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TSA Screeners Can't Detect Weapons (and They Never Could) (arstechnica.com)

JustAnotherOldGuy writes: TSA screeners' ability to detect weapons in luggage is "pitiful," according to classified reports on the security administration's ongoing story of failure and fear. "In looking at the number of times people got through with guns or bombs in these covert testing exercises it really was pathetic. When I say that I mean pitiful," said Rep. Stephen Lynch (D-Mass.), speaking Tuesday during a House Oversight hearing concerning classified reports (PDF) from federal watchdogs (PDF). "Just thinking about the breaches there, it's horrific," he added. A leaked classified report this summer found that as much as 95 percent of contraband, like weapons and explosives, got through during clandestine testings. Lynch's comments were in response to the classified report's findings.

16 of 349 comments (clear)

  1. Detecting weapons is NOT the purpose of TSA... by loony · · Score: 4, Insightful

    ... giving you the feeling that your government cares and reacted to 9/11 and other threats is.

    Peter.

    1. Re:Detecting weapons is NOT the purpose of TSA... by Archangel+Michael · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Security Theater is nothing more than the Wizard of Oz. The problem is, nobody learned that lesson, in spite of nearly universal knowledge of that movie's pivotal scene.

      The problem is, the security theater only makes it more difficult, and now we're finding out it actually doesn't make it all much more difficult.

      IMHO the chances of hijacking a plane became much less likely to be successful after 9/11, because they broke the cardinal rule of hijacking, and turned the plane into a weapon. People on planes already know they are dead if a hijacker takes over, and will respond accordingly.

      --
      Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
    2. Re:Detecting weapons is NOT the purpose of TSA... by Bob+the+Super+Hamste · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The problems are that there are vast swaths of the population that believe that the TSA is actually doing something to keep them safe. I have a cousin who is 13 years younger than I am who is a weekend warrior (MN national guard reserves) and he fully believes the line that all of this is necessary and prevents terrorist attacks. He is too young to really remember before 9/11/01 and so doesn't really know what has changed. Pointing out that the 3 things that have actually prevented another 9/11 doesn't register with him and he insists that our foreign adventurism has helped the most. He may very well be correct as he may be privy to information that I am not but I have yet to see any evidence showing this to be the case.Then you have people like my mother who will openly state that "At least they are trying to do something". Then add in the "if you have nothing to hide", and "so long as it keeps us safe" groups and this won't change for a very long time.

      As I have pointed out here before I have accidentally brought banned items through security without any real effort in concealing them, they were left in coat pockets, and the TSA never once found them. Yet every time I bring my camera through I get to play 20 questions with the otherwise unemployable.

      --
      Time to offend someone
    3. Re:Detecting weapons is NOT the purpose of TSA... by Ash+Vince · · Score: 4, Insightful

      This, and also the fact that they reinforced and lock the cockpit doors from now on.
      The TSA has not stopped ANY attempts at bombing or hijacking airliners since 9/11. Various other methods have, but the TSA has been singularly useless.

      Reinforced cockpit doors do sod all. Even without a reinforced cockpit door the crew could have kept them out of the cockpit if they wanted to using a co-pilots foot .

      What has made us tons safer after 9-11 is that now there would be reasonable quantity of the passengers who would challenge the hijackers, as recently shown on a French train. Previously most air hijackings were about taking hostages and using them to plead for some worthless chum of yours to be released, as soon as it became clear that the hijackers were never interested in your survival or their own it made trying to subdue them the safest option, no matter how dangerous that seemed.

      If you wanted to fly a plane into a building now you would have to steal an empty one first.

      --
      I dont read /. to RTFA, I read /. to offend people in ignorance.
    4. Re:Detecting weapons is NOT the purpose of TSA... by StikyPad · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The government knows damn well that the TSA is security theater -- someone just forgot to tell this particular elected official.

      Security theater can be great as a deterrent, but once everybody starts shouting about how it's not real, then its deterrent effect is decreased. So we can either tell people to shut up about it, or eliminate the facade, but increased security isn't an option, for two reasons:

      1) Nobody can be vigilant against mostly non-existent threats for hours and days and years on end, except the most paranoid, OCD people, who aren't hireable anyway. That's why bouncers are effective -- people are constantly trying to sneak in, and bouncers know they're going to catch people. Most other security guards know they'll never, ever catch anyone, because nobody ever tries, and their attention suffers as a result. It's not that they don't want to do their job; it's that the reality of their job is incredibly tedious. It becomes about going through the motions most of the time, and maybe making an effort every so often.

      2) Real security takes time, and that pisses people off. Maybe not in the immediate wake of a catastrophic security failure, but days or weeks later, it will. Patience will run thin. Moreover, the biggest advantage of flying is convenience -- it's fast. Once that convenience goes away, its popularity will decline.

      Honestly, it doesn't matter though. Security has diminishing returns, like anything else, and no target can be fully protected. We can't, even collectively, control all of the variables. And when the risks are infinitesimal to begin with, then taking steps to lower them even more is usually a wasted effort. Better to focus on having procedures in place to handle things when the worst case happens.

    5. Re:Detecting weapons is NOT the purpose of TSA... by ahodgson · · Score: 3, Insightful

      It's never going to go back to the way it was. Too many people make too much money from the new way. No politician is ever going to get rid of the TSA; whenever the next attack happens, they'll get blamed.

    6. Re: Detecting weapons is NOT the purpose of TSA... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      To be fair, I don't always start reading a comment from the subject line either ;-)

      Putting half of the first sentence of your post in the subject line should be a capital offense. If you oppose the death penalty for religious or moral reasons, then you should mod them down instead.

  2. And yet..... by clifwlkr · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Nothing happened. No hijackings, no downed planes, absolutely nothing. Maybe we don't need all of this security theater after all and could just leave our shoes on and take some water with us through the gate then? Save a few tax dollars?

    Of course it will go the other way and will be a huge call for more strict rules and procedures. Sigh.....

    1. Re:And yet..... by trout007 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The passengers on the 4th plane on 9/11 are the first. Planes are done. Crews and Passengers were taught to cooperate with hijackers. That's all over. To stop 9/11 all that would have been required is a declaration not to cooperate with terrorists.

      --
      I love Jesus, except for his foreign policy.
  3. Anecdotal evidence by Locke2005 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    My sister watched the supervisor run her backpack through the xray 3 times before the screener notice the pen knife in it, and my mother actually succeeded in getting a small pen knife onto a plane by "forgetting" it was in her makeup kit. These incidents were years ago. And, they don't really matter; post 9/11, a knife would not be an effective weapon for highjacking a plane. When every passenger makes the assumption they are going to die anyway if they don't take out the highjacker, pretty much every passenger is going to attempt to jump the highjacker and take him out. Even with a knife, you'd be hard pressed to be 100 to 1 odds - people don't die fast enough.

    --
    I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
    1. Re:Anecdotal evidence by Scutter · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Prior to 9/11, past hijackings were primarily of the "Take this plane to Havana!" type. People believed that if they complied, they' go home safely. 9/11 changed that forever. When you have no expectation that the plane is going anywhere but into the side of a building, you're not going to sit still and wait for it to happen, pen knife or no penknife. And the handful of incidents since have proven that completely. The passengers will tear a hijacker limb from limb with their bare hands if they have to.

      --

      "Tell me doctor, with all of your defenses, are there any provisions for an attack by killer bees?"
    2. Re:Anecdotal evidence by arth1 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      We've already had one example in Flight 93.

      And even more examples of people not storming the bad guys.

      You can't rely on the public. Or screeners. Or air marshals. You can't protect everyone from everyone, all the time, or trust that threats you don't even know what are can be neutralized.

      The only reliable defences against terrorism are to (a) not go out of your way to piss off people so much that they want to kill your civilians to get your attention, (b) don't present such big fat targets, and (c) don't act terrified and make knee-jerk reactions when civilians are killed. Concentrate on why instead of who and what.

  4. Who's Surprised By This? by Jason+Levine · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Number of people surprised that the TSA is completely ineffective: 0.

    Not coincidentally, that's also the number of terrorists that the TSA has caught.

    They have saved us from the scourge of water bottles and decent sized toothpaste tubes, though.

    --
    My sci-fi novel, Ghost Thief, is now available from Amazon.com.
  5. The TSA boondoggle needs to be terminated by JustNiz · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Since their inception the TSA has been repeatedly proven to be almost completely ineffective at prevention, yet there has been no US planes hijacked or blown up since their inception anyway.
    This alone proves that any benefit to the TSA's existence is entirely imaginary because the threat is not real.
    The TSA were originally created as a perhaps understandable but nevertheless paranoid and ill-informed kneejerk overreaction to 9/11. We need to simply fix that mistake now.
    There is clearly no rational reason for the TSA to continue to exist, especially since they cost the taxpayer 7.9 Billion USD every year that could be spent elsewhere solving problems that actually exist.

  6. I thought it was obvious by Trailer+Trash · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The purpose of federalizing airport security was to create more union members to funnel federal tax dollars to the Democrats.

    https://www.opensecrets.org/pa...

    Looks like I was right.

  7. Having the information out there is better. by tlambert · · Score: 3, Insightful

    On the other, I'd hate to give inept dummy terrorists the idea that they should give this stuff a try since we're catching so little.

    Having the information out there is better.

    The effectiveness of a terrorist attack is proportional to how much people believe they are protected from a terrorist attack. In other words, the attack effect is amplified by the idea that the attack is impossible or unlikely to be successful.

    One of the reasons for using a commercial jetliner, rather than simply using the money, which these groups has in abundance, and buying or leasing business jets, and filling them with explosives, and then using those to crash into the targets instead was obviously to prove that the screening at airports was not enough to keep the public safe from such attacks.

    How much worse would the public overreaction to a subsequent attack, if the public had the perception that the security theater was in fact actually security, and terrorists were able to penetrate it anyway? How much more would the public be unlikely and unwilling to trust government reassurances that they are protected from terrorists?

    I can think of about 15 ways to crash the U.S. economy, and I can thing of at least 9 ways to crash the economy of the Western world, and I can think of about 11 more ways to crash things using domino attacks vs. European only targets, or a specific nexus or set of nexuses that don't look like they'd need protecting.

    It's pretty obvious that the attacks were not intended to crash the economy.

    In fact, if you think about it some more, the fact that there have not been subsequent large scale attacks... the terrorists must feel that they have achieved the goals they intended to achieve through them: massive losses of civil liberties, civil unrest relative to that, and so on.

    Security theater in the form of the TSA -- the inability to take bottled water not purchased at the on the other side of the security checkpoint aboard a plane, the inability to see friends and family off at the gate at departure, or greet them at arrival -- merely serves to rearm the weapon of a public perception of security where none actually exists.

    Once again: Having the information out there is better.