Slashdot Mirror
The Arrival of Man-Made Earthquakes
An anonymous reader writes: The New Yorker has a long investigative report on a recent geological phenomenon: man-made earthquakes. The article describes how scientists painstakingly gathered data on the quakes, and then tried to find ways to communicate the results — which are quite definitive — to politicians who often have financial reasons to disbelieve them. Quoting: "Until 2008, Oklahoma experienced an average of one to two earthquakes of 3.0 magnitude or greater each year. (Magnitude-3.0 earthquakes tend to be felt, while smaller earthquakes may be noticed only by scientific equipment or by people close to the epicenter.) In 2009, there were twenty. The next year, there were forty-two. In 2014, there were five hundred and eighty-five, nearly triple the rate of California.
In state government, oil money is both invisible and pervasive. In 2013, Mary Fallin, the governor, combined the positions of Secretary of Energy and Secretary of the Environment. Michael Teague, whom she appointed to the position, when asked by the local NPR reporter Joe Wertz whether he believed in climate change, responded that he believed that the climate changed every day. Of the earthquakes, Teague has said that we need to learn more. Fallin's first substantive response came in 2014, when she encouraged Oklahomans to buy earthquake insurance. (However, many earthquake-insurance policies in the state exclude coverage for induced earthquakes.)"
In state government, oil money is both invisible and pervasive. In 2013, Mary Fallin, the governor, combined the positions of Secretary of Energy and Secretary of the Environment. Michael Teague, whom she appointed to the position, when asked by the local NPR reporter Joe Wertz whether he believed in climate change, responded that he believed that the climate changed every day. Of the earthquakes, Teague has said that we need to learn more. Fallin's first substantive response came in 2014, when she encouraged Oklahomans to buy earthquake insurance. (However, many earthquake-insurance policies in the state exclude coverage for induced earthquakes.)"
But stop messing with my atmosphere.
Dadburnit liberals and their commie "Global Shaking" scam.
Get off my perfectly-stable lawn!
Table-ized A.I.
oklahoma is just trying to shake texas loose.
Lets see, no earthquakes until fracking started, then more and more earthquakes as fracking continues. Yup, sounds logical to me.
"It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends upon his not understanding it!" --Upton Sinclair
Any sufficiently unpopular but cohesive argument is indistinguishable from trolling.
Russian analyst urges nuclear attack on Yellowstone National Park and San Andreas fault line
A Russian geopolitical analyst says the best way to attack the United States is to detonate nuclear weapons to trigger a supervolcano at Yellowstone National Park or along the San Andreas fault line on California's coast.
The president of the Academy of Geopolitical Problems based in Moscow, Konstantin Sivkov said in an article for a Russian trade newspaper on Wednesday, VPK News, that Russia needed to increase its military weapons and strategies against the "West" which was "moving to the borders or Russia".
He has a conspiracy theory that NATO - a political and military alliance which counts the US, UK, Canada and many countries in western Europe as members - was amassing strength against Russia and the only way to combat that problem was to attack America's vulnerabilities to ensure a "complete destruction of the enemy".
"Geologists believe that the Yellowstone supervolcano could explode at any moment. There are signs of growing activity there. Therefore it suffices to push the relatively small, for example the impact of the munition megaton class to initiate an eruption. The consequences will be catastrophic for the United States - a country just disappears," he said.
"Another vulnerable area of the United States from the geophysical point of view, is the San Andreas fault - 1300 kilometers between the Pacific and North American plates ... a detonation of a nuclear weapon there can trigger catastrophic events like a coast-scale tsunami which can completely destroy the infrastructure of the United States."
Full story
There are fault lines in Oklahoma. There's a fairly large one that runs down from Nebraska into the eastern part of the state. It's usually pretty quiet, but every now and again you get a shift.
And the article said that they're updating fault maps - they don't have enough data.
So... are we sure these are caused by fracking? 'Cause even if you are, you'll never get Oklahomans (especially the government) to believe it.
After all, we're the state that gave you Sen. Inhofe, who still denies that climate change is happening at all (sorry about that, I didn't vote for him). We've got a lot of people employed in the Oil industry. Going against Oil here is political suicide.
Hopefully we can provide scientists enough data to prove what's going on (if it is indeed manmade) so they can use the data elsewhere. They'll make no traction here.
Those who can't do, teach. Those who can't teach either, do tech support.
Repent sinners! God is angry at Oklahoma.
This isn't the "arrival" of man-made earthquakes. Ever since man has been doing large scale environmental modification, we have been inducing seismic activity.
The most common induced seismic events occur when we build dams to create reservoirs. One of the first examples was the filling of the Oued Fodda Dam in 1933. Others occur due to depletion of underground reservoirs (like the Lorca earthquake in 2011) or enhanced geothermal energy extraction (Cerro Prieto in 1979).
Of course all phenomena is new to the non-research reporting that passes for news today. The only difference is that today the perpetrators are seeking evil oil rather than life giving water or "renewable" energy...
We could be on the verge of the next tectonic shift in warfare: Earthquake Warfare.
In an article about geopolitics or nuclear war this would be an interesting post. If delivery were possible a nuke right on top of Yellowstone could have an effect far, far in excess of its own tonnage.
Thanks Obama
So, if the insurance company can prove the quakes were man-made, they don't have to pay out. But if they can prove it, that goes against claims by many in the state and oil industry. The oil industry would likely try to hound/silence/sue the insurance company.
If they deny a claim with loose evidence that it's man-made, the claimant could (theoretically) prove it was a natural occurrence. Because proving such is to the benefit of the oil industry, they would jump at the chance to "help", and perhaps have the state "investigate" the insurance company for fraud or questionable practices or something.
It seems to me that, despite whatever exclusions the insurance company has, they will likely pay out for any and all earthquake claims with the oil industry helping them cover that pay out behind the scenes in order to keep any proof or claims of "induced" earthquakes out of the public eye.
It is easy to get someone to make a particular claim if they are paid enough to do so.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
So we get a nice helping of "Mankind is destroying the planet" and the chicken littles get to practice their duck and cover.
Seriously how do you genetic failures manage to get up in the morning and go out of the house ? Or do you ?
Now, if only we could show a direct link to the alarming increase in morbid obesity levels in Americans with their preferred locations for vacations and these earthquake epicenters, we might just locate a great new All-You-Can-Eat buffet!
If these quakes are truly man made then we have made a great technological leap forward.
Imagine being able to drill thousands of wells along a fault line to trigger small incremental slips frequently as opposed to allowing the energy to build and produce massive seismic events when a slip occurs naturally. We b e able to reduce insurance costs in earthquake prone areas and make it easier and safer to live in those places.
As long as it means more profits for almighty Job Creators and lower Gas Prices for me, then I'm all for it. Go tell Gore and his lying "scientists" to go get some real education at Church.
Well gosh! If big business can make more money and create just one more minimum wage job what does it matter if thousands are killed and entire cities shaken into dust. I man, where the hack are our values. Maybe some of those tall buildings can TRICKLE DOWN and smack a right winger on top of his head. And with rising seas the dust and corpses will be washed away anyway so businesses do not have to clean up the dead and dying. Oh the joys of capitalism!
So if I understand this, the price of Natural gas is down, what, 80%? And now places where mostly no one lives have hundreds of itty bitty tinny tiny tremors so small that the people, that don't live there anyway, can barely detect them without specially calibrated scientific instruments. Also figure into the equation that the nearly free natural gas has allowed us to decommission coal burning plants left and right and is even threatening the economic viability of nuclear fission.
Notwithstanding the absolute fact that relying solely on a single source of power is dangerous and stupid, this seems like a pretty freaking wonderful tradeoff! Granted the media panders exclusively to the eco-terrorist agenda and anything other than a rare earth exhausting solar panel, or a bird extincting windmill is unmitigatedly evil in their narrative. But for those of us that rather like living in the first world, with reliable power at record low prices, this seems like a glass half full sort of story.
Do people in Oklahoma even read the New Yorker? How is this even going to reach Oklahoma? Besides, as a Californian who has lived through Loma Prieta and Northridge, I can tell you right now that anything under 6.0 is a non-starter for the public. It's not a real earthquake if stuff doesn't shake and move a little, eh.
At first, I caused the quakes to see if I could. Next I caused the quakes to extort the government for money. But anymore, I just cause the quakes to make time with The Baroness more interesting.
God spoke to me
TFA has nothing to do with fracking. It is about disposal wells. Indeed, TFA states that fracking is linked only to very small earthquakes, unlike disposal wells which have now been conclusively linked to earthquakes of magnitude 3.0 - 6.0. Further, all of the article's scientific statements are quotes from geologists who live and work in Oklahoma, or simply relate to the amount of research which has so far linked seismic activity to disposal wells.
They should take time to learn about the geology of flyover country.
You should take the time to learn something about petroleum extraction in Oklahoma.
.: Semper Absurda
Now press play on DVD....
My God, you're going Krypton over there!
They're turning subterranean water reservoirs into essentially shit.
Not my country, so I shouldn't even have a say in all this. But you know, things change. Americans in the future might be good folks (some already are); but they won't have water.
This could be a problem.
Aside from the uptrend in fracking induced quakes, quakes have previously been associated with other types of drilling. The Geysers geothermal field in California has induced quakes, and they've been there for decades. Induced quakes have also been documented near dams. The mass of impounded water stresses faults locally, and produces quakes. AFAIK, no "big one" has been linked to induced quakes. Anyway, they aren't a recent arrival, and they aren't always due to modern fracking techniques.
Also, quake insurance being sketchy is not really news either. Insurance companies will do anything to duck out of paying claims. Always have. Always will...
"The article describes how scientists painstakingly gathered data on the quakes, and then tried to find ways to communicate the results — which are quite definitive — to politicians who often have financial reasons to disbelieve them."
Might I suggest ... a man made earthquake where they live?
Come, Mr. Bigglesworth .... our work is done here...
Check Groningen, The Netherlands, where natural gas production causes earthquakes regularly.
Lots of discussion, people saying production should be lowered, government not wanting to, things like that
First Elevator World runs a story on the new elevators to the WTC towers (a renevation which the 9/11 commission says didn't happen), Sandy Hook demonstrates how school shootouts can be faked, then the Snowden leaks show the government really is spying on everyone. Video analysis shows ISIS beheading videos are just propaganda. And now we find out manmade earthquakes are possible.
It's gotten to the point that it's actually a safer bet to trust conspiracy theorists over the news. Now, if you'll excuse me, I've got to read up some more about mind control rays.
Fracking and disposal wells are very similar, they both involve pumping liquid deep underground. I've heard it said that water pumped into faults can lubricate the interface between the "boulder" and the mountain, I believe there have been experiments on minor faults in CA to examine that theory that tension can be relived in the fault by pumping water into it.
The theory is that faults are similar to large glaciers where melt water has been shown to lubricate the interface between a glacier and the bedrock, accelerating the flow of the glacier and speeding up the calving of icebergs. This phenomena has long been a concern by climate scientists looking at east Antarctica. There is a difference between horizontal/vertical, ice/rock, but it seems to me that the mathematically chaotic behaviour of the crust means pumping water into deep wells is something we should should avoid if possible.
I've been a "science based greenie" since the 70's. It doesn't matter to me if you call it a fracking operation or a disposal well, the unpredictability and risks associated with pumping (often polluted) water deep underground is the core issue for both types of well.
And did you exchange a walk on part in the war for a lead role in a cage? - Pink Floyd.
Are the insurers expecting the inducer to pay for damages? Are they insuring the inducers against damage caused?
DC itself is on a sedimentary deposit and sits in a former tidal swamp. The geology of the area is such that they might not notice small quakes all that much. Just west of DC (beginning around Alexandria) is the Piedmont, the edge of the mountains; so, it is possible to transmit energy to the area if the quake is sufficiently large. There's a region around Louisa County and Charlottesville, about 100 miles south west of DC, that regularly spawns small earthquakes . They occur a couple of times a year and are typically in the 2 to 3 range like the Oklahoma quakes. This is the region that spawned the 5.8 quake that damaged the Washington Monument.
GEOLOGIST: Injection of wastewater in Oklahoma is triggering earthquakes.
POPULAR PRESS: Injection of wastewater is causing earthquakes.
ACTIVIST: Fracking causes earthquakes.
GEOLOGIST: Many small quakes relieve pressure, bigger ones inevitable but smaller, less often.
ACTIVIST GEOLOGIST: Many quakes means movement! Big one inevitable! It's our fault! Soon!
POPULAR PRESS: Mankind fucking with Earth again
GAIA: I just want to be left alone. Naasty peepl.
ARCHIMEDES: Give me a place to stand and with a lever I will move the whole world.
WASTEWATER INJECTION CREW: All we're doing is lubricating the lever. We did not create it.
VIRTUALLY EVERY OKLAHOMAN: No big deal.
Meanwhile,
GEOLOGIST: Depletion of groundwater creating uplift along San Adreas Fault
DESERT PERSON WITH LUSH LAWN: San Adreas is not my fault.
AGITATED FRACKING ACTIVIST: Who let that guy in anyway? We're talking about Big Oil.
MULLHOLLAND: We shall deflate the West to bring water to California.
Meanwhile,
SCIENTIST: By use of amazing technology, traces with unique Cesium-134 fingerprint of Fukushima have been detected in ocean off Vancouver.
SCIENTIST: if a person swam for six hours each day in water with Cesium levels twice as high as those found in Ucluelet, they'd receive a radiation dose that is more than 1,000 times less than that of a single dental X-ray.
INTERNET DOOMPORN STAR WITH PERFECT TEETH: This is an extinction level event! Look, a fish died in the Pacific! Salmon are misshapen! The cans are dented!
POPULAR PRESS: Mankind fucking with Earth again
GAIA: Stop the world, I want to get off!
Parturiunt Montes, Nascetur Ridiculus Mus
The mountains are in labor; an absurd mouse is the result.
~~Horace
<blink>down the rabbit hole</blink>
"Otisburg?"
Look, I don't expect slashdot to be a "news site", but seriously, it would be best to be at least vaguely familiar with the subject material before making a story submission.
The Geysers#Seismicity
It is not even close to news that humans are causing quakes.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
I once caused an earthquake by bumping my chair into the sensitive recording device. It was an 8.0! The recording device was sitting on a column of concrete that was buried down 120 feet below. The guy said you can slam your car door out in the parking lot and cause the sensitive equipment to record "an earthquake". I say to you that the recording devices are not recording any kind of a man-made earthquake, what they are recording is just the frack in fracking. No earthquakes, just anomalies recorded by very sensitive equipment.
To put this in a bit of perspective, earthquakes were pretty much unheard of in the state when I was a kid. Yeah, seismologists would probably tell you there were some, but not ones anybody ever noticed. We used to console ourselves that, yes we have tornadoes, but those you can prepare for. At least we didn't have Earthquakes like California. Hahaha, suckers!
In 2014 we had three times more earthquakes than California.
The most famous induced earthquakes was Rocky Flats outside of Denver in 1965. It was a waste injection well like these fracking-waste wells. Colorado also has had M5 quakes from agricultural salt water injection in the west near Rangley and coal methane waste injection south near Trinidad.
Quakes may be associated witht loading or drainign of large water dams. The 2008 Sichuan China quake could have been one of these.
Geothermal energy projects sometimes have induced quakes. Most geothermal project inject water for heating.
It is often impossible to bribe every scientist in a field, and very expensive to bribe most of them.
The demand for oil and other fossil fuels is only a symptom of over population. We can go on endlessly about all of the effects of a population explosion without ever confronting what drives all of the issues. Fraking, coal ash dumping, air pollution, urban sprawl, ruined oceans, water shortages, military threats, illegal immigration, food prices all go back to the same core issue which is too large a population both in the US and around the world. Without strict birth control it will continue to get worse and worse and just maybe end human life on Earth.
Just like the great pacific garbage patch (which you can't see even if you are in the middle of it) this is just another environmentalist talking point. So there are all these earthquakes that only people with the right equipment can detect, and we must trust them because they are scientists with white lab coats and clipboards.
So at what looks to be the beginning of another Dry Epoch on the High Plains (REGARDLESS OF THE CAUSE), we're still allowing millions of gallons of WATER to be thrown away instead of strictly mandating it be recovered and cleaned by any means necessary (and paid for by those that polluted it). Even setting aside their lies about the earthquake cause, this is the most damning proof of a corrupt Oklahoma government (though hardly the only one in the region).
NZ (New Zealand...its a country, on the bottom of the world) is 1.5 times the size of Oklahoma; 500 quakes is a week for us.
GeoNet - Stats
@Random_Adam
Sometimes a sig doesn't have to be funny!!
I could swear this is what destroyed Krypton...
It is often impossible to bribe every scientist in a field
You don't need to. You just need to bribe a few, then shut everyone else out of journals and claim you have unanimity amongst all scientists.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley