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Woman Recruited By Google Four Times and Rejected Now Joins Age Discrimination Suit

dcblogs writes: An Ivy league graduate, with a Ph.D. in geophysics, Cheryl Fillekes, who also specializes in Linux and Unix systems, was contacted by Google recruiters four separate times over a seven year period. In each instance, she did well enough on the phone interviews to get invited to an in-person interview but was rejected every time for a job. She has since joined an age discrimination lawsuit against Google filed about two months ago by another older worker. "The amended lawsuit also alleges that the U.S. Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) received 'multiple complaints of age discrimination by Google, and is currently conducting an extensive investigation.'"

21 of 634 comments (clear)

  1. Does indeed happen. by BrookHarty · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Getting into my late 40's, I find my friends are experiencing this all over. EMC keeps contacting a buddy who is a storage architect, he designed storage hardware at sun, they never make an offer after multiple interviews, he says its because hes almost 60. Facebook keeps calling a few of my buddies, but they too never get hired and are in their 50's. I was turned down by 2 companies when they learned my age and I had a family. But I dont want to work in a sweat shop anymore, so its good to know exactly how bad some places can be. Amazon so far seems to be hiring everyone, because they burn them out quicker than they can hire.

    Yeah, people are working until retirement age now, so this is a problem. (You know, that reset button that wipes out your entire life savings called divorce)

    1. Re:Does indeed happen. by Dutch+Gun · · Score: 4, Insightful

      We don't really know what the facts of the case are, but I wonder what it is about people that lead them to believe they're being discriminated against based on a particular factor, like age, race, etc? I've gone to plenty of in-person interviews where I didn't get the job. I could often tell when I didn't answer the questions as well as I'd have liked. For instance, I'm a pretty decent programmer, but my math skills are not outstanding. If the interviewer asks a bunch of math-intensive questions, it's nearly always game over for me. I've had other interviewers ask me really abstract problems, such as how to calculate the number and types of elevators a particular-sized building needed. Honestly, I had no fucking clue. I'm a videogame programmer, not an architect. I reasoned it out as best I could, and obviously I didn't guess well enough.

      Has anyone ever had an experience where they were positive they had a good chance at the job, but nothing came of it? Honestly, I don't think I ever have. Rather, the ones I came away from feeling really good about were generally the ones in which I was offered a job. I'm also sort of curious why someone would interview at the same company four times. Good lord, after the second or third time being rejected, I would have told the next interviewer to piss off, and let them know exactly why.

      --
      Irony: Agile development has too much intertia to be abandoned now.
    2. Re: Does indeed happen. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      "It might be a culture thing"

      Kind of like only hiring men might be a culture thing? "Culture" is very often a word people hide behind for illegal hiring bias.

    3. Re:Does indeed happen. by chipschap · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I'm also sort of curious why someone would interview at the same company four times.

      Because she wanted to sue. No, I'm not being facetious here. I don't for a moment doubt that age discrimination is going on at companies like Google, but it seems obvious enough that the woman wanted to sue. Not saying that she shouldn't --- probably she should.

    4. Re:Does indeed happen. by Darinbob · · Score: 3, Insightful

      That's what "culture" often means. The word makes little sense elsewhere. Anything I can think of that's "culture" a good corporation will want to mix up anyway; otherwise you get monoculture. If you're got a group that's all gamers, then that is bad. If you've got a group that's all dope heads, then that is really bad too (and I've seen that group). If it's a group that's all foodies stuck together in a clique, then that's also bad.

      The other thing that "culture" means can be just a code word for "we all work 80 hours a week here, and we don't enforce that because it's obviously illegal, but if you don't voluntarily work 80 hours a week too then you're just not the right fit for the culture." Which also in a roundabout way is also age discrimination, or at least discrimination against people who know better or who would rather have a life.

    5. Re:Does indeed happen. by narcc · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Wouldn't the more obvious answer be "because she wanted to work for Google"?

    6. Re:Does indeed happen. by hairyfeet · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Which makes these companies run by idiots IMHO. I may be pushing 50 now but even when i was in my 20s I always tried to get the older guys on my team because the old guys knew how to roll with the changes and adapt. Which only makes sense, the old guys when I was in my 20s had gone from punch cards and paper tape to tape decks to the first HDDs, from time sharing to micro computers to desktops, from ASM to Fortran to Basic so they knew about change and were able to adapt.

      Compare this to the young ones where as long as nothing went wrong they were fine but heaven forbid something out of left field went wrong as they just sat there with their thumbs up their ass with no idea how to proceed. When you have had to deal with multiple OSes and form factors you learn the steps wrt basic troubleshooting and how to work their way through a problem logically. It reminds me of a story one of my colleagues used to tell about being sent down to figure out why the "new hot shot" hadn't gotten the server back up, he gets in there and the kid has got the thing practically torn down looking for blown caps or burnt traces as he was sure there HAD to be a hardware problem...there was a hardware problem alright, somebody had knocked out the power cord to the UPS.

      Are their clueless old guys? Sure but you should have those weeded out before it even gets to the one on one interviews, and if this woman had a good enough resume they called her in not twice, not thrice, but FOUR times only to reject her when they saw her? Yeah it really wouldn't be surprising if it was strictly based on age. What somebody needs to do is turn in identical resumes and send two people in, one young and one old, and have them give as close to identical answers as possible and see what happens. If they hire the 25 year old and reject the 45 year old with the same identical resumes and answers? Well it would be damned hard for them to argue anything but age discrimination.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    7. Re:Does indeed happen. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Yes, I had an interview that went extremely well and I didn't get hired. I interviewed right before another person that was friends with people already working there. I'm sure the only reason they interviewed me was so they could meet some bs company requirement of interviewing X number of candidates before hiring.
      I had a mediocre interview another place but my former manager was best friends with the VP so I was hired.
      The people you know can matter more than qualifications.

    8. Re:Does indeed happen. by BVis · · Score: 4, Insightful

      If you still haven't found a decent job you want to stay at in a 7 year time span, you're probably willing to consider a lot of unpleasant options...

      Or, you wanted raises larger than 1.5%. The only way you get a raise of any significance (or a promotion) these days is by switching jobs. After all, your current employer has you right where they want you; why would they want to spend more on you if they don't absolutely have to? They probably resent every dime you get paid and would love nothing more than to chain you to your desk and make you work for nothing. But, since, technically, that's "illegal" (some large-government bullshit like "slavery is illegal".. why can't they let the free market work?), they resort to other methods of minimizing costs at the expense of their employees.

      --
      Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.
  2. the important detail by circletimessquare · · Score: 1, Insightful

    Today, Fillekes' LinkedIn profile describes her career as a "cheese maker at Mohawk Drumlin Creamery." In 2014, "I bought a dairy farm in upstate NY. I designed and built an on-farm creamery to produce farmstead sheep's milk cheese and yogurt," she wrote.

    someone with her education who goes to make cheese... hey, that's really romantic. maybe she burnt out, maybe she has some social issue that prevents competent office interaction

    but maybe the real issue here is resume prejudice. where the guy or gal who takes 5 or 10 years off to pursue a passion never can get back in the game. which is especially true of women and the pursuit being having children

    the usa should be like the nordic countries, and have mandatory child leave for *fathers and mothers*

    that way having kids dings men's careers as much as women. otherwise, as long as child rearing impacts women disproportionately, women will never achieve parity with men in the office. nevermind that men want to spend time with their children and time with dad is just as important as time with mom if we really care about strong families in this country. put your money where your mouth is on your rhetoric about strong families, the presence of a father in a child's life, and family values in general, dear social conservatives, and promote equal family leave for men and women

    --
    intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
    1. Re:the important detail by goose-incarnated · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Whereas your whine about "SJWs"has nothing to do with the topic at hand.

      circletimesquare was entirely on-topic and was making an interesting point. He did not deserve your attack.

      Really? Care to point out my "attack"? You blatantly throw insults as shown above, but anyone who dare politely question what relevance enforced paternal leave has on an ageism lawsuit is an attacker? Did you ever consider why the phrase "victim mentality" has been gaining prominence recently?

      --
      I'm a minority race. Save your vitriol for white people.
    2. Re:the important detail by FlyHelicopters · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Those standards are largely a joke. They are actually worse than a joke because we tell people, "oh, you're all equal, no discrimination", then everyone knows it goes on anyway.

      It is like trying to legislate morality, it doesn't work.

      If a group of 20-30 year old white males are running a business, guess what? They'll largely hire 20-30 year old white males to work with them. They might hire some 20-30 year old white women to work there too, they smell nice and look nice.

      Sounds horrible, doesn't it? Guess what? That is life and reality, and passing a law doesn't change that.

      25 year olds look at a 55 year old and see their parents. They generally will not hire someone who reminds them of Mom and Dad. Note: They SHOULD because most 25 year olds have a lot to learn (I'm 40, I have kids, I know this now, but I didn't at 25 either).

      White kids largely won't hire blacks either, at least not to work with.

      Is that illegal? Yes. Does it still happen? Yes. Complaining about it won't change it.

      Welcome to Earth and the human race. :) People like being around people who are like them, this is largely true everywhere on the planet.

    3. Re:the important detail by dbIII · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The real question is why ANYONE would want to work with people who did not like them

      If they are good at what they do then you don't have to like them. This weird concept that every single person in a workplace has to be the ideal drinking buddy is completely fucked up. A bit of professionalism goes a long way and can keep people who do not like each other from having a horrible work environment or "a life of despair".

  3. Re: All you have to do is walk around Google... by bill_mcgonigle · · Score: 4, Insightful

    kids are easier to boss around and they don't tell the product manager that his new Maps is a piece of shit.

    --
    My God, it's Full of Source!
    OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
  4. It's discomfort at working alongside older people by DNS-and-BIND · · Score: 4, Insightful

    My impression isn't that it's age discrimination per se, it's the culture of twentysomethings. The way they were raised, they are simply uncomfortable with anyone but their own kind. It's not that they hate old people or anything, it's just that they feel weirded out and feel they couldn't possibly work every day with such a person. It's lack of empathy with "the other". It's also a form of oikophobia, in which they welcome people from other cultures but fear and loathe people from their own.

    You can trot out the tired cliches about GET OFF MY LAWN LOLZ but at a certain point, there is truth there. I never felt weirded out by working with age 50+ people, even when I was a new recruit. It was just something everyone did. But now, unless you're one of their own kind, they just get freaked out and think they can't deal with having you around day in and day out. When it comes to making a decision, they drop the black ball in the fishbowl and that's it. No regrets, they just prefer the company of their own generation.

    And I can sort of see where they're coming from. What happens when they share the latest meme from Tumblr around the office? You're going to show a blank look and keep on working. You're not on Tumblr, nor Twitter, nor Facebook, and this not only weirds them out, but makes you automatically suspicious. What are you trying to hide by not making your life public? You're probably a child molester of the kind that their parents constantly warned them about. "Stranger danger!"

    --
    Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
  5. Re:Clearly a shoo-in by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Insightful

    Fooor sure! Any woman who doesn't look good in a dress and expect a slap on the ass once in a while is trouble! Maybe if she'd put on some makeup and hike those little tits up a bit she'd get hired, amirite?
     
    Who cares that she was educated at Cornell and Harvard and is a crazy entrepreneur? If she doesn't learn to stop being so uppity and stop trying to outshine men she'll never make it and really, has only herself to blame!

  6. Ageism v sexism by Any+Web+Loco · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Always really interesting to see these two topics come up on Slashdot. Ageism apparently exists, sexism doesn't.

  7. Quite a few reasons by ET3D · · Score: 1, Insightful

    Older people tend not to want to work long hours, which is expected in many places in the industry.

    An older person won't fit well into a young company, probably won't enjoy hanging out with 20 year olds that much, etc.

    Older people do, in general, have less "zest". They've seen enough, they're more measured, they don't go "OMG, my first job, how exciting is that" or "did you see that programming competition?"

    Older people have more experience, and it's expected that they'd expect and ask for higher salaries.

    While it's all individual, it's much easier to assume up front that a young code monkey will be more excited and willing to work for less, will fit in more easily and code 14 hours a day.

    1. Re:Quite a few reasons by Daemonik · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I've often thought the greatest mystery in the world was how corporations convince otherwise rational people to sacrifice their lives, their health, their families all in the name of "THE TEAM" or "THE COMPANY", as if the company will ever return even 1/10th of that devotion to the employees. Corporations are the ultimate Stockholm Syndrome with some serious Manchurian Candidate brainwashing behind them.

  8. Re:Commission by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Can't just be the recruiters. Someone above them has to either be actively allowing them bring people back in who have already been rejected three times before or they're just so disorganized they don't keep records on that kind of thing.

    Could be legal restrictions too.

    Not sure about USA, but here in EU, employer is legally allowed to store applicant profiles only for 6 months.

    Summary mentions four interviews during 7 years, so the earlier mention about non-selection would have expired.

  9. ... v racism by Kunta+Kinte · · Score: 4, Insightful
    Thank you for that observation. Apparently racism does not exist as well. Just read the comments on any diversity article. Almost every top rated comment proclaiming racial bias does not exist in tech. And you are a SJW for saying so.

    The difference is that ageism does affect many Slashdot readers. Sexist and racism apparently not so much.

    --
    Based on upvotes, Ageism is the only "-ism" Slashdotters care about and think isn't SJW