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University Students Made a Working Model Hyperloop
derekmead writes: Elon Musk's Hyperloop gets people excited. Promise the ability to travel from San Francisco to Los Angeles in less than an hour, and you're going to get people salivating. But for as much as we've heard about it, we've had scarcely little to see—until a team of students at the University of Illinois decided to build their very own miniature hyperloop.
Mechanical engineering students at the university built a functioning 1:24 scale model of the Hyperloop, a "fourth mode of transportation" that sends pods through a partially pressurized tube at very high speeds, as part of a senior design project. It was designed to test some of the key components of Musk's design, which was outlined in a much-read, open source whitepaper (PDF) published in August of 2013. That said, there are several key differences, which keep this from truly being a proof-of-concept as to whether or not the Hyperloop will ultimately work.
Mechanical engineering students at the university built a functioning 1:24 scale model of the Hyperloop, a "fourth mode of transportation" that sends pods through a partially pressurized tube at very high speeds, as part of a senior design project. It was designed to test some of the key components of Musk's design, which was outlined in a much-read, open source whitepaper (PDF) published in August of 2013. That said, there are several key differences, which keep this from truly being a proof-of-concept as to whether or not the Hyperloop will ultimately work.
Planes generally average around 500mph, and the average plane flight time between SF and LA is... roughly 57 minutes. You'd have to hit much higher speeds to not be survivable. You're just going to be spending the last 15 minutes slowing down gradually.
Pretty sure my bank has one of these. How is this news?
LOL ... well, I'll accept my being a moron as the problem here ... despite reading it, and knowing where those cities are located ... my brain was treating that as a "coast to coast in an hour", like New York to LA.
You are utterly correct.
Lost at C:>. Found at C.
Is one of the key differences that it is twenty-four times too small?
The Second Decree: No more pollution. No more car exhaust or ocean dumpage! From now on, we'll travel in TUBES! Get the scientists working on the Tube Technology immediately!
Taking guns away from the 99% gives the 1% 100% of the power.
When I was little, I found a book in our bookshelf about the future. The book was from the early sixties. All with floating at sea nuclear plants, automatic farming, synthetic meet, maglev trains, and trains running through tubes. Propelled either by a propeller at the back or by magnets in vacuum. So Elon Musk just had a similar book in his youth and now tries to build the stuff. Some is great, but that tube thing sucks. It is expensive, it will require a lot of resources even compared to bullet trains.
...isn't this basically just a model train in a tube? It sounds like the only thing from the hyperloop they are actually using is the "electromagnetic motors." It's using roller bearings, and the tube is not depressurized. As far as I know, those are the two most important things about the hyperloop, which speak to the goal of increasing speed by reducing drag. The speed is 160mph, which is less than half the speed of the fastest trains currently operating. Using electromagnetic acceleration is pretty cool, but I remember riding on roller coasters that used this method of acceleration back in the 90s. I don't fault the students for doing a cool engineering project, but the headline chosen by the journalist is more than a little disingenuous.
It is much better when public transport is run by the city and state. Have a look at many European countries, they have working modern and secure public transport systems.
Most of the time it is coasting, so a power loss would not cause it to stop. If one does get stuck, they have emergency air, and the capsules behind the stuck one would drive themselves back to the station with onboard motors. The life support systems are battery powered. And why would it take 5-6 hours for emergency help to arrive? This thing is not in the middle of nowhere, it is following I-5 between LA and SF.
When the damn thing turns. Maglev trains for people are actually slower then the ones for freight because the freight trains don't have to worry about grandma surviving the trip. If they were going straight the whole way that wouldn't be a problem, altho there's some time for slower acceleration and deceleration they the hyperloopies don't seem to add in. But to get from LA to San Fran you can't go straight, you have to go up and down hills, around mountains, over rivers, etc.
A big part of the reason for Hyperloops cost advantage on rail is that Musk insists that a Hyperloop track can be cheaper. He says it would be more analogous to a oil pipeline then a rail track, and have cheaper construction, more abrupt bends, etc., which leads to higher G-Forces; this is a an even bigger problem problem for actual implementation of the idea then it would be for alternatives.
Mark my words: every trial of this will be successful until they put people in it. By the time they've smoothed out the turns, upped construction standards to virtually eliminate accidents, and reduced speed to something grandma can survive it will probably cost more then rail. It's brand-new technology and first generation check is never cheaper then the stuff it's replacing. I suspect there will be significant energy savings, and possibly some speed advantage, due to the fact that a hyperloop operates in a vacuam and there's no wind resistance, but the price advantage ain't gonna last.
Coast to coast still wouldn't be that big of a deal. The SR-71 Blackbird flew from LA to Washington DC in 64 minutes 20 seconds.
They didn't design a hyperloop. They designed something that tested some aspects that would get used by a hyperloop.
Do editors even work here?
BeauHD. Worst editor since kdawson.
NY to LA is 2448 miles - at an acceleration of 1g (~22 (Miles per hour) per second) it would take 102 seconds (1.7 minutes) to achieve a speed capable of going from LA to NY in an hour. As long as there aren't any sharp curves, or things to hit along the way, there aren't any forces that would prevent a 1hr trip from LA to NY. Hell the SR-71 made the trip from NY to London in 1hr 40 minutes, and that's 1000 miles farther at ground level - let alone at the 80k - 90k feet the SR71 flew at.
Sorry, but I'm having trouble imagining such a facility being run by a typical American for-profit entity. Bad morale, low standards, high staff turnover, no loyalty to the employee, so no loyalty from the employee back to looking after the public.
So how's about we agree, that we'll make the operating entity an crown (or state) owned utility (not for profit) and run with a well paid, well trained, workforce ?
If only we could fall into a woman's arms without falling into her hands
Their proposed route never exceeds 0.5g in any direction, and the capsules can bank.
Floating at sea nuke plants? Fukushima came pretty damn close, eh? Not to mention all those nuke subs and carriers. Maglev trains are out there. Some of them even run through tubes (and/or chunnels). And synthetic meet? Kids these days just call it "social networking."
Eloi are stupid, throw morlocks at them!
It's O scale or no scale.
Good lord a correction that didn't descend into mudslinging on the internet. It really *must* be a new era.
Their whitepaper, starting on page 39.
The "Hyperloop" concept - putting a capsule with seats in a tube and having it speed between cities - has been around for decades. I have seen concepts for it in old engineering books from the 1950s. Somehow, this becomes "new" and Musk gets his name on it.
I really don't get this cult of personality around Musk. He must have a god for a publicist.
If it's state run that's fine, just make sure it's not a "jobs program" where people are never fired or held accountable for their actions. I don't want something like TSA where people are rummaging through luggage for SWAG
I'm glad you people weren't around when the Wright bros were doing their thing. Or the Panama Canal. Or the Hoover Dam.
Eventually, this will be a viable project. Decades at the very earliest, before the first shovel full is dug. And then decades later before the first mile mile is complete. Gotta let the enviroweenies have their say.
But one of these will be built. Eventually.
And why would it take 5-6 hours for emergency help to arrive? This thing is not in the middle of nowhere, it is following I-5 between LA and SF.
A couple of fender benders during rush hour on the Wednesday before Thanksgiving and it will take 5-6 hours to go 4 car lengths. ;-)
Cool. When I was at university, all I made was a bong out of a half-gallon milk bottle.
It was a pretty sweet bong, though.
You are welcome on my lawn.
Read more than 2 pages. Pages 44-50 show the details, including the turning radii and the deviations from I-5.
An hour to get from New York to San Francisco, an hour and a half to get through the TSA inspection and baggage handling. An enclosed tin can would be a perfect environment for a terrorist attack, and even if it wasn't the TSA would want to stick their noses in for the sake of empire building.
Also in Musk's published photos, they'd have a hard time fitting in the disabled access and public toilets which would be demanded by regulators and pressure groups.
Depending on cost and energy requirements, the Hyperloop may be better suited to goods transport. High acceleration and deceleration forces would not be a problem for goods shipments.
Godel_56 posting anon. due to mod points.
It would actually take about 8 years.
Um, 25 percent of the US population lives within 100 miles of the I-5 highway corridor in the West.
I think it does make sense. Just not in the tax-subsidized empty states.
-- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
From Los Angeles to San Francisco: 559 km
From Paris to Marseilles: 660 km, 16 high speed trains per day.
Ever heard of Scotland? It has worse population density then the US East of the Mississippi. Sweden actually has a population comparable to NYC spread out over a land mass comparable to Cali. Finland's population density is more comparable to Alaska then any other US State. They don't all have record-breaking high-speed rail systems, but they all have rail systems connecting every major City.
Look at it this way: let's say we implement Hi-speed rail in a state with a highly concentrated and relatively large population. Michigan has 9 million people, 58% of them live within two counties of Detroit. Anywhere you're likely to go is within an two hours of Detroit by car, which means means the train has to stop every 20 miles, which makes it very hard to use the high speed, all the construction is somebody's house, so it's very expensive to build, etc. The rail system that makes the least amount of nonsense for the state would probably be circa-1940 speeds from Detroit to Toledo, Gary, and the Wisconsin border, with stops in major cities on the way, and an extensive streetcar system also using 1930s tech.
Let's say, OTOH, you just put a hi-speed rail line across the middle of Montana east-to-west. The low population density makes it incredibly useful because people're likely to be driving for hours and hours across the damn state otherwise. Now it's true there wouldn't necessarily be a whole lot of riders, but if the line actually goes from Minnesota to Seattle...
Rail makes sense when it goes from one major population center to another through ranch land that's cheap to get right-of-way through.
And guess what ? You should know better than to rely on time or speed to make such a guess. You should rely on force and acceleration. 1 G is perfectly survivable by human , and within 1 minutes you are already at 60 meter per seconds, and in 10 minutes 600 meter per seconds or about 2160 kmh. At that sped you do paris new york in 2 and half hour and the 400 miles between los angeles and san francisco in about 15 minutes. Naturally the speed we are talking about are not even 1/4 of that, and the acceleration much lower. But still it shows you that when it comes to beeing squished, you are way way underestimating how much it would take.
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For that matter, at 1g for the entire duration of the ride (1g acceleration halfway, 1g deceleration the other half) it would only take a bit over 21 minutes.
And if we want to talk about human survivability, Wikipedia tells me that humans can generally tolerate up to 5g before blacking out. At that rate it would take about 9.5 minutes one way.
And if we're just looking to get there in an hour, 1/8 g would do the trick.
All my liberal friends think I'm a conservative, all my conservative friends think I'm a liberal.