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Skip the Picks; Expert Uses Hammer To Open a Master Lock (csoonline.com)
itwbennett writes: Buyer beware. If it's security you're looking for, the #3 Master Lock might not be for you. In a video, locksport enthusiast Bosnian Bill demonstrates how to open a new #3 Master Lock using a small brass hammer — in under 90 seconds. This video is just one of several videos he's produced focusing on defeating the security of Master Locks, and, according to Bosnian Bill, has earned him several lawsuit threats from the company.
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"derp, you can open a lock by hitting it friggin hard with a hammer"
Yes indeed.
But I could probably do the hammer thing with a rock I pick up near the location I want to enter, rather than carry a pair of bolt cutters with me.
macgyver
how to open a new #3 Master Lock using a small brass hammer — in under 90 seconds.
The entire video is 72 seconds long. The actual defeating of the lock takes a grand total of five seconds.
So yeah, technically that is under 90 seconds. But you're really understating it.
systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
I am sure all the lower end locks are just as easy to defeat.
Troll is not a replacement for I disagree.
But, can an acetylene torch, bolt cutters, or hydrofluoric acid leave you a complete lack of evidence of tampering? He didn't smash the lock, just tapped it.
APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
How to pick a lock using a pick (as in pick and shovel)
The Marines would use a 12 ga shotgun
When I was in high school (40 years ago), I had a classmate with the colorful name of Print that could pop open Masterlocks with a textbook.
That's difficult though. It's a lot easier to go to your lawyers and order them to make it go away.
No, the cheaper and more effective solution would be to simply say "well no shit the lock eventually broke if you hit it enough times with a hammer. Even safes can never be completely 100% impenetrable."
but the lock didn't break -- it unlocked, so he can steal your stuff, put the lock back on, and when the security guard checks on it an hour later, he'll confirm that it's still securely locked and you won't know for days or weeks that your stuff was stolen.
Doesn't totally twatting the fuck out of the lock leave the bolt(s) still engaged?
Oh hang on, it's a padlock. Where not only the body of the lock, but the actual bit that links to the door is completely exposed.
Try this one neat trick with an angle grinder!
An angle grinder makes a lot more noise, is harder to keep in a pocket, and prevents you from locking it back up again to hide your tracks.
You can use more than just a hammer. How about an acetylene torch? Bolt Cutters? Hydrofluoric acid? Typical "if all you have is a hammer" tunnel vision. I expect more from you, Slashdot!
True, but with this method, or lock picking, I can gain access to whatever it is that is locked up, remove what I want, and then replace the lock with no visible evidence of entrance. The noise is minimal, the technique and tools pretty trivial, so that at any opportunity, someone who wanted to could gain entrance and leave without leaving obvious clues. If you had a job box, tool shed, or building locked up with one of these, they could easily gain entrance, and remove something, possibly leaving the owner no idea it had been stolen. Locks still there, key still works, perhaps they'll think they put it someplace else and spend days if not weeks looking for it before realizing it's actually missing. Even then they might not be sure it was stolen. If there was more items that could be taken in one trip, they could even come back later.
That being said, unless you're investigated by spooks, any old lock will probably work. Most doors won't stand up to a couple of solid kicks if a credit card won't work, and the best NYC bike messenger lock would last about as long to power tools or a farm jack.
This isn't like "oh, I can eventually break this lock by smashing it", it's "this lock opens if you tap it in the right place". It takes seconds, and requires nothing in the way of fancy technique or specialized tools.
Yes, we all get it, any lock can be defeated - but this isn't the right story to use that stock comment on. This isn't someone smashing a small lock with a big hammer - this is someone demonstrating how defective a particular lock is, and it makes for an entertaining little video.
Let's not stir that bag of worms...
Its not just hammers, this guy has shown how to get into these licks with a plastic zip tie and all sorts of other things that it shouldn't ever be possible to open a lock with.
Master Lock makes junk locks and anyone who uses one for anything important is an idiot.
Hammer time!
Locks are just there to keep honest people honest anyway. If somebody wants to get in, there is not much you can really do to stop them, especially with a sub $10 padlock. They can brut force (bolt cutters, drill, heat, crowbar etc) or finesse it open (bump key, pick, or what this guy does) and get in, you cannot stop that.
All you can really do is to slow them down by making things difficult enough it takes a long time to break in (Drill the safe, dig though the wall of the vault, or what have you) and provide enough regular surveillance that you will catch them before they get inside. You cannot stop them from trying.
"File to fit, pound to insert, paint to match" - Aircraft Maintenance 101
A set of shims would be nice, quiet, cheap AND fast.
I never get used to these constant resurrections
Hydrofluoric acid sounds cleaver in theory but is a great way to accidentally kill oneself "in real life".
Breaking bad used HFL as a red herring. It was intended to be misleading.
Actually this technique does not damage the lock. It's more of a finesse technique, where you bump the lock in the correct way to overcome the force of a small internal spring to push the shackle locking pin out of the way so you can slide it open.
So, the AC is right, better lock designs might be a good idea.... But, alas it's a fool that thinks a $10 padlock is going to afford you much security. It's really only going to keep honest folk honest because they are too easy to brute force with bolt cutters, bump keys, lock picking tools etc...
"File to fit, pound to insert, paint to match" - Aircraft Maintenance 101
Yer right; walking around with bolt cutters is like a neon sign that says I'm a thief.
I guess you could hide it under a trenchcoat. Which would be totally low profile.
... it's quite evident that not many posters actually watched the video.
The lock isn't being smashed, bashed, smacked or slammed. It's being gently tapped with a brass hammer.
So mentioning bolt cutters, sledge hammers and acetylene torches is about as pertinent as launching into a diatribe about how Mandarin is a hard language to learn, with all of it's tonal inflections, when the discussion topic is about programming languages...
You know the old saying "when all you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail"?
Who'd have thought it can be right...
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
These guys really have some nerve. You'd think the least they would do is try to avoid the courtroom.
Cheap padlocks, sure, but if you get a high-end padlock from manufacturers known for high performance (e.g. Abloy), you'll find these workarounds don't work, and you need to cut it with a torch or destroy it with a shaped charge (good padlocks have the shackle shielded so depending on how it's positioned, you can't always get at it with a large enough bolt cutter that can handle a very hard alloy). And trying to pick an Abloy Protec is a waste of time -- a few experts with special tools (not regular lock picks) and a couple of hours to spare can do it -- maybe.
"Politicians and diapers must be changed often, and for the same reason."
This a new lock:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?...
It's on kickstarter now:
https://www.kickstarter.com/pr...
You'd think Master Lock with all their cash would come up with clever ideas like this lock's mechanism.
A lock is only as strong as the weakest link.
And there's not much that a pair of boltcutter's won't go through in seconds. Whether that's the lasp, the hasp, or some other part of the door.
A lock's purpose is not to stop it being opened EVER, it's to stop it being opened by a opportunist with equipment that he can find laying nearby. You can do super-cheap locks with nothing more than a small screwdriver as leverage.
Everything else is purely within the realm of whatever it is locking being weaker anyway.
yeah, but that leaves evidence.
This method does not leave evidence that the lock was opened. Someone could easily open the lock, take something, and relock it without the owner thinking anything was up. A bolt cutter would leave a broken lock which means the owner knows he was robbed.
That's why this is an important hack - because insurance often won't pay if there's no physical evidence of a break-in. Think of it - you could enter your neighbour's locked shed and steam their power tools, relock the shed, and the owner wouldn't know about it until they open the shed again. It could easily be months before the theft is discovered.
I'm shocked and dismayed legendary hacker Samy "I suck slashdot editor tiny penis" Kamkar isn't in on this hack.
>> open a new #3 Master Lock using a small brass hammer — in under 90 seconds
Or, just haul a big bolt cutter into the locker room in a duffel bag and go "snip, snip, snip."
Yes, but by using the method described in the article, you can re-lock the lock. If I were a thief, I would probably use this guy's method. Not only can you re-lock the lock afterward (meaning whoever owns the shit you're stealing probably won't notice until much later), it looks less suspicious.
Example: If a witness sees you doing anything involving a pair of boltcutters, it looks pretty damn suspicious. If you use a small hammer to open the lock, then stuff the hammer back into your coat, and someone sees you messing with a duffel bag/briefcase/whatever with a cleanly unlocked lock, it doesn't scream "I'm stealing things".
The 5 button door locks are also trivial, we call them 'riff-raff filters'. Anyone determined appropriate your lab equipment will not be stopped by them, or much else.
Anyone bent on doing bad cannot be stopped easily, but those folks are pretty darn rare. Most honest folks don't need much beyond a piece of tamper resistant tape to be kept honest, and a cheesy lock is even better.
Watch the video. He taps it rapidly about 10 times on the side with a tiny hammer to jiggle the internals and it just pops open in less than 5 seconds.
I was able to open a Master combo lock by yanking it mildly hard. I found out why that model was on sale for 99 cents.
(-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
Back some time ago, Master went to Slashdot to claim they needed some information security about lock-breaking methods otherwise it'd be game over for locks. New cars today come without physical keys and rely on an RFID-like chip that when close enough unlocks the car. Most important things are now locked with PIN-locks or card locks rather than key locks.
It's basically game over for the products under the Master line... repeated combo locks and key locks just didn't last until today.
Not with this particular lock, but another very similar. I bought it when I was 15 or so, for locking up my bicycle. The lock shackle was entirely removable and shaped like a mushroom, the intent being you couldn't cut the hasp because the eyes of the cable lock were in the way. The body of the lock was shaped such that he could tell which way the dog engaged the shackle, so he picked it up, took off his shoe, whacked it, and the shackle popped right out, within about ten seconds of the first time he saw it. That shook my faith in physical security.
A design that uses a rotating tumbler cylinder that has a dog machined on the surface of it, that rotates into and out of the cutout in the shackle as the key is turned, would be proof against bumping. It's only because of the sprung dog that this works.
Nostalgia's not what it used to be.
So what? Your software doesn't come with Windows either. You shouldn't expound on how you dominate people before you even win an argument, it is jumping the gun and makes you look bad.
APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
Yeah, you really taught me a lesson. You taught me a lesson in what incompetence looks like.
APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
best subject title EVAR
it would be super sweet of you to steam your neighbor's power tools, and I bet they would look super clean afterwards, but why would you bother? maybe you're just a good neighbor?
All of this depends on where the lock is. If it's at a remote, unsupervised site, no lock will hold for very long. If it's a cheap padlock at the local gym, not so easy. Some techniques like raking the pins or shimming the bold are quiet enough to work. But even tapping on a lock attached to a metal locker is going to attract the attention of six MMA fighters training with the weights. Even your lookout with his gun is going to get his neck snapped for screwing with their gym bags.
Have gnu, will travel.
I remember back in grade school they did not have a lock cutter. The administration would just whack the combination locks with a hammer and they'd pop right open. I remember one of the non-Master locks popping completely apart and spilling its guts. It doesn't surprise me that it works for other types of locks as well. Locks are, after all, good at keeping honest people honest.
This post is encrypted twice with ROT-13. Documenting or attempting to crack this encryption is illegal.
Then just put your own padlock on it with gum jammed in the keyhole. The owner will need to cut your lock off because his key won't work, but he won't be suspicious because he would have blamed the gum.
Most of those brass lock I had which failed, actually primarily failed because with age you did not even need the hammer to release the pick, just pressing with the hands and the picks released, the mechanism inside or the picks becoming so used that they lost even a small modicum of tension retention. One i am keeping for demonstration purpose you can simply open with bare hands. This happens the more you open and close the lock. I do wonder if this was a new lock or a somewhat used one.
C. Sagan : A demon haunted world:
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visit randi.org
Gee, there is gum in the lock. I have no idea how it got there. Those burn marks were not on the wall before. I am not suspicious at all. /sarcasm
I agree, the lawsuits only makes Master Locks look stupid while serious lock manufacturers actually learns from how the locks are picked and make better locks the next generation.
Meanwhile the Abloy disc lock that's very hard to pick still is available over the counter in a model with keys almost identical to the keys that were available in 1907. They have improved versions as well today that are considered to be very hard to pick.
Personally I'm only considering the locks from Abloy, ABUS Granit Series or Anchor.
If builders built buildings the way programmers wrote programs, then the first woodpecker would destroy civilization.
Only the ABUS Granit series is good enough though, even if even the 37RK/80 only scores a 4 out of 5 in the SBSC security rating for locks. Also look at the Abloy and Anchor locks.
If builders built buildings the way programmers wrote programs, then the first woodpecker would destroy civilization.
The whole point of locks is a DETERRENT, they are not pure security.
Don't remember anyone saying otherwise...
They will keep out casual thieves
Not now they won't. Now a casual thief who's forgotten to bring his bolt cutters - and who isn't specifically looking out for a Master lock, by the way - will spot one and know that he can just tap it with a rock.
systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
Noooo.
The solution is to make the possession of hammers illegal.
If All you've got is a hammer, every problem looks like a lock.
aaaaaaa
If All you've got is a hammer, every problem looks like a lock .
aaaaaaa
It all depends on what you're trying to secure. Knowing how easily a lock can be defeated is good information. My most frequent use of a padlock is in the gym. Who's going to carry a pair of bolt cutters into the locker room of the gym, health spa or anywhere else there are lockers available for temporary use? Obviously a padlock can be defeated by a determined thief with time, privacy and the right tools, but sometimes a deterrent against the casual thief is exactly what's needed.
For the locker room, even a small hammer and 90 seconds seems a bit too conspicuous. The little combination Master locks that seem to be a de-facto locker room standard are much worse. Some of those can be defeated with the quick jerk of a pry bar.
Oh yes, because someone who has no thefts planned will just be casually strolling down the street at 2 AM and see the master lock on your toolshed and decide "you know what? I have had enough of the straight and narrow, time to steal some hedge trimmers".
Yes, because that is how most thefts happen. They never happen with someone canvassing a neighbourhood and taking as many quick-win items as possible.
Why would anyone goof around trying to find a rock to break open your cheap $10 padlock to get at your worn out hedge trimmers when your neighbor likely has hundreds of dollars of stuff sitting out in the yard unsecured?
Home security is all about making your house MARGINALLY more difficult to steal from than the guy beside you - nothing more, and nothing less.
Why would anyone goof around trying to find a rock to break open your cheap $10 padlock
Because they know it will work.
Oh yes, because someone who has no thefts planned will just be casually strolling down the street at 2 AM and see the master lock on your toolshed and decide "you know what? I have had enough of the straight and narrow, time to steal some hedge trimmers".
You were the one who posited the "casual thief" in the first place:
The whole point of locks is a DETERRENT, they are not pure security. They will keep out casual thieves, who will go onto the next house that has no locks at all.
If he's seen this video, he now won't go the next house, because he knows he can defeat the lock in five seconds.
If I was a thief, and you gave me a free choice between an unlocked shed and one locked with a lock I knew I could defeat in five seconds, I'd probably go for the locked one on the basis that it was more likely to have something worth nicking inside.
systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
A set of shims would be nice, quiet, cheap AND fast.
Actually the lock companies are learning though. Most of the decent companies, and even some of the Master Lock lines are essentially shim-proof now.
Chas - The one, the only.
THANK GOD!!!
Thing is, there's a readily available tool for picking disk locks nowadays.
Chas - The one, the only.
THANK GOD!!!
The huge "upside" to this method. You require no specialized tools and no real skill with said tools.
Basically ANYONE can perform this attack.
Chas - The one, the only.
THANK GOD!!!
Even with such a tool the latest versions of those locks like the Abloy Protec2 it will take some time to pick them, and you need to get the tool.
It's a question of delaying the criminals and if it's complicated enough then they go for an easier target or go for the more violent version.
If builders built buildings the way programmers wrote programs, then the first woodpecker would destroy civilization.
This isn't about "breaking off the lock".
This is about tapping the lock several times to cause the locking bar to release. Leaving an undamaged lock.
Chas - The one, the only.
THANK GOD!!!
Yep. Specialized tools.
1: Needle nose pliers
2: Hammer
3: Bolt
https://youtu.be/4tc8LJiBuOc
Chas - The one, the only.
THANK GOD!!!
Again, the thing is, crashing a window, or breaking down a door is loud and obvious and attracts a lot of attention.
That's the LAST thing a prospective sneak-thief wants.
Chas - The one, the only.
THANK GOD!!!
do this all of the time. Not for thievery, but it's a pretty common bike problem for totally legitimate reasons.
So, the idea that this is newsworthy, is the shock to me. In Junior High (a goodly number of years ago) the benefit of a Master lock was that when you forgot or lost your key, you took a buddies shoe, whacked it solid on the top and it came open. If you're buying a Master Lock, or any similar style lock, that it is somehow theft-proof is naive at best. You're buying a deterrent. On your school locker, the school ne'er-do-well' can't simply rummage your stuff as he slinks on through. sure he could take his shoe and whack it open, but that's noisy, and likely draw suspicion. Master Lock sells stuff that generally does the job, just recognize what you're buying and get on with life.
Shite! You can break just about ANY padlock with a 4 foot piece of 1/2" steel pipe. Simply slide it through the padlock hasp, and twist (trust me, you'll have plenty of leverage) and it will either snap, or what it is attached to will snap. Either way, you're in. Same goes for chains on fences with padlocks. In fact, 4 foot is probably overstating it. Hell I've done it with like a 2ft piece. Takes no more than about 20 seconds. Doesn't require significant strength. Physics - it's your friend. Or has often been said, "Give me but a long enough, and strong enough lever, and I can move the world!"
My dad did an old school correspondence course in locksmithing while i was a kid (the resulting business putting me through college.) he used to challenge my brother and I to lock picking challenges. My best record (starting with the pick and tension bar on each side of the master lock in question, hands on hips) was 2.1 seconds, lucky? sure, but no hammer involved. I can to this day pick a standard master lock in less than 5 seconds, and probably the lock on your front door in 15.
...yet possibly even quicker: bolt cutter!
Self-importance and self-indulgence is the root of ALL evil.
That's a cool trick, but it won't work on their higher end locks like Protec and Protec2. Also, it will only work on locks installed in knobs where there is sufficient room behind the lock for the internals to be pushed out into. I submit that's going to be a rare occurrence.
"Politicians and diapers must be changed often, and for the same reason."