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A Fresh Take On Fake Meat

Posted by samzenpus on from the tastes-like-chicken dept.

JMarshall writes: Impossible Foods, a Silicon Valley food start-up started by a Stanford professor who quit his job, just raised $108 million to pursue a plant-based burger that truly tastes like meat. This ACS article explains how Impossible Foods and other startups and researchers are tackling the tricky chemical and engineering challenge of making fake meat that tastes real. "Meat flavors and aromas come from thousands of volatile small molecules released by muscle and fat cell destruction. Flavor precursors start with an animal’s diet, which influences the molecular composition of its cells. After slaughter, enzymes in an animal’s muscle cells begin breaking down biomolecules into simpler amino acids, sugars, and fatty acids. This means some flavor molecules develop even as the meat ages during its trip to the store. Other flavor and aroma components emerge from reactions between sugars, amino acids, or fatty acids as the meat is cooked."

48 of 317 comments (clear)

  1. I found another unicorn! by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    In short, they're reinventing the Tofu burger.

    1. Re:I found another unicorn! by tchdab1 · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Are people who are concerned about what they eat going to embrace a chemical s**t storm just because it's meatless?

    2. Re:I found another unicorn! by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      It's for people who want the THIS IS HEALTHY label on the box, who aren't going to check the ingredient list to verify that its healthy, and think what they're eating is healthy. IAfter all, the label can't be wrong.

    3. Re:I found another unicorn! by HornWumpus · · Score: 3, Insightful

      In other words, Almond 'Milk' drinkers.

      --
      John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
    4. Re:I found another unicorn! by Your.Master · · Score: 5, Interesting

      They will if they are the sort who abstain from meat due to ethical considerations (the "fish are friends, not food" crowd). Your chemic shitstorm isn't alive so there's no ethical debate about eating them.

      Also normal people who don't give two shits will eat it. I eat normal meat but if this tasted like real meat, and wasn't substantially less healthy or more costly, I'd eat it for sure.

      If it comes even close in price I can see restaurants choosing it because then they don't have to have separate vegetarian and vegan menu options.

    5. Re:I found another unicorn! by ganjadude · · Score: 3, Informative

      to be fair, there are some of us who simply dont like the taste of cow milk, (me) and almond "milk" is a nice option

      --
      have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
    6. Re:I found another unicorn! by bughunter · · Score: 2

      Lots of people do it for Religious reasons, for instance, Adventists.

      I once dated an Adventist girl who lived in Loma Linda, CA, which has a very high population of Adventists. I was amazed when I first walked into her local grocery store - there was aisle after aisle after aisle of stuff pretending to be meat.

      It was bizarre.

      --
      I can see the fnords!
    7. Re:I found another unicorn! by pubwvj · · Score: 2

      The problem is it will turn out to be bad for you. Factory produced problems.

      Me, I'll stick with pasture raised, naturally grown meats. They are a nicely integrated part of our vegetable and fruit farming too. It's a system that works. Permaculture.

    8. Re:I found another unicorn! by mjwx · · Score: 2

      They will if they are the sort who abstain from meat due to ethical considerations (the "fish are friends, not food" crowd). Your chemic shitstorm isn't alive so there's no ethical debate about eating them.

      The probelm is that the "fish are friends" crowd are also the "chemicals are bad m'kay" crowd. They eat organic, fair trade, ethically cultivated, save the whales vegan because everything else is factory farmed, chemical laden, horse meat infected rubbish that give them the cancers and the autisms. They also like to ignore the fact their organic cucumber is just a normal cucumber that has had the price jacked up on it.

      Put simply, they have an irrational fear of non-descript chemicals (not anything specific, its just the word "chemical") but there wont be an ethical debate from this crowd because they never let a little hypocrisy get in the way (or a lot of it either)

      --
      Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
    9. Re:I found another unicorn! by Darinbob · · Score: 4, Insightful

      But it doesn't have to taste like meat. That part is pointless I feel. If they don't want to eat meat than that's fine. Veggie burgers are good too (not the tofu junk) and even meat eaters like them. It's just that the need to make faux meat seems strange to me. It's not like they're coming off of a lifetime of heroin and need something like methodone to keep themselves clean.

      I know when I visit the veggie line for lunch the worst things they have are the meat substitutes, like seitan or tempeh.

    10. Re: I found another unicorn! by roc97007 · · Score: 2

      Think of it this way -- the more almond milk he buys, the more real milk for you.

      --
      Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
    11. Re:I found another unicorn! by Your.Master · · Score: 4, Insightful

      You're being unfair and unnecessarily polarizing. Just because you've met people who have both beliefs doesn't mean they always go together. People aren't always either right about everything or wrong about everything.

      I'm not convinced there's any correlation at all, though there could be. As anecdotal evidence, at the time of writing there are four responses to my post. Two of them are explicitly meat eaters who are making the "chemicals are bad" argument and both precluding any possibility they are wrong. Clearly none of them are vegans.

      I've also met lots of vegetarians and vegans, and literally none of them have irrational fears of chemicals in foods (they have rational fears of things that actually cause food poisoning and such). The only time I've seen those two beliefs together are in stereotypes.

      In fact, the person I know who is most irrational about food is almost a complete carnivore. He's all-in on his keto diet. He lost like 150 lbs when he switched to basically only ever eating sausages, and from that he's drawn the conclusion that a co-worker of ours could cure her Multiple Sclerosis by cutting the grains and veggies out of her diet. Second place goes to a vegetarian who was pretty convinced that ancient humans never hunted for meat.

    12. Re:I found another unicorn! by marsu_k · · Score: 2

      Milk allergy != lactose intolerance. The former can potentially be fatal, the latter gives you gas.

    13. Re:I found another unicorn! by Maritz · · Score: 2

      Everything you eat, and everything you are, is 'chemicals'. Don't fall for the naturalistic fallacy. The animals we eat aren't even 'natural'.

      --
      I do not want your cheap brainburning drugs. They are useless for work. And I am a working man today.
  2. Why not eat meat? by grimmjeeper · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Our bodies evolved over millions of years to eat meat. The fact that your senses crave the smells, taste, and texture of meat means... your body wants meat. Now, we all know that you should eat it in moderation because of the problems of overeating. But meat in reasonable portions is naturally good for you.

    All of this biochemical engineering to come up with a meat substitute is reminiscent of all the chemical companies trying to come up with artificial sweeteners. The end result is probably as bad for you or worse than the original.

    Eat your meat. That way you can have your pudding.

    1. Re:Why not eat meat? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Depends on the professor I guess... Could be just to cash in on the vegetarian / vegan / health market like everybody else seems to be doing. Could also be a 'think of the future' thing. Meat produced from grazing animals (e.g.: beef) is pretty inefficient to raise for our tables. As the worlds population grows we might need to start thinking about alternatives to satiate our bellies. In the future you have an alternative to that beef flavored partially refined locust protein burger everybody has been talking about if the professor is successful :)

    2. Re:Why not eat meat? by grimmjeeper · · Score: 2

      Well, there is that. And that's probably 1% of the non-meat-eaters out there or less. But I'm sure a significant number of them are self diagnosed with that problem so a survey would show substantially more people indicating they have it when they really don't.

    3. Re:Why not eat meat? by Mr+D+from+63 · · Score: 2

      How about fake vegetables made from meat? We can convert those vegans!

    4. Re:Why not eat meat? by ohnocitizen · · Score: 5, Informative
      There's a few reasons, and people might find all or just some of them convincing.

      I eat (and enjoy) meat myself, but if there's a way to get that texture and flavor (texture is the most important part, I think) in a healthier and more sustainable way - I'd love to see it happen so long as the final result is actually more efficient to produce and healthier to eat. As you say, many artificial foods have ended up being worse than what they were meant to replace.

    5. Re:Why not eat meat? by Locke2005 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Our bodies evolved over millions of years to crave the smell, taste, and texture of COOKED meat? Not sure where our ancestors found that in the wild...
      I subscribe to an evolutionary theory of nutrition, which says that we do best if we eat what our ancestors ate for tens of thousands of years. We were designed to eat meat, but because we didn't have refrigeration, we didn't eat meat very often. Gorging on red meat a couple times a month should be fine; eating it for every meal, not so much.

      --
      I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
    6. Re: Why not eat meat? by dunkelfalke · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Speak for yourself please. My body doesn't crave meat and i don't particularly like the taste of many meats, especially beef. I would take good cheese or nice rye bread or vegetables over meat any day. But meat is often cheaper, otherwise i'd probably eat meat once a week or so.

      --
      "It's such a fine line between stupid and clever" -- David St. Hubbins, Spinal Tap
    7. Re:Why not eat meat? by grimmjeeper · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Our ancestors were using fire to cook meat long before recorded history.

    8. Re: Why not eat meat? by grimmjeeper · · Score: 2

      I'm sure some people can condition themselves to suppress their cravings. And if you want to live that way, go right ahead. But eating meat is an instinct inherited through evolution.

    9. Re:Why not eat meat? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      medical literature shows significantly lower incidence of diseases such as cancer and ischemic heart disease in populations eating a vegetarian diet

      Correlation is not causation. Those populations either have much poorer healthcare and die of other things, go undiagnosed, or they're young health nuts who don't have many unhealthy symptoms like smoking, lack of exercise, and overweight.

    10. Re:Why not eat meat? by rahvin112 · · Score: 4, Funny

      The dog will go for whichever one is closer and then try to eat the second one, at least judging by all the dogs I've known. Dogs are not as particular as you imply.

    11. Re:Why not eat meat? by PolygamousRanchKid+ · · Score: 5, Funny

      Try this test. Take a chunk of raw beef, slice it in half and cook one of them on an open fire (in an appetizing way so that you'd wanna eat it... don't burn it). Leave the other half raw. Present both halves to a dog and see which one it goes for first. Now repeat this test on a tiger or some other non-domesticated carnivore.

      Ok, I tried this experiment. I ate the dog, and then I ate the tiger.

      What do I do now . . . ?

      Please advise.

      --
      Schroedinger's Brexit: The UK is both in and out of the EU at the same time!
  3. Is this really important? by roc97007 · · Score: 2

    I've been eating fake meat in various forms since the late seventies. It's mostly a matter of convenience, so I can partake in events like barbecues as a vegetarian. Fake meat patties and cutlets and so forth have various flavors and textures, none of which taste like real meat. (at least, as far as I can remember) But is it necessarily bad that they have their own taste? If the taste and texture are pleasing, (some are, and some are not) does it really matter if it tastes nutty or tofu-y and not meaty? I guess what I'm asking is, what problem are we trying to solve here?

    I have a friend who is a vegetarian chef, and she says if you're trying to be vegetarian but only eat products that ape the food you don't eat anymore, what's the point?

    --
    Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
    1. Re:Is this really important? by Goragoth · · Score: 2

      Some vegetarians don't eat meat because they don't like it but for many that isn't the reason. They like the way meat tastes but they refuse to eat it for a variety of other reasons. It might be moral (they don't like animals being slaughtered for food), due to health concerns (meat is often said to be bad for you, although this is generally not true if you eat it in moderation), or because meat production is horrendously inefficient (usually out of some concern for the those starving in poor countries, even though in reality this is a distribution problem and not a production problem at all).

    2. Re:Is this really important? by i.r.id10t · · Score: 2

      The only non-pretentious dietary vegan (she still buys and wears leather, etc) I know switched in an effort for her and her husband to get off cholesterol meds. It has worked for them, but yeah, they eat a lot of "replacement meat-like products". As was said upthread, why bother if you are just going to eat stuff that (poorly) imitates what you no longer eat by choice?

      One other NPV (who is no longer vegan, or even vegetarian - back to omnivore-hood!) I know did it to become more conscious of the world around him and how he interacts with it - he went vegan for 2 years or so... but even in the middle of it he said that if he hit a deer with his car he'd happily take it home and eat it - he had already interacted with it, it was no longer a choice of "do or do not" and why waste perfectly good meat?

      --
      Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos
    3. Re:Is this really important? by Jeremi · · Score: 2

      I guess what I'm asking is, what problem are we trying to solve here?

      We've got a lot of people out there who really like to eat meat, and aren't likely to give it up anytime soon. To meet their demand, we've got a meat industry that is inefficient, unhygienic, environmentally harmful, and cruel to animals.

      If (and it's a big if) someone can come up with a meat substitute that is sufficiently similar to the real thing, and cheaper to produce and to buy, then the problematic meat industry will likely shrink down into a much-less-problematic niche/specialty market for foodies.

      --


      I don't care if it's 90,000 hectares. That lake was not my doing.
  4. Re:dont want it to taste like meat by DRJlaw · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I'm a vegetarian because I don't like meat. It's so frustrating to have a veggie burger like a Boca burger that tastes way too much like meat. I want to have something else, or I would eat a real burger. There's a lot of non-meat protein that tastes good. Why the fixation on making it taste like beef?

    Because it's a veggie burger, not a veggie patty. They are expressly trying to simulate meat, because there are also people like me who quite like meat and quite dislike vegetables. I might move to a veggie burger but sure as hell am not going to move to a vegemite patty, a bean patty, or 90% of whatever ground-vegetable-matter-in-puck-form you're after.

    Don't complain that a thing called a "burger" is trying to simulate a "real burger." Complain that they aren't making something some other thing that tastes way too much like a vegetable.

  5. Alternate plan by blue9steel · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Why not just genetically engineer plants that grow meat, that way you get the best of both, flavor and saving the fuzzy animals. I look forward to sampling the bacon bush and porterhouse tree.

  6. Who says I want the taste of real meat? by Twinbee · · Score: 2

    Fake 'meat' made from ingredients such as quorn, soya or veg is no panacea, but after getting used to Quorn mince, minced beef now tastes a little, erm 'metallic', or at least strange in some way. For those who don't like the taste of liver, it's a little like that, though less extreme.

    I don't want to have the taste of meat. Nor do I want the slightly cardboardy taste of current "veg meat" foods (though it is improving).

    Instead, I want something which combines the best aspects of the flavours of both real meat and fake meat.

    Only fake meat can even attempt to reach that solution, or at least can offer a far bigger variety of flavours than real meat could hope to offer.

    --
    Why OpalCalc is the best Windows calc
  7. Re:dont want it to taste like meat by ArmoredDragon · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Cheaper is about the only justification I could see for it. As the FDA has been getting more and more of a clue lately, it's basically been found that red meat isn't actually bad for you after all. The original belief in that (as well as the belief that meat causes high cholesterol) originated from some poorly done studies in the early 60's and late 70's.

  8. Re:Self-contradicting terms by DRJlaw · · Score: 2

    A self-contradicting â" meaningless â" term like... low-sodium salt", or "gay marriage".

    Potassium chloride.
    Calcium chloride.
    Magnesium chloride.

    Several of my friends from high school, and the first amendment, and a government where religion does not have monopoly rights to defining a purely legal arrangement (says this atheist).

    Sod off you relic.

  9. Re:dont want it to taste like meat by The+Good+Reverend · · Score: 4, Insightful

    There's also "I don't want to kill animals for the sake of my dinner". Meat in moderation isn't bad for you, but there are plenty of other reasons why a lot of us don't eat it.

  10. Re:dont want it to taste like meat by Chas · · Score: 2

    Then don't kill animals for you dinner.

    Do what billions of people do.

    Pay someone ELSE to kill animals for your dinner.

    --


    Chas - The one, the only.
    THANK GOD!!!
  11. But does it have truly complete protein? by kheldan · · Score: 2

    Does their fake meat have really complete protein (not missing or deficient in any essential amino acids) or is it just the typical vegetarian junk that's incomplete in one way or another? Taste is not important; nutrition is. If it's protein is not as complete as the meat they're trying to replace, then it's useless.

    --
    Are YOU using the TOOL, or is the TOOL using YOU? Think about it!
  12. Re:dont want it to taste like meat by Greyfox · · Score: 2

    What's the actual union of people who don't want to kill animals for dinner but are also pissed off that their dinner then doesn't taste like animals? It seems like those people are just impossible to please. Yes, your dinner doesn't taste like meat. That's what you signed on for there, buddy!

    --

    I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?

  13. Oh FFS. No, it's not people. by fyngyrz · · Score: 2

    True spoiler alert: it's algae. The whole "people" thing? Just Hollywood screwing up a good SF story. As usual. No more than that.

    Harry Harrison: Make Room, Make Room

    Read it. I guarantee it will be a better experience than that ridiculous movie ever was.

    --
    I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
  14. I just don't get the point of mimicing meat by bughunter · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Why even try to mimic meat? It struck me the first time I walked into a grocery in an Adventist community - there were multiple aisles of highly processed vegetable/fungus/grain matter trying to resemble meat.

    I mean, especially if you're living a totally meatless lifestyle, why even kowtow to the omnivore food culture?

    For example, look at Middle Eastern cuisine. Sure, they have kabobs, etc, but things like Falafel, Faul, Hummus, Baba Ghanouj, Tabouleh and Dolmas are all fantastic, and none of them are trying to mimic a hunk of beef or chicken.

    Same with Asian food. There are fantastic meatless dishes that don't try to resemble an animal part.

    Why do we do it in the West? Marketing?

    --
    I can see the fnords!
    1. Re:I just don't get the point of mimicing meat by TeknoHog · · Score: 2

      This. A lot of people are vegetarians for ethical reasons (e.g. sustainability and energy conservation, not just tree hugging and cute animals). They don't need constant reminders of the negative associations they have with meat. They also don't believe that meat is the one true food that other foods should emulate.

      --
      Escher was the first MC and Giger invented the HR department.
  15. Re:dont want it to taste like meat by slew · · Score: 4, Interesting

    The original belief in that (as well as the belief that meat causes high cholesterol) originated from some poorly done studies in the early 60's and late 70's.

    FWIW, there are many contradictory studies made in this area that correlate read-meat consumption with higher mortality. Earlier studies that blamed cholesterol and fat in meat were poor studies, but there are more modern studies that illustrate correlation. Some studies blame gut bacteria that converts Carnitine into TMAO. Some blame the nitrates in processed meat. Some studies show an increased link with certain cancers. Some studies blame poor dental hygiene causing a general inflammation response leading to heart disease.

    We may not know the truth yet in this matter, except there is some correlation (but if there is actually causation is a bit of a mystery still).

  16. Re:Self-contradicting terms by DRJlaw · · Score: 2

    So, all you have is semantics? Figures...

    Only a true moron has the gall to claim that something is a "self-contradictory, meaningless term" and then complain that the argument against them is "semantics."

    se-man-tics
    noun
    the branch of linguistics and logic concerned with meaning

  17. Hey Mutant, most adult humans can't digest milk. by billstewart · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Yeah, I called you a mutant. I'm one also, from the Northern/Western European version of the mutations that let adult humans digest lactose. (There are other groups of humans that also have that - the Masai in Kenya, for instance - and most of them evolved independently about 5000 years ago.) Most normal humans are lactose-intolerant as adults, so they get indigestion if they drink raw cow milk, though most of them can handle cheeses and some other sufficiently fermented milk products.

    Theoretically I can drink milk; in practice I almost never do, unless it's got coffee or cocoa in it, or it's on cereal or something.

    --

    Bill Stewart
    New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
  18. Re: Hey Mutant, most adult humans can't digest mil by binarylarry · · Score: 4, Funny

    Hello my Lactose Master Race brothers! Is this where the meeting is at?

    --
    Mod me down, my New Earth Global Warmingist friends!
  19. Re:dont want it to taste like meat by Jeremi · · Score: 2

    It seems like those people are just impossible to please. Yes, your dinner doesn't taste like meat. That's what you signed on for there, buddy!

    Of course, the point of the article is that several companies are well on their way to making it possible to please those people. Science!

    --


    I don't care if it's 90,000 hectares. That lake was not my doing.
  20. Re: Hey Mutant, most adult humans can't digest mil by billstewart · · Score: 2

    Meeting's down at the ice cream place.

    --

    Bill Stewart
    New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks