. A free and open Internet isn't served by this kind of behavior.

    7. Re:Not going to happen by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      social justice warriors

      Yeah, fuck them for even thinking about changing the status quo. People should just accept their lot in life, even if that means they get shit on for no good reason. Just so long as you don't have to care!

      For guys like the GP the choice is clear - fight on the side of injustice, Social Injustice Warriors FTW!

    8. Re:Not going to happen by Microlith · · Score: 1

      An organization like Mozilla should be especially careful not to take sides on politics.

      Even when one of the sides is obviously wrong? Good 'ol dose of false equivalence?

      They now have a record of using someone's personal information against them.

      Ah, so now Mozilla is responsible for the actions of others? Or do you have evidence that Mozilla (the corporation) took action against Eich? As it stands, Eich chose to step down of his own volition and there's no evidence against it.

      Who knows what person will be their next target

      Given Eich wasn't opposed by Mozilla, I don't expect anyone will.

      or whether or not they'll use their software products to snoop on whom they perceive to be the enemy

      And now we delve into paranoid bullshit territory.

    9. Re:Not going to happen by narcc · · Score: 1

      Cue the "we're being oppressed!" Pac-Man pie-chart...

      I love how people in the majority pretend that they're an oppressed minority to make themselves feel more important. Look, we get it. Despite having every advantage, you still can't compete with people who are significantly disadvantaged. That's got to make you feel terrible. I'm so sorry.

      --
      Required reading for internet skeptics
    10. Re:Not going to happen by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      >Even when one of the sides is obviously wrong?

      Of course they are. Otherwise we couldn't scream about it and get Eich to step down over it. Far better to destroy a man because we disagree with him than it would be to look at his track record at work to see if he doesn't let his opinions get in the way of his job. Far better to assume we're the only ones with the right to be intolerant, because we're the righteous ones. Far better to cry and stamp out feet about these things than actually, you know, make a real difference. Eich is gone now, but it has only made the supposed bigotry you're rallying against worse. Kudos.

    11. Re:Not going to happen by OhPlz · · Score: 1

      Even when one of the sides is obviously wrong?

      That's your belief. It's not shared by everyone, or even the majority. In fact, most places that have voted have voted against your opinion. It's only some of the courts that are in your favor, and that kind of lawmaking from the courts should be abhorrent to all of us.

      That's not even the point. It could have been any political issue. What was done by activists in getting him removed was completely inappropriate.

      Eich didn't stand down on his own, he was forced to. We all know it. He didn't accept the job and then just suddenly change his mind. He was forced out. Rather than take a long battle through the courts, he walked away to move on to something else, rather than get stuck on this issue for years. He's the only one involved that had any dignity.

      As for paranoia.. no. If they are now in the business of social activism, they cannot be trusted. CA law states that workers cannot be punished for political donations, but that didn't stop anyone. There is no reason to believe that they would not go data mining for other people to punish under the mantra of "progress". Their organization and their products are toxic.

    12. Re:Not going to happen by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah, Google's so much better, despite them simply caving in to Russia about the evil, evil gays during the Olympics. Mozilla simply let Eich step down after nominating him for CEOship. What horrible people.

    13. Re:Not going to happen by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      An organization like Mozilla should be especially careful not to take sides on politics.

      Even when one of the sides is obviously wrong?

      Especially then. The rule has to be absolute, or it's meaningless. It's like saying only people who say things I like deserve freedom of speech.

    14. Re:Not going to happen by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "As an organization who values, respects, and supports and promotes free speech and privacy on the internet, we will not be firing our CEO because of their political beliefs a decade ago. That would be ridiculously hypocritical and destructive to our primary mission."

      This same organization is now selling ads. The entire project is a farce.

  9. Designers again by NotInHere · · Score: 1

    Instead of developers fixing websocket traceability, they focus on making a new theme. Firefox has clearly too much designers. It's enough that every two or three versions the color of the developer console changes (and its design), and now an extra browser? I hope they don't transport the developer features into that browser, leaving firefox as a "customer only" product. When I was at places where I couldn't install software (libraries etc) I have been always happy to debug websites with the standard browser.

    1. Re:Designers again by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Translation: "instead of fixing my pet bug, they did something for others. Therefore they must not be fixing any worthwhile bugs for web developers, despite the copious evidence to the contrary."

  10. Glad to see by bsdasym · · Score: 0

    that Moz/FF is still focusing on stupid features that are already covered by other tools, rather than fixing their memory leaks and other bugs. Hopefully we'll get another pointless UI facelift soon too, I've finally adapted to the last one.

  11. please remove al the developer crap from the reg.. by williamyf · · Score: 0

    Now the Firefox team can remove all the developer crap from the regular browser.

    Is amazing how most of the browsers, in order to pander to developers, became bloated with developer cruft. Do not get me wrong, getting developers to use your browser as primary is important. Nonetheless, this could have been done using the add-on/plug-in interfaces using an official set of add-ons/plug-ins, instead of bloating the browser.

    Here I hope that the offering of a specific browser for developers means that the consumer and ESR browser are streamlined as a result.

    --
    *** Suerte a todos y Feliz dia!
  12. Damn it... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Internet browsers should be built and designed for one simple thing.
    Browsing webpages.

    If the site needs Turing complete code, run it server side. I don't want, nor should I have to run your program. Doing so is a huge security risk and in most cases sluggish. This whole webapps and javascript everywhere BS is really degrading the internet imo. Specially when the majority of "web programmers" are in the bottom rungs of quality.

    In summation, browsers shouldn't be virtual machines. I know I'm a minority voice compared to the general consumer, but it's good to vent. ;)

  13. Self-XSS blocking is only the beginning by tepples · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Now the Firefox team can remove all the developer crap from the regular browser.

    Removing even the most basic JavaScript console from the standard browser would be a bad idea. It'd encourage some developers of prominent web sites to block users of the developer browser as a "security" measure. Facebook and Netflix, for instance, already block use of the JavaScript console out of "self-XSS" worries; removing even "view source" would make it even worse.

    1. Re:Self-XSS blocking is only the beginning by narcc · · Score: 3, Insightful

      RMS predicted this in The Right to Read.

      --
      Required reading for internet skeptics
  14. Re:please remove al the developer crap from the re by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Please don't. Even non-developers are increasingly using the basic devtools to manage the modern web (defeating right-clicks, removing elements that get in the way, etc). And far more practically, the dev tools let devs diagnose bugs with users as they happen, without having to frustrate them with lots of extra steps that might lose their session entirely. At this point it would be like removing images from the browser core just because blind people have no need for them.

  15. Collaborative whiteboard by tepples · · Score: 1

    If the site needs Turing complete code, run it server side.

    Under your proposal, how would a collaborative whiteboard work? Would users have to reload the page in order to see others' changes, and then click-click-click, reloading the whole thing every time as a submission to a server-side image map, in order to add lines to the whiteboard? Or ought the whiteboard to be released as a native application? That would exclude users of OS X, GNU/Linux, Android, iOS, Windows Phone, because these systems can't run a Windows .exe.

    1. Re:Collaborative whiteboard by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Native applications of course.
      A halfway decent programmer would make your "whiteboard" cross platform. It's not that hard to do. I know, my job is porting software.

      Or if you're a really shitty programmer, you use a virtual machine language like java. There is nothing wrong with interpreted languages. Just the browser suite should not act as a vm.

    2. Re:Collaborative whiteboard by squiggleslash · · Score: 1

      Hmmm, that sounds like it would best be implemented using some kind of cross platform networked app layer. Maybe we could describe forms and windows using some kind of XML-based language so it's familiar to programmers, perhaps with a lightweight OO scripting language tying it together, and some basic security checks to ensure that networked data doesn't accidentally leak from one source to another and with no access to files on the underlying device.

      --
      You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
  16. Don't remove "view page source" by ciaran2014 · · Score: 1

    Developers aren't marked from birth. The WWW took off because non-developers copied the html of various pages and made their own pages. Eventually some of them became developers. It's important to maintain at least some of these on-ramps.

    I'm no web dev but I often view the page source (e.g. so I can download a video instead of viewing it in my browser) or use "inspect element" (e.g. to get rid of some bar at the top or bottom taking up too much screen or being too distracting).

    --
    Help build the anti-software-patent wiki
    1. Re:Don't remove "view page source" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I very strongly agree. I just recently managed to get my high-school dropout cousin (through no fault of his own) interested in HTML and CSS. He's spent the past few weeks mocking up web designs and then creating them in markup. His life could get back on track, all because of "view source" and "inspect element" helping him to understand how other sites do it.

    2. Re: Don't remove "view page source" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Modern sites don't work that way.
      The times when viewing the source could useful are fewer and fewer.

  17. Browser for *Web* Developers by catf00d · · Score: 0

    Will this help me write an application in C++? No? Then don't call it a tool for developers. We're not all web monkeys.

  18. But will they remove the child safety features? by aneamic · · Score: 1

    I'm most interested to see if this means the release will be without a number of firefox's more annoying features, for example will I be free to disable warnings about third party extentions, and turn off the annoying messages about apps going fullscreen? Those alone would make me consider using it full time.

    1. Re:But will they remove the child safety features? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Really? You're complaining about child-safety features and you're still not advanced enough to use addons or just go into about:config and change settings like full-screen-api.approval-required to false?

      Then what browser are you using that DOESN'T artificially kneecap or coddle you? Chrome won't even allow me to install third-party addons anymore.

  19. Re:please remove al the developer crap from the re by squiggleslash · · Score: 1

    I get the impression that much of this was integrated into the browser because half the criticisms of Firefox came from people who had tools like Firebug installed - itself infamous for bloating the footprint of any browser it was running in.

    I seriously doubt any of the dev tools that come built-in to Firefox, Chrome, or IE are doing much if anything to bloat them. What I suspect is happening is that webdevs themselves are making use of features en-mass that are turning out to have some disastrous memory side effects - unconstrained closures due to widespead jQuery use would be a good example.

    --
    You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
  20. Would be nice if it supported GWT plugin by adiposity · · Score: 1

    We still use a Firefox 24 install for debugging GWT.

    http://www.gwtproject.org/miss...

  21. It's not really anything new by aitan · · Score: 1

    What they have "released" is just the Aurora channel with the Dev Tools theme covering all the browser.

    Everything else seems to be just the same that it used to be, the only improvement is the ability to run it side by side with another Firefox profile but if you used work with Aurora like I did, all this means that you must go back to the beta channel to keep an usable Firefox with a normal UI (after applying the Classic Theme Restorer)

    Their "mobile emulator" is quite simple, I don't understand why anyone would like to use it to debug Chrome on Android instead of using Chrome on their computer as it has better tools and surely it will always be integrated better.

    And for CSS tweaking I prefer to use Firebug or even the IE11 dev. tools thanks to its great CSS Changes pane.

  22. Native apps are easier to reject than web apps by tepples · · Score: 2

    Native applications of course.
    A halfway decent programmer would make your "whiteboard" cross platform.

    Use of native applications leads to three roadblocks, and I'd be interested in how you would recommend to solve each:

    • First, the developer has to buy the devkit for each of 15 platforms, which can be several dozen times more expensive than just buying a computer and starting a web browser. If the developer can't afford the devkit, you end up with no application to use. So it's your concern because it's the developer's concern.
    • Second, the developer has to get his whiteboard app onto each platform's monopoly app store. If Apple rejects it, you won't be able to run it on your iPhone or iPad or on Macs whose Gatekeeper settings are set to Mac App Store only. If Microsoft rejects it, you won't be able to run it on Windows RT, Windows Phone, Xbox 360, or Xbox One. If Sony rejects it, you won't be able to run it on PlayStation 3, PlayStation 4, or PlayStation Vita. If Nintendo rejects it, you won't be able to run it on Wii U or 3DS.
    • Finally, you will have to ask the computer's administrator to install the application before it can be used.

    Or if you're a really shitty programmer, you use a virtual machine language like java.

    Is there a way to get an application onto Xbox 360's Xbox Live Indie Games or Windows Phone 7 at all without using a virtual machine language?

  23. bad idea. by kuzb · · Score: 1

    It's imperative that when I develop, that I'm developing and testing using the same browser an end user will have. Introducing differences where you have a developer and a non-developer browser is a bad idea.

    --
    BeauHD. Worst editor since kdawson.
    1. Re:bad idea. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      You still testing on/using the device in question. This just lets you connect to the device and debug things from the desktop firefox instance beside you, while you test on the device. Which is a damn sight better than having to install a ton of custom tools or try to figure it all out on the device (which is often a phone or other small-screened device). It's basically a debugging IDE.

    2. Re:bad idea. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Developers refuse to eat their own dogfood. I'm leaning that way myself. - not eating their dogfood I mean. This whole thing really exposes how undisciplined, juvenile, and poor these bunch of hacks really are. Luckily this garbage doesn't come preinstalled on windows or bsd.

    3. Re:bad idea. by squiggleslash · · Score: 1

      Quite I program desktop applications the same way. No fancy debuggers, and I use Notepad to write the source code. Then I print out the source code using an ordinary printer and hand compile the code into hex codes, which I input back into the system and write out as a .EXE using an Excel VBA Script program I wrote myself.

      Anything else is just asking for trouble...

      --
      You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
  24. mod parent up by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I use the "Inspect Element" at retailmenot to get the actual voucher code directly without letting the site track me with cookies or inform dominos where I got them from.

  25. Methinks thou dost protest too much. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Just where did Mozilla break CA law? Mozilla wanted him as CEO. They made him CEO. Some mental midgets went on a crusade against him. He stepped down. Is it illegal to just let him walk away because he doesn't want to drag Mozilla down with him? Or are you really so mental that you honestly think he was "fired" by Mozilla? He's still contributing to Mozilla, just look at their bugtrackers and such. He even rejected taking back his old job. The real people to be upset about are the shameless opportunists that can't understand that destroying one man won't help their cause, it will just destroy one man. And your need to vilify Mozilla is hardly better. If you're this concerned about privacy you should have starting barking at them when Google became their primary source of income, not just when Eich stepped down. You clearly don't care about Eich or Mozilla, just getting up on your own irrational soapbox.

    1. Re:Methinks thou dost protest too much. by OhPlz · · Score: 1

      No, I care about free speech and people's right to privacy. I don't see that Mozilla did anything to keep Eich in place and they allowed things to get out of control to the point where he couldn't continue. He was under fire from people within the organization just as much as he was from the likes of OkStupid. There were people there that posted about it, that they were too scared to speak up within the organization because they didn't want to be next. Are you assuming they were all shameless opportunists too? That's the atmosphere he was faced with. Mozilla failed. Eich was taken out by friendly fire as well as by the liberal propaganda machine. The fact that I'm still pissed about it doesn't mean it didn't happen.

      I might not like their partnership with Google, but it's a valid business decision. Letting Eich's situation go the way it did is not valid and is 100% against a free and open Internet. To act like this is no big deal is shameless.

    2. Re:Methinks thou dost protest too much. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It seems to me that you're trying your best to spin this as "invalid" simply because you dislike it. What COULD they have done? What SHOULD they have done? What would have made their actions "valid" to you? I never hear those things answered. I simply hear people bluster and blame Mozilla, rather than any of the parties who were the actual ones at fault here. They neither demanded that he give anyone any kind of apology or statement, nor did they take either of the polarizing stances in the debate that caused his taring and feathering. Would you rather they had? Should they have demanded that everyone in the company fall into rank, by revoking their own rights to be vocal about Eich? Should they have sheltered him in a nuclear bunker and "waited out the storm"? What could they have possibly done to appease you, which would not have impinged on anyone's rights to privacy, free speech and other such lofty ideals?

    3. Re:Methinks thou dost protest too much. by OhPlz · · Score: 1

      If you want to have a real conversation, stop posting as AC. It's rude.

      They should have stood up for their CEO and their organization. It's painfully obvious that being seen as a social justice organization is not good for them. They have alienated a good number of people. Attacks like this do not serve to protect a free and open Internet. Mozilla should have explained this in plain terms. You can disagree with the man's opinion in his role as an individual, but it should not spill over into his workplace. You say he still commits code, why hasn't OkStupid gone after him again then? Because it had nothing to do with his role, it was a personal attack. The liberal machine knocked him off a high perch and that's all this was ever about. Mozilla let it happen.

      You want to know what they could have done? Read up on "Arthur T DeMoulas". He was a CEO of a supermarket chain here in New England. He was fired from his position in a power grab, and the employees walked off their jobs for weeks on end to defend him. They stood by their CEO even as it cost them their livelihood, because they believed that much in what they were doing and believed so much in their former CEO. They ultimately won. What happened to Eich should not have happened, and it could have been stopped.

      Frankly, you prove my point. If what you hint at is true, that Mozilla was unable to rally their workers to defend their CEO, then that validates the general opinion that Mozilla is, in fact, an organization in pursuit of social justice. It may not be in the mission statement, but it's in the heads of the people working for them. Hence my point that their brand is toxic, and so is their software.

      Now run along AC, go sign up for an account. They're free. Fortunately, Dice doesn't shun people for their political beliefs.

  26. Re:another pointless UI facelift by TaoPhoenix · · Score: 1

    Actually, they hid Aurora and went back to one of the older square layouts!

    I had to use Classic Theme Restorer to add back a couple of minor buttons and colors though.

    --
    My first Journal Entry ever, in 8 years! http://slashdot.org/journal/365947/aphelion-scifi-fantasy-horror-poetry-webzine
  27. Developers by TeknoHog · · Score: 0

    Developers. Developers. Developers. Developers. Developers. Developers. Developers. Developers. Developers. Developers. Developers. Developers. Developers. Developers. Developers. Developers. Developers. Developers. Developers. Developers. Developers. Developers. Developers.

    Your comment violated the "postercomment" compression filter. Try less whitespace and/or less repetition.

    --
    Escher was the first MC and Giger invented the HR department.
  28. Bad GUI, No sync migration by mnt · · Score: 1

    The GUI is very bad. Black on black, nearly no contrast... I'm back to Pale Moon.

    Oh, and why is there no migration path between old sync and new sync? It's just a new authentication, everything under the hood is the same. If i run Pale Moon (old sync) and Firefox (new sync) i cannot have both of them, i'm forced to choose.