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Sony Decides Its Waterproof Xperia Phones Are Not Actually Waterproof
Mark Wilson writes: Sony seems determined on confusing its customers by giving very conflicting advice about its Xperia smartphones. If you're familiar with the range, you'll no doubt be aware of the advertising material that appears to show users taking photos in the rain and even (seemingly) underwater at the pool. Take a look at the picture above and you'd probably assume that a) it depicts someone shooting a video or taking a photo in a swimming pool, and b) you can do the same with your phone. But you'd be wrong (at least on b) because Sony has changed its mind about what waterproof means. Or it doesn't know. It really depends on where you look on the Sony website.
and legal.
I know because I've used it underwater multiple times without the slightest ill effect. This is warranty semantics, nothing more or less.
you need to root the phone to make it waterproof.
lucm, indeed.
"Fluff" and "Puffery" are one thing. Explicitly showing people doing things the device can not do is plain false advertising.
A bullet may have your name on it but splash damage is addressed "To whom it may concern."
Ads for trucks often show warranty-voiding off road activities. It's not CGI, the trucks will DO the stuff in the ad, but you're probably SOT (Spot Outta Truck) when you break it that way.
Pretending this is my office full of bitter coworkers..
If it says Sony, it's a phony. Stay dry.
Life is not for the lazy.
Been going on since advertising was invented. And if you honestly looked at this phone and said "now I can take my phone snorkling", well, that's a problem at your end.
Doesn't make it legal or okay. It turns out false advertising is a thing society does a little bit to punish.
Of course, the practical result is more puffery. Advertising has evolved over the last century to present as little information as possible so that none of it is false.
Just because advertisers have always been depraved abhuman shitweasels, why should we tolerate them being so now? If anything, the fact that a given sector has always been rotten seems like a better argument for extirpating it than for putting up with it.
Look, we all know that marketing materials are fluff, and should not be relied upon when buying or using a piece of equipment.
The problem is that "we all" don't know that; in fact there are so many millions of people who don't know that, we have a Federal Trade Commission with the authority to regulate marketing materials. Sony's advertising explicitly infers using this phone to take photos of someone underwater in a swimming pool. If the phone is not intended or designed to be used that way, then depicting that exact activity in marketing materials is not okay.
It seems fairly obvious to me that by "water proof" they mean "water resistant" and they make it clear that it is not designed for dedicated underwater use such as a GoPro-like device. But you can probably still drop it in your toilet and it will work after being fished out.
It was obvious to me that those Enzyte pills with "Smiling Bob" were snake oil, that didn't stop the company from being bankrupted or the owners from going to prison. If this phone isn't designed for underwater use then Sony should not be permitted to promote it that way. Their website should show an image of a phone being fished out of a toilet, perhaps, not an image of someone photographing swimmers underwater.
Thanks to the War on Drugs, it's easier to buy meth than it is to buy cold medicine!
As an owner of this phone says below, it's warranty semantics:
gweilo8888: I know because I've used it underwater multiple times without the slightest ill effect. This is warranty semantics, nothing more or less.
...and...
willworkforbeer: Ads for trucks often show warranty-voiding off road activities. It's not CGI, the trucks will DO the stuff in the ad, but you're probably SOT (Spot Outta Truck) when you break it that way.
Nothing to see here.
If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
Honestly, I wish I dunked my Z2 the day it came in the mail. This way, if there was a problem, I could just chargeback. (I bought it straight from Sony.) Otherwise, the wettest I've gotten it is to dip a corner.
No, I will not work for your startup
I was told in store that I could take my Z3 windsurfing with me.
Last I checked the Z3 was rated somewhere around IP67 which does have a standardized definition (or, at least, a test) and isn't just marketing fluff like "water proof"
"Fluff" and "Puffery" are one thing. Explicitly showing people doing things the device can not do is plain false advertising.
Isn't a large amount of advertisements out there patently false? Look at the claims made by supplement vendors and diet pill pushers. How do you know a marketing guy is lying? His lips are moving ...
I assumed the phone, xperia z1 comact, is waterproof and shot some pics in the pool. Nothing happened to the phone. The pics are fine too. Two years later the rubber bands around the charching port flap are all destroyed and i will not try the trick again.
You expect the Truth ? Oh damn! Did I just *go there*?
Been going on since advertising was invented. And if you honestly looked at this phone and said "now I can take my phone snorkling", well, that's a problem at your end.
Actually the problem isn't on my end.
If I pay for of full tank of gas I expect to get a full tank of gas. If I buy a pound of meat then I expect it to be a full pound. If the seller fails to deliver then there is a problem and it is the sellers responsibility to correct that problem.
If I buy a waterproof phone and a non-waterproof phone is delivered then that is no different from me buying a 1TB harddrive and getting a 100GB one.
It could be an honest mistake by the seller and I will be fine with them correcting their failure and deliver the correct item. It could also be fraud in which case it is illegal.
Don't defend Sony, they have been convicted of crimes before and still keep ending up on the wrong side of the law.
Thousands of consumer complaints were made to the Better Business Bureau about the company's business practices, especially the "autoship" program that repeatedly charged customers' credit cards for refills even after they canceled their orders.
Wayne?
Luckily there are laws that protect consumers from people like you.
They show someone taking a photo with it underwater in a pool and it really cant? Absolutely liable for damages under the letter of the law.
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
I work for a wireless carrier, I would endure a lot less headache if people weren't dunking their phones because they think they are waterproof. I wouldn't believe it and just assume the phone is water resistant. Just do yourself a favor and keep your supercomputer tricorder phone out of the pool.
willworkforbeer: Ads for trucks often show warranty-voiding off road activities. It's not CGI, the trucks will DO the stuff in the ad, but you're probably SOT (Spot Outta Truck) when you break it that way.
Nothing to see here.
And what, exactly, are they showing trucks doing that voids their warranties?
If I break a tie-rod end off-road they'll replace it. If I snap a ball joint they'll replace it and will probably fix the bent wheel opening molding and fender that resulted. If the steering gearbox or rack-and-pinion fail they'll replace those unless they failed as a direct result of striking a rock with the housing itself.
Same goes for axle shafts, axle housings, springs, even driveshafts, depending on the cause. Most truck and true-SUV manufacturers also have either options for underbody skid protection or OEM-aftermarket skid plates specifically for these applications.
Obviously if I sideswipe a tree they're not going to repair and repaint the side of the truck or replace the glass, that's a given. If the truck is sold as a serious off-road vehicle then there's an expectation that it'll do the job that it's marketed for and that the manufacturer will, to at least an extent, stand behind it.
Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
Look, we all know that marketing materials are fluff, and should not be relied upon when buying or using a piece of equipment. It seems fairly obvious to me that by "water proof" they mean "water resistant" and they make it clear that it is not designed for dedicated underwater use such as a GoPro-like device. But you can probably still drop it in your toilet and it will work after being fished out.
They make it clear that the phone can be taken underwater up to 1.5m deep and up to 30 minutes. Why would someone read this and assume that the phone is only waterproof enough for use in the rain?
http://www.sonymobile.com/in/p...
The Xperia Z3 is waterproof and protected against dust as long as you follow a few simple instructions: all ports and attached covers are firmly closed; you can’t take the phone deeper than 1.5 m of water and for longer than 30 minutes; and the water should be fresh water. Casual use in chlorinated pools is permitted provided the phone is rinsed in fresh water afterwards. No seawater and no salt water pools.
It appears that it does meet the long-established standard, and Sony explains what the standard requires. The ad showing the person in the swimming pool may be a bit questionable , though. On that note ...
We offer an inexpensive hot spare service, so that if anything happens to your server, our copy takes over. Right at the top of the order form, it says clearly that this is designed to be an inexpensive service, to provide great value. Everything is therefore fully automated and nobody has tested it with your specific setup. I thought about doing an ad in which, for dramatic effect, we take a machine gun to a running web server and watch as the site switches over to the hot spare. That SHOULD work, but I wouldn't RECOMMEND actually shooting up your datacenter. Sony may be in a similar position - testing suggests it should work okay, but they don't recommend pushing the limits.
http://downloadmoreram.com/
Errrr, how do you figure? If a company tells you that what they're selling is food and it turns out it's poison, is it your fault for not expecting to buy poison?
same shit since 1979... "The first Walkman weighed in at a solid 390 grams (plus 50 grams for the headphones). With its strong square lines and metallic blue finish, it was almost as streamlined as today's surge protectors. To emphasize its portability, Morito reportedly had a shirt custom-tailored with an oversized chest pocket in which to carry the 3.5 x 5.5 x 1.25 inch device." https://reason.com/archives/20...
- In Soviet Korea, only old people loose all their bases to Natalie Portman's petrified hot grits overlords.
Unless you lift it. Than you're on your own.
But don't kid yourself, very few new trucks on the trails. Paint is too shiny.
John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
You can. If you make sure every plug is in place.
The kicker is that water inside is used as evidence that you had a plug out.
John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
Maybe it's like one of those commercials where beer doesn't taste like piss and void the warranty on your liver, and instead is a delicious and refreshing beverage that causes hot chix to like you.
Don't waste your vote! Vote for whoever you want, unless you live in a swing state it won't matter anyways
And we all learned as kids that advertisements show things the product absolutely cannot do ALL THE TIME. Is it wrong? You bet it is. Is it commonplace? Yep, sure is.
Been going on since advertising was invented. And if you honestly looked at this phone and said "now I can take my phone snorkeling", well, that's a problem at your end.
If there were no mention beyond what was normally expected from a cellphone, I would say yes. However, the pics and the marketing materials expressly suggest that it is possible to "now I can take my phone snorkeling". Sony is still weak from the hack (that was far overdue and well deserved). Their Legal department fears people who take their phone snorkeling and it dies on them because it was inappropriately sealed, and then sue. So they backpedaled.
However, that shows a) they lied on the marketing which is fraud, or b) there engineers are now incompetent.
Alot of use who hate Sony and want to watch it burn to the ground as a warning to the next ten generations that some favors come with too high a price, feel the first option is best.
Sony's advertising explicitly infers using this phone to take photos of someone underwater in a swimming pool.
No, it does not.
Quite, we shouldn't expect anything shown in an ad to be accurate. If we buy a so-called "phone" for $600, and it cannot make phone calls, take pictures, or store music, then that's our fault for just assuming it could on the basis that the ads show it doing all those things. We're the idiots, while the advertisers are find upstanding capitalists that are beyond all criticism and whose integrity must not be besmirched by the likes of us.
You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
They show someone taking a photo with it underwater in a pool and it really cant?
They never said it can't, they said you shouldn't. Big difference.
Again, refer to truck commercials.
If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
Waterproof, The Coast Guard definition is found in 46 CFR 110.15-1(b)19, which states that a "Waterproof machine means a totally enclosed machine so constructed that a stream of water from a hose with a nozzle one inch in diameter that delivers at least 65 gallons per minute can be played on the machine from any direction from a distance of about 10 feet for a period of not less than 5 minutes without leakage..."
Passionately Indifferent
Perhaps more importantly, the Register has reported that at least one of Sony's Xperia phones (the M4) is not only IP65/68 compliant, but passes their "IP-Beer" test:
"More importantly, the M4 passes The Reg’s IP-booze test, which mandates immersion in two pints of lager for one hour, then being left to dry while said lager is drunk and then dropped onto the toilet floor after being used singlehandedly as the aforementioned alcoholic beverage is disposed of."
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2...
The really funny commercials are for cars. It shows a car driving calmly down the road, and the small print says: "Professional driver on a closed course. Do not attempt."
Don't attempt what? Driving down the road? Isn't that what the car is for?
Maybe the Sony phone thing is the same level of CYA boilerplate from lawyers.
If you think I voted for Trump because of this post, you're wrong. I voted for Dr. Jill Stein of the Green Party. Again.
Every android phone that shows a screen says SCREEN IMAGES SIMULATED while the iPhone NEVER does. it is the actual screen - ust like when Nokia demoed their great photo images, turned out the photos were taken with an SLR. Basically, if you actually have faith and belief in your product, you just show it in action. Porsche does do not need to show the car flying and underneath note, NOT A FLYING CAR. Some products require puffery and fakery like beer or soda but a CE product? They should take Apple's lead and just show videos or photos taken normally.
They advertised IP67. That is a technical spec with a very specific meaning. If it's not meeting IP67 they have a serious false advertising issue on their hands.
Sorry, IP68. Google suggestions deceive!
You've got to love El Reg.
Look, we all know that marketing materials are fluff, and should not be relied upon when buying or using a piece of equipment. It seems fairly obvious to me that by "water proof" they mean "water resistant" and they make it clear that it is not designed for dedicated underwater use such as a GoPro-like device. But you can probably still drop it in your toilet and it will work after being fished out.
clear? hmmm Personally I consider using advertising material of people swimming taking underwater photos as pretty fucking clear that they are implying it is waterproof and meant for underwater use.
"... doesn't make 'it' legal."
Did anyone at Slashdot really believe they'd be able to shoot underwater videos with $900 cell phone!? (Go price a Nikonos underwater camera setup.)
Why would anyone ignore the obvious lessons of childhood? The vast majorityof us recognise that we live in a world where nearly every word has more than one definition and we all had to learn to deal with context long before we could afford a cell phone, even one purchased on contract. Does it really shock you to learn that diving into a pool with an Xperia might void your warranty, or that Betanews' big scoop could really have been confined to explaining the methodology used in the IP standards testing process?
There really ought to be a designated kiddie section of the internet...
If you lift it then it's no longer in the manufacturer's configuration, unless again, one follows the manufacturer's OEM-aftermarket program, which *might* still have a degree of warranty available.
But you're certainly correct, very few new trucks and SUVs are out on the trails, and very few new vehicles are heavily modified. I'm mulling getting a 2000 or so Cherokee and putting a bit of work into it; I've seen very nice 4x4 examples with low miles and not for as expensive as one might dread. Throw a mild suspension lift, some ARB pneumatic differential lockers some under-body skid protection, some good tires, and have a pretty decent off-road rig without having to lift it to kingdom come. Too many other projects before I could do that though.
Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
And what, exactly, are they showing trucks doing that voids their warranties?
There was an "issue" with the Ford Raptor where customers were jumping them off hills - something they're designed to do - but going way too fast for the truck, to the point where suspension would bottom out and frame damage occurred. Ford would not honor the warranty, and rightly so, because people were pushing the truck way harder than it was designed for, even though the activity itself was not necessarily warranty-voiding.
Do you know what false advertising is in fact? "A reasonable person must believe it." Catch 22; no reasonable person would believe any advertising so it is hard to get a conviction. Here it might be more cut and dry because they claim an IP68 standard which does mean something. Either way I'd rather have a phone that tries to IP68 than one that doesn't. I've had a S3 Active and I took a lot of underwater video with it but I seated my cover correctly every time. The new Sony have a open USB port that is IP68 or was obviously until a rational engineer told the marketing folks that that they cannot claim X. I honestly have NO IDEA why we need any ports on any phone at all. Sure I love me some 2 batteries but with Qi, NFC, Wifi, Cloud Sync, Chromecast et al. I would be happy having all those things like USB, SIM, SD, and whatever under screw down o-ring bezels.
Many countries (e.g. Australia) have truth in advertising laws. Those diet and supplement vendors in Australia get fined and shut down if they make those sort of claims here. Similarly Sony are likely to be in serious trouble here if those swimming adverts are shown here (no idea if they are or aren't)
You can.
But you have to promise to post the link to your blog about your small claim suit.
You should entitle it, "This is what happens when Don Quixote battles small print, armed with nothing but an illogical sense of outrage and the right to defend it at court."
IP68 is...
6 Dust tight No ingress of dust; complete protection against contact (dust tight)
8 Immersion beyond 1 m The equipment is suitable for continuous immersion in water under conditions which shall be specified by the manufacturer. However, with certain types of equipment, it can mean that water can enter but only in such a manner that it produces no harmful effects.
No mention of salt so fuck snorkling. If it is not made out of a sealed portless glass block. marine grade stainless or brass it is not going in the ocean. But i've dropped more than one phone out of a chest pocket into a stream pong or river. It if makes it through that it is better than the alternative.
Sony has at one point sued its **fucking self** take that in to account.
7
Immersion up to 1 m
Ingress of water in harmful quantity shall not be possible when the enclosure is immersed in water under defined conditions of pressure and time (up to 1 m of submersion). Test duration: 30 minutes
Tested with the lowest point of the enclosure 1000 mm below the surface of the water, or the highest point 150 mm below the surface, whichever is deeper.
I have some experience working for a company that advertises devices at higher waterproof/resistance ratings than they mostly are. Some people use them in water no problem, most can't. WaterProof requires qc that would reduce ceo's profit margin by .1 cents and he can only get a gulfstream 1 instead of the latest gulsfstream3. Thus the legal team makes all support and technical documents downplay the design specs that the mamrketing team advertises.
They claim the Apple Watch isn't waterproof, yet there's plenty of evidence you can swim with it with no ill effect.
Indeed. I have an Xperia Z2. Great phone, I love it (although definitely get a protector! The glass never ever scratches but it will break if you drop it too much/too hard/sit on it at a bad angle/whatnot). But the waterproofness is conditional on the plug over the USB port being in. But the plug likes to come out sometimes. So, you're probably fine if you check the plug and make sure it's fully secure before you get in the water, and don't fiddle too much with it. But it's certainly possible to screw up.
That said, when you use it properly, it is indeed waterproof. I've used mine in the shower (although that's a bit tricky as the water droplets can count as screen touches) and fully underwater in the sink (easier to use there). I've never taken it in the pool but I have no doubt it would be fine there... again, conditional on that plug being right in position.
If I could change one thing about the phone, I'd gladly give up the USB port and just use inductive charging in order to have the waterproofing be more reliable. I never transfer data over USB.
"This administration is so incompetent that they cover their tracks with bigger tracks." - Seth Meyers
My $147 camera is water and shock proof, so yes, a $900 cell phone could be waterproof.
The kicker is that water inside is used as evidence that you had a plug out.
Indeed. My experience with the equally waterproof-but-oh-not-actually Galaxy S6 Active:
...
Me: I've had it underwater for a few minutes total, to a depth of a foot at most. It flipped its shit, the screen bugs out and it thinks a Galaxy Gear is plugged into it.
Customer Service Rep: OK. Take the SIM tray out. Is the ring white or red?
Me: Red.
CSR: Well that's proof that water has gotten into the phone, so unfortunately there's nothing we can do for you.
Me: The red ring is proof you've sold me a defective product. You advertise it as able to withstand water under the conditions in which I've used it. Your own commercial has this device getting doused in ketchup, dropped hard, and then dunked into a bowl of milk. Water getting in means it didn't function as advertised.
CSR: You must've used it wrong.
Me: Everything was perfectly secured and I used it in a way supported by the manual and your advertising materials. You even have an "Aqua Mode" explicitly for taking pictures underwater.
CSR:
Me: If you don't make this right, I'm just going to dispute the charge on this defective product.
CSR: Unfortunately there's nothing I can do.
They ended up with their defective phone back and I ended up with my money back. PITA, though.
Nothing posted to
Between wireless charging and bluetooth there is no need for ports or air spaces inside the device. Customers get a cool scuba diving phone and manufacturers end up with much better reputation and lower repair costs for water/sand/dust damage. Win-win!
I took the phone into a 45 min cenote swim trip in cancun and it's still working (I'm typing on it now). I took pictures and video but the touchscreen was flaky when wet. It mostly sat in my pocket under water.
However I did develop corrosion in the headphone jack within a week. This made the jack useless until I tried lemon juice (fail) and later vinegar (ftw) to fix it.
Before my purchase, advertising said you could take video underwater. Photos showed a guy underwater with it. But Sony's later backpedaling basically says the phone is not waterproof and they will not replace any water damage.... As clear a case of false advertising as I've ever heard of. My attempts to contact them were ignored.
Class action layup if you ask me.
The extreme abuse done to a Ford Raptor is a bit of an outlier, and is a lot more akin to sideswiping a tree or high-centering on boulders. Sure, the truck can handle some high-speed offroading better than many other 4x4s, but there is a limit to how much dynamic load the manufacturer should be required to withstand.
That kind of treatment isn't the same as someone out on the rocky trail or in the dry riverbed that has slowed down to match the terrain they're crossing.
Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
Because even a sealed phone will eventually have it's seals wear away. Especially in salt water! This is why Sony is COVERING THEIR ASS from Joe Moron.
No such thing as waterproof, only water resistant to specified depths.
I agree
They could make a completely sealed phone. No need for any plugs of any type. Wireless charging plus all of the communications protocols means you never have to plug anything into the phone. Just seal it up tight.
I don't think I've plugged my Nexus 5 phone into anything for more than a year.
I don't read your sig. Why are you reading mine?
IP68 is itself quite vague. It's rated for continuous submersion, but that could mean 10cm of clean water for 5 minutes or it could mean 30m in the sea indefinitely. The worry for consumers is that if the phone dies due to a poor seal Sony can claim that the water was too acidic, had chlorine or salt in it, submersion was below 1.5m etc.
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
When these phones first came out, I remember shopping mall stands where they had aquariums with submerged phones. People were handed phones and shown how to take photos under water. Clearly marketed as being able to withstand being under water.
There are plenty of places in the U.K. where you can go wind surfing on FRESH WATER. It quite clearly states in all the materials for all the waterproof Z series that it *EXCLUDES* salt water. For some you can dung it in chlorinated water, but that comes with a warning to rinse thoroughly in fresh water, and that the seals may become corroded over time if you do it a lot.
Note that the as time has progressed the Z series phones have become more waterproof than before. So the upcoming Z5 is a lot more waterproof than my Z1 compact.
While I agree wireless charging would be great (and Z5(c) doesn't include the magnetic dock connector anymore), Z5(c) doesn't have the USB port behind a plug anymore, only the SIM and MicroSD. The headphone connector has been plugless since Z2. So there's little need to fiddle with them anymore.
I bought an Xperia Z1 from swappa for $150 (to replace my aging Samsung Galaxy S) and it was a pretty good phone. Now I can barely use the thing without bluetooth as the microphones are wonky and 50% of the time I use the damn thing to call someone they can't hear me. I did put it under running water a couple of times (made sure all the little rubber gaskets were secure and rinsed it for 2 seconds in tape water). I'm not sure if that borked up the 2 microphones or not.
Le sigh.
I followed most of the recommendations, check the seals. I have used it in ponds, salt and fresh and in the ocean, but always less than 1 meter deep. I have had mine sincerity was released in Australia.
I don't want a phone I can use underwater. I want a phone that will be fine if I accidentally drop it in water, get pushed into a swimming pool or get drenched in a rainstorm. As long as the common accidents are survivable, I'll be happy.
Yes, you read the specification that says IP68. Did you see the commercials?
Just because you have fine print that says one thing doesn't mean that it is legal to use advertising that shows capabilities beyond that.
They didn't indicate salt water but the commercials clearly shows that they expect you to take the phone with you when you jump into the water.
Exact measurements aren't shown but the events depicted shows situations that will bring the phone beyond what Sonys own testing takes it.
Why would anyone ignore the obvious lessons of childhood? My childhood was in the 80's so the lesson I learned was no matter how good the box art is on that Atari 2600 game, actually game play will only involve a series of coloured blocks.
This is just to save Sony the lawsuits by idiots who drown thinking they can talk underwater.
Buddy of mine got a 2001 cherokee for his son. Kept overheating, found the tines rusted off the water pump. It also had the jeep death wobble too. Just FYI....
May I ask how you managed that? I had a Sony Xperia Z phone (advertised as waterproof) and although I never tested the claims to be water proof, I did find out that while they may have made their phones water proof, they didn't take into account that a fully sealed phone has issues with heat stress. I live in a country where it gets to -40, and after taking the phone out of my pocket (warm beside my body) the screen cracked. A simple, single, hairline fracture. Unfortunately it was under the glass (couldn't feel it) which interfered with it's touch screen. The phone was completely unusable. I Googled it, as I had never dropped the phone and kept it in a case for it's entire life, and it turn out to be a very common problem ("Google Xperia Z series self cracking screen").
BBC Watchdog investigated them, the Sony in the US offers refunds, but Sony Canada apparently does not and I got nothing except for a $25 bill for shipping the phone for them AFTER I had called to confirm this was a warranty issue, had the guy at Sony customer service email me a written document saying it was a warranty issue, and included this written document with the phone sent to Sony Warranty.
My only recompense was watching Sony fail miserably in Canada and have to shut it's doors several months later.
So how do you get your money back if a phone company screws you?
A friend had older model and got somehow tricked by advertising, decided to dive to sea with it.
They restored the SD card, it actually has video of fish checking it out.
I took a Fujifilm Finepix XP series camera scuba diving in the ocean, are you saying that the plastic used in that isn't waterproof in saltwater? I was actually quite impressed, it survived much deeper than I expected it to, and still functions now.
I am not sure the exact model I have, but this is much the same:
http://www.fujifilm.com/produc...
Things don't have to be stainless, glass or brass to survive salt water, you just have to be sure to rinse it off afterwards.
APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
The only truck commercial I can think of that was literally impossible was the Toyota (can't remember which) getting his by a meteor and coming out of the crater. What truck commercials show trucks doing things that are clearly not supposed to be done?
APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
Um, the picture is in TFA, the first one. That is the Sony advertising showing the phone being used in a FREAKING POOL.
APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
As long as you drop it "gently"...
From Xperia blog:
Sony devices that are tested for their waterproof abilities are placed gently inside a container filled with tap water and lowered to a depth of 1.5 metres.After 30 minutes in the container, the device is gently taken out and its functions and features are tested.
Same happened here with a brand new Sony Xperia Z3.
Wanted to listen to music while in the tub. Being a responsible user, I double and triple checked that all cover flaps on the device were perfectly absolutely closed. Flap seals of the brand new device were undamaged, no dust or sand inside. Never intended to use the device underwater, just near the tub.
Device fell in, shut off 10 seconds later, never came back on, interior was chock full of water.
RMAd the device, short discussion with customer service rep and they replaced the whole thing free of charge. A few recent photos were lost, everything else was backed up and I had an older Xperia Z available for having the smartphone need filled until the replacement arrived, so it wasn't that big of a deal.
Since the process cost zero bucks, I kept the new Xperia Z3, but I will never trust their waterproof-ness ever again. For me, it is a huge lie in advertising.
On the practical side, it wasn't even possible to get the water OUT of it. iPhones etc. are not waterproof but may survive if switched off and dried out immediately. Put them in rice or silica packets will dry them out fast. Not so much with a fully sealed phone. Since corrosion happens within days or even hours, it cannot be prevented.
Lockers on an independent suspension truck are pretty much guaranteed to break something. Plan on swapping in a real front axle.
John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
Z1 is also plugless for the headphones.
John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
Oh OK. I recall someone lamenting about the headphone plug in an earlier model, but I guess it was the original Xperia Z then, I stand corrected.
I've owned a Z3 compact for a year. Best phone I've ever had. Not because of the waterproofing but due to the awesome battery life and small (in today's terms) size. But that's just by my criteria.
As other owners of the line have noted above: yes I do use it while having a bath, and I casually wash it off under tap water. Never taken it to a pool, though it has been submerged in the bathtub (though the depth would be something like 10cm). Would I try to take an underwater photo? Yes, I wouldn't think twice about it. It is possible to access the camera and shoot merely through tapping the screen. Would I use the fast-shoot button though? Probably not, I'd avoid any mechanical moving part underwater.
The USB flap is the most annoying thing on the phone. I _NEVER_ use it. I bought the magnetic cable that sticks to the side of the phone where the two charging pins are in my first week of having the phone. There is a second flap where the mini-SD card plugs, which I assume is still there, though I doubt anyone would need to use it often (as opposed to the USB port which is used for charging). I'm 100% certain that if you open this port daily it will gradually wear (it's mad of rubber I think) and lose its effectiveness.
In short, I think that the phone will do everything that is claimed in the ad, as long as it's used properly (don't forget the flap open) and it is new (flap won't help after X number of open/close cycles). So, the catch is that normal wear and tear (i.e. using the USB port flap every other day for charging) will probably break its waterproof ability.
It sucks, but they seem to have fixed it in the Z5 compact (thinking of buying it) which has a flap-less USB port that is waterproof. And even the current model has ways around it (the magnetic charging cable I mentioned, or a dock, combined with transferring files via WLAN rather than attaching it to your computer with USB).
To err is human, but to forgive is beyond the scope of the Operating System...
willworkforbeer: Ads for trucks often show warranty-voiding off road activities. It's not CGI, the trucks will DO the stuff in the ad, but you're probably SOT (Spot Outta Truck) when you break it that way.
Nothing to see here.
And what, exactly, are they showing trucks doing that voids their warranties? If I break a tie-rod end off-road they'll replace it. If I snap a ball joint they'll replace it and will probably fix the bent wheel opening molding and fender that resulted. If the steering gearbox or rack-and-pinion fail they'll replace those unless they failed as a direct result of striking a rock with the housing itself. Same goes for axle shafts, axle housings, springs, even driveshafts, depending on the cause. Most truck and true-SUV manufacturers also have either options for underbody skid protection or OEM-aftermarket skid plates specifically for these applications. Obviously if I sideswipe a tree they're not going to repair and repaint the side of the truck or replace the glass, that's a given. If the truck is sold as a serious off-road vehicle then there's an expectation that it'll do the job that it's marketed for and that the manufacturer will, to at least an extent, stand behind it.
Sure they'll fit it, but it won't likely be covered by the warranty - it'll likely be at your cost. Why? At a minimum, normal wear and tear is not covered by warranty. No different than my Mazda3 which, despite Mazda having a program for racers, explicitly states that racing will void the warranty. The Mazda3 is a popular vehicle for Rally Racing, and it will certainly do it. They also have had a bunch of ads - including some you find at the dealer - showing it doing stuff that they don't generally recommend. Many car commercials show off the performance, all while showing tiny print saying "do not do this" and all kinds of other disclaimers.
Truth is like the sun. You can shut it out for a time, but it ain't goin' away. - Elvis Presley (source: imdb.com)
If I could change one thing about the phone, I'd gladly give up the USB port and just use inductive charging in order to have the waterproofing be more reliable. I never transfer data over USB.
No need. For example, the new Moto G (2015 model) that was just released has some water resistant features (1 meter/3ft for 30 minutes) as well. Only, it has no plug for the USB as it uses a new method to allow the USB to be exposed even during immersion.
Now their purpose if more for those who accidentally drop the phone in water; but I doubt that would really change anything related to the USB port.
Also, the lack of a USB port would be a problem as you wouldn't be able to diagnose a faulty device without it since USB is used for all the diagnostics functionality on a running device. So it'd be better to do what Motorola is doing versus dropping it entirely.
Truth is like the sun. You can shut it out for a time, but it ain't goin' away. - Elvis Presley (source: imdb.com)
I modded your comment down, but realized it was only because I disagreed with your statement, and I should be voicing my disagreement with a comment instead.
A sealed phone as you describe means a battery that is not user serviceable. I am strongly in the "a device's battery should be user serviceable" camp.
"now I can take my phone snorkeling"
While most snorkeling is close to the surface, it's extremely easy to go beyond 1 meter, especially when entering the water from a boat (as is often the case, especially for those doing so on vacation and guided tours). You're also very likely to forget, and dive a little further (2-3 meters is easy to do) to look at rocks, marine life, etc too.
One reason why sports watches typically are 100 meter water resistant, and dive watches even more so.
Truth is like the sun. You can shut it out for a time, but it ain't goin' away. - Elvis Presley (source: imdb.com)
"Fluff" and "Puffery" are one thing. Explicitly showing people doing things the device can not do is plain false advertising.
Isn't a large amount of advertisements out there patently false? Look at the claims made by supplement vendors and diet pill pushers. How do you know a marketing guy is lying? His lips are moving ...
As noted by http://tech.slashdot.org/comme..., the USA has truth in advertising laws - both at the Federal and State levels for most States.
That said, advertisers can get around it somewhat by disclosures in the ads, which are typically in fine print shown for the duration of the activity that they are not recommending, advising, etc. Same with the diet stuff where they disclose that results may vary, etc. However, they usually have to also have stuff that backs up the general case - IOW, they can't use a one-off example in adversing, it has to be something that falls within the data-backed realm of general use of the product.
Truth is like the sun. You can shut it out for a time, but it ain't goin' away. - Elvis Presley (source: imdb.com)
Let's be real there though. Is the real use case for the waterproof feature, taking the phone into a swimming pool? Or is it to protect the phone from dropping in a toilet or urinal? I know where my vote is going.
[citation needed]
Often those trucks have suspensions that are not stock or at least modified from stock.
I had a Galaxy XCover 2 that got water damaged after filming underwater.
I brought it to the service center and they basically told me that waterproof phones are actually not meant to be used underwater, that they get them regularly and they are often not covered by warranty. I think they even said "false advertizing" explicitly.
They sent my phone back to Samsung and I got a replacement for free so I guess I was lucky.
"Waterproof" is a relative safety feature but don't expect more.
The frame would bend when hitting a dip after a jump, the raptor should have been able to handle the said dip through the advertising. It happened to a number of trucks on a course. If you market your truck as a trophy truck you should expect it to be used as such.
I don't see how that's relevant. Not everybody wants a user serviceable battery, and many phones don't have that, so it isn't a need.
"When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
Wait, Sony actually makes a smartphone?