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Microsoft Now Uses Windows 10's Start Menu To Display Ads (betanews.com)

Mark Wilson writes: We've all become used to the idea of ads online — it's something that has become part and parcel of using the internet — but in Windows? If you've updated to build 10565 of Windows 10, you're in for something of a surprise: the Start menu is now being used to display ads. We're not talking about ads for Viagra, porn, or anything like that, but ads for apps. Of course, Microsoft is not describing them as ads; 'Suggested apps' has a much more approachable and fluffy feel to it. Maybe. This is a 'feature' that's currently only being shown to Windows Insiders, but it could spread to everyone else. Will it be well-received?

24 of 578 comments (clear)

  1. If you did not pay for the product, you are one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    That's why it's "free". They're getting their money by selling you.

    1. Re:If you did not pay for the product, you are one by dAzED1 · · Score: 5, Interesting

      and just how is it that you secure a product that is constantly talking to systems on the internet, and doesn't have a way to disable such communication? An early beta of Win10 did this as well, I saw it - I was just curious what Win10 looked like, so I put it on something. After seeing that, I quickly removed it and any thought I'd ever use Windows for anything ever again.

    2. Re:If you did not pay for the product, you are one by Saithe · · Score: 5, Informative

      Win10 ignores the Host-file for certain Microsoft functions and simply bypass it.

    3. Re:If you did not pay for the product, you are one by tepples · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Did you mean "DNS Servers and Firewalls" in hardware or in software? If you meant in software, then Windows can go around it. If you meant in hardware, then good luck carrying "DNS Servers and Firewalls" with your Windows 10 laptop when you use public Wi-Fi.

    4. Re:If you did not pay for the product, you are one by LVSlushdat · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I have a small side business (me and two other techs) doing Windows cleanup and upgrades of older systems still on XP over to XUbuntu. Since about 2011, we've done over 30 such systems, and in most cases, before the upgrade our phone number was on the customers speeddial, due to constant malware infestations.. We rarely hear from those folks anymore... Since Windows 10 has come out, we've had several customers who bought brandnew systems at a big-box store come to us and ask about what they'd heard about Windows 10 and its blabbing everything to MS... We showed them several traffic analysis done on an "uncastrated" copy of Win10. In both cases, the owners opted for us to install Linux on their systems. I told them that we *could* run some tools that would disable the especially blatant spying aspects, but there was ZERO assurance that MS would not come out with an update that would roll our "castration" back... Our recommendation was to stop using MS products if the customer had ANY concerns about privacy and Microsoft...

      --
      THANK YOU, Edward Snowden!! Americans owe you a debt of gratitude (whether they know it or not..)
    5. Re:If you did not pay for the product, you are one by TheGratefulNet · · Score: 5, Insightful

      nah, problem solved by fresh install of dvd based win7, disable all bad updates (beyond a certain date) and disable update mechanism entirely.

      that also means that win systems can't be directly on the net and even allowing them access to the net is not very smart anymore.
      whee! its like win95 and win98 days, where every windows box is, by definition, unsafe on a LAN or WAN.

      we had a few years in the middle where it was good to enable updates and windows was starting to show some maturity in the computer market. not any more. MS has gone back to its truly evil ways and - funny enough - its starting to make apple look good in comparison! wow, just wow.

      --

      --
      "It is now safe to switch off your computer."
    6. Re:If you did not pay for the product, you are one by BradleyUffner · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Does this apply to Linux too?

    7. Re:If you did not pay for the product, you are one by squiggleslash · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Every other post about Google is someone bashing it for "selling personal data to advertisers" (which, FWIW, never happens) so I'm not sure where you're getting it from that there's a double standard here.

      As for these "ads", I can't comment. What I will say is that if there's no way to turn them off, then it's not a good thing. If I fork out $100-200 for an operating system, whether it comes with my computer or I buy it separately, I don't want ads with it. And no, for those about to say it, I don't consider a "free upgrade" a "free operating system". If you want to call it free, let me dual boot between my existing Windows 7 and Windows 8.1 installs and Windows 10. Replacements are not free. Ever.

      --
      You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
  2. Yet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    We're not talking about ads for Viagra, porn, or anything like that, but ads for apps.

    First displaying some app advertisements is a nice slippery slope to later transform it to a vehicle delivering all sorts of advertisements.

    1. Re:Yet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Not surprising. Had to install Win10 yesterday to test compatibility with some legacy software. What a complete and utter clusterfuck. The amount of telemetry/spying intrusion that Microsoft expects users to accept without question is...staggering. Just trying to keep the firewall and defender off was a major endeavor. And travel/sports/etc. embedded in the OS I paid for to generated revenue via tracking? Facepalm.

      And that's the thing, they could have tons of spyware by default and those stupid enough to allow the spying deserve what they get. The problem is automatically turning everything back on after I've made the choice to turn it off/uninstall. And that includes the whole force-fed updates issue.

      My humble prediction is that Win10 is going to get much worse beyond just injecting ads into the start menu. So much so that even Aunt Sally is going to get the willies. Most of us know how oblivious Aunt Sally is to this stuff so that will be an accomplishment.

      And what will Microsoft do in response? Make up some official sounding names (like WGA) and try to stuff even more shit down the throats of anyone stupid enough to use the OS.

      Having said all that, they're obviously testing the waters to see how much shit people will eat then back off. The problem is that there are real alternatives now for the consumer, not like back in the monopoly days.

      Bitch about the arrogance of Apple all you want. Microsoft is way worse, they taking coupling arrogance with incompetence to whole new level.

  3. How come THEY always get all the cool stuff? by Cajun+Hell · · Score: 5, Funny

    It'll be years before XFCE gets this. By the time we get ads, everyone else will be all "yeah whatever, anachronistic loser."

    --
    "Believe me!" -- Donald Trump
    1. Re:How come THEY always get all the cool stuff? by Cajun+Hell · · Score: 5, Insightful

      XFCE users are used to being heavily behind the times anyway.

      You make it sound like constantly living the nightmare makes us numb to it, no longer suffering because we don't have feelings. Nothing could be further from the truth!

      Day in, day out, all I dream of is to some day be able to own a computer that works for other people instead of me. There the damn thing is, awaiting my command, putting me on a pedestal! Sometimes I just want to scream, "Computer, where do you want to go today?! Don't you want to send some spam, or mine some bitcoins to make someone else richer? I'll pay for the electricity. Show me some fucking ads already (I swear, I'll pay for the bandwidth!), so that when I spend time at work, I'll know that there's a purpose to passing away years of my only life at the office: to make the money to give to someone else to buy some garbage that I don't really want, so it can take up more space in my unwanted hoard."

      But no, the damn thing is all about me, me, ME! I can't stand it! It's like this fucking codependent computer has no life of its own, and exists on nothing but fulfilling my desires, like some kind of TOOL that I .. I .. (ugh) that I own! It's like I have some kind of mindless robot slave!

      "Used to" it." Fuck you, dude! Put yourself in my shoes, in a social situation. There's all these people laughing and having a great time, big smiles on their faces telling exciting tales about the conniving backstabbers on their desks and in their pockets. "OMG, everything is full of ads," they say with a mirthful chuckle, and they all get to nod along in solidarity and comradeship. Then I have to fucking stare cluelessly and therefore stick out like a sore thumb, obviously "one of them" and no longer cool. Or I can fake it, nod and agree, and die a little more inside.

      "It got pulled from the app store," they say. I have to pretend I know what the fuck that means or else be alienated yet again.

      "It wants me to enter the license and I can't find the package," they say. I'm not sure what entering a license means, but they've phrased the problem well enough that it includes the solution, right? So I wonder: Why don't they just refresh the package from the repo? I might be inclined to suggest that, carefully being neutral and noncommittal so they won't realize that I haven't yet figured out whether the package is a deb or rpm. But go ahead, just try saying that once and see the stares you get, where suddenly everybody knows that you're heavily behind the times.

      It's not just social situations, either. Imagine me at an office, hearing "Oh, I can't run that one, because it requires polar lion or bigger, but I only have hill tiger." I don't know what all this technical Felix jargon means, just that some guy doesn't get to do what he wants to do, because he isn't typing apt-get dist-upgrade every two years. He gets to talk about cats all day whereas I have to do my job (to get the paychecks that I don't even know what to spend on), because I'm behind the times.

      Ribbons. What the fuck were ribbons? Everyone was talking about them a few years ago, but now no one mentions them. Is this going to be another one of those "the spoon is a lie!" things where I finally get to have a ribbon in the 2022 release and when I go around telling everyone how awesome it is, they look at me like I'm some kind of drunk caveman?

      Vistas? Everyone says they suck but they're not specific. That's some kind of MSSQL version of views, right? Other than being nonstandard, I don't know why they'd be so hated, but maybe some say I'll find out when they add it to postgresql.

      I'm so heavily behind the times, I couldn't even keep up with the early-21st-century shorthand people were using to paraphrase everything. i.e. I'm totally out of touch with culture and language. I learned some of it

      --
      "Believe me!" -- Donald Trump
  4. Cannot reproduce by Rhywden · · Score: 5, Informative

    Updated both my desktop and my laptop to build 10565 and am not seeing those suggested apps.

    1. Re:Cannot reproduce by Moof123 · · Score: 5, Funny

      Big data says your a cheapskate and not worth the effort.

  5. Simple solution by Guspaz · · Score: 5, Informative

    http://www.classicshell.net/

    It's free. I installed it when I got tired of the Win10 start menu lag (if you press the start key and begin typing, the Win10 start menu will delay opening just long enough to miss one or two keystrokes).

  6. Ability to disable feature by donaggie03 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I don't care what features they throw in, as long as they also let me disable it somehow.

    --
    Three days from now?? Thats tomorrow!! ~Peter Griffin
  7. Hypocrites. by technomom · · Score: 4, Informative
  8. Speak for yourself by An+ominous+Cow+art · · Score: 4, Insightful

    We've all become used to the idea of ads online

    It's pretty obvious that many of us are not used to the idea, and block them completely.

  9. Not so different from XBox by Picass0 · · Score: 4, Informative

    Anyone who's a gamer has seen this enough that it's become invisible. The XBox Dashboard is ~50% user-space and 50% new product promotion.

  10. Can be disabled by RogueyWon · · Score: 4, Informative

    For the moment, at least, you can turn this off. Indeed, you can turn off more of the Windows 10 start menu nastiness than is initially apparent and get back to something fairly civilised without third party addons. For now.

    In its current form, it's not completely catastrophic even if you don't disable it. It's significantly less intrusive than the advertising you get on the top-level menus on the PS4, Wii-U and, in particular, Xbox One.

    The worry, of course, is about the slippery slope. Look at how advertising has flooded over the menus on the Xbox series:

    - Basically absent on the original Xbox and the first-gen Xbox 360 UI.
    - Present but subdued on the second-gen 360 UI.
    - Completely dominant on the third-gen 360 UI (at the cost of useful navigation features that were present in the second-gen).
    - A major presence on the Xbox One.

    Actually, now I'm wondering whether my ability to disable the advertising in Win10 has been because I'm both on Professional rather than Home and on an OEM license purchased with a new PC rather than a free upgrade. Anybody applied this patch on the Home edition or a free upgrade yet?

  11. Re:This is it! by flopsquad · · Score: 4, Insightful

    This is The Year of Linus app, suggested for your convenience directly into C:/Program Files (x86). Download it today by not clicking cancel 3 seconds ago!

    The Year of Linus adds in the frequently requested functionality of replacing the standard Windows calendar with 365 days of Met Life advertisements featuring beloved Peanuts character Linus.

    You're welcome. Love,
    Microsoft

    --
    Nothing posted to /. has ever been legal advice, including this.
  12. "This isn't so bad"? by Scroatzilla · · Score: 4, Insightful

    It's weird that pro-Windows folks are saying "this isn't so bad," pointing out how easy it is to turn off. Why would my operating system recommend apps in the first place? Others are suggesting that "perhaps I'll find an app that I never would have noticed with these suggestions." When I have a need for functionality, I will actively research apps! Do Windows users really sit around waiting for "surprise apps"?

    IMHO, starting with Windows 8, Windows began transforming into a steaming cesspool of unusable crap. Recently, when faced with having to drop some money on a new computer, I switched from Windows to Mac. I'm not a fanboi, but because Windows started to dumb desktops down into the smartphone form factor, I figured: If I have to learn a new UI anyway, why not just switch? Now, I very much appreciate using an unobtrusive OS that lets me load files and run applications, and that also allows me to update the OS when I want to, at no additional cost.

    I'm still forced to use Win8 at work (we're completely entangled in Office365 now), and to support my wife's Win8 machine at home, and that is enough Windows for me.

  13. Re:This is it! by AntiSol · · Score: 4, Informative

    I can't recommend a book. My advice is to pick a commonly used distro with good documentation and more importantly a good community. Ubuntu is good in this respect (or xubuntu or kubuntu if you want a more familiar interface). I've also heard good things about mint and arch. Introduce yourself, say you're a newbie, and ask questions. Be polite and try not to be stupid or lazy if you can help it - try to read documentation, and always do a search before you ask a question (it's faster than waiting for a forum response anyway). There are also rooms on IRC where you can get help. In my experience people tend to be friendly there. I think the days of "RTFM" are mostly over. You might still get the occasional "RTFM" response or links to the relevant manual, but you'll usually get a helpful response.

    IMHO the easiest way to learn Linux is to not have windows installed. It forces you to learn rather than being lazy and retreating to familiar territory.

    It's not that scary these days anyway, there's a GUI for most things and you're rarely forced to use the command line (unless you want to) or mess around configuring hardware.

  14. You can opt out by vergeme · · Score: 4, Informative

    I worked on this feature, it's designed to optimize engagement, not monetization. What's the difference? You can opt out if you don't want to see it. You can right click on the "Suggested App" and choose to not see the suggestions.