Steam Stealer Malware Becomes Extremely Sophisticated, Remains Very Cheap (securelist.com)

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Steam Stealer Malware Becomes Extremely Sophisticated, Remains Very Cheap (securelist.com)

Posted by BeauHD on Tuesday March 15, 2016 @08:41AM from the going-once-going-twice-sold dept.

An anonymous reader writes: During the past years, malware aimed at stealing game inventory items from Steam accounts and logging Steam login credentials has become extremely sophisticated, but [has] remained at a lower-tier pricing range on underground hacking forums, rarely going above $10, never over $30. Valve says that it receives 77,000 complaints a month for hacked accounts, and Steam Stealers are responsible for most of them. [The] most targeted game is Counter-Strike: Global Offensive, while Kaspersky Lab says that most of the cyber-gangs behind these malware families are of Eastern European origin, mostly Russian.

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Not all complaints are legit by Acid-Duck · 2016-03-15 08:49 · Score: 4, Informative

There was a time where people faked their accounts being hi-jacked as a way of duplicating really expensive skins. They would then turn around and sell the skin which was scammed on a site like OpSkins and then keep the duplicated skin in their main account and still play with it. Not anymore though, Steam wised up and made some changes.
1. Re:Not all complaints are legit by Pascoea · 2016-03-15 09:17 · Score: 1
  
  So, I'm confused. I just popped over to OpSkins, after a quick perusal, it appears that you can buy different weapons of varying conditions for wildly varying prices. Couple questions. Are those prices in real dollars? Do people actually buy shit for that price? (A knife for $1000+) Has the world gone full-on insane? Why?
2. Re:Not all complaints are legit by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-15 09:22 · Score: 0
  
  yes those prices are real.
  They pay for the for the same reason you get fancy paint jobs on your car or buy exotic furniture and arr for your home.
3. Re:Not all complaints are legit by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-15 09:28 · Score: 0
  
  True that. It's also the case that I no longer do trades because it's too much damned hassle and, no, I'm not turning over my mobile phone number and installing an app in order to pass around virtual goods more conveniently. 2-factor authentication to trade (for example) a fricking hat? No thanks. If this is the future of virtual commerce I'm opting out of it.
  So, hurray, they've improved security, but simultaneously killed off a lot of casual trading. And even if I would probably willingly turn on a switch saying "You know what, I know what I'm doing and I don't really care enough to worry if this transaction for an utterly vanilla item is a scam -- let it proceed anyway", Valve won't supply that option because inevitably scammers would find some small fraction of people who would turn it on if the scammers asked them to do so. There's a small minority of people out there who will happily install malware such as trojans, say "yes" to everything, and then blame Valve for the problem. As usual, the clueless and the scammers make it more difficult for everyone else.
  Heck, a friend bought me some nice cosmetic items for a game they knew I played a lot, and then we spent something like a week with items in escrow and/or in cooldown periods trying to trade the damned things after they bought them. I told them the gift was appreciated but please don't do that again.
4. Re:Not all complaints are legit by aliquis · 2016-03-15 09:36 · Score: 1
  
  The knife skins are extremely rare and cost money to get (you have to open cases of skins using keys which are over â2 and it takes a lot of attempts to be lucky enough to get a knife skin, that make it rare and cost actual money to get) and you can resell your items though on Steam Valve keeps 15% of the value.
5. Re:Not all complaints are legit by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-15 09:47 · Score: 0
  
  Some of the items were won at the end of a 10 mins round (aka 'a drop') of 'death match', sometimes people gamble by opening containers and win a pretty expensive skins. You spend 3$ to open a container and you could win a virtual good which sells for anywhere from $0.02 to $500 on the steam market (and some sell for even more) Personally I spent about 100$ to win a $300 item. I turned around, sold it, bought a few skins I really wanted and then bought steam games with the rest. If I wanted to cash out, I'd have to go through a site like Opskins, probably lose 10-20% (I don't know the exact percentage, I never really looked into it) and from what I've read, it takes a few weeks before you get paid.
  TBH I don't feel bad at all having spent ~200$ on this game over 2years. CSGO is the only game I play and compared to my friends who are console players who spend ~400 to buy the latest console whenever it comes out + 50-75$/games for the 2-4 games a year they buy, what I spent is relatively little compared to them. Btw, CSGO not only has a huge online community and is a serious skill-based game, the game only cost me 10$ !
6. Re:Not all complaints are legit by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-15 09:49 · Score: 0
  
  I don't really see what's the big deal having to confirm your trade using a 2nd step verification. Once you've enabled the 2nd step verification and had it enabled o your account for over 7 days, trades are instant. It wasn't always like this however after so many ppl getting their accounts hi-jacked and steam getting wiser, they decided it was time for them (and their clients) to stop getting scammed. Personally I applaud them for these changes.
7. Re:Not all complaints are legit by Pascoea · 2016-03-15 09:51 · Score: 1
  
  I really wish you were joking, but I know you're not. How does someone say to someone else with a straight face: "I can't go out tonight dude, gotta save money for that bomb-ass Karambit skin."
8. Re:Not all complaints are legit by chaotixx · 2016-03-15 10:13 · Score: 1
  
  A lot of geeks have expensive hobbies. Cars, guns, model trains, stereos, it can all get expensive.
  
  I have a suspicion that there is a lot of of illegal money make it's way into the Steam economies as well. Hacked credit cards are much more dangerous to use buying physical goods.
9. Re:Not all complaints are legit by fluffernutter · 2016-03-15 10:32 · Score: 1
  
  I don't really understand how a knife skin can be 'extremely rare'.. Why don't copy commands work on it?
  
  --
  Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
10. Re:Not all complaints are legit by Scorch_Mechanic · 2016-03-15 10:47 · Score: 1
  
  For (extremely roughly) the same reasons that copy-paste commands don't work on bitcoins. Sure, you can duplicate your bitcoins as much as you want (in the case of these knife skins, you can install as many knife-skin mods as you want) but once you transfer those bitcoins to someone else, as far as everyone else is concerned, they belong to that other person. No matter how many knife-skin mods you have installed on your computer, the "digital goods" are in somebody else's safe deposit box.
  
  --
  You should turn signatures off.
11. Re:Not all complaints are legit by delt0r · 2016-03-15 11:11 · Score: 1
  
  Well i didn't use real money. But in eve i lost 6 carriers 4 dreads and a bunch of very shiny internet space ships. All up about 2000USD worth *if i used real money*. And well many people really do. I though it was strange at first. But then well if that is their hobby, why not. You will spend more on shiny golf clubs if you play golf. I paid far more for a mill and a lathe just for my rocket hobby. And well yea those expensive golf clubs are no more useful really than an internet space ship or a internet knife.
  
  --
  If information wants to be free, why does my internet connection cost so much?
12. Re:Not all complaints are legit by aliquis · 2016-03-15 11:18 · Score: 1
  
  Also beyond what I said before about paying for keys to open cases which rarely give out knives:
  Even if you get a knife they have virtual wear of their skins so to say with more complete/full skins normally being worth more than the worn ones.
  On top of that people may decorate their skins with stickers, stickers cost money too but some are more rare and some have signatures from e-sport players at specific events and so on.
  A few of the skins also have "StatTrak" capability which mean that they have a counter on the skin which shows how many times the current owner have killed someone with that skin.
  All in all it make some knives even more rare or rather completely exclusive and for a $1000+ knife it's likely a rather unique piece.
13. Re:Not all complaints are legit by fluffernutter · 2016-03-15 11:19 · Score: 1
  
  Wow.. just wow. Seems the only smart thing to do is to stay far, far away from that. I'm ok with the government giving money value by limiting it... because they're the freaking government. I can wrap my head around physical goods having value, because only so many can be manufactured. I can even kind of understand bitcoin, though I would never use it, because it is limited by no one except for its own internal mechanism. But having a game company tell me that something virtual has value because they alone chose to let me use it or not... I guess I'm just part of the wrong generation to put up with that.
  
  --
  Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
14. Re:Not all complaints are legit by aliquis · 2016-03-15 11:24 · Score: 1
  
  If you own it others see you running around with it.
  Knifes don't drop when you die so opposite of the ranged weapons where you drop them and someone else can pick them up and then run around with your super-cool skin being informed it's yours and in the case of StatTrak enabled how StatTrak isn't enabled because the skin/weapon knows it's not held by the correct owner .. but if it was a different weapon that's what would happen.
  The knife is yours only but as soon as people die in the game they become spectators and may follow any player including you and you move fastest with the knife and they have animations where the player juggle them and as such people can see that "hey this person have a $1000+ knife!!"
  You can't copy that. You can't run around with whatever skin showing towards others without paying for it. If you want it you've got to pay.
  It's nothing weirder than getting a more than adequate car (I guess), fancy clothes, jewelry, do donations, get a hair cut, wear make-up, smell good and so on.
  You totally don't need to do that and some may consider it "a waste of money" but people will view you differently / maybe it's important for you too look good and having fancy skins are no different.
  Just view it as the CS:GO-players ring or whatever.
15. Re:Not all complaints are legit by aliquis · 2016-03-15 11:29 · Score: 1
  
  How does someone say to someone else with a straight face: "I can't go out tonight dude, gotta save money for that bomb-ass Karambit skin."
  "I gotta save for my fiancees ring"? "I need to get a new suit"? "I need to get a haircut"? "I want bigger boobs"?
  Sports car, useless ring, Karambit skin. What's the difference really?
  How long it lasts?
  Diamonds are forever, a skin only is worth something for a decade and a sports car? .. The damn haircut is kinda wasted in two months anyway?
  Shave your hair once and get a setup of skins for your most used weapons in CS:GO instead? Maybe that feel more worth it than having specific hair-piece for two months for some?
  Heck, here in Sweden it's supposedly cool to order champagne just to have it poured into the sink to show that you can afford it ..
16. Re:Not all complaints are legit by aliquis · 2016-03-15 11:37 · Score: 1
  
  What about all the brands?
  Have you never worn any clothes from a cloth-brand which is more expensive because it's that brand rather than because the clothes are so fucking awesome in quality or cut?
  What about shining Apple logotypes?
  Maybe you feel more comfortable spending more money on a eau de toilette which wear the Armani or Boss brand than Wanker-SteveÂs (ok, I admit that would be an awesome brand to wear, "Wanker-Steve's secret pussy-magnet juice" (Then again if he had such a good product why would he be a wanker? I don't know! It's a secret, maybe it could be mentioned on the bottle? Maybe he was a wanker before he came up with the recipe?)
  Sure it may be somewhat more fun to drive a Nissan GT-R or Lamborghini or what not but how often do you have the usage for it? Is it really worth it?
  Sure from a physical / rarity stand-point there's a reason why say old whiskey or wine or what not would be worth more money but what if it actually kinda taste just the same to you but you know it's more exclusive?
  What about a fake vs a real ring which look the same and considering that even the real ring isn't really worth so much?
  What about shaving your pubes and then not get laid anyway. Was it worth it? Complete waste?
17. Re:Not all complaints are legit by fluffernutter · 2016-03-15 11:42 · Score: 1
  
  The day I attach my self esteem to something that isn't real is the day I seriously start to reexamine my life. I don't really believe in fancy clothes or make-up either. I've always been able to understand that anyone can wear a suit, and a person's intelligence and skill is not attached to it. But I have to say, at least those things are real. I guess it just surprises me that people could take things to an even greater level of frivolousness than that.
  
  --
  Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
18. Re:Not all complaints are legit by fluffernutter · 2016-03-15 11:46 · Score: 0
  
  Honestly, I do most of my shopping at wal-mart. The clothes I have get worn until they wear out and I can't tell you what brand they are. I drive a minivan because that is what fits the practical needs of my family. If you're looking to make this case, then you are definitely talking to the wrong person. I don't attach any value to any of those things, and I'm completely fine with the way I am without them.
  
  --
  Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
19. Re:Not all complaints are legit by aliquis · 2016-03-15 12:00 · Score: 1
  
  The day I attach my self esteem to something that isn't real
  It is real. It's "just information" but so is your bank account balance. I assume you may care somewhat about the later at-least..
  Also I'm not convinced those people lack self-esteem otherwise. I don't care for it really but I guess I could had bought some cheap skins because I've put 300+ hours into the game and if I ran around with â5 in skins and would lose â1 if I sold them would that really mattered if I thought it was cool to run around with them / see something different / know some others would pick it up and see that "hey that's aliquis gun!"
  It's not the end of the world.
  
  that isn't real is the day I seriously start to reexamine my life
  Did a tailored suit, jacket and a hair-cut counted here or not?
  
  I don't really believe in fancy clothes or make-up either.
  Swedish TV saw this show about how black in America developed a method where they dressed up smart to get into less trouble. Dress like a banker vs lose pants and shorts and like you are "from the hood" and maybe people will treat you differently. I guess that effect is LESS in CS:GO but what do I know. Some people are like "look at this person! He can't play but he's got a knife!" - as if that meant anything, you don't get a knife for skills you get it for spending money.
  I guess if nothing else how you dress may be expressing what group you belong to and how you want to be seen and the same may be true for the game. Do you want to be seen as someone heavily invested in CS:GO or who fancy the AWP or what not? Like the guy who always use the UMP-45? The person who prefer the desert eagle, knows how to use it and have the stats on it to confirm it for everyone else?
  Whatever. One don't need to get the skins, they have NO game effect whatsoever in CS:GO, they just look different.
  In Payday 2 however the skins CHANGE THE EFFICIENCY OF THE WEAPON!!! THEY HAVE ABILITIES!!
  In many claimed to be "free to play" titles you have to pay to unlock all heroes/traits/capabilities/.. and that affect what you can do in the game and likely how well you perform, maybe you'd view it as more real if one at-least get access to more heroes by paying because then it granted actual additional game content but I'd see it as a kinda unfair advantage and would rather prefer everyone had equal possibilities no matter how much they had spent into the game.
20. Re:Not all complaints are legit by 110010001000 · 2016-03-15 12:03 · Score: 1
  
  All the things you mentioned get you sex in return for them.
21. Re:Not all complaints are legit by fluffernutter · 2016-03-15 12:19 · Score: 1
  
  So you pay and you win the game or kick ass.. where is the reward in that? All you did was invest more money than anyone else. More people are likely to consider you as a bigger loser than a bigger winner. Anyway, I know I am fighting an uphill battle here. Long story short, putting money into anything is not a replacement for character.
  
  --
  Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
22. Re:Not all complaints are legit by aliquis · 2016-03-15 12:27 · Score: 1
  
  All the things you mentioned get you sex in return for them.
  Yeah, I guess sex-appeal is what you're buying and CS:GO skins maybe do a poor job there. Maybe it make some people excited but ...
  Guess "I've got $5000 in CS:GO skins!" may not even impress on a girl. CS:GO-girls? .. then again all they will want to have is free skins anyway.
23. Re:Not all complaints are legit by Scorch_Mechanic · 2016-03-15 15:42 · Score: 1
  
  I don't play CS:GO but I have a substantial amount of Fake Digital Stuff in my Team Fortress 2 "backpack". I've spent at least several hundred dollars on completely digital "goods" in TF2 over the years I've been playing it (since open beta, October 2007). Mostly I haven't regretted the individual "purchases" I've made, and to a large part it gives me joy. I budget it as "entertainment" money, so as long as I'm entertained to a degree I deem of sufficient value in exchange for my money, I don't mind giving it to Valve. After all, I've been playing TF2 for nearly ten years and they've been supporting it and adding gameplay (and a huge ton of digital "goods", which is neither here nor there for the sake of this argument). I'm voting with my wallet.
  Some players have things called "unusual hats" in their backpacks. They're hats (which are many in TF2) but they're also special. So called "unusuals" have particle effects attached to them. Buzzing flies, or sunbeams, or little clouds, or sprays of confetti, aces of spades, hundred dollar bills, or perhaps little orbiting planets, or a little cloudburst... there's dozens of effects of varying value determined by inherent coolness, appropriateness of effect to headgear (example: buzzing flies is sold for the lowest prices, but buzzing flies on a hat that's a plunger you wear suckered to your head? That's a "valuable" combination!) and rarity of the effect. Unusual hats go from anywhere from twenty, thirty dollars to many hundreds. Still not as much as the knife skins mentioned though, because CS:GO is a more popular game than TF2.
  Different items for different circles, but the reason remains the same: Expensive knife skins, rare hats that appear to be literally on fire, the latest iphone, or the flashiest roadster, it's all purchased for other people to look at and say to themselves "that fellow has a fat wallet and I'm jealous of him".
  
  --
  You should turn signatures off.
24. Re:Not all complaints are legit by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-15 17:17 · Score: 0
  
  Don't look at the crowd funding for Start Citizen or you might commit suicide.
25. Re:Not all complaints are legit by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-15 17:21 · Score: 0
  
  Unbelievable.
26. Re:Not all complaints are legit by Kkloe · 2016-03-15 20:21 · Score: 1
  
  It can also be said about food or anything you buy, why do you buy brand a thats more expensive than brand b if the end result of both brands are the same?
27. Re:Not all complaints are legit by hairyfeet · 2016-03-15 21:54 · Score: 1
  
  I've probably spent a couple hundred on War Thunder for planes and tanks, I don't see this as being really any different.
  As for why I spent that money on the game as opposed to...say buying another piece of gear for my music or my PC? I already have what I need to do what I want, anything above that would just equal more clutter. As for why that particular game? I had 2 relatives that fought in WWII and I consider it one of the most fascinating periods when it comes to planes and tanks. While you can progress through the trees faster by using premiums for me I chose them simply because most are prototypes or planes that aren't as well known as the Mustang and FW190, like the Wirraway, the SMK double barrel heavy tank, or the Japanese Spitfire which came about when the IJA captured a squadron of Spitfire Mk IIa on Burma IIRC.
  If these skins increase their enjoyment of the game they are playing? Then I say go for it. I personally couldn't see spending 4 figures on anything game related (most I ever spent was $29 to get a rare tank/plane combo pack) but when I've had a bad day and go home and see that CAC Wirraway in front of my hanger with "Lucky Lady" nose art I applied to it? It always makes me smile, and taking her into the air and dogfighting first gen BF109s and actually beating them? Always brightens my day. This makes it worth the money spent to me and if they feel the same with these knifes? More power to them, I hope it gives them endless hours of happiness.
  
  --
  ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
28. Re:Not all complaints are legit by Maritz · 2016-03-15 22:20 · Score: 1
  
  You're confusing opinion for fact there buddy. Nobody cares what you think about the game or what you're "sticking with".
  
  --
  I do not want your cheap brainburning drugs. They are useless for work. And I am a working man today.
29. Re:Not all complaints are legit by Maritz · 2016-03-15 22:29 · Score: 1
  
  It might simply be that you and the people who pay for this are different. Perhaps you're unusual in that everything you buy has practical value. If that is true, you're the outlier. I don't buy this stuff, I find the prices crazy, but they obviously get a reward out of it. You might not be expending enough effort to see from another's perspective here.
  
  --
  I do not want your cheap brainburning drugs. They are useless for work. And I am a working man today.
30. Re:Not all complaints are legit by fluffernutter · 2016-03-15 23:06 · Score: 1
  
  Well, some people eat shit. Literally, some people eat shit. I don't understand them either. Sometimes people do things that don't make sense and there is really no understanding it. Sometimes they happen to be part of a small minority and sometimes they are a majority. It doesn't make their behavior any more reasonable. With that said, I'm trying to understand. That is why I'm having this conversation here on Slashdot.
  
  --
  Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
31. Re:Not all complaints are legit by goose-incarnated · 2016-03-15 23:10 · Score: 1
  
  The day I attach my self esteem to something that isn't real is the day I seriously start to reexamine my life.
  You should start now, then.
  
  I don't really believe in fancy clothes or make-up either.
  But you believe in your smugness; you parade it in this thread as if it was something to be proud off. You imply that the peoples self-esteem are attached to some frivolous thing.
  Get over yourself. You've got hobbies that cost you money and give you entertainment, I don't see anyone here pointing out how frivolous your hobbies are - how they are a waste of money. And on the off-chance that you have no hobbies, then still I have to say - Get Over Yourself - you're not somehow better than someone else just because you're boring and they're not.
  
  I've always been able to understand that anyone can wear a suit, and a person's intelligence and skill is not attached to it. But I have to say, at least those things are real. I guess it just surprises me that people could take things to an even greater level of frivolousness than that.
  Yeah, why don't you post your entertainment costs here and we can make fun of it? Hell, I don't even play those games, nor would I ever bug digital game goods, but because I have a life, and have hobbies I can understand that hobbies cost money. You, presumably, sit in a chair and look at the walls when you're bored? No? Well, then, trust me, your hobbies are likely just as uninteresting to everyone else, yet no one acts smug due to you wasting money on a useless waste of time.
  
  --
  I'm a minority race. Save your vitriol for white people.
32. Re:Not all complaints are legit by Drethon · 2016-03-15 23:54 · Score: 1
  
  Heck, here in Sweden it's supposedly cool to order champagne just to have it poured into the sink to show that you can afford it ..
  Tell them to ship me the champagne and I'll resell it back to them. We can repeat this as often as they feel they need to dispose of money.
33. Re:Not all complaints are legit by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-16 00:16 · Score: 0
  
  The smug is strong in this one. Sniff your own farts much?
34. Re:Not all complaints are legit by Pascoea · 2016-03-16 01:35 · Score: 1
  
  I've probably spent a couple hundred on War Thunder for planes and tanks, I don't see this as being really any different.
  The big difference here, is I assume that planes and tanks in this game serve a purpose. IE, you can buy and utilize more powerful equipment to gain an advantage over your competitor. The "add ons" aid the progression of the game. And in your example, I can understand spending a couple bucks here and there. In this instance, a $1,000 dollar knife skin adds exactly zero play value.
  But, I guess if someone wants to blow a grand on something that I feel is useless, that is their prerogative. It pisses me off because they have brainwashed bunch of teenagers that these things have an actual value to them and are therefore willing to shell out relatively small amounts of money to purchase keys in the hopes that they find an object of more significant value. Maybe that's why I have such a problem with it. It's essentially gambling that prays on minors.
35. Re:Not all complaints are legit by Triklyn · 2016-03-16 01:43 · Score: 1
  
  my interpretation is that at least some of the things he purchased were downgrades. he buys them, hopefully to support the developer, and because he likes the historical aspects of the game.
  let me ask you, if they released a skin that changed the knife to a dildo, would you buy it? for 5 dollars, 10 dollars? do you know someone who would?
36. Re:Not all complaints are legit by Pascoea · 2016-03-16 01:55 · Score: 1
  
  if they released a skin that changed the knife to a dildo, would you buy it? for 5 dollars, 10 dollars? do you know someone who would?
  $5, yeah, in a heart beat. $10, probably, but I'd hesitate for a couple seconds. $20, maybe, if I was drunk. $50, not a chance in hell. I won't spend $50 on a game, much less something to make something in that game look different.
  But I'm not talking about $5 and $10 skins, I'm talking about spending a grand. And I'm talking about deluding minors into wagering money thinking they have a chance of obtaining something of more value.
37. Re:Not all complaints are legit by Maritz · 2016-03-16 02:20 · Score: 1
  
  I could've been an obnoxious prick about it like you, but I'm in an alright mood today. Thanks tho ! ;)
  
  --
  I do not want your cheap brainburning drugs. They are useless for work. And I am a working man today.
38. Re:Not all complaints are legit by Maritz · 2016-03-16 02:21 · Score: 1
  
  People who buy expensive skins for games are just like people who eat shit. That's so true. Thanks man.
  
  --
  I do not want your cheap brainburning drugs. They are useless for work. And I am a working man today.
39. Re:Not all complaints are legit by wardrich86 · 2016-03-16 03:17 · Score: 1
  
  > Why would I spend so much money on such a shit game? Valve has been turning CS: GO into a poor man's CoD. I'll stick with 1.6
  >> Valve has been turning CS: GO into a poor man's CoD. I'll stick with 1.6
  >>> poor man's CoD. I'll stick with 1.6
  >>>> poor man's CoD.
  >>>>> Poor
  
  Poor man's COD... Knife sells for $1000. Something's fucky.
40. Re:Not all complaints are legit by fluffernutter · 2016-03-16 04:33 · Score: 1
  
  My hobby is an internet startup I work on that I started with primarily open source software.
  
  --
  Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
41. Re:Not all complaints are legit by fluffernutter · 2016-03-16 05:38 · Score: 1
  
  Hey, I'm just saying both make about as much sense to me. Was hoping someone could explain it, but I guess not. People do what they do, let's leave it at that then.
  
  --
  Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
42. Re:Not all complaints are legit by Triklyn · 2016-03-16 05:59 · Score: 1
  
  :) not valve's job to keep a minor from spending money.
  parental oversight and all that.
43. Re:Not all complaints are legit by hairyfeet · 2016-03-16 09:35 · Score: 1
  
  Actually? Most of them have at best equal and most of the time worse performance than what is in the regular free tech tree...I buy them because....well I like the whole "mad scientist" aspect of early WWII and like to support the developers of games that I enjoy.
  Take for example the Australian planes in game, both of which I own, the CAC Wirraway and Boomerang. The Wirraway is IRL a trainer that they slapped some guns and bombs on as an emergency fighter, the Boomerang was a Wirraway that a Jewish refugee from Germany turned into a fighter. Both are slower than most of the planes at their tier, sure they are tough as trainers are meant to take abuse by novice pilots, but they are no powerhouses. So why did I get them, along with many other planes and tanks one would consider "challenging" to use like the Panzerbefelswagon IV? Because they ARE a challenge, it makes me feel great when I take down a supposedly "superior" vehicle in my premium, and...they're fun. It lets me support the devs while having fun, and isn't that what games should be about?
  As for $1000 on a skin? You have to look at it in perspective. To you and I that would be an insane amount but to someone who makes 7 figures a year? That would be pocket change. I have met guys like that in the War thunder community, they have probably dropped a good $15K+ into the game...why? They like having every single plane and tank and they make enough money per year that $15K isn't shit to them. If you have that kind of money and that $1000 skin or whatever makes you happy? I see nothing wrong with it, anymore than I see anything wrong with owning all the vehicles in WT, as long as it makes them happy then they should enjoy it, just as I'll enjoy my derpy no armor Nb:Fz double barrel tank or my little Wirraway.
  
  --
  ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
44. Re:Not all complaints are legit by hairyfeet · 2016-03-17 02:38 · Score: 1
  
  You are correct, planes like the Wirraway and Tuck's Gladiator, or tanks like the SD.KFZ. 140/1 and Panzer III N? Are NOT giving me a "competitive advantage" and in fact can be quite a challenge to compete with compared to the regular vehicles....but ya know what they DO have? FUN, they are fun to drive or fly, and I have fun when I whip them out and take them into battle.
  And yes I do this to help support the game and it lets me have fun at the same time, a win/win in my book.
  
  --
  ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
OK but... by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-15 08:52 · Score: 0

...isn't pretty much the whole world running AV now? Why are these things still getting installed?
1. Re:OK but... by fluffernutter · 2016-03-15 08:59 · Score: 1
  
  I know there are a lot of OSX users out there that find it too difficult and/or inconvenient to install AV.
  
  --
  Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
2. Re:OK but... by U2xhc2hkb3QgU3Vja3M · 2016-03-15 09:12 · Score: 1
  
  Without Flash, Adobe or Microsoft installed on their machines and without running external 3rd-party software, what do OS X users have to be afraid of?
3. Re:OK but... by fluffernutter · 2016-03-15 09:18 · Score: 1
  
  I'm just saying that I have seen many people comment that they use OSX because otherwise they would have to install AV, and it is too difficult for them.
  
  --
  Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
4. Re:OK but... by spire3661 · 2016-03-15 09:36 · Score: 1
  
  They arent wrong. Most AV software bothers the hell out of you with notifications and constantly tries to frighten you. Its not the installing that is difficult, its living with the software day-to-day that pisses people off.
  
  --
  Good-bye
5. Re:OK but... by Acid-Duck · 2016-03-15 09:38 · Score: 1
  
  Because of uneducated users. The same reason why people get caught by cryptoware.
6. Re:OK but... by irrational_design · 2016-03-15 10:03 · Score: 1
  
  Exactly this. I'm a programmer. I can install AV software easily. But, I've never used a machine with it installed where it doesn't become a giant pain in the ass with all the notifications and slow downs and what not. I just stick to Unix-like OSes, use ad-block and noScript, and hope that the malware authors will target easier targets. It's a gamble, but there are pros and cons and for me the pros of not running it out weigh the cons of not running it (plus I back up my important files to multiple off-site facilities on a daily basis that, as far as I've read, the ransomware programs can't get to).
7. Re:OK but... by drinkypoo · 2016-03-15 16:40 · Score: 1
  
  Right now the one that is not a PITA on Windows is BitDefender.
  In case anyone cares. AVG, Avira and Avast! are all nagware, and AVG has an overzealous protection regime that sometimes evaporates files you really would have liked to have restored from the "virus vault" (ugh)
  
  --
  "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
8. Re:OK but... by Raenex · 2016-03-15 17:12 · Score: 1
  
  Without Flash, Adobe or Microsoft installed on their machines and without running external 3rd-party software, what do OS X users have to be afraid of?
  Bold mine. So you're depending on the user to not go around a security feature to get a shiny app. But these "Steam Stealers" mainly work on the principle of fooling users into installing trojans. Even OS X users like forbidden fruit, which is why you can find instructions on how to install 3rd party apps in OS X, and isn't it funny how they mention Steam?
  http://www.imore.com/how-insta...
  "As a rule, please make sure the web site you're downloading from is legitimate: Make sure it's the vendor's actual site, for example, or go with a third-party service you trust (like Steam or Macgamestore.com for downloading games, for example)."
9. Re:OK but... by U2xhc2hkb3QgU3Vja3M · 2016-03-16 02:08 · Score: 1
  
  The only way to protect a computer against trojans is to educate the users of those computers.
Cheap since it closed loop by subanark · 2016-03-15 08:53 · Score: 1

Money goes into steam games/DLC money doesn't come back out. Valve can just reverse all exchanges, so even if you broker the trade of one game for another, it will all get reversed after a complaint.
The only way to make money is to convince someone to do an under-the-table trade, which most people know is pretty risky on its own.
1. Re:Cheap since it closed loop by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-15 08:57 · Score: 0
  
  If what you intend to buy with your money is games stealing items could net you a very respectable library of new releases.
2. Re:Cheap since it closed loop by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-15 09:07 · Score: 0
  
  That doesn't solve the issue of not being able to run away with it, i.e. once a complaint is made, Valve can reverse the transactions you made.
3. Re:Cheap since it closed loop by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-15 09:25 · Score: 1
  
  There are sites like OPskins.com that are highly reputable and make the conversion of steam items to cash pretty easy and safe.
4. Re:Cheap since it closed loop by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-15 09:27 · Score: 0
  
  They can reverse them, but they don't. I assume because of the cascading nature of trades/steam market transactions.
5. Re:Cheap since it closed loop by Acid-Duck · 2016-03-15 09:39 · Score: 1
  
  You can cash out by selling through sites like OPSkins but obv you're losing a %.
6. Re:Cheap since it closed loop by subanark · 2016-03-15 09:51 · Score: 1
  
  Ah, guess I didn't realize that. I did find a policy that indicated a 7 day waiting period if using official channels though. I just assume that most games have a "you cannot profit on it" policy.
7. Re:Cheap since it closed loop by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-15 09:54 · Score: 0
  
  They can but they used not to. Only very recently (last few 2 or 3 months) did the start doing so. Some people got away with scamming Steam for a good 1+ year. No doubt they made a killing. Google 'reddit expensive csgo skins duplicated' and read all the various posts. I'm talking about rare skins worth $1000-$1500 being duplicated several times over. All the guy had to do was put the skins up on Opskins.com, sell them and be patient until several Gs started flowing back to him.
8. Re:Cheap since it closed loop by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-15 10:08 · Score: 0
  
  I just assume that most games have a "you cannot profit on it" policy.
  If that were the case Steam would block sites like Opskins (which it isn't). People are allowed to profit of the game if they want to. Some people gamble with their skins and sometimes make a thousand dollar profit in a single day.
9. Re:Cheap since it closed loop by The+MAZZTer · 2016-03-15 14:31 · Score: 1
  
  Valve does not reverse exchanges as it can be difficult to do so. Scammer trades item to unsuspecting Player A, Player A trades that item and something else to Player B, Player B sells it to Player C on the market...Player B's unrelated item he got is traded to Player D... The Scammer sells his account with Player A's stuff on it for real money... and it just gets more convoluted form there. Valve has tended to just duplicate the affected items instead but this has been abused by people who fake being scammed to get free duplicates. So Valve no longer reverses or duplicates items; they instead have put any account not using 2FA under a strict lockdown with a two-week delay before any attempted market or trade is allowed to take effect (if you're friends with the guy you're trading with, it's only 1 day) giving users a chance to spot their account being emptied before they lose everything.
Use APPS, not LUDDITE games! by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-15 08:54 · Score: 0

Modern app appers know that ONLY apps can app apps, and LUDDITES who play LUDDITE games instead of apping appy apps deserved to get screwed over!
Apps!
1. Re:Use APPS, not LUDDITE games! by the_Bionic_lemming · 2016-03-15 08:59 · Score: 1
  
  Wish they'd shut off the annoying nag screen that asks for your SMS phone number.
  Of which I do not own and never will - Steam support refuses to help, there's no phone number to call. And if you put in a support case, they just ignore you.
  Steam's gone really downhill.
  
  --
  _ _ _ Go for the eyes Boo! GO FOR THE EYES!
glad I don't use Steam by ihtoit · 2016-03-15 08:57 · Score: 0

anyone else?

--
Political debates have me rolling my eyes so much I think I got optical whiplash. I should sue. - Foamy The Squirrel
1. Re:glad I don't use Steam by Whorhay · 2016-03-15 09:27 · Score: 1
  
  I use steam and really can't find the will to care about this. Granted I don't play any games that use steam marketplace stuff in an important way. The most I use the market for is completing holiday badges for personal amusement. There is never more than a couple dollars in my balance and the items in my inventory are hardly worth posting in the market for sale.
2. Re:glad I don't use Steam by aliquis · 2016-03-15 11:43 · Score: 1
  
  It's ok to play with the standard skins and not have any special ones.
Steam theif by ThatAblaze · 2016-03-15 09:00 · Score: 0

Steam thief: yet another phrase that meant something completely different 100 years ago.
why is this a big deal? by known_coward_69 · 2016-03-15 09:04 · Score: 0

information wants to be free and all and no one loses money when someone plays a game they didn't buy
1. Re:why is this a big deal? by pontoffel · 2016-03-15 09:18 · Score: 1
  
  People aren't cracking into Steam accounts to play the games on them: they're actually looking to steal their game items, often to sell for money.
2. Re:why is this a big deal? by 110010001000 · 2016-03-15 09:44 · Score: 1
  
  It isn't stealing. Maybe just copyright infringement. Anyhow, those players should give away their game items. They can make their money performing live and selling tshirts at their concerts.
3. Re:why is this a big deal? by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-15 10:41 · Score: 0
  
  The analogy doesn't work here since everyone can't just freely download and install a copy of the virtual item. These items are finite and only have one owner at a time.
4. Re:why is this a big deal? by 110010001000 · 2016-03-15 11:34 · Score: 1
  
  Nah. They are digital items. Anything digital can be copied freely. That is why DRM doesn't work.
5. Re:why is this a big deal? by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-15 15:23 · Score: 0
  
  Nah. They are digital items. Anything digital can be copied freely. That is why DRM doesn't work.
  Obvious troll is obvious.
6. Re:why is this a big deal? by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-16 20:40 · Score: 0
  
  You know that the money sitting in your bank account is digital too? That is, the bank does not actually deposit physical small bars of gold in a safe deposit box marked "3208", right?
  The Steam items are not stored on your computer, they are just attached to your Steam profile. So if the Steam overlords decide to remove them from your account, it is gone. Unless you hack the Steam servers I highly doubt that you can copy an item, so there not much of a DRM, rather than a record keeping.
  But trolling is sooo much fun, right? Or perhaps looking like an factoid regurgitating ignorant fool is what you are going for.
In Soviet Russia... by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-15 09:25 · Score: 0

Meh, I got nothin'.
1. Re:In Soviet Russia... by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-15 12:44 · Score: 0
  
  Exactly.
Counter-strike by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-15 09:38 · Score: 0

Well there's the problem. > 90% of the people playing that are stupid children. (and "adults")
Never ever understood the hype that trash game gets.
In fact, generally most Valve games, they are generic-to-bad levels, none exceptional, including Half Life.
There are far better games in all genres. Even Half Life and its physics were crap back then. It was hard-coded crap that is still exactly the same today. You can crash the engine by setting a weight to zero. Nice gravity-by-division.
The thing that always gets me is the hilarious lie of "but Source is great for modding!". Yeah, gotta LOVE all those mods out there. SO many of them.
The majority of Source mods get abandoned because the engine is trash, crashes half the damn time and is inflexible as high FUCK.
The others that eventually do come out either get abandoned and left with serious bugs, or don't come out for an actual decade.
The only worthwhile thing Valve has ever made is Steam.
The concept that is, not the program, the program is the worst thing about Steam. Why is is still crap?! It is 2016 for crying out loud.
1. Re:Counter-strike by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-15 12:47 · Score: 0
  
  2003 called. They want their bitter WON luddites back.
Re:Virtual property by spire3661 · 2016-03-15 09:39 · Score: 1

Like money? The vast majority of people's money is just bits in a database.

--
Good-bye
Some People Like To Steal by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-15 10:10 · Score: 0

So build the stealing system inside the game to reduce the illegal activities. It looks like The Division has that sort of system implemented already.
Re:Virtual property by fluffernutter · 2016-03-15 10:23 · Score: 1

When companies such as Steam can back their virtual products with the same security and universally guaranteed value as federal currency, perhaps I will change my mind. So far it seems to take more than a $10 warez for a sleezeball in Russia to take money out of my personal bank account and make it available for their own personal use.

--
Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
Re:Virtual property by Anonymous Coward · 2016-03-15 12:58 · Score: 0

I paid a whole dollar for Ring Runner, a 2d space sim that is really fun to play.
I don't care if it is virtual. I don't care if I don't own it. I don't care if Steam might do something wonky I lose access. It cost me basically nothing and is lots of fun.
Going out to the movies is orders of magnitude more expensive.
Re:Virtual property by drinkypoo · 2016-03-15 16:38 · Score: 1

I paid a whole dollar for Ring Runner, a 2d space sim that is really fun to play.
I don't care if it is virtual. I don't care if I don't own it. I don't care if Steam might do something wonky I lose access. It cost me basically nothing and is lots of fun.
No, we're talking about something even more ephemeral than a Steam game. We're talking about items for Steam games. People are not only spending money to buy games, they're spending money to buy items for their characters in these games. And they have enough monetary value to be worth stealing, so there's malware for that. Is there a number for that rule?
I personally think that buying items for games when you've already paid for the game or when the game is a moving target and the value of what you've paid actual money for can vary wildly in the future based on rebalancing is a bit daft, but if you're not spending much money total and it makes you happy then who cares?

--
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Re:Virtual property by aliquis · 2016-03-15 18:30 · Score: 1

Guess you may view the game access as permanent then again the current monetary system may not be either.
As long as people trust the Steam items they are very different from any other currency though, you can exchange them for real money (on Steam in your Steam wallet but on the side say with Paypal) and you could get other games or whatever with the money.
Supposedly Steam has said before you'd be able to download your games even if they went bust or whatever, I don't know if that's worth anything but for single player games maybe that's a better deal than for fiat currency.
Steam has pretty decent security and they try to make it safe and as-long as they know what's right I guess they can revert the actions, something which is harder to do if you're robbed IRL.
I lost my bicycle. I haven't lost my Steam items. The bicycle was worth more and easier to take.
Re:Virtual property by KozmoStevnNaut · 2016-03-15 21:20 · Score: 1

Man, the concept of Chinese WOW gold farmers must really blow your mind.
Gamers are notoriously bad with money, and think their virtual possesions will define their personality. That's all there is to it.

--
Eat the rich.
Re:Virtual property by drinkypoo · 2016-03-16 00:56 · Score: 1

Man, the concept of Chinese WOW gold farmers must really blow your mind.
Well, no. It doesn't blow my mind that most people spend most of their time doing stupid shit. I go outside and see it.

--
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Had my Steam account hacked the other day :( by DarthVain · 2016-03-16 01:35 · Score: 1

It was a PITA. Had to go through the recovery process and change all my passwords, before I could play DOTA2 again... All for what, so some Russian teen can root through my account, and see I have nothing worth stealing? This is the first time it has happened to me, but I have had about 5 or 6 recent attempts prior to that. Lame. Seems to be getting worse. If Steam wants to continue growing, they are going to have to deal with this issue.
N/A by wardrich86 · 2016-03-16 01:47 · Score: 1

[The] most targeted game is Counter-Strike: Global Offensive ... cyber-gangs behind these malware families are of Eastern European origin, mostly Russian.
Cyka blyat!
The elephant in the room is VAC by Pichu0102 · 2016-03-16 05:26 · Score: 1

And this is where Valve's stance on VAC being zero tolerance, permanent, and in place regardless of if your account was hijacked or not needs to be addressed. You get a VAC ban, you're not going to be able to participate in the Steam community or any online game in any fashion without being harassed endlessly, or repurchasing all games on a new account. Seen it time and time again even if VAC is not relevant to whatever discussion is at hand. I can only hope that with all the security I've set up on my Steam account, it never gets hijacked and exploits to get around all that are never found, as I'd never be able to afford to repurchase all my games on a new account.