Slashdot Mirror
Uber Denies Access To Harvard Startup That Compared Ride-Hailing Prices (boston.com)
In April, a group of Harvard Business School students created an app called Urbanhail that allowed users to see side-by-side real-time pricing -- including surge rates -- for different ride-sharing apps including Uber. The app received a tremendous response from users. Shortly after that, the group received emails from several Uber representatives, asking them to remove Uber's data from the app citing terms and policies. "Uber's developer terms explicitly forbid using its data in any manner that is competitive to Uber," said Chris Messina, Lead at Uber Developer Experience. This has resulted in Urbanhail removing Uber's data from price-comparison-list. Urbanhail's Amber James didn't find Uber's stance on the matter. He said: They are absolutely a champion of competition when it's them against taxi companies or them against regulators. However, in its own ride-hailing niche of the transportation market, Uber's stance is ironically absolutely anti-competitive.
Grease those pockets proper.
Just make a website that says "Uber is usually the cheapest, and frequently, the only option to get you from point A to point B. Why use anyone else? Click below if you don't believe us, to see the best "competitor's" rate from Urbanhail (if they have one!) next to the unbeatable offer from Uber."
The word you're looking for is "hypocritically".
I find Uber's behavior to be totally expected, and not ironic in the least. Hypocritical, perhaps. Ironic? Not even a little bit.
A corporation that favors things that benefit it and is against things that don't? Who'd have thunk it was possible?
Could you please proof read your shit before you commit. The top three posts are currently yours, perhaps a total of 350 words in these summaries, yet the spelling and grammar errors abound. If it was one, sure they slip. But this is obviously a career choice to write to /. Try to get it right every now and then please.
> competition when it's them against taxi companies
Doesn't he mean "against other companies".
A taxi company with an app is still a taxi company.
Film at eleven!
SJW's don't eliminate discrimination. They just expropriate it for themselves.
Surely custome price data is in the public domain and so fair use applies?
How can we enable efficient price discovery if we don't know what Uber's charging for the same ride? Oh wait...
Allowing customers to compare prices is a slippery slope. What we need is to hand all market control to a small number of really big companies like Uber, Apple and Comcast. That will guarantee low prices and great products and services without the danger of a free market hurting everyone.
In their app they make it clear that they are showing only competitively priced rides without mentioning Uber. Even if they just omit Uber, they are in effect cutting Uber out.
And since this app is so popular, I guarantee you that Uber will eventually change their minds and maybe even PAY these folks to list their company.
Uber management did NOT think this through.
I have many more suggestions like this Uber management. I charge $10,000 per day with a 30 day minimum booking. Sorry, cash only. I don't take Silly Valley funny money (stock or stock options).
2012 called...
sig: sauer
They should use the standard line from the uber playbook:
Uber:
We aren't a transportation company - we're not competing with the taxi's, we're a data company!
Urbanhail:
We aren't a data company, we're advertising your service! We don't have cars or a data service! just ads!
"They are absolutely a champion of competition when it's them against taxi companies or them against regulators. However, in its own ride-hailing niche of the transportation market, Uber's stance is ironically absolutely anti-competitive."
Allow me to be the first to say, "Duh!"
Uber wants to have its cake and eat it, too. Nothing surprising about this at all.
Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
Amber James... "he said"
I'm sure Amber appreciates being defined by the slashdot editors' gender preconceptions. Of course, maybe Amber identifies as male. but the photos of the Urbanhail team seem to indicate otherwise.
2020 called... looking for a miracle worker.
"Same essential features as uber... book a ride online (set time, pickup / destination addresses); see confirmations, see if a cab has been dispatched to you, see where available cars are on the map"
Except for price.
The reason people don't like taxis is because drivers always play shenanigans with fares. Always.
It's a business where the customer is always wrong.
Two major differences in your scenario. McDonald's has W2 employees, your hypothetical has contractors. Taxi companies, including Uber, use contractors.
Each McDonald's has a food safety permit, and in many states each employee does as well. If they used contractors, the contractors would by law be required to have a permit for commercial food preparation in all states. Much as traditional taxi drivers have the appropriate permits. Uber drivers of course do NOT have proper commercial driver's licenses, in 99% of cases.
It's unfortunate that taxis, unlike food handlers, have developed a special relationship with politicians in many cities and ask their politicians to improperly restrict licensing. For some reason, the taxi, garbage, casino, and solar-electric industries have a lot of political graft and corruption. That's the real difference between taxis and fast food. Nail salons have a lot of Korean owners, convenience stores are popular with Indian entrepeneurs, and taxis are popular with crooked people who engage in political corruption.
They push too hard too often. They have made themselves the last service I will try if I need a ride.
Don't step on the baby.
Here in the state of Ohio, a standard taxi rate is $4 for the hire plus $2 per mile. Any licensed taxi service has to abide by that rate. If I can't find out what my ride will cost before I book the trip, and without downloading an app on my phone, I'm not going to use their service. As an additional bonus, I can pay cash for a taxi.
Go on, citizen, stamp the vote card. R or D, your choice.
Well, it's against their ToS. Sounds like someone didn't read the not-so-fine-print.
When there's a dominant player in an industry (and for transportation networking / ride shaing companies in the U.S., that's what Uber is), they fight against anything that could level the playing field and make them less competitive vs. the competition. Conversely, it's in the competitor's best interest to combine, where possible, to make them all more competitive vs. the dominant player. So this is to be expected. And the Uber API terms of service makes it clear you they don't allow it to be used for side-by-side comparisons. They figure they have enough recognition and prestige to get customers and prospective customers to install their app, which only gives Uber as an option. All the others figure that they are better off ALLOWING their services to be on a price comparison app, because customers don't want to install separate apps from "You Never Heard of Us," "Just Started Last Month," and "Limited Services" ride share companies, but might install one app to rule them all, and use it.
This is why back in the 80's the saying was that IBM joined standards organizations in order to stall their progress. IBM could offer the IBM solution. To reach critical mass, everyone else had to agree to a common standard. It's an old play from an old playbook.
So, taxis aren't Ubers, just like McDonalds aren't apps to link you up to some dude's backyard cookout.
Support my political activism on Patreon.
This is going to sound controversial, but I think we are at the point where we would be best to let these mega-corps go crazy disrupting industries and livelihoods en-mass. Big money has won, and workers are just fighting a rear guard action attempting to slow down the destruction of the middle class.
The reality though, is that none of this can sustain itself inside a democracy. Once enough of the middle class realize that even modest dreams (a home, stable income, time to pursue their own interest) are no longer attainable, there will be a political backlash. In my view, if that moment comes sooner, the backlash might be someone progressive, modifying the rules of capitalism to bring some sensibleness back to the setup. If the process is left too late, anger will build and I fear the backlash will be a coin-toss as to whether it is better or worse than what we have now.
Free-marketers like Uber just cannot see that there is a bigger 'free market' than the economic system. It is called the will of the masses, and even without democracy, it has proven to be quite capable of disrupting the rules when its interests are not met.
food safety permit
Having seen a McDonalds (and most Fast food) kitchen, I wouldn't call it "safe". The kitchen itself may be acceptable, but the weak spot is always the worker. There is NO permit for the cook with a dripping nose, or sneezing or coughing or jacking off in a hamburger ...
But if if makes you feel good that there is a big fat "A" rating on the door, by all means feel good.
Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
These practices by uber are clearly in violation of Federal Antitrust law. I'm not a lawyer, but I am suing the board of regents of my own state over antitrust violations. I have done a fair bit of research and I would conclude, based only on the summary, that it does appear to be a violation. I suggest that the app developer hire a lawyer to fight this.
Most people claim Uber will dominate if/when autonomous vehicles arrive. This is a false assumption. There is no brand loyalty to Uber . Unless Uber can find a way to differentiate their product - all that matters to riders is who's cheapest. Most of my friends (even non-techie people) who use ride-hailing services have several apps installed, and will compare the price for each service before ordering a ride. The barrier to entry is so low almost anyone can start a ride sharing service. Uber can't stop it unless they somehow bring back the walls they helped tear down, which will never happen.
What's the difference between:
a) A service that connects you to a driver, who is an independent contractor.
b) A service that connects you to a driver, who is an independent contractor.
Choice (a) is a taxi. Choice (b) is Uber. They do precisely the same thing, because Uber is a taxi company, plain and simple. The ONLY difference between Uber and most taxi companies is:
a) A service that connects you to a driver, who is an independent contractor, and who is licensed by the city and sate as required by law.
a) A service that connects you to a driver, who is an independent contractor , and who is operating illegally, without the required license, because the driver is either unable or unwilling to be licensed properly.
A billion years ago, I worked as an intern for a research group called CSTaR. One of the things they came up with was one of the first shopping bots. It would poll a bunch of sites like CDNOW (yeah this is old, back before Amazon ruled the roost) and a few others, and would come up with the cheapest price. A few sites blocked the bot.
Nothing new here, just interesting that Uber starting to do it now.
They only say so such that they can grab more shares of the market. Every single company prefers monopoly. But in order to get there, they will use every tactic conceivable, which include competition.
You keep repeating what you first guessed the facts MIGHT be. You're not listening. Most taxi drivers are NOT employees. They are contractors. The company you call is a dispatch service. Drivers most often own the cars, except in New York where the $1 million medallion, and attached car, is most often owned by investors who lease it to the driver (not to the dispatch company).
* In the very smallest cities the driver is often neither employee nor contractor, he is the whole company .
But all those guy on slashdot and other forum railing against "ordinary" taxi anti competitiveness system... Well how is that crow tasting ?
C. Sagan : A demon haunted world:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0345409469/
visit randi.org
It's NOTHING more than an app and a name and the first to market. There is no actual value here. Just make sure you get out before the bubble bursts.
Any company that posts public rates has no right to say those rates cannot be used by the competition. That's just not how life works. We've had competing commercials for over 100 years where they use the ACTUAL product, not just data, but the actual product in the comparison, sometimes even by name.
You don't get to be a public company and post public data and rates and then have a LEGAL claim you're competitors can't use that data. You can claim anything of course, and you can lie and have lawyers say you have legal standing, but you don't. it should be illegal for layers to misrepresent the justice system like that.
A lawyer should not be legally able to make a false or misleading statement in order to scare competitors, but they do it all the time. They claim they will bring lawsuits that will crush people, knowing they have no case, and that's intimidation and is illegal. It's not that is SHOULD be illegal, it is illegal, but the justice system doesn't magically find every crime. People have to challenge things and keep the justice system honest.
It's easy to get away with corrupt behavior when nobody challenges you.
I don't know if pricing data is public domain or fair use but it cannot be both. Fair use is a term applied to the lawful use of material that is otherwise protected by copyright.
I do not block ads. I do block third party scripts.
Uber drivers aren't employees. They are independent contractors.
Uber isn't a taxi service. It's a ride sharing program.
This program isn't abusing Uber's database. It's reposting public information.
You forget the network effect, which can be a very high barrier to entry.
Drivers are on Uber because the customers are there. Customers are on Uber because drivers are available.
Try to compete against Uber by being a lone driver with your own application. Even if you are cheaper you won't get any customers.
The only way Uber can loose once they get a dominant position, is if someone can develop a single application to give prices from multiple sources, since the user do not have to know them all (and ideally, doesn't have to be registered with them all). Exactly why they are blocking this.
"He said:" Amber is a woman, not a man. Should be "She said:" I know we don't RTFA here but the name "Amber" may have been a dead giveaway...
> Taxis can be hailed as they are driving past
That depends. In New York, for example, there are three types of licenses, yellow, blue, and black. Yellow and blue cabs must be painted the designated colors. Black CAN be any other color, but are typically painted black. Black cars must be arranged ahead of time. Blues should be called, but often unlawfully pick up hails.