Apple Looks To Introduce OLED Displays In iPhone Models From 2018 (thestack.com)

An anonymous reader writes: Apple is expected to integrate organic light-emitting diode (OLED) display technology in its iPhone handsets from 2018. The Cupertino-based giant will jump from liquid crystal display (LCD), which has been used in iPhones since 2007, to OLED – turning to suppliers like LG Displays, according to Japanese reports. The switch follows the steps of other smartphone makers such as Samsung and LG, which have both already integrated OLED technology in their mobile device ranges.

Comments

Oh, really?

[Anonymous Coward]

My I9100 has OLED too. In 2018 it will be 5 years old. Really up to date hardware reseller, this apple inc. is.

Re:Oh, really?

[alvinrod]

And people flipped shit when they thought there was a big difference in CPU quality. It turned out that this was completely overblown after people did more testing, but it didn't stop it from devolving into a complete shit show for a few days. Imagine if they used different manufacturers for their OLEDs and one had slightly better color accuracy. The baboon screeching and shit flinging would never cease.

Re:Oh, really?

[Anonymous Coward]

It's one thing to ship a couple thousand OLED screens, it's an entirely different thing to ship millions of them.

The Galaxy SII (I9100) sold 40 million units in the first 18 months after release.

Like OP said: really up to date hardware reseller, this apple inc. is.

Re:Oh, really?

[cheater512]

My Nokia N85 (which still works) has a OLED screen.

In 2018 it will be 10 years old.

Re:Oh, really?

[gstoddart]

The baboon screeching and shit flinging would never cease.

Yes, it's called the internet .. that's kind of what if does.

And it's been like that since before you could explain it to your mom.

Re:Oh, really?

[Computershack]

It's one thing to ship a couple thousand OLED screens, it's an entirely different thing to ship millions of them.

Samsung has sold hundreds of millions of phones with OLED screens in. Even their new entry level Galaxy J3 will have an OLED screen.

Re:Oh, really?

[perryizgr8]

Couple thousand? i9100 sold more than 40 million units. i9300 has sold over 80 million units. i9500 sold 40 million within the first 6 months of release. Need I continue?

Re:Oh, really?

[Anonymous Coward]

Couple thousand? i9100 sold more than 40 million units. i9300 has sold over 80 million units. i9500 sold 40 million within the first 6 months of release. Need I continue?

No this is the point where the morons who didn't know what they were talking about, they suddenly shut up and you don't see them posting in this thread again. Suddenly the cat's got their keyboard-tongue. Never do they say "hey, you made a compelling point, I was all wrong and didn't remotely have any acquaintence with the facts, thanks for setting me straight on this". Such grace is beyond the reach of douchebags who shoot off at the mouth because their feelings are offended at hearing the truth.

Re:Oh, really?

[Bing Tsher E]

Only a sucker buys products from a company that boasts of a high markup on their products.

It's just weird when people come on here praising Apple, as consumers of Apple products, with this as one of the 'virtues' they prize.

Is there some sort of secret form of self esteem boost that comes of proudly proclaiming that you are a sucker for a company?

Re:Oh, really?

[jblues]

Hehe, I thought the same thing. But seriously: As I understand it, current iPhones use IPS (in-plane switching) displays, which, while more expensive offer superior color reproduction. I'd bet that by 2018 OLED will have caught up or exceeded IPS in this regard and therefore it makes sense to switch at this time.

Re:Oh, really?

[Beck_Neard]

I've had my AMOLED phone for 3 years now, using it aggressively for several hours a day, and no visible sign of wear as of yet. If you place it right next to a spanking-new phone and squint your eyes, you can make out the slightest amount of color tint. But so what? LCD backlights degrade too.

I wouldn't recommend an OLED screen for something like a desktop computer where it's on 24 hours a day every day. But for a phone, it's perfect.

Re:Oh, really?

[shugah]

But they'll be "retina" OLED displays. :P

Re:Oh, really?

[Anonymous Coward]

You don't buy soda or bottled water?

Re:Oh, really?

[AbRASiON]

"As I understand it, current iPhones use IPS (in-plane switching) displays, which, while more expensive offer superior color reproduction."

What?
Pardon?

I think you got your technology backwards. OLED is the one which is superior in color reproduction, always has been, by a leaping mile.
There are some good IPS displays out there but OLED is superior technology, has been for years (burn in issues aside, I'm talking colour / blakcs)

Re:Oh, really?

[cfalcon]

> Only a sucker buys products from a company that boasts of a high markup on their products.

How does this follow? Nintendo and Apple are both famous for this- their per unit profit is always a record high within the industry.

Nintendo has had this policy since at least the 80s, and Apple since right about the time they stopped being broke as all hell.

So why would you be happy to be ripped off? You aren't- but you might be happy to:
1- Pay money to a company who is trying to *make money in a market*. When you see someone come along and give away their product, like Microsoft, this isn't charity- it's an attempt to grab marketshare. Do they want the marketshare just to drive out the competition? What's next after that? Once you injure Nintendo, do they keep selling at a loss? Most phones are Android, and a lot are priced sub commodity- what's their business model, because it obviously isn't selling you a phone, right?

2- Pay money to a company that is rewarding itself by selling to consumers instead of monetizing them, betraying them, or monitoring them. If the hardware is the loss leader, do they just want to get you subscribed to something so that they can pile on adware, bloatware, and crapware endlessly, and now you are locked into their product? Buy an iphone, it has all the stuff an iphone comes with. Buy and Android and start trying to remove all the vendor crapware, that varies from place to place.

3- Pay for a status symbol.

(1) and (2) are fully and completely rational. (3) is usually not rational, but it's still a reason.

Now, many Androids are sold at profit, and many vendors are honestly trying to earn money by selling you a product- but some are not.

As one final note in (1) and (2)- this isn't some vague "vote with your dollars" thing that maybe benefits society eventually- this benefits you personally immediately, because the company you just bought the product for is heavily motivated to please you and keep you around. If you buy and iphone and never buy a single app or anything, Apple loves you. If you buy a break-even or sell-at-loss phone, and then don't ever buy stuff, you're basically playing a "freemium" game- the devs have every motivation to dick you around until you open wallet. But unlike a freemium game, this is not obvious to most buyers- they don't realize they are "freeloading" and that the company is looking for ways to make them either become a real user, or gtfo to another brand.

Anyway, "high profit margin" doesn't only mean "you're getting ripped off". It can, and whether Apple products are worth their "Apple Tax" is certainly not any manner of given.

Re:Oh, really?

[AK Marc]

Electric cars were available before gasoline cars. Gasoline cars were available before Diesel cars. But if you ask someone which is newer or better, you'll get the reverse order.

Just because something is newer doesn't make it better. The OLED in the Samsung got lots of Samsung press, but the reviews and side-by-side comparisons didn't see the difference Samsung claimed. Maybe Apple was waiting for it to actually be better than the LCD before moving to it.

Re:Oh, really?

[AmiMoJo]

Imagine if they used different manufacturers for their OLEDs and one had slightly better color accuracy.

They have done this in the past. When MacBooks first started getting "retina" displays they used two LCD panel suppliers, LG and Sharp. The Sharp displays were perfect, but the LG ones suffered from quality issues. Most of them had ghosting to some degree. People found a way to determine if they had an LG or Sharp panel and were demanding to have their MacBooks swapped for Sharp models because they knew that problems with the LG panels were inevitable. The command used was:

ioreg -lw0 | grep IODisplayEDID | sed "/[^<]*</s///" | xxd -p -r | strings -6

It's quite a common problem. Manufacturers like to have at least two sources for every part. One source turns out to be defective or measurably lower performance, even if it is still in spec. Customers always find out.

Re:Oh, really?

[Carewolf]

You don't buy soda or bottled water?

Do you buy it due to the high margin or because you like/need it?

Re:Oh, really?

[maccodemonkey]

Samsung has sold hundreds of millions of phones with OLED screens in. Even their new entry level Galaxy J3 will have an OLED screen.

By the time the Galaxy S3 was released they had run out of OLED screens and went back to their horrific LED "Pentile" displays. So it's not like OLED worked out all that great for Samsung. Then to try to get production back up, they combined OLED with Pentile, taking a screen with lovely colors, and totally destroying it's color accuracy and eveness. Samsung has done a horrible job of keeping up with OLED demand. I'd rather take an accurate LED display, than a bright but inaccurate OLED.

To try to make up for the issue, Samsung has brought their device resolutions up to just ridiculous resolutions. 2560x1440 is ridiculous in a 5" phone, until you realize the reason they've pumped the resolution that high is to hide the issues in Pentile pixels by making them really small. But now of course you pay for that in GPU and CPU (because you have to push more pixels) and power (because you have to power the pixels and the CPU/GPU that pushes them.)

Every phone up until the S6 is still using Pentile OLEDs. That's a heck of a tradeoff to make. And Apple won't do Pentile when they do OLED displays. Samsung is throwing a lot under the bus to get OLED on their spec sheets.

2015

[hcs_$reboot]

The switch follows the steps of other smartphone makers such as Samsung and LG, which have both already integrated OLED technology in their mobile device ranges

Plus, Apple, in 2015, is still not able to provide Macbooks with matte screens. Working while watching a mirror for hours is an eye killer..

Re:2015

[hcs_$reboot]

Is it supposed to be funny? Or is it just plain dumb?

Re:2015

[damnbunni]

The IBM T221 monitors had 'retina' resolutions and matte screens in 2001.

They had some down sides - they needed quad-DVI connections, couldn't manage a 60 HZ refresh, and they were $8400. But they were matte and 204ppi.

Re:2015

[pauljlucas]

Yes, a matte screen used to be a BTO option, but said option hasn't been available for at least couple of years. Jobs was enamored with glossy screens. I was hoping, with Tim Cook taking over Apple and giving users what they want (e.g., larger iPhones that also reversed a Jobs' decree of smaller iPhones), that the matte option would come back, but so far it hasn't.

Re:Why...

[pollarda]

You ask and you shall receive ....

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1015238-REG/sony_pvma250_25_professional_oled.html
http://www.amazon.com/s/?ie=UTF8&keywords=4k+oled&tag=googhydr-20&index=aps&hvadid=80219436733&hvpos=1t2&hvexid=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=8649967677167467747&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=b&hvdev=c&ref=pd_sl_332gpox0u4_b

Re:Organic?

[Michael Woodhams]

But organic LEDs are good for you and the environment, because chemical fertilizers and pesticides aren't used to make them.

Will Apple be able to spec/source a good OLED?

[aussersterne]

I'm actually a fan of OLED displays when they're perfect, yes, even the bright colors.

But dammit it's hard to find a really good *actual* OLED display in an *actual* unit.

Went through five phones before I got a Note 4 with a good display. Went through four Galaxy Tab S units to find a good one new out of the box. Let's see, what are the problems encountered in the various and sundry displays?

- Strong yellow cast, like ridiculously strong
- Pink/green gradient, usually from corner to corner, with "white" only in display center
- Uneven brightness, i.e. dark "splotches" on white backgrounds or "dark gradients" at one edge of the screen to about 1-2" in from bezel
- Terrible pixelation/pixel noise at low brightness, not unlike digital camera "noise" in low-light exposures
- Burn-in (even in supposedly factory-new devices)

Either QC or the production process or both appear to be nearly fatally flawed for Samsung, and they're currently the biggest shipper of OLED screens in gadgets, and have had years of experience. You'd think they'd have it sorted out by now.

I love the *potential* of OLED, but it seems like for the most part right now, attempts to actually ship them in consumer devices leave a lot to be desired.

Re:Will Apple be able to spec/source a good OLED?

[AmiMoJo]

That's odd, all those sound like problems you get with LCDs, not AMOLED screens.

The uneven brightness is common with LCDs due to them being backlit, and I have to say that the iPad in particular is terrible for it (well, the older ones, I haven't looked at the new ones). Same for uneven brightness and splotches. AMOLED is generally immune to them, if it fails it tends to be via banding rather than blotching.

The yellow discolouration is the glue used to stick the screen layers together, affects LCD as well. The noise at low brightness was an issue but has been fixed on newer panels, from the last couple of years. Burn in with AMOLED clears up pretty quickly, I used to get it with the status bar on my old Samsung but after a few seconds in a full screen app it would fade away.

You have been incredibly unlucky it seems.

Re: Will Apple be able to spec/source a good OLED?

[Solandri]

Color cast is entirely an Android problem. If Google would get off its butt and implement color management in Android, you could simply profile the screen and correct the color in software. That is in fact what Apple does with its phones, tablets, and laptops to eliminate color casts - they color calibrate each screen and implement the correction in software. It's got nothing to do with OLED - as long as red, green, and blue are being generated in sufficient quantities, you can have a perfectly color calibrated display assuming the software lets you actually calibrate it. And OLED generates gobs of red, green, and blue - enough to cover AdobeRGB color space and beyond. Most LCDs are limited to sRGB or less (they only use blue LEDs, and a phosphor which converts some of that blue light into yellow, with the yellow substituting for red+green).

Uneven backlighting and dark splotches a LCD problem. You try coming up with an arrangement of lights around a rectangular perimeter which provides even brightness across the entire surface area. LCDs use an complex arrangement of diffusers and light channels to try to spread the light around evenly. It is not precise at all, and very fragile. I had left my laptop closed on a table, and someone signed a piece of paper on top of it. Apparently they pressed down very hard, because the pressure from the pen was concentrated enough to deform the diffusers slightly, and that laptop screen developed a dark splotch right where the person signed.

Pixel noise is due to most LCD panels being 6-bit and using time-dithering (rapidly flickering it between two 6-bit color values) to achieve 8-bit color depth.

Color gradients I've seen on OLED screens, but it's not because of the OLED layer itself. It's something to do with the layers they put on top. It's greatly exaggerated if you look at the screen through polarized glasses. In theory OLEDs should look identical through a polarizer as without. But something they're doing with the layers above it (maybe the capacitive touch layer?) leaves stresses in the material which are obvious through a polarizer.

Burn-in is the one problem OLED does have. But I used my Galaxy S for 5 years without any significant burn-in.

Re:Will Apple be able to spec/source a good OLED?

[tlhIngan]

Perhaps that's why Apple isn't going OLED until 2018 - OLEDs have/had issues and Apple believes in 2018 they can get good ones.

Sure Apple doesn't implement the latest and greatest all the time - they often wait for technology to mature to the point where it meets existing quality. OLED displays are like that - they're bright and vibrant, but their color accuracy is often crap because the gamut is exaggerated on one end. And they're nice and people love the oversaturated look, but again, not accurate.

Then there's the whole RGB pixel versus PenTile displays which cause all sorts of resolution issues and color issues.

Also, since LCDs have hit 100% sRGB gamut, the next target is apparently AdobeRGB, where OLEDs are able to get 97%. Perhaps in 2018 Apple can make it 100% AdobeRGB, producing a wide gamut and accurate color.

OLEDs may have been on other phones for years, but that doesn't mean it's a technology that makes it "acceptable" to Apple - it's just a technology. Apple may be a latecomer, but when they do that, it usually means they've been waiting for the technology to mature and fulfill their requirements.

Re:I avoid OLED when buying displays

[thegarbz]

All of which is not at all relevant on a disposable device like a smartphone.

But I agree. I'm not going to call for this technology in desktop or laptop monitors. But on a phone. I won't ever buy a phone without it. They are just so much better to look at. Also I don't see any difference in daylight visibility now. I did back in the Galaxy S vs iPhone 3G days. But I have no problem using my current phone in the sun.

Re:Disposable screens for disposable products?

[gweihir]

This is likely by intent: Planned obsolescence can simply be implemented a lot better with OLED than with LCD. LCD was designed from the start as a long-lifetime technology. OELD is now correcting that mistake.

Quantum Dots First

[monkeyxpress]

My guess is that Apple will move to a quantum dot LCD on the iPhone 7. The main tangible advantage of these is that they are more efficient than existing displays that use RGB filters, which will mean they can make the phone a bit thinner (or more battery life, but then again this is Apple). They also can have better colour performance, which I imagine Apple will heavily tout, despite most people not really caring.

After that they will move to OLED, since this will allow them to go even thinner.

For the iPhone 7 I imagine they will:

• 1. get rid of the headphone jack, allowing them to go thinner.
• 2. finally get rid of the sim card slot, allowing them to go thinner.
• 3. go back to a square (iPhone 5) style edge design.
• 4. move to a multi-element camera, which will allow them to remove the camera bulge from their thinner design.

iPhone 7S will probably just have wireless charging after all these years.

Re:Disposable screens for disposable products?

[gweihir]

No, I am not. Historically, with CFLs you are right. With LED backlights that became unworkable as reliable self-destruct. Hence OLED (which has a lot lower lifetimes than standard LEDs used in backlights) to the rescue.

Re: Disposable screens for disposable products?

[Karlt1]

Apple stopped selling the iPhone 3GS new September 2011. Apple didn't drop support until iOS 7 - introduced September 2013. In fact, Apple released a patch for iOS 6 for the "goto fail" bug February 2014.

Samsung's Quality Control is Crap

[Dr.Dubious DDQ]

"Either QC or the production process or both appear to be nearly fatally flawed for Samsung"

I'd lean towards this explanation, and not just in the matter of OLED displays. Over the years, I've noticed a trend of faulty hardware from Samsung. Samsung refrigerator/freezer whose temperature control is prone to go nuts after power outages (usually it stops bothering to cool the contents despite the temerature controls working and showing the current temerature accurately, though on one occasion getting stuck "on" and freezing everything in the fridge. Also, the ice maker ironically freezes up so it can't make ice), camera with a lens/focussing flaw that renders everything outside of a small circle in the center of every photo out-of-focus (sent in in for RMA, got it back unchanged a few weeks later with a note to make sure the battery was fully charged when using, WTF?), Galaxy "Mesmerize" (Galaxy S for US Cellular) whose 3G/wifi/gps/bluetooth radio would regularly completely die until the phone was power-cycled (its replacement actually was okay). My current phone is a Galaxy S4 (running Optimized CyanogenMod 12.1) that I'm actually pretty pleased with, but its USB port failed within a few months and I can't transfer data over it (it still charges and I can easily transfer data via sftp, so I haven't gotten around to getting the $5 replacement port and ripping the phone apart to fix it yet).

Samsung's Quality Control sucks. If I'd had the option of any other rootable phone from another manufacturer when I got the S4 I'd have gone with it instead, but US Cellular's selection is pretty meager. I'm just glad "have to use something other than USB to transfer files" is the only real problem I've had with it.