Mattel Sells Out Of 'Game Developer Barbie' (cnet.com)

Long-time Slashdot reader sandbagger writes: The Mattel people have released a new Barbie doll figurine touted as Game Developer Barbie. Dressed in jeans and a t-shirt, she was apparently designed by a game developer.
It's already sold out on Mattel's web site, with CNET saying it provides a better role model than a 2014 book In which "computer engineer" Barbie designed a cute game about puppies, then admitted "I'll need Steven's and Brian's help to turn it into a real game," before her laptop crashed with a virus. Mattel says that with this new doll, "young techies can play out the creative fun of this exciting profession," and the doll even comes with a laptop showing an IDE on the screen. Sandbagger's original submission ended with a question. Do Slashdot readers think this will inspire a new generation of programmers to stay up late writing code?

Comments

STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

Good. We need more women in STEM.

Re:STEM

[arth1]

Good. We need more women in STEM.

We absolutely do. We're frequently out of hot coffee, and the meeting rooms are a mess.
Not to mention the office parties, which are dull without some booby shakin' goodness.

But how, exactly, is a Barbie doll going to fix that?
Should we pin a few of them to the walls, and the dames will flock to us?
Or should we hand them to our daughters, reinforcing that girls play with dolls? That, it seems, is where the problem lies. Not what the doll models.

Re:STEM

[BitZtream]

Why?

Other than someone says 'we need more women in STEM', why do we ACTUALLY NEED more women in STEM?

Put your SJW bullshit aside and actually in a objective and factual way describe to me why we NEED more women in STEM.

WOMEN DON'T FUCKING LIKE STEM STOP TRYING TO IMPLY YOU KNOW WHAT THEY NEED TO DO AND FUCK OFF. Women are more than capable of taking over any industry that want to take over, its happened countless times and there are large swaths of women dominated professions.

We need more women garbage men too, but you aren't fucking whining about that are you? More women in STEM is not going to get you laid or fix your social issues that prevent you from getting a date.

Re:STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

Good. We need more women in STEM.

I don't think so. See, most women are smart enough not to get into professions that are frequently and increasing offshored to cheap labor countries. They're smart enough to get into professions where there are sill plenty of opportunities when you get over 35 years old - Life may begin at 50 elsewhere, but in the tech biz the only thing certain about middle age is unemployment..

I see plenty of women in law, medicine, dentistry, and veterinary - they seem to be over taking men in those professions, too.

Re:STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

This is just more of the "diversity" bullshit.

Hiring women gets you nothing. Hiring minorities gets you nothing, Hiring skilled and well qualified PEOPLE will make your company better. Demanding the hiring of more women, more minorities, etc. is nothing more than judging people by their race and gender, which is what we're supposedly trying to get away from.

Re:STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

Men can play with dolls too, you know. (NSFW)

Re: STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

Because I need someone to have sex with in the office bathroom at lunch. Why do you fucking think men want more women around?

Re:STEM

[PeteJanda]

I'll take a shot at this from an economics point of view... The number of cretins claiming there are not enough domestic tech workers is legion (e.g., Ellison, Zuckerberg), and these cretins are spending money hand over fist buying up politicians who want to increase H1-B visas. I don't wish to turn this into an H1-B discussion, but the Cliff's Notes version is: more H1-B visas = downward pressure on tech wages, as Sanjay in Hyderabad does your job for pennies on the dollar. If you increase the domestic supply of tech talent, then you'll undercut a key argument for increasing H1-B's. You may still end up see some wage headwinds but not nearly as much as if foreign workers flood the U.S. market place.

Re:STEM

[BadMrMojo]

Other than someone says 'we need more women in STEM', why do we ACTUALLY NEED more women in STEM?

Off the top of my head, I'd say it's because it's better for the industry and the field of study.

• Because a demographically diverse group is going to bring a greater range of ideas and perspectives to the table.
• Because encouraging the presence and visibility of women within the field helps ensure that those who choose to be there are accepted as a relatively normal occurrence and therefore given credence for their ideas and work, rather than judged based upon the novelty of heir gender.
• Because if an entire intellectual pursuit builds itself up around self-selection of an unrelated trait like gender, it's symptomatic of other self-selected biases which are similarly counter-productive and not in any way relevant to the pursuit itself.

It's fundamentally better for the industry and profession as a whole. For a field that tends to pride itself upon its egalitarian ethos and the importance of logic, the idea that an irrelevant criteria (in this discussion, gender) is so wildly over-represented is wildly hypocritical.

We need more women garbage men too, but you aren't fucking whining about that are you? More women in STEM is not going to get you laid or fix your social issues that prevent you from getting a date.

You accurately noted that there is a wildly disproportionate representation of men amongst garbage collectors and yet that doesn't bother me in the least. That's not because it's unglamorous or because I think it's beneath my notice, but rather because I don't think that physical act of garbage collection will be improved through fresh insight, voices, or perspectives.

I will admit that I would like for there to be at least a few women in garbage collection, just as an indicator that, "No, seriously, 50% of the population can actually choose to do whatever work they damn well please, just like the other 50%," but that does not improve garbage collection itself, just society as a whole. Since it isn't improving the actual practice of garbage collection, let's set that aside as "SJW bullshit", shall we? I can accept that.

I absolutely do think that the logistics of how to handle garbage collection on a city- or region-wide level is a field that can benefit from fresh insight and voices. I know nothing about the sanitation services management industry, but I strongly suspect that it's run by old white men. Rather than gender being the issue, in this case, I'd be more concerned about class, race, and representative makeup of the public being served.

That's why your counterpoint is in no way related to the topic of hand.

Re: STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

Diversity makes innovation, which is why the most innovative and successful companies in tech are so diverse... Right?

Try again, dipshit.

Re:STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

Also the Silicon Valley companies are stuffed with 30 something overworked single males who might well bail if they can't have any sort of a normal life.

More women in tech = more possible partners to keep the nerds happy.

At least in theory.

Re:STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

Or should we hand them to our daughters, reinforcing that girls play with dolls? That, it seems, is where the problem lies.

Why on earth would that be a problem? Boys play with various toy figures too. Is GI Joe less of a problem than Barbie?

Re:STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

Cannot believe parent was voted up. Disgusting.

Re:STEM

[Morpeth]

"WOMEN DON'T FUCKING LIKE STEM STOP TRYING TO IMPLY YOU KNOW WHAT THEY NEED TO DO AND FUCK OF"

The 1950s called, they were looking for more archaic closed-minded dumbfucks... I'd be happy to provide a reference for you.

I work in education (teaching robotics and programming after working in the industry for 20 yrs). I
have girls/young women in my classes, don't fucking tell me girls/women don't like STEM you total fucking moron. Girls are some of the better ones in my class.

It's asshats like you that I have to contend with in getting more young women interested, and people like this.
https://www.theguardian.com/te...

Re:STEM

[RobotRunAmok]

>>We absolutely do. We're frequently out of hot coffee, and the meeting rooms are a mess. Not to mention the office parties, which are dull without some booby shakin' goodness.

Fuck you, you sexist asswipe.

It is out of fear for the dickless wonders like you that more women aren't in STEM.

Re: STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

Buddy, if you had a wife, she'd be sucking another man's dick with all the freedom you want to allow her. That probably give you wood though, doesn't it?

Re:STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

Lolz. Women aren't in STEM because they're not idiots.

How many women in HR have you seen made redundant, or made to do overtime or on call enslavement?

Re:STEM

[arth1]

Fuck you, you sexist asswipe.

It is out of fear for the dickless wonders like you that more women aren't in STEM.

Whooosh much? If you had bothered to read the entire post before commenting with froth around your mouth, you might have discovered that it was irony and ridiculing STEM males. Others managed to catch that.

Re: STEM

[cyber-vandal]

Women have also faced sexism in medicine, the legal progression, accountancy and many other fields but seem to be thriving. What makes the STEM assholes more terrifying than those in other professions?

Re:STEM

[Applehu Akbar]

I wonder how 'HR Dragon Barbie' would go over?

Re:STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

Veteran software developer here.

I have seen two things change in the past few years:

1) more young women are applying for entry-level software development positions.
2) the vast majority of candidates (both genders) with Computer Science or Software Engineering degrees can't code their way out of a brown paper bag.

Computer geeks always come out of college with an arrogant over-appraisal of their own talents, largely because the only kinds of problems they have ever had to solve are academic problems that lack that "real world punch" that really makes the difference. But lately the problem as worsened, as the curriculum has been severely dumbed-down. Crazy logic like "we don't need to make these kids code a sort algorithm because modern languages all have that built in" produces wave after wave of graduates who can't create algorithms. Without that skill, they can't solve any problem that lacks ready-made code snippets on stack overflow, and they can't pull their own weight on our development teams.

We put new hires through 6 months of training before they can even begin to code anything independently. It feels like we have no choice but to spend company resources to provide remedial education (to men and women alike) because of this.

I am not claiming that the lowering of the educational bar is the reason these women are computer scientists. I will make that judgment in another 5 years, after I see how long this crop has lasted.

Re: STEM

[ShieldW0lf]

If I already have all the money, and all the men are already heeding my wishes and obeying my commands, where is there left to go?

The answer is, get the women into the workforce, where I can exploit them as well.

Do you get it now?

Re:STEM

[K. S. Kyosuke]

It is out of fear for the dickless wonders like you that more women aren't in STEM.

But it is not due to people like him that people like you are so bad at recognizing sarcasm.

Re:STEM

[K. S. Kyosuke]

Because a demographically diverse group is going to bring a greater range of ideas and perspectives to the table.

And an educationally diverse group is going to bring an even greater range of ideas and perspectives to the table. That really sounds like an argument for experimenting with high school and college curricula and educational techniques than anything else.

Re:STEM

[lgw]

Cliff's Notes version is: more H1-B visas = downward pressure on tech wages, as Sanjay in Hyderabad does your job for pennies on the dollar

I see this a lot, and it's deeply stupid even by /. standards (and racist besides). Even the very dim should be able to understand that if Sanjay is in Hyderabad then he's not in the fucking US on a visa, is he? Offering Sanjay an H1-B means he now has to pay to live in the US, and he now makes a higher wage and removes some downward wage pressure. Sanjay of course is no dummy, so he's going to get a Green Card as fast as he possibly can, at which point he just another American tech worker, same as anyone else.

Re:STEM

[aevan]

Well if we're playing with assumptions on anecdotes...

I went to two majority-female universities over the course of seven years in the 90s for several pieces of paper. In my STEM courses, females were a huge minority. Of the students in my courses, they often were among the top scorers.
MY observations were that the majority of the women I talked to on campus has no interest in STEM stuff. A decent amount of the men that were in my courses were in it because they were expected to have went into it, or thought it would be a well paying job. The majority of the women in my courses were in it because they enjoyed the field and felt they had talent in it.

My conclusion would be that the girls in STEM wanted to be there, were driven to succeed in there, and it showed. Some of the guys just 'expected' to pull out 'a pass' and it also showed. The women that couldn't hack it dropped out, and the men that couldn't hack it stayed until they failed out. End result: the women in the courses placed rather well, but in no way meant that the majority of women 'secretly want to be in STEM and we are losing top engineers/coders because of it'. I've no doubt that there are some women who would have flourished had they chosen a different major, but I looked it as more that 'too many men thought they could take a piece of the 'new rising field''.

Re: STEM

[samwichse]

Buddy, you have a pretty pathetic outlook on life.

Re:STEM

[I'm New Around Here]

Don't worry about them. Some idiots just can't figure out humor, and have to let their pet peeve control their lives.

Re:STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

Why don't nobody complain about women coaching baseball?

Re: STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

I've never had the opportunity. Where is this female baseball coach you speak of?

Re:STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

Maybe we just need less men?

Re: STEM

[Darinbob]

Because more men around leads to a frat house mentality at work, that's why. It's nice to have mature and professional people at work for a change.

Re:STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

Sanjay of course is no dummy, so he's going to get a Green Card as fast as he possibly can, at which point he just another American tech worker, same as anyone else.

Not quite. Sanjay may not be a dummy, but neither are the people running the outsourcing companies that employ him. They purposely rotate employees in and out of the United States on short term contracts to prevent them from developing roots and connections in the United States. Because the employees work for the outsourcing company and not the parties for whom they are doing the work under contract, they don't have much say in this. If they complain, the outsourcing company fires them, they loose their H1-B visa and have to go back to India in shame. They will never work in outsourced IT again. So Sanjay may not be dumb, but the same crooked system that screws American tech workers screws him too. The only winners are the lying cheating outsourcing firms and their investors. Even the US companies who hire them end up getting screwed with crap quality systems that basically don't even work and have to be thrown out and written off as a loss. I have been called in to re-design and re-write systems like this and have heard executives swear they will never hire Indians again as they hand over the check when I give them the keys to a working system. Of course by then Sanjay and his employer have moved on to their next short term target and the process repeats all over again.

Re:STEM

[Toonol]

Don't be so disgusted. It was obviously making fun of the somewhat obliviously sexist OP.

Re:STEM

[PeteJanda]

Thanks. Just logged in and saw IGW's mindless drivel. You beat me to the punch. IGW - Before you and your fuckin' idiot ilk spew shit out of that sewer of your mouth about racism, ask yourself whether you actually know what the fuck you're talking about.

Re:STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

Not a clue.

I tell you, I would buy a "Genuinely a Dragon Barbie" in a hot minute though.
(ahh, the joys of being furry trash)

Re: STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

Nothing; except they complain louder on the internet about having to be politically correct. (IE not make dick jokes at work)

Re:STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

The problem; is your experience with women "seeking revenge" is from the perspective that you personally haven't denigrated women.

Women regularly get denigrated, maybe not by you, but as your example with your grandmother illustrates, there are people out there that denigrate women in everything.

Some of them do it just by looking at their boobs the entire time they talk, some of them do it by only ever asking the woman to get them a coffee.

All women have experienced it, some of them don't notice. Some of them appreciate the differential in attention, but that doesn't excuse it.

Sure, you aren't oppressing them yourself, but you have to remember that their life experience is being denigrated and oppressed. Don't be surprised that they all act like you are about to jump down their throats. (Chances are pretty good that you would).

Its not really an excuse, but until you have lived constant and unrelenting 'isms (racism, sexism whatever) I'm not sure you can really attack them for expecting that response (and acting just a little more hostile as a defense mechanism). Remember, we taught them to behave like this.

Re:STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

So all the reasons are completely selfish. Why don't one of you fuckers try and explain to women why it's good for them?

Re:STEM

[jandersen]

Hiring women gets you nothing. Hiring minorities gets you nothing, Hiring skilled and well qualified PEOPLE will make your company better. Demanding the hiring of more women, more minorities, etc. is nothing more than judging people by their race and gender, which is what we're supposedly trying to get away from.

There certainly is such a thing as "reverse racism/sexism/...", in the sense that people may cover up the racism host within by overcompensating in their actions and rhetoric, and one may suspect some of the more absurd manifestations of "anti-racism" fall into that category. However, that does not mean that there is no argument for addressing the imbalances and unfairnesses that still occur in society. If particular segments of the population are significantly less well represented in certain professions, then it is worth finding out why, and possibly addressing in some way; it may even make sense to use some form of positive discrimination, although I think it is too often used without actually thinking about the issues involved. It would probably be much better for the state to invest in better education for whichever group is under-represented, since that would help break the vicious cycle of poverty -> poor education -> poverty ...

Re:STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

Why, because its sold so clearly people want to buy it that why. This has got nothing to do with diversity hiring, it about supplying a clear demand, so whats your problem. I do think that there will always be more men, than women in STEM jobs, the personality type attracted to that occurs more often then men than women, probable for the same reasons autism occurs more often then men. But if there are kids who are growing up thinking certain options aren't available to them, then trying to fix it at that level is exactly what they should be doing, clearly this barbie has filled a demand that wasn't being satisfied. How screwed up an individual are you if you are angry about letting kids know what options are available to them.

Re:STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

However, that does not mean that there is no argument for addressing the imbalances and unfairnesses that still occur in society. If particular segments of the population are significantly less well represented in certain professions, then it is worth finding out why, and possibly addressing in some way; it may even make sense to use some form of positive discrimination, although I think it is too often used without actually thinking about the issues involved.

You do not hear short, white men crying about the injustice of not being represented in the National Basketball Association (NBA). Surely if there exists a racist organisation it is the NBA - majority are African-American and over six feet tall. So these athletes contribute to "their people" and tell them to stop acting like gangstas and get an education and take responsibility for their actions? Nope.

Re: STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

Nothing; except they complain louder on the internet about having to be politically correct. (IE not make dick jokes at work)

In all the years that I worked in IT I never heard any "dick jokes" nor were women treated as second-class. I have met a few arrogant, workplace bully types over the years. My only regret was not reporting their conduct although I got the impression management wilfully turned a blind-eye to the situation they knew existed.

Re:STEM

[TheLongshot]

Course, the problem there is when "skilled and well qualified people" = someone like me, which is often white men. It isn't always intentional, but it has been shown that such biases happen.

Re:STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

Don't be surprised that they all act like you are about to jump down their throats. ...until you have lived constant and unrelenting 'isms...

Is constantly being treated as if you're some sort of threat an accepted 'ism, yet? Because it's pretty damn unrelenting.

Re:STEM

[lgw]

About 95% of the engineers I've worked with for the past 10 years have been recent immigrants - on a visa or green card. None of them were "outsourced", that's just what a West Coast software developer looks like. What I say is based on experience. What you just said seems to be based only on hate.

The various visas allow the same guy to do the work here, with the same costs I have, instead of someplace far cheaper. That's a good thing: for me, and for the other guy too, who deserves a job just as much as I do.

Re:STEM

[BadgerRush]

You don't get it. NO ONE is telling you to hire non-skilled or non-well-qualified professionals, there is nothing inherently less skilled/qualified about being a woman or a minority. Let me repeat: there is nothing inherently less skilled/qualified about being a woman or a minority.

What diversity programs do is not "judging people by their race and gender", but instead showing statistic significant biases in hiring processes where people are being excluded from consideration for irrelevant reasons not related to their skill or qualification. No one is demanding that you hire only women or only minorities, but that instead you stop excluding those from your hire pool.

And if you argue that you always hires the best person for the job, but your workforce greatly differ from the gender/ethnicity/etc distribution of your local population and/or graduates, then you are both bad at hiring and bad at statistics.

Re:STEM

[jandersen]

You do not hear short, white men crying about the injustice of not being represented in the National Basketball Association

True - but then I don't hear anything about the NBA; I guess it is a strictly American phenomenon. However, this is not even about the hurt feelings or psychological traumas suffered by those suffering unjust discrimination; it is about good, common sense: if we need more, highly skilled people, how does it make sense to exclude certain groups of people from making a valuable contribution? Not long ago it was common to expect wives to stay home, rather then have a job; was it very clever for a family to choose to have a significantly lower income, just because of - what? Men's prejudice against working women or something? Letting everybody contribute to the best of their abilities is simple, common sense. It also happens to be fairer and better in so many other ways; I don't hope this fact in itself counts against.

Re: STEM

[cyber-vandal]

Does that make a significant difference? I remember all sorts of sexism such as female doctors were assumed to be nurses because "women couldn't be doctors" but that didn't stop women from thriving in other fields. What makes STEM different?

Re:STEM

[beastofburdon]

That is nearly the most retarded post I have ever seen. Keep working hard and someday you will hold the title.

Re: STEM

[beastofburdon]

You've never worked with more than four women at the same place have you?

Re:STEM

[beastofburdon]

There is not one single way in which women are "denigrated" in which there is not a male equivalent. The only difference is that the male equivalents are deemed acceptable and in fact expected.

Re: STEM

[beastofburdon]

Your sig is very relevant to this comment.
Very few women were forced to be housewives in history, they had the option and chose to be housewives.

Re:STEM

[beastofburdon]

What the fuck are you rambling about?
Nobody in the STEM fields is excluding any minority group, they are tripping over themselves to hire them.
Housewives, now you have this one all sorts of wrong. There were many reasons why women chose to be housewives, not forced like many people are certain of.
* Birth control was unheard of, so if you wanted to fuck then you were going to be popping out kids. This was not conducive to keeping and advancing in any job, still isn't today, and shouldn't be.
* Child care is fucking expensive. Then and today, child care would cost nearly as much as one parent can make, and often more.
* It was a better deal. Being a housewife involved far less manual labor than most jobs, as well as a vastly lower injury and death rate. After the first couple of kids started nearing ten years old the housewife's amount of work started to plummet because the kids were helping with most things, including caring for the other children.

Re:STEM

[beastofburdon]

Bullshit, the entire point of diversity programs is to impose a preference for one gender or race over another. That explicitly requires hiring someone of the favored gender or race over another even if they are less qualified. In the current situation in technology that means hiring women and other minorities, but primarily women, no matter how low there qualifications because there are so few of them in the pool to hire from.

Re: STEM

[Anonymous Coward]

lol, so true

Come on Barbie Lets's Go Write C, Ah Ah Ah Yea

[lobiusmoop]

Link is article is borked I think...

Re:Come on Barbie Lets's Go Write C, Ah Ah Ah Yea

[Noiser]

Broken for me, too—it's just <a>!

But the “cnet.com” link in the title works correctly. Here’s the URL: http://www.cnet.com/news/game-developer-barbie-gets-it-right-by-being-cool-and-capable/

Re:Come on Barbie Lets's Go Write C, Ah Ah Ah Yea

[Anonymous Coward]

This might make a lot of little girls say they want to be game developers. Most of them will stop saying that the moment they start learning code. You might make them live in the fantasy a bit longer using those fluffy code-like games that are now popular in education...but you can't protect them from reality for ever.

And the reality of software development is unpleasant for most people. No amount of manipulation while they are young-and-impressionable will change that.

Re: Come on Barbie Lets's Go Write C, Ah Ah Ah Yea

[Anonymous Coward]

Why is this nodded -1? The same applies to boys. In college they had a really hard C++ course, only half of us passed, the other half quit. Mostly men. Some woman passed some quit, same with the men.

She's still white

[Anonymous Coward]

Sorry Barbie... You didn't check your privilege. So only white people get to make games? This is bullshit.

Re:She's still white

[BitZtream]

Fuck off.

If it was african then it wouldn't represent latinos, asians and other shades of brown.

It can't be every color so just fuck off with your whining bullshit about how it doesn't fit every personal agenda you have.

To put it bluntly, by posting your comment you've shown that YOU ARE A RACIST FUCK because you picked one race that YOU think deserves it and ignored all the others. You try so hard to hide the fact that you're a racist asshole that it shines through like the sun. Hint: Racism comes from every race, especially the assholes who think you have to be white to be racist.

Re:She's still white

[Anonymous Coward]

YHBT. HAND.

Re:She's still white

[Anonymous Coward]

Whoosh.

Re:She's still white

[Anonymous Coward]

She's Barbie, not Michael Jackson. A coloured doll should have a different name. Otherwise, let's complain how Barbie isn't a man. Men are so ignored! I mean, have you seen a male Barbie?

Re: She's still white

[Anonymous Coward]

Transgender Barbie can be made with a glue gun.

Re: She's still white

[Anonymous Coward]

Lol dipshits like you are the reason why I wake up to troll in the morning.

Re: She's still white

[Calydor]

I thought you'd need a pocket knife to whittle off the breasts considering what Ken dolls look like.

Re: She's still white

[Anonymous Coward]

Shemale Barbie: no knife needed.

Broken link?

[danaris]

Is it just me, or is the main link (the one actually referencing Game Developer Barbie) just an anchor tag without an href...?

Dan Aris

Re:Broken link?

[alvinrod]

Maybe EditorDavid needs Steven's and Brian's help as well.

Re:Broken link?

[Anonymous Coward]

Not just you. I cant click in in Android Chrome (both normal and mobile site) and a long press makes it select text as if there is no href..

Re:Broken link?

[Selur]

Link is under 'cnet.com' in the title bar,... http://www.cnet.com/news/game-...

Re:Broken link?

[Anonymous Coward]

Broke Code Mountain is upon us!

Erm

[Anonymous Coward]

Shouldn't that be 'Game Developer' Barbie?

Some clarification is needed.

[Anonymous Coward]

Does this doll represent a "female game developer" in the sense of a woman who likes math and computer programming, who studied computer science at a real university, who works on commercially-successful games selling millions of units, and who because of her abilities and experience is respected by her fellow game developers, both men and women alike?

Or does this doll represent a "female game developer" who was born a man, suffered from severe identity issues and gender confusion, started calling himself a "woman" despite having a penis, studied game development by reading a book about JavaScript, works at a grocery store, and launches one angry tirade after another on Twitter attacking alleged "racists", "misogynists", and "homophobes"?

I ask because these days the concept of a "female game developer" is, sadly, more commonly associated with the second sort of person than the first. It's shameful how the great accomplishments of real female game developers are overshadowed by a few loudmouths on Twitter.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[AmiMoJo]

The hair in particular makes it look like it's based on Brianna Wu, a game developer with published and we'll received titles and demonstrated technical knowledge. Mattel did good.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[Z80a]

There are several more important female game developers that could serve as a model like Carol Shaw (probably one of the first female game programmers, that had to deal with the hell that is programming for the atari 2600) , Roberta Williams (Basically invented the point & click genre and had such influence on the gaming in general that PC gaming probably would not exist as it is today without her influence), Corine Yu (Worked directly on Direct3D, and its quite likely you're reading this text thru her work, given the fact windows aero uses D3D to compose the windows etc..)...

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[AmiMoJo]

Sure, and I funny think Wu was used as a model exactly, just a one of many influences and a nice nod towards her efforts in this area.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[Z80a]

I think most boys when they dream of being a game developer, they dream of being Shigeru Miyamoto, not some random mobile developer.
And as such, girls should aspire as be as big as Ms.Williams, because well, besides the fact we need another of those because the game industry is stagnant as hell, it's a much more glorious dream.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[arth1]

Sure, and I funny think Wu was used as a model exactly, just a one of many influences and a nice nod towards her efforts in this area.

But what will it do to a young girl? Do young girls understand Gamergate or deadline crunches or entering the flow? What kind of role model is this beyond a stereotypical image of a nerd girl? If your aspirations are to be like that, it will turn young girls into otaku wet dreams, not programmers.

Even if you play with a nerd doll, you still play with dolls.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[Anonymous Coward]

There seems to be a few 'female game journalists' these days who meet the second criteria, too. Is this so the computer industry can say they're employing 'more women' and the tech press can pretend their diversity extends beyond 'white hipsters from SF'?

Re: Some clarification is needed.

[Anonymous Coward]

A single game, where the individual in question was caught red handed seeding hate posts aimed to herself. She had made the mistake of not logging out of her developer account. Also, people who have removed themselves from that singular project have noted that she actually didn't do anything, and ate curious why their former coworker. Allstars herself a game developer.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[linuxrocks123]

> and its quite likely you're reading this text thru her work, given the fact windows aero uses D3D to compose the windows etc

Pretty sure I'm not unless she worked on OpenGL, too.

$ uname
Linux
$ glxinfo | grep "OpenGL renderer"
OpenGL renderer string: Gallium 0.4 on AMD KABINI (DRM 2.43.0, LLVM 3.8.0)

This is Slashdot, man. Or Sparta; take your pick.

I don't think it really matters who they based it on, as long as it seems "real" to someone in the target audience. I think the doll is good, as far as a plastic role model can be "good".

My concern, though, is that there's no reason she should be dressed "plainly". Barbie has a very distinct, flamboyant taste in fashion, and there's no reason she should be suppressing that just because she's a programmer. That plus the "geek glasses" could send the signal that "yeah you can do this, but you won't be pretty/fashionable/cool if you do". But, hey, molehill!=mountain ... especially compared to the travesty that was the "computer engineer Barbie" story.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[AmiMoJo]

Note to mods: This is a transphobic attack on Brianna Wu. FWIW she is a skilled developer, knowledgeable about the Unreal engine on mobile platforms in particular. I don't know where the "works at a grocery store" bit comes from, that's just batshit even by AC standards, and of course the "confusion" and speculation about her body is pretty much textbook transphobia.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[AmiMoJo]

I'm not sure I follow. Is playing with dolls somehow a problem for developers? I think a fair proportion of them do, even if they prefer the term "action figure".

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[Mashiki]

The hair in particular makes it look like it's based on Brianna Wu, a game developer with published and we'll received titles and demonstrated technical knowledge. Mattel did good.

Can't say that's a good plan aposematism and all that. FYI Wu hasn't had any acclaim to their titles outside of what they paid reviewers for. Every site that gave big accolades was a tablet pay-as-you-go review site, and demonstrated technical knowledge? Is that before or after they got put in their place by actual developers? Or where they're simply a sack of shit? Or they're considered one of the biggest jokes around.

Sorry, you can try polishing a turd but it's still a piece of shit in the end. And in this case, one that stinks.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[AmiMoJo]

I have got to buy a Bluetooth keyboard. Damn auto-correct!

Re: Some clarification is needed.

[Anonymous Coward]

Note to mods: ami is a fucking loser SJW who makes it his life's goal to make sure no rock is left unturned in the fight for woman's equality. Even if that rock means not being able to take a fucking joke and laugh.

You are a piece of shit, seriously man. Learn to laugh and love. All you do is hate.

Re: Some clarification is needed.

[Anonymous Coward]

This is not the '80s anymore: the industry has changed, the environment has changed. Girls are smart enough to understand that childish dreams do not translate into viable career choices and that's why they stay away from coding. Women are also far more into socializing, and the coders' crowd is severely lacking in that and other aspects. Women do not steer clear of IT because of sexism: they stay away because it's a shitty job done in a shitty environment by shitty people.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[arth1]

I'm not sure I follow. Is playing with dolls somehow a problem for developers? I think a fair proportion of them do, even if they prefer the term "action figure".

I don't think playing with dolls is a problem for developers. However, I don't see it as conducive to making young kids switch their mindset to one that makes such a career path likely.

Based on my working for more than two generations in science and engineering, I find that most of my colleagues, regardless of gender, were those who did not grow up with social-skill-building toys like dolls, but played with other types of toys that challenged other faculties and made them ask questions of the world.
As such, I'm inclined to believe that giving children dolls as toys is not going to make them more likely to understand or pursue a specific career, no matter whether the doll depicts a diva, soldier or a "programmer". How many of us grew up to become firemen?

I believe dolls can be useful for children learning skills through play, like understanding other people. But at the expense of learning other skills, like inquisitiveness and knowledge for knowledge's sake - skills that are more likely to make them understand and perhaps pursue a STEM path.
I don't think cutesy barbie nerd girl or GI Joe will spark that fire - rather the opposite.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[Anonymous Coward]

The problem is that Barbie's will always be nothing more than GI Joe's bitches. Snake eyes used to load the truck up with the barbie heads after we invaded. They popped off so easily. Of course my sister protested, but the invasions continued relentlessly. They were good fun, even Scarlett of the Joes(a real woman) had her way with that little floozy named Skipper.
Doctor barbie, lawyer barbie.... didn't matter, they all got the same treatment.
Yo Joes!!!!

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[AmiMoJo]

Wow, you really are gullible, aren't you. BTW, I have a bridge for sale...

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[AmiMoJo]

I don't think playing with dolls is a problem for developers. However, I don't see it as conducive to making young kids switch their mindset to one that makes such a career path likely.

Thanks for clarifying. I tend to agree with you, but that's not really the point of this. It basically has two functions, to normalize the idea that girls do engineering (incredible this needs to be said, but it does) and to give girls who are interested in it a doll that fits their fantasy.

A lot of commenters seem to be assuming it's much more than it is. Having said that, exposure to programming at age 3 lead to me becoming a programmer, so I'd advocate programmable toys for that age group. Obviously at age 3 I didn't understand what a programmer was, but learning that I could control machines with simple software was the spark.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[lgw]

Everyone would be happier if you would just stop posting to Slashdot.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[AmiMoJo]

I think I've found a new Slashdot trigger word. I figured the transphobia on her Q&A session was just that, but I clearly underestimated the instinctive ad-hominem her name attracts. Pavlovian indeed.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm saying this as someone who doesn't like Wu and her Social Justice/neo-liberal ilk any more than I'd like a blow torch being taken to my dick - Likening dying one's hair to aposematism is profoundly retarded, and you're a monumental fucking simpleton for doing so. It's absolutely no wonder nobody takes people like you seriously. You will be laughed at, mocked, and derided wherever you go, for the rest of your life.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[Anonymous Coward]

Someone points to photographic evidence providing proof of their claims, and you response with a meme claiming that they're wrong.

You anti-gamers are pretty desperate these days, huh?

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[Anonymous Coward]

If she represents a true game developer she drinks nothing but coke and eats nothing but pizza till she develops diabetes, works 18 hour days 7 days a week, rarely showers, and eventually gets given an impossible deadline and is fired on her 36th birthday just before she dies of congestive heart failure.

Gender and gender identity don't even matter. No one wants to be with someone that doesn't shower and she doesn't go out so public bathrooms are not an issue. She just waits till all the other developers go home to use the bathroom.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[Anonymous Coward]

FWIW she is a skilled developer, knowledgeable about the Unreal engine on mobile platforms in particular.

Citation sorely needed.

Because citations for the opposite are stupid-easy to come by (and already present in this thread) but I've yet to see anything to suggest that "Ms" Wu has done anything beyond write cutscenes using the Unreal engine.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[Anonymous Coward]

I've never heard of her beyond gamergate. I agree with the parent / AC. There's no confusion.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[Sir Holo]

Third Option: The physicians screwed up the circumcision, and instead installed an analogue vagina, prescribed life-long hormone therapy starting at the age of nine, and charged the parents for all of the "extra" work that the physicians themselves caused.

Fourth Option: She is a smart woman who does what she loves.

The gaming community is still disgustingly misogynistic. Women do like to play video games (my wife does), but it's hard enough to find one that isn't slanted, and harder still to find any multiplayer environment that isn't hostile (outside of a home-based LAN). My wife likes FPS games – killing people of zombies. But to avoid the trolls, we just play through the story-lines in co-op mode. It's almost enough, but we'd rather be social.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[Sir Holo]

There are several more important female game developers that could serve as a model like Carol Shaw (probably one of the first female game programmers, that had to deal with the hell that is programming for the atari 2600) , Roberta Williams (Basically invented the point & click genre and had such influence on the gaming in general that PC gaming probably would not exist as it is today without her influence), Corine Yu (Worked directly on Direct3D, and its quite likely you're reading this text thru her work, given the fact windows aero uses D3D to compose the windows etc..)...

Roberta Williams! Absolutely! It all started with King's Quest, and expanded from there. She created not only the "point and click" genre, but also paved the way for story-driven 3D open-environment games, which started with Myst – written by two brothers, but she paved the way to a great extent.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[goose-incarnated]

The hair in particular makes it look like it's based on Brianna Wu, a game developer with published and we'll received titles and demonstrated technical knowledge. Mattel did good.

Wait, what? Brianna Wu isn't a programmer, doesn't have published and well received titles[1] and has never demonstrated technical knowledge. Hopefully, the resemblance is only coincidental - we don't really want young girls to think that the best they can offer a game development team is doing the artwork.

[1] Having released one title does not qualify one to use the plural "titles"

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[goose-incarnated]

Wow, you really are gullible, aren't you. BTW, I have a bridge for sale...

You understand the concept of "photographic evidence", right?

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[goose-incarnated]

Note to mods: This is a transphobic attack on Brianna Wu. FWIW she is a skilled developer, knowledgeable about the Unreal engine on mobile platforms in particular. I don't know where the "works at a grocery store" bit comes from, that's just batshit even by AC standards, and of course the "confusion" and speculation about her body is pretty much textbook transphobia.

Note to mods: Brianna Wu *isn't* a programmer, has never demonstrated any technical skills and has frequently posted evidence of not knowing anything about programming. Brianna Wu is a *journalist* turned game-studio-owner.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[AmiMoJo]

Check out her twitter feed. She occasionally posts some quite insightful technical stuff about the Unreal engine that she is working on, particularly a few months back when her company upgraded from Unreal 3 to Unreal 4 for the PC release of Revolution 60.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[AmiMoJo]

You posted some memes suggesting that some women look like plants and some other stuff that made even less sense. I think I have a better idea what photographic evidence is than you.

I have you on my friends list because you posted some good, rational and level headed stuff on other stories. Shitty memes and ad-hominems are below you. I was going to ask why Wu is a trigger for you, but it seems more like feminism in general is.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[goose-incarnated]

You posted some memes suggesting that some women look like plants and some other stuff that made even less sense.

Please read more carefully, I posted no pics, I simply clicked on what the other poster replied to you with.

I think I have a better idea what photographic evidence is than you.

I don't think you do - just because two of those images posted are memes, you discard the other two? It's not even in dispute anymore: Ms Wu claimed that she had been driven from her house and was forced elsewhere, and the pictures she posted almost certainly disputes her claim.

I have you on my friends list because you posted some good, rational and level headed stuff on other stories. Shitty memes and ad-hominems are below you. I was going to ask why Wu is a trigger for you, but it seems more like feminism in general is.

Not feminism, dishonesty. With most people, actually. Ever wonder why mentions of Grace Hopper, Ada Lovelace, Carol Shaw, Dona Baily and other such icons receive no derision but Brianna Wu and that lady behind Depression Quest are considered such failures?

You need to ask yourself, when you run into somewhere who admires the former list of women above, why do they have such contempt for the latter list? Surely if it was sexism and/or misogyny they would either hold all women programmers in contempt. When people pick and choose which female developers they consider great and which they hold in contempt, the problem certainly isn't sexism.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[AmiMoJo]

You need to ask yourself, when you run into somewhere who admires the former list of women above, why do they have such contempt for the latter list? Surely if it was sexism and/or misogyny they would either hold all women programmers in contempt.

This is a classic tactic of misogynists, to compare women to the greatest women who ever lived and deride them for not meeting that ridiculously high standard. It's like claiming all guitar players are shit because they aren't Hendrix or Gilmour, and that's objective because look we are giving credit those guys.

The misogyny comes from GamerGate. Look at their ridiculous arguments. Wu's game doesn't look like a PS4 title, even though it's running on a 5 year old iPhone. She made a game, it got good reviews, and it might not be the greatest game ever but it's still more than most wannabes have ever made. There are hundreds of other mobile games that look the same or worse, and play a lot worse too, but they don't get the abuse because the head of the company that made them hasn't been targeted by GamerGate for daring to criticise the games they like.

Look at the comments on this story. Plenty of transphobia to go around, much of it modded up. That is not objective criticism of her work.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[goose-incarnated]

You need to ask yourself, when you run into somewhere who admires the former list of women above, why do they have such contempt for the latter list? Surely if it was sexism and/or misogyny they would either hold all women programmers in contempt.

This is a classic tactic of misogynists, to compare women to the greatest women who ever lived and deride them for not meeting that ridiculously high standard.

Say's who? You're basically claiming that having contempt for *any* woman is the same as having contempt for *all* women. That's a mighty broad brush you have there - it's not sexism to dislike or deride individual women because of their politics. It might not be right, but it certainly isn't sexism. This is like saying "gamers are sexist" because some gamers are actually sexist.

It's like claiming all guitar players are shit because they aren't Hendrix or Gilmour, and that's objective because look we are giving credit those guys.

The misogyny comes from GamerGate. Look at their ridiculous arguments. Wu's game doesn't look like a PS4 title, even though it's running on a 5 year old iPhone. She made a game, it got good reviews, and it might not be the greatest game ever but it's still more than most wannabes have ever made. There are hundreds of other mobile games that look the same or worse, and play a lot worse too, but they don't get the abuse because the head of the company that made them hasn't been targeted by GamerGate for daring to criticise the games they like.

It's one thing criticising, it's quite another to call an entire demographic names because you found a prostitute in a game.

Look at the comments on this story. Plenty of transphobia to go around, much of it modded up. That is not objective criticism of her work.

Point to one. Seriously, people aren't attacking women, transgendered or otherwise. People are attacking a specific person, not for her gender but for her political views, and her public calls for attacks. Honestly, any person who publicly criticises something is open to criticism as well. In this case, I honestly cannot find a single technical output from her on the web.

Please, you said she tweeted about the innards of working on $SOMEENGINE? Got a link I can look up? Because I just did another search for technical anything from her. Anything - a talk on thread issues, on native-code components, on scoping in the scripting logic in the one game her studio released, a comparison of IDEs, SCC, anything at all. I haven't found it.

But *you* have seen it, so I ask for the link, so that I will never again say "I've not seen any technical competence from Brianna Wu".

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[AmiMoJo]

You're basically claiming that having contempt for *any* woman is the same as having contempt for *all* women.

No, absolutely not. I'm saying that their accomplishments are belittled by misogynists because they are women, in this specific case. Wu's game has been successful and had some good reviews. It might not be the greatest game ever, but it doesn't deserve the hate and vitriol she gets over it.

Can you perhaps explain how you parsed by sentence to reach your conclusion? If I said something to imply that I'll gladly accept responsibility, but I really can't see how you could reasonable make your conclusion from it.

It's one thing criticising, it's quite another to call an entire demographic names because you found a prostitute in a game.

Can you cite a specific quote that does that?

Please, you said she tweeted about the innards of working on $SOMEENGINE? Got a link I can look up?

Sadly the Twitter search engine is shit, but you could start with her interview on Slashdot:

https://interviews.slashdot.or...

She answers a few questions about Ureal, particularly the last one where she talks about the challenges of using it on mobile platforms.

I expect you will dismiss that for some reason, so if I remember I'll look up some tweets later.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[goose-incarnated]

You're basically claiming that having contempt for *any* woman is the same as having contempt for *all* women.

No, absolutely not. I'm saying that their accomplishments are belittled by misogynists because they are women, in this specific case.

And I maintain that her accomplishments are being belittled because of who she is; faking threats against oneself (those photos above you dismissed) makes one a rather stupid and selfish person, regardless of gender.

[snipped...]

Please, you said she tweeted about the innards of working on $SOMEENGINE? Got a link I can look up?

Sadly the Twitter search engine is shit, but you could start with her interview on Slashdot:

https://interviews.slashdot.or...

She answers a few questions about Ureal, particularly the last one where she talks about the challenges of using it on mobile platforms.

It's completely devoid of technical content. Let me post her answer here for you:

It’s hard to stress just how much work we had to do to get Revolution 60 to run on older Apple devices. You start out with 512 megs of RAM, and a good chunk of that is taken up with Springboard. Then, iOS 7 came out midway through development and we found ourself suddenly with 134 megs less RAM to work with. We lost over four months solving that problem.

It's very hard to stress how much they had to do, and it took them four months to do it, but she's got not a single technical issue to share? Not one? After four months of challenges? The above is something you get out of a journalist, not a programmer.

What's really ironic is that she ends up this content-free answer with "There are a lot of gamers out there that like to play armchair developer because they don’t understand these engineering tradeoffs.", but she hasn't actually given anything specific. To keep some perspective, look at how specific her responses on her social media involvement is.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[AmiMoJo]

It's very hard to stress how much they had to do, and it took them four months to do it, but she's got not a single technical issue to share? Not one? After four months of challenges?

Keep reading...

Revolution 60 got a lot of critique for our textures - which has always felt unfair to me. Low resolution textures were a deliberate tradeoff. Infinity Blade looks amazing, but they only have 2 characters on screen at a time. Cyrus has 22 mesh influencing bones, with a level 2 joint influence. Holiday has over 75 mesh influencing bones - requiring a second draw call with level 3 joint influence. We have up to five characters on screen at once, all with a 2k diffuse and a 2k normal. On top of that, there is a ton of custom animsets and sound that isn't hardware decoded. This is very ambitious to ask all of this to run on the iPhone 4S.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[Anonymous Coward]

Interesting. I immediately thought of Jade Raymond when I saw the Barbie.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[goose-incarnated]

It's very hard to stress how much they had to do, and it took them four months to do it, but she's got not a single technical issue to share? Not one? After four months of challenges?

Keep reading...

Revolution 60 got a lot of critique for our textures - which has always felt unfair to me. Low resolution textures were a deliberate tradeoff. Infinity Blade looks amazing, but they only have 2 characters on screen at a time. Cyrus has 22 mesh influencing bones, with a level 2 joint influence. Holiday has over 75 mesh influencing bones - requiring a second draw call with level 3 joint influence. We have up to five characters on screen at once, all with a 2k diffuse and a 2k normal. On top of that, there is a ton of custom animsets and sound that isn't hardware decoded. This is very ambitious to ask all of this to run on the iPhone 4S.

Here we are talking about someone who claims to be a programmer (a very specific claim) and the closest you can get from this person is a description of what they had to use in Blender/3dMAX/Solidworks? Those aren't technical details I'd expect to hear from a self-identified engineer (Yes, she really calls herself that). Those are details I hear from our artists.

There *are* multiple talented women programming computers; thing is, they're more interested in programming than in social movements. The type of person who seeks celebrity status is not usually the type of person who will write software. The type of personality that seeks social change and/or social engineering is orthogonal to the type of personality that loves to solve algorithmic problems.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[Ash-Fox]

Sadly the Twitter search engine is shit, but you could start with her interview on Slashdot:

Not the grand parent here. I read through it, end to end... To be quite frank, I saw nothing here that was particularly technical and this was on a site for an actual technical crowd... I'm disappointed.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[Anonymous Coward]

On the contrary, dear friend: public opinion is strongly on the anti-gamer side and the truth is, mainstream media have declared "gamers" to be essentially over. Nobody would touch that audience with a barge pole now. Mission accomplished. Anyone identifying as a "gamer" will be shunned and publicly reviled, just as it happens with "hackers". Words are weapons, my dear friend, and we know how to wield and to use them. While obviously you can not. But then, you never had the power to make words mean what you want. :)

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[AmiMoJo]

Thanks for neatly demonstrating the problem. If a random guy said that you would assume he wasn't lying when said he was a programmer. You would just think that it's a short answer to a question that is supposed to be understandable by non-programmers (all sorts of geeks come here)... But because it's Wu, or maybe because she is a women, I don't know, there is no benefit of the doubt or assumption of good faith.

She has to post actual code your your default assumption is that she is a liar. How fucked up is that?

There is literally nothing I can say to change your mind at this point.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[zrobotics]

I would actually argue that the problem with gaming isn't misogyny, it's that the entire culture is overwhelmed by a toxic minority. Women are an easy target for the mouthbreathers, but I gave up playing online FPSs simply because I was sick of constantly hearing the n word and other crap being spewed over voice chat. Yes, women do get singled out, but focusing on strictly misogyny rather than the culture as a whole will be less effective overall. Not only will women feel more welcome, but others will as well. As a straight male I'm not singled out, but I still quit online play. And LGBT individuals, at least in my experience, seem to attract more ire than women. The creeps aren't hitting on them, but they seem to ratchet the hate levels right up to Westboro Baptist levels almost instantly.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[Anonymous Coward]

Why can't the girl also aspire to be Miyamoto?

The problem here is you and those identitarians who think we retards limited by what is spoon fed us.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[Anonymous Coward]

Why should Wu count as an influence towards anything? There was nothing interesting or groundbreaking about Revolution 60, except perhaps that it's pretty unusual to have a small scale indie game made with a spouse bankrolling hundreds of thousands of dollars behind it and developers paid upfront. If it had to be developed with a usual method of crowdfunding, outside investment, a publisher or a development team willing to put in hours upfront on the hope of generating revenue later it probably wouldn't have been made. It's not that far off from the gaming equivalent of a vanity publication.

Ironically, the other female developers who collectively contributed far more to Revolution 60 than Wu rarely get mentioned. So much for empowering women in game development. The media that Wu has so effectively rallied and intertwined herself with only cares about women when they come with perpetual victimhood stories.

Maybe you think that her contribution is in raising awareness towards gender equality and improving things for women in game development. Well sorry, but I disagree with this too. Even a lot of the other prominent women in that space see her as the self serving, manipulative and dishonest egomaniac that she is. She is not a good spokesperson for anything.

I really hope that girls don't aspire to become like Brianna Wu.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[goose-incarnated]

Thanks for neatly demonstrating the problem. If a random guy said that you would assume he wasn't lying when said he was a programmer. You would just think that it's a short answer to a question that is supposed to be understandable by non-programmers (all sorts of geeks come here)... But because it's Wu, or maybe because she is a women, I don't know, there is no benefit of the doubt or assumption of good faith.

Well, when someone refers to themselves as an important programmer within industry, we'd expect them to have at least written something.

She has to post actual code your your default assumption is that she is a liar. How fucked up is that?

That's just the way it is - don't grandstand about how damn important you are when you are unable to back it up, regardless of whether youre' male or female. We don't discuss technical details to prove a point, we discuss them because we find it entertaining, we find value in it. The other posts I made to slashdot today very neatly displays my point - I made no claim about my skills but still got a technical discussion in. Wu *never* has anything of technical value to say. Not even when asked directly.

There is literally nothing I can say to change your mind at this point.

Actually, you made the claim that she's a programmer, upthread. It's the same claim she made, you just repeated it. Thing is, there's absolutely no statement she's ever made that paints her as a programmer, only as a social movement leader.

You want good role models for women? So do I, but women like Wu (and that other lady, I forget her name) aren't good role models. They *want* to be role models but can only offer moral support. Their entire online footprint is nothing but their crusade. And like I said before, it's rare that the activist personality type intersects often with the programmer personality type.

Programmers are doers, not talkers. Activists are talkers, not doers. Wu and her ilk would do a great deal of good for female programmer models if they at least showed the world (male and female) that they can code. All they've shown thus far is that they can talk.

Re:Some clarification is needed.

[Sir Holo]

I would actually argue that the problem with gaming isn't misogyny, it's that the entire culture is overwhelmed by a toxic minority. Women are an easy target for the mouthbreathers, but I gave up playing online FPSs simply because I was sick of constantly hearing the n word and other crap being spewed over voice chat. Yes, women do get singled out, but focusing on strictly misogyny rather than the culture as a whole will be less effective overall. Not only will women feel more welcome, but others will as well. As a straight male I'm not singled out, but I still quit online play. And LGBT individuals, at least in my experience, seem to attract more ire than women. The creeps aren't hitting on them, but they seem to ratchet the hate levels right up to Westboro Baptist levels almost instantly.

Good point. Your more general observation is probably the more general root-cause.

My solution is to play FPS or TPS games that require more than just trigger skills. That is, more than just an arena with re-spawning guns. Alternatively, games that require goal-based or team-based games---if you screw things up for the team, then you will get booted. Or I just do a LAN-host and play with my wife.

Try CS:GO on Steam. Teams are typically 5 vs. 5, making players less tolerant of the little potty-mouths who also tend to flub round for your team. "Vote to boot 14-tr-old-K1ll@h47?" The "yeses" will come in rather quickly, and the slot will be refilled with someone waiting to join a game before the next round (usually best out of 15, or best 15 out of 30 rounds).

If you want FPS or TPS games with reasonable female and male characters, and like squads of up-to-four characters killing zombies, then try "Left 4 Dead 2" or "Dead Island". Each of the 4 characters to choose from has their own specialty traits, too, so it's worth playing without regard to gender. They are both story-driven, with Dead Island being the most story-driven and open-world enough that you can easily stray too far and get yourself slaughtered if you're not careful.

Last, stay away from the latest, greatest titles, and stick to the ones a year or three back. The little griefers are always clamoring for the latest game, and will have left the "Eww, that game's like two whole years old!" types, from which you can choose the best by looking at reviews, and can also buy for cheaper.

Try them again!

Link?

[alexhs]

<a>new Barbie doll figurine touted as Game Developer Barbie</a>

Good job, EditorDavid ! Was it supposed to be submitter's link to sfgate ?

Where's Gamergate Ken?

[Anonymous Coward]

Butt Bongo Fiesta!

Re:Where's Gamergate Ken?

[matbury]

Does game developer Barbie shudder every time a male colleague walks behind her?

Re:Where's Gamergate Ken?

[Z80a]

We need the indie developer ken, complete with bangs, thick glasses, shallow beard and a face that you must to your best to not punch your screen, complete with a starbucks coffee cup and a mac.

Re: Where's Gamergate Ken?

[Anonymous Coward]

You just described me you asshole. Except I've looked this way for over 15 years lol. I invented this look. I'm an east coaster.

Please more stereotypes!

[allo]

Because a regular barbie cannot represent a game designer, or can it?

Stop being so stupid. It's all about the fantasy. Even a stick man cut out of paper can be a game developer role model, if the child likes to play this game.
If this is the most attractive game is a whole other question. If you look at the game development sector you're not even sure, if you would encourage somebody to get a game developer. Respect to the ones, which are, but that does not mean i would want to push my child in that direction.

Re:Please more stereotypes!

[Anonymous Coward]

Well at least this one doesn't seem like it has impossible body style?

Re:Please more stereotypes!

[arth1]

Well at least this one doesn't seem like it has impossible body style?

No, but it does reinforce the stereotype of nerd girls wearing glasses, having funky colored hair, print t-shirts and canvas jackets. Put some cat ears on the headphones, and it would probably sell well ... to a different audience.

Re:Please more stereotypes!

[Anonymous Coward]

That audience being 20 something feminists with rainbow-colored hair?

Re:Please more stereotypes!

[Anonymous Coward]

Blonde, attractive, Barbie: "Hi, I'm Barbie. I'm a software developer. I optimise Java functional algorithms for a living."
Ripped Ken: "Hi, I'm Ken, Barbie's boyfriend. I'm a rocket scientist. Using orbital mechanics, I tell others when the optimal launch date for a spaceship is."

Both: BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!! Go away nerd! Don't ruin our cool! We don't need to do any of that stuff because we're actually adequate in the looks and fashion departments. We pose (and sometimes do porn) for money. Easy stuff.

Re:Please more stereotypes!

[Anonymous Coward]

there was a "<smiley pause>" before "Both", it got eaten as bad HTML.

Re:Please more stereotypes!

[Anonymous Coward]

Well at least this one doesn't seem like it has impossible body style?

No, but it does reinforce the stereotype of nerd girls wearing glasses, having funky colored hair, print t-shirts and canvas jackets. Put some cat ears on the headphones, and it would probably sell well ... to a different audience.

Not really. Most of the buyers of limited edition toys are collectors and traders. These will be back on the market via ebay and amazon after Thanksgiving at 5 to 10 times the price. It happens every single time, LEGO sets in particular.

Re:Please more stereotypes!

[Anonymous Coward]

probably why it sold out

SJWs to the rescue!

[Aboroth]

This is almost a step in the right direction, but this doesn't go nearly far enough to teach young girls that only white people can be racist. There is always something to complain about in SJW-land! Everything is always your fault, doubly so if you're white! Quadruply so if you're a white male! FEEL GUILTY, GOD-DAMN IT!

Which reminds me- how dare you all assume this Barbie is a girl! If you use the wrong pronouns on him/her/it/shmim/shmer/shmit, you might seriously damage his/hers/its/shmis/shmers/shmits incredibly fragile SJW psyche! Make sure when your daughter/schmaughter learns how to properly feel like walking on eggshells when talking to the doll to properly emulate healthy real-world interpersonal relationships. You might want to buy the official "Barbie Safe Space" where the doll can be placed to avoid hearing opposing viewpoints, and be sure to get the closest thing to a proper life partner currently available for sale for Barbie, "Fully-Emasculated Feminist Ken!"



#triggered #preferredpronouns #checkyourfuckingprivilegeyouwhitescum

Re:SJWs to the rescue!

[Anonymous Coward]

LOL! You show those women and children who's boss. #beltnotthickenoughforwifebeating

Re:SJWs to the rescue!

[AmiMoJo]

Interesting, I don't feel any guilt or get that message so the question becomes why do you? Can you tell us exactly what makes you feel guilty?

Re:SJWs to the rescue!

[Anonymous Coward]

This is almost a step in the right direction, but this doesn't go nearly far enough to teach young girls that only white people can be racist. There is always something to complain about in SJW-land! Everything is always your fault, doubly so if you're white! Quadruply so if you're a white male! FEEL GUILTY, GOD-DAMN IT!

The SJW thing appears to be an artificially created meme used to attack and silence voices that some do not wish to be heard. No doubt there are people paid to use the talking point, though hopefully more skilfully than this one did.

I have no problems with game developer Barbie. Its a free country and some good might even come about because of it. That doesn't mean we need quotas for high tech jobs, but it seems a loss to the species in general if there is a lot of potential standing at the sidelines that is not being utilized.

I tend to think the SJW meme is linked to the more dangerous meme of anti-intellectualism. This meme says that being an intellectual is a bad thing for those that lead and make decisions. President Obama has regularly been criticised along those grounds. Hell the republican party nominate someone with, as near as I can tell, no real firm positions, let along intellectual reasons behind those positions. Even the blatant racism seems likely to mostly be a tool to manipulate, though that doesn't make it better. If anything, it makes it worse. It assumes that on some level he believes that the people are stupid and easy to manipulate and it also presupposes that their nominee doesn't particularly care how he wins

The goal is not for girls to believe creating games is cool. That is at best a means to an end. The goal is for young people to believe that engineering is a rewarding career. Of course, as an engineer, I don't really see a desperate need for additional engineers. As it is where I work has across the board cuts in budget. Strangely they are also hiring college graduates. Still, I have no objections in general to encourage everyone to live up to their potential.

All that being said, wouldn't it be cool to actually have a 30 hour work week that paid as much as a 40? We could spend more of our lives, just living and pursuing our own pursuits. Continuous employment can't continue forever. Automation insures that, and it is going nowhere. Even art and music are unlikely to fill the gaps. Most people don't care if it is an original or a digital copy. Low paying jobs are also limited, since more and more of that can be automated. Heck, sooner or later McDonalds is likely to sell vending machines. Smash the middle button for a fresh chicken sandwitch, or better yet, click from your work pc, then have it ready for you when you hit the break room.

Re:SJWs to the rescue!

[Anonymous Coward]

Are you thick? You don't have to actually feel guilty to understand that losers are screaming "FEEL GUILTY ABOUT YOURSELF GOD-DAMNIT!" to every white person. If anything, all it's done is turn me completely off to ever considering their positions ever again. Besides, this is America, a free country. You're free to be racist, sexist, whatever -ist you want to be and there isn't a fucking thing anyone can do about it. Blacks are the most racist group of people on the whole I've ever met, and on the whole, whites are so thoroughly domesticated that there isn't a bone left in their bodies that cares about their own people, so how they can be called racist, I'll never know.

Re:SJWs to the rescue!

[Anonymous Coward]

Nobody is yelling anything of the sort except the voices in your head. If your first response on hearing that someone is being given a hard time by others who intersect a group with you, then either you're a narcissist, or you're enthusiastically (not accidentally, not by virtue of being human, but actually, pro-actively, enthusiastically) actually giving the subject a hard time yet simultaneously know that you shouldn't.

Real men listen and look for opportunities to become better people. Pathetic gamergate losers sit whining because don't want to be criticized if they treat other people like shit.

Re:SJWs to the rescue!

[Ash-Fox]

The SJW thing appears to be an artificially created meme

Could you describe to me what a organically created meme is and how this is different?

I would also appreciate it if you could describe after that why we should care if it's an organic or artificial meme too and then why we should care about memes at all?

Yeah

[Anonymous Coward]

Do Slashdot readers think this will inspire a new generation of programmers to stay up late writing code?

About as much as barbie inspired a generation of thin women (fatter than ever and getting even fatter).

Just from personal experience

[Anonymous Coward]

"Do Slashdot readers think this will inspire a new generation of programmers to stay up late writing code?"

Depends on the girl. Example, some of my daughter's kindergarten girl classmates like Barbie, My Little Pony, and similar figures so they can do "girly" stuff like brush the hair and such. My daughter likes My Little Pony but re-enacts the adventures of what she saw on the TV show and me reading the comic books to her. I asked her why she doesn't like Barbie dolls? She said it was boring.

Now if Game Dev Barbie came with an actual programming environment that kids can install in their computers, and start creating a mini game, then "Yes, this will inspire to code and dev.". However, if it is just another Barbie doll with plastic accessories, then "Nope.".

While writing this, it reminded me of this SNL skit: https://youtu.be/1Se8PVZdfPg

Re:Just from personal experience

[AmiMoJo]

That's actually a really good idea. I started coding at age 3 with a toy, so there is definitely scope for something here.

Re:Just from personal experience

[arth1]

Indeed. If girls want to play with dolls instead of building and exercising faculties like curiosity, experimentation, building and problem solving, it won't do much good - it will just cement the gender divide further.

Personally, I think the personality and drive forms quite early in life, and if you don't think it's awesome to spend hours researching and finding solutions to problems by age 9-10, it's too late; the train has left without you. At most, you can learn the motions later, but without the built-in drive, there's little chance of ever becoming more than a worker.

Re:Just from personal experience

[PopeRatzo]

Indeed. If girls want to play with dolls instead of building and exercising faculties like curiosity, experimentation, building and problem solving, it won't do much good

What's the difference between a doll and an action figure? I could argue that the first let's you create a story, with all the curiosity, experimentation, building and problem-solving that entails. The second (action figures, in case you've lost track), impose a story on you. No curiosity, experimentation, building or problem-solving required.

So before you complain about the doll in your neighbor's eye, you might want to remove the Limited Edition Tony Stark as Iron Man Poseable Action Figure from thine own.

Re:Just from personal experience

[arth1]

What's the difference between a doll and an action figure?

None. You're attacking a straw man here. Most "action figures" are dolls marketed towards boys.

The exception being a few action figures that actually do something, challenging the brain of toddlers as to how to assemble them or get them to do specific things. But even then, the challenge tends to be minor and short-lived, and the major function is as a role play effigy, i.e. a doll. Which is fine if that's what the child needs at that point, but a doll doesn't in any way imbue other skills or lead anyone onto a technical path.

Re:Just from personal experience

[PopeRatzo]

The exception being a few action figures that actually do something, challenging the brain of toddlers as to how to assemble them or get them to do specific things.

I would argue that an action figure/doll that does nothing challenges the brains of toddlers even more, forcing them to create their own stories, to think creatively and to use their brains instead of being told what to do by some jackoffs in the marketing department.

Personally, I gave my kid Lincoln Logs, a chemistry set, and a carton of Chesterfields, just like my parents gave me. She didn't know exactly what to do with them, being only 18 months old, but this week she's defending her thesis toward a PhD in math. In this case, I'm pretty sure it was less about what toys she played with than the genes of her mother whose only fault is having terrible taste in men.

Re:Just from personal experience

[Anonymous Coward]

Who the hell played with action figures? When I was 2, I was taking apart electronics, when I was 3 I was watching discovery channel and asking my mom about science enough to drive her crazy. When I was 4, I went in for speech therapy. I remember going into a room and seeing a mirror. It made no sense to me that there was a mirror in that room, I assumed there had to have been something special about it. I eventually figured out it was a one-way mirror in only a few minutes left on my own. That was how I learned about them.

That's about all I remember about the months of therapy. It was just so exciting to have seen a mirror like that, it stuck in my memory. My mom said the doctors loved me over there because I was so inquisitive, asking to many questions and able converse with them on topics they were also interested in. They encouraged me to talk about science since it was interesting to them and it helped my speech.

The first time I saw a computer I was about 7. I knew about electronics, but not computers. I thought it was a TV playing a video, but the sales person said it was a computer that was like a calculator, but really fast, and used math to create the moving patterns (screensaver). I immediately fell in love. I saw the keyboard and he showed me how to enter in commands. I asked if you could enter in data via the keyboard and the computer could output data via the monitor, if two computers could communicate. Then I learned about Ethernet. I asked my dad to get me a book on programming. He was going to get me a book on Basic, but I looked at it and complained Basic looked like English and there's no way computers used English. He got me a book on C, it looked like math. After a short bit of reading on C and played around with pointers, I wanted to find out how compilers worked, since they translated C into numbers the computer worked with. That's when I learned about ASM. In less than a week at the age of 7, I self taught myself C and ASM. It was all too easy, I got bored and didn't program again until college. Of course I never studied and was the only person who got an A in DataStructures and Algorithms.

I didn't know children had to be inspired or encouraged to do something they love. Even my co-worker was getting left-over PC parts at the age of two, and putting them together without instruction. He's one of the few people I feel I can actually talk with without having to over-simplify problems. Even my brother is a Junior and is interning to program super-computers for R&D, one of a hand-full of students ever to be allowed to do such a thing in the 50 years history. He's also like me and finds problems like Parallelism, Concurrency, and Distributed programming easy. Of course certain problems in those categories can be extremely difficult, like geographically dispersed multi-master conflicts and time syncing, but most problems are not like that.

If you're not passionate about programming, please don't start. I spend most of my time cleaning up after and otherwise babysitting programmers who make, what I considered, simple logic mistakes. Not bugs, just wrong. Everyone makes mistakes, god knows I do, but most people constantly make design mistakes. So aggravating.

I almost failed school several times because I have some mental disabilities. Took me almost 8 years to graduate from the State Uni. My high school did tell me I shouldn't go to college and probably not even vocational school. Turns out I'm bad at remembering stuff, but I can naturally infer knowledge by using reasoning allowing me to jump into problems in which I have no experience. Most people learn from knowledge gained from experience. I have trouble with remembering knowledge, so I have learned to learn from reasoning alone, no experience required. It's much faster to think than it is to spend a life time experiencing. It's easier for me to dynamically recreate knowledge than to remember it. As a result, I devote little time to remembering details of my code and spend most of my time making my code logical so I can re-reason the details.

Re:Just from personal experience

[arth1]

I would argue that an action figure/doll that does nothing challenges the brains of toddlers even more, forcing them to create their own stories, to think creatively and to use their brains instead of being told what to do by some jackoffs in the marketing department.

And I would argue that a lump of clay would do that better, by making the creative world much more open and free than a doll that's made to represent one very specific situation (by the same jackoffs in the marketing department that would want to sell one toy per possible play scenario).

It's much like a book being a better exercise for imagination than a movie is, and a blank paper much better for learning to draw than a paint-by-number book.
(Or, to take the analogy all the way, like a blank programming editor is a better introduction to programming than an IDE with five hundred bundled black box modules.)

Re:Just from personal experience

[PopeRatzo]

When I was 2, I was taking apart electronics

When I was 2, there were no electronics. I had to take apart my parents' abacus. Ate several of the beads, too. And let me tell you, it was NO FUN passing those damn things.

Re:Just from personal experience

[PopeRatzo]

Ate several of the beads, too. And let me tell you, it was NO FUN passing those damn things.

OK, it was a little fun.

Not any more than other Barbies.

[Anonymous Coward]

What kid dreams of an office job with long hours and low pay? Programming can be interesting because of the thinking. The sitting behind a glowing screen part is boring, even more so if the screen is actually a sticker. If toys had that much of an influence all men would be cowboys, astronauts or supermen.
But then I'm not a girl toy designer, so what do I know. It's parents who buy the toys, not kids, so maybe it can ride the fad and sell.

Link

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't seem to have a true link either. But, these dramatic and hostile comments more than make up for that.

Will it work?

[Ol Olsoc]

Only if the regular Barbie actually causes women to become bulimic.

Are female programmers the only women who wear jeans and t-shirts? That is what makes a person a programmer?

First off, we need to realize that not all that many men are into programming. Long hours, so-so pay, especially considering the hours. And zero social prospects. A real niche group.

I can see the stories now.......

Barbie eats cold pizza at 2 in the morning while trying to clean up some code for Friday's big rollout.

Barbie gets told to do duty at the IT help desk because "You know computers and stuff, right?!"

Barbie gets to wear her blue jeans and shirt at work the couple weeks she would have been at the beach because her vacation was cancelled so she can clean up some shitty code that the guy who up and quit left, and they gotta meet Friday's deadline.

This is not a field for many people - male or female. Finally, are young females so shallow that a little plastic doll's clothing can determine their choice of careers?

If so, that is what needs worked on, not putting a plastic doll in a t-shirt and bluejeans.

Re:Will it work?

[AmiMoJo]

It's not really supposed to "make" girls become developers, any more than a Disney Princess is supposed to make them royalty. Children just like to play "grown-ups", even if sometimes we think being a grown-up sucks (like those dolls that wet themselves... ugh).

The significance is that children can see that being a game developer is something women. Maybe it seems obvious to adults (well , some of us, a few are still in denial) but child psychologists will tell you that role models are really important.

Re:Will it work?

[Anonymous Coward]

It sold out.

They only made 1000... and they were bought by collectors.

Re:Will it work?

[Ol Olsoc]

It's not really supposed to "make" girls become developers, any more than a Disney Princess is supposed to make them royalty. Children just like to play "grown-ups", even if sometimes we think being a grown-up sucks (like those dolls that wet themselves... ugh).

The significance is that children can see that being a game developer is something women. Maybe it seems obvious to adults (well , some of us, a few are still in denial) but child psychologists will tell you that role models are really important.

I know, I went through a lifetime of steroid dependence tryting to be like a he-man doll I had as a young boy - that is kidding of course.

It's the part I don't get though. I never gave a damn about who thought what. Neither did the feamle engineers I worked with. They just knew what they wanted to be and did it. And to a person, they scoffed at the ideas being presented today for the dearth of women in STEM careers.

In perhaps the greatest irony, I developed my views on getting women involved in STEM, from women involved in STEM. Which do not seem to be anything like the views of women who think that men are keeping women out of STEM careers.

Which is why I believe that after a small part of my career was trying to get more women involved in STEM, I've come to the conclusion that we will not cure this problem by blaming men. Or Barbie. A woman who wants to have a career in STEM should be encouraged, but not coddled. Because the coddling stops abruptly upon entering the workplace. Because coding does not have a gender. Rocket science does not have a gender. And it is not cool or anything like that except to peopple who believe it is cool from the start.

Re:Will it work?

[AmiMoJo]

Barbie is aimed at really young children, so I think by the time girls start to study STEM seriously they are probably well beyond such toys.

I'm not sure where you got the blaming men bit from. How does Game Developer Barbie blame men?

Re:Will it work?

[Ol Olsoc]

Barbie is aimed at really young children, so I think by the time girls start to study STEM seriously they are probably well beyond such toys.

I'm not sure where you got the blaming men bit from. How does Game Developer Barbie blame men?

Barbie is aimed at really young children, so I think by the time girls start to study STEM seriously they are probably well beyond such toys.

I'm not sure where you got the blaming men bit from. How does Game Developer Barbie blame men?

I don't think either of us have been hiding under a rock for the past several years.

http://www.businessinsider.com...

One of my (not) favorites because of the nasty implications is from this article: http://www.aauw.org/files/2013...

One of these nasty tidbits that in essence tells women that they need special help because they can easily be turned away from a STEM career:

Does the stereotype that boys are better than girls in math and science still effect girls today? Research pro led in this report shows that negative stereotypes about girls’ abilities in math can indeed measurably lower girls’ test performance. Researchers also believe that stereotypes can lower girls’ aspirations for science and engineering careers over time. When test adminis- trators tell students that girls and boys are equally capable in math, however, the difference in performance essentially disappears, illustrating that changes in the learning environment can improve girls’ achievement in math.

What an odd thing, that telling a person they are not good at something makes them not good at something. Bloody hell, I was told I was going to be a failure by my parents, my teachers, my guidance counselors, from third grade on. Every damn day. I wasn't, I actually became quite successful. Would I have been a failure if I was female? What is the difference?

In addition, at least where I spent my career, most of the accountants were female. There was some math involved. What are the factors that cause this?

The concept that any negativity will cause a person to fail, is disturbing indeed. How does one function in the workplace when the key to getting ahead is telling others that they suck, in the process making them incompetent.

Amazingly enough they managed to make a pop culture reference complaining about the stereotyped female STEM characters in "The Big Bang Theory". Having worked with a lot of engineers of both male and female - that is us! What the hell, are we all supposed to become Danica McKellar, or Hedy Lamar so that women decide that it is cool to become an engineer or mathematician?

Regardless, in the second article, all of the changes needed and the implications derived from it are that men must change. Ergo males are at fault for the problem. Who else would be at fault?

Re:Will it work?

[AmiMoJo]

I don't think either of us have been hiding under a rock for the past several years.

http://www.businessinsider.com...

I read that article but no-where does it blame men.

One of my (not) favorites because of the nasty implications is from this article

I think you are reading too much into this. These people are not blaming men, not blaming 50% of the population. They are identifying institutional problems. Yes, sometimes men are involved, but often it's women who are the problem, and mostly it's both.

I hear this a lot. Feminism is seen by some as an attack on men when feminists point out issues that might require men to change to solve. That's absolutely not the case.

The concept that any negativity will cause a person to fail, is disturbing indeed.

That's clearly not what they are saying. They are saying that when they identified an issue and counteracted it, on average it made a difference. Sure, there will always be people for whom being told they are inadequate causes them to defy their detractors, but if you read any book on teaching or child psychology it will tell you that for most children encouragement is important.

How does one function in the workplace when the key to getting ahead is telling others that they suck, in the process making them incompetent.

In the workplace it is important to encourage people, but also to help them improve if they are having trouble. I get the impression that it is different in the US, that people are basically disposable and if they show weakness their co-workers use it to shred them and clamber over their corpse on the way to a promotion. In the UK we try to support each other and help each other grow, and are rewarded for helping others with promotions and raises. Well, some places are like that, there are some bad places and I've left them behind, along with many others - they have problems retaining staff.

Personally I wouldn't recommend people try to make their way in an environment like that, unless they are some kind of sociopath, because the stress just isn't worth it. Don't allow yourself to be exploited, find a better place to work.

Re:Will it work?

[K. S. Kyosuke]

Does the stereotype that boys are better than girls in math and science still effect girls today? Research pro led in this report shows that negative stereotypes about girls’ abilities in math can indeed measurably lower girls’ test performance. Researchers also believe that stereotypes can lower girls’ aspirations for science and engineering careers over time. When test adminis- trators tell students that girls and boys are equally capable in math, however, the difference in performance essentially disappears, illustrating that changes in the learning environment can improve girls’ achievement in math.

From what I read, this only works until the test admin also tells the boys that it's a competition.

Re:Will it work?

[Anonymous Coward]

In my experience half or more of the men in programming aren't even up to spec. There is a lot of demand and limited supply of really good talented programmers. Push a lot of women into it for the sake of it with no real passion in code for the sake of code or talent and you will create an army of Paula Beans sitting around pretending to code waiting for a real programmer to do it for them under the hope of getting laid.

Re:Will it work?

[Anonymous Coward]

Oh just shut up.

Re:Will it work?

[Ol Olsoc]

I don't think either of us have been hiding under a rock for the past several years.

http://www.businessinsider.com...

I read that article but no-where does it blame men.

Are you serious? Male dominated "culture" must change or else women will not enter the culture. As Thinkprogress.org states:

"There is also persistent discrimination against women who enter the science and math fields. CTI’s study found that almost a third of “senior leaders” in STEM fields think a woman would never be able to reach top jobs at their organizations. A part of this surely comes from a general societal bias against women in those fields. Previous research has shown that even STEM professors doubt the ability of their female students. Biases against women in STEM start when they’re young girls and can become so ingrained as to actually make the girls worse at the subject. http://thinkprogress.org/econo...

So anyhow - who is doing this discrimination -the Flying Burrito Pug?

As well, they are far more likely to get into STEM if the classrooms do not have male type art on the wall:

Over and over, Dr. Cheryan and her colleagues have found that female students are more interested in enrolling in a computer class if they are shown a classroom (whether virtual or real) decorated not with “Star Wars” posters, science-fiction books, computer parts and tech magazines, but with a more neutral décor — art and nature posters, coffee makers, plants and general-interest magazines.

So men need to stop putting things that offend women on the walls. A Star Wars poster can keep them out of tech.?!?!

As well, the Barbie in a T-shirt and jeans might j8ust backfireon Mattel because yup, you guessed it, a person in jeans can apparently keep a young woman out of a STEM career. to wit:

In another experiment, Dr. Cheryan and her colleagues arranged for female undergraduates to talk to an actor pretending to be a computer science major. If the actor wore a T-shirt that said “I CODE THEREFORE I AM” and claimed to enjoy video games, the students expressed less interest in studying computer science than if the actor wore a solid shirt and claimed to enjoy hanging out with friends — even if the T-shirt-clad actor was another woman.

So it appears that the t-shirt barbie is wearing will actually be counterproductive. Girls don't like other girls in t-shirts

Here is the article cited. It unabashedly blames males, and for things like -- almost everything about them. http://www.nytimes.com/2015/10...

To make up the list for the tl;dr crowd, what really keeps women out of STEM:

Star wars posters in the classroom

Science fiction books

computer parts

tech magazines

T-Shirrt on men or women with anything technical on them.

pop culture portrayals of scientists as white or asian men.

Guys drinking beer when you don't

This sounds so ridiculous that people should doubt my veracity, but its right there in the article. One of the most damning things on this list is "computer parts. If seeing computer parts keeps a woman out of STEM, just what on gawds green earth is she going to do when she sees on where she works? It is exceptionally difficult to work with computers when seeing one makes you quit working with them.

By the way, there is an easter egg in the second article, a one sentence paragraph that kinda sums it all up. Let's see if you find it.

I think you are reading too much into this. These people are not blaming men, not blaming 50% of the population. They are identifying institution

Re:Will it work?

[AmiMoJo]

"There is also persistent discrimination against women who enter the science and math fields. CTIâ(TM)s study found that almost a third of âoesenior leadersâ in STEM fields think a woman would never be able to reach top jobs at their organizations. A part of this surely comes from a general societal bias against women in those fields. Previous research has shown that even STEM professors doubt the ability of their female students. Biases against women in STEM start when theyâ(TM)re young girls and can become so ingrained as to actually make the girls worse at the subject.

Again, it doesn't mention men anywhere in that. You are reading more into it than it says. In fact, it is extremely careful to avoid blaming men and point out that the issues are institutional. Elsewhere it mentions that women are often the ones perpetuating these institutional biases.

Over and over, Dr. Cheryan and her colleagues have found that female students are more interested in enrolling in a computer class if they are shown a classroom (whether virtual or real) decorated not with âoeStar Warsâ posters, science-fiction books, computer parts and tech magazines, but with a more neutral décor â" art and nature posters, coffee makers, plants and general-interest magazines.

So men need to stop putting things that offend women on the walls. A Star Wars poster can keep them out of tech.?!?!

This is a really, really common mistake that so many nerds make I'm starting to think it's something about the logical way we like to think. Look at the text again, it's a list. It's not saying that those things individually are going to stop a girl entering that classroom, it's saying that taken as a whole the atmosphere of such rooms is not welcoming, or at least not very encouraging. I mean, those things are clearly there to encourage boys, they aren't just artful decoration.

The goal isn't to force men out, it's to create an environment that is suitable for BOTH men and women. You could flip your argument around and ask if boys are really so insecure that they wouldn't come without Star Wars posters on the wall. I doubt it, but maybe if the room was decked out in pink with My Little Pony dolls everywhere they might be less inclined to join in. All it's saying is make the room more gender neutral, not oppress anyone.

You are reading a lot into these articles that they very clearly don't say.

So nothing about E3, but we get this

[Anonymous Coward]

So Slashdot decided to run nothing about E3, one of the major nerd events of the year where things like a new Zelda game were announced, but instead decided to run a story about a girl's doll.

Remember when this site used to be about "news for nerds, stuff that matters?"

Sad

[Anonymous Coward]

It's really sad everyone is pushing these young girls into IT. Now when our jobs get outsourced in the next 5-10 years we can have our men and our women jobless.

This Is A Stupid Post.

[zenlessyank]

Actually, this is beyond stupid. Plastic toys can't program. This toy is a lie. A toy never played with is not a toy at all** (Kevn Kinney)

Economics 101

[Anonymous Coward]

Selling out only means demand > inventory. A little googling and I don't see any articles mentioning the quantity of dolls manufactured. Mattel's true fault is not having a preorder function so they could gauge the total demand for the next production run.

Hey Slashdot, you fucked up again

[wonkey_monkey]

The link's broken. People have pointed it out already but if we spam the top level comments repeating it, it might just get fixed.

Pssht. BATTLE BARBIE.

[Anonymous Coward]

Game developer Barbie will get destroyed by Battle Barbie who rides a giant tardigrade. http://zheng3.com/2016/05/04/faire-play-iii/

But who exactly is buying these?

[RogueWarrior65]

Are young girls buying them to play out their fantasies of becoming a game developer or are guys buying them to play out their fantasies of meeting a smoking-hot female game developer? I ask because most of the women I know who are into game development aren't into playing with Barbie dolls. They're usually tom-boy types. Not that that's a bad thing. (I prefer women that way, quite frankly). And one could argue that Game Developer Barbie's skin isn't nearly pasty enough. ;-)

Re:But who exactly is buying these?

[jader3rd]

I don't believe that young girls buy Barbies. They ask for them for gifts. So it's possible that the first rush of sellout is happening because social justice parents want their girls to have some influence into making computers look cool, even though the daughter will have that Barbie program a game once, when her parents are looking, and then just play with the doll in non-programming settings from then on.

Re:But who exactly is buying these?

[Anonymous Coward]

Are young girls buying them to play out their fantasies of becoming a game developer or are guys buying them to play out their fantasies of meeting a smoking-hot female game developer? I ask because most of the women I know who are into game development aren't into playing with Barbie dolls. They're usually tom-boy types. Not that that's a bad thing. (I prefer women that way, quite frankly). And one could argue that Game Developer Barbie's skin isn't nearly pasty enough. ;-)

Pink haired idiots on tumblr and twitter are mostly the ones buying this, I'd wager. "Smashing the patriarchy," "striking a blow for women's lib," or whatever buzzwords the marketing execs at Mattel seeded social media with and the usual suspects (man hating idiots at The Mary Sue, Jezebel, etc) picked up and ran with for clicks.

Re:But who exactly is buying these?

[RogueWarrior65]

Perhaps, but I would say that social justice parents are more likely to reject Barbie altogether for a whole list of reasons not the least of which is body-image issues. I wouldn't be surprised if someday some SJW tries to sue Mattel for having once portrayed unrealistic body images that magically scarred their precious little snowflake who likely still eats paste.

Re:But who exactly is buying these?

[jader3rd]

I would say that social justice parents are more likely to reject Barbie altogether

True, but sometimes as a parent, the best you can do is find some sort of middle ground. "I don't want you to have a Barbie, but if you have to have one, so help me, it's going to be one encouraging non-traditional roles!"

Game Developer Barbie = $129 (Amazon). Raspberry P

[Anonymous Coward]

And their objective is more women in computing or fleecing idiot parents?

Source: I have two Barbie-Free little daughters.

It will

[Anonymous Coward]

If they are people that are actually a good fit for that profession. I absolutely feel that kids interested in engineering have limited options in school (and basic logic could easily be a part if mathematics curricculum), but that's true for most kids' interests, whstever they may be. For non-engineers, not likely, no, nothing will change a banana into a willow tree. We accept that gay conversion camp flies in the face of nature, i don't know why we assume other natural traits can be twisted and shaped to our whimsy (maybe we need a right to be human movement ;). Still, for coding interested kids, what an improvement!

How about Embedded Control Barbie?

[Herger]

Perhaps it would be more inspiring if the doll was itself programmable? They'd learn a lot more with a Barbie that they programmed to talk or move!

Re:How about Embedded Control Barbie?

[CronoCloud]

Mattel did that already:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

As a software developer male.

[Fragnet]

As a software developer (15 years) it amazes me how certain people are pushing women to become devs. It's a dead-end job that's about as rewarding as stabbing yourself in the head. Any woman with any sense will steer well clear of it.

no

[Anonymous Coward]

not really.

All bought up..

[Anonymous Coward]

.. by a bunch of single male game developers living in their Moms' basements.

Re:All bought up..

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah but eventually they'll become their true selves and transition. Then they can get on with the business of fighting for women's rights and attacking nasty nerds on Twitter.

Selling out

[Jiro]

Whether something sells out depends partly on how many you made in the first place. In other words, the fact that this "sold out" is not useful information, and is an advertising trick. It's just that in this case the advertising trick is selling politics as well as dolls.

The new EditorDavid Barbie though?

[Anonymous Coward]

Takes a seat and does as he's told, isn't that right?

"stay up late writing code"

[bill_mcgonigle]

Dumbasses, the absurd schedules that male developers allow themselves to be subjected to are the #1 reason there are relatively few females in the profession. Moms, generally, need 9-5 jobs. If you want there to be more females in the profession then you need to stop allowing your management to treat you like a wage slave.

Oh, but that might be hard and uncomfortable while being a social justice worrier is easy to feign online.

Re:"stay up late writing code"

[Anonymous Coward]

Males working harder and more hours than women is causing the wage gap, shitlord!

Re:"stay up late writing code"

[Anonymous Coward]

More importantly, working more hours does not equal more output. Once you get past 45 or so hours/week, you're doing less, not more.

See Myth #1 in this Lifehacker article: http://lifehacker.com/more-productivity-myths-debunked-by-science-and-commo-514253858

Re:"stay up late writing code"

[Ash-Fox]

More importantly, working more hours does not equal more output. Once you get past 45 or so hours/week, you're doing less, not more.

My experience varies. I was definitely doing more work and getting a project moving faster when I was doing 100 hour work weeks verses 50.

Longer hours do not make you more productive, and can in fact have the opposite effect: You'll get less done

I found if my work is time sensitive and I can get things deployed, configured and running as soon as they're ready, they're done sooner and therefore more work is completed as a result of that.

When I was able to produce a work output through a constant stream that didn't have time sensitive points when I could or couldn't work, I found that less was more.

Comment removed

[account_deleted]

Comment removed based on user account deletion

Comment removed

[account_deleted]

Comment removed based on user account deletion

there are a few Ladies of Computing

[laurencetux]

Starting with of course and actual titled Lady Ada Countess of Lovelace

then we have Rear Admiral Grace Hopper (was part of the team that wrote COBOL and had to retire 3 times before it stuck)

Then we have the legions of Telephone Operators and "Calculators"

We could go on but i will end with the comment that a lot of Programmers would do good to have somebody serving as "Team Mother".

You know...

[Anonymous Coward]

Percentage-wise there were probably more women in STEM in the 50s than there are today....

Just going off anecdotal evidence I met more women from STEM careers in the 50s than I have in all the years since. Most modern ones went for MBAs, nursing, psychology, drama, or writing based degrees (communications, journalism, etc.) Quite a few in (professional, not min wage) food service too.

Re:You know...

[beastofburdon]

That's because all the men were at war.

well why don't you step up??

[laurencetux]

if you would take better care of yourself and get even close to pulling off the Chippendale look you might inspire a few ladies to do some office party dancing.

Porn Actress Barbie

[Anonymous Coward]

It'll happen one of these days.

Re:Porn Actress Barbie

[Anonymous Coward]

Time to come up with the B-Mods Inc, the place for all your Barbie and Ken body modification services.

Re:Porn Actress Barbie

[Anonymous Coward]

There was a stripper at my bachelor party that did entertaining things with a Barbie doll.

A working link

[tgibson]

Unboxing of Game Developer Barbie annotated with overly-smarmy commentary.

A Redhead?

[CronoCloud]

I know there's a bit of a stereotype of nerdygirls being redheads (either natural or dyed), but I'm bit surprised the doll is a redhead. Mattel says redheaded Barbies don't sell well. They actually do very few good redheads and most of those being lighter reds and strawberry blondes.

Re:A Redhead?

[cmdr_klarg]

I know there's a bit of a stereotype of nerdygirls being redheads (either natural or dyed)

I am a big fan of red-headed nerd-girls. Like a moth to the flame, so to speak.

H1-B Visa Barbie

[Anonymous Coward]

Do Slashdot readers think this will inspire a new generation of programmers to stay up late writing code?
Yes, Pajeet's daughter will love her new doll and cant wait to get the new H1-B Visa Barbie

Life imitates USENET

[Guy Harris]

Life. (Bonus: this link actually works!)

USENET. (Hacker Barbie's Dream Basement Apartment. "To me, the most realistic thing is how if you put in her in the chair in front of the monitor, she'll stare at it for hours without blinking or taking her hands off the keyboard.")

Re: women garbage men

[Anonymous Coward]

> We need more women garbage men too

I certainly don't think that we need more "women [anything] men" or any other cross-dressers, lady-boys or boy-girls.

However, if all you meant was more women involved in the garbage collection process, then I can assure you that my wife always puts out the garbage and is thus fully involved in the first stage of this industry.

Hurry up!

[r1348]

Still a few copies left of Barbie Proctologist!

How soon they forget...

[Anonymous Coward]

Date: Fri, 8 Apr 1994 20:14:17 -0600
From: matossian@aries.colorado.edu (Espacionaute Spiff domine!) ...
From: hemr@hulaw1.harvard.edu (Kurt Wm. Hemr, Harvard Law School)

In article , writes:
> I am looking for input on a subject concerning Barbie. I would like to
> gain more information regarding her position in today's society despite
> her long controversial history. Tell me about your opinion surrounding
> her stereotypical image, as well as where you think she will be in
> the future. Do you agree with what she represents? How influential is
> her image on the young girls playing with her? [ . . . ]

Speaking for myself, my niece can't get enough of Hacker Barbie's Dream
Basement Apartment! The pink Sun workstation in the corner, the little
containers of takeout Szechuan scattered across the floor, her "Don't
Blame Me, I Voted Libertarian" t-shirt -- it's on every little girl's
Xmas list!

To me, the most realistic thing is how if you put in her in the chair
in front of the monitor, she'll stare at it for hours without blinking
or taking her hands off the keyboard.

- --
Kurt Wm. Hemr / 1541 Mass. Ave. Apt. 553 / Cambridge, MA 02138
** Better living through shorter .sig files -- ask me about it! **

Retarded

[Anonymous Coward]

If you want to get your kid into computers then get them a computer.

I am all for more women in computing but this kind of thing is condescending and a waste of time.

Re:Retarded

[gfxguy]

I wouldn't call it condescending, nor a waste of time (any more than any other Barbie is), but it certainly isn't going to (nor should it) influence someone's choice in careers. When it comes to more [insert class identity] in STEM, I don't care - the people that want to do it should do it, the ones that don't shouldn't listen to the people trying to "empower" them into doing something they are not interested in.

Some minor problems.

[Anonymous Coward]

They got the problem hair and problem glasses down right, but she's about 150 pounds too light to be a "female" game dev.

Boohoo

[Anonymous Coward]

We put new hires through 6 months of training before they can even begin to code anything independently. It feels like we have no choice but to spend company resources to provide remedial education (to men and women alike) because of this.

Why should anyone else give a shit about your inability to external your training costs onto the rest of society?

Just more MBA arrogance... Other people should make massive investments at great cost in time and money so that you don't have to spend a penny of your own cash on training your own employees.

Fuck off, you precious little victim.

Howdy

[MobileTatsu-NJG]

When I read your post I could hear your voice in my head, and it had a southern accent.

Did we all forget that it is misogynist?

[kriston]

Did we all forget that it is misogynist?

http://www.dailydot.com/geek/b...

Ken the Reviewer

[abies]

I wonder if they will sell boxed set of Barbie The Game Designer together with Ken the Reviewer (and few small, hairy Internet Trolls), so little girls can roleplay entire Gamergate...

I'm confused.

[Anonymous Coward]

Does this new doll... actually develop games? If not, how is it actually different from Gynecologist Barbie? Or Hash-slinger Barbie? Or Professional Polygon Sorter Barbie? Or Deep Sea Manganese Nodule Hunter Barbie?

This story really should read: Mattel Corp. just figured out how to get you to buy more of the same old bullshit, dressed up as new bullshit, for a bunch more money, which you'll pay because you are wrapped around your baby-girl's little finger, and now, you're wrapped around Mattel's. Specifically, it's their middle finger, and you're wrapped around it becuase it's up YOUR ASS.

why?

[Anonymous Coward]

to counter attitudes like this. Lots of women like STEM; have you seen how many women doctors there are these days?

The smart girls are holding out for CCNP certified Barbie anyway.

so diversity is BS?

[Anonymous Coward]

Not in nature, it is not! Mono-cultures don't last long since they are prone to singular disaster. If you THINK that only tubby white guys with beards and sandals are effective computer programmers or operators, you are imposing a mono-culture on your company and your efforts. You lose all the ideas and energy that difference brings. Think of it as the cross-pollination that slays the threats of the mono-culture in a company.

p.s. so glad that I don't work for you or with people with your attitude. Bet I'm not the only one.

Helldesk

[Anonymous Coward]

She's wearing a headset so she can answer all the "technical" queries in the call center.

Opportunity Lost. No wait Paradise, Paradise Lost

[Anonymous Coward]

Facepalm Computer Engineer barbie should not be a mere developer. If you want inspiring computer engineer barbie should be working with neural networks or more in line with IoT tech. Ideally we are looking for a female version of Iron Man. It happened for Deadpool. It can happen for a person in computer systems and mechatronics. Otherwise it is gamer/game developer barbie and look how that turned out. There is a reason why females are discouraged from getting into and pursuing the careers long term and it is not because of biology or interest. The culture even in the Pacific is so toxic not even chemosynthetic bacteria could survive. People of both sexes are thrown into to depression due to many of the industry's foibles and in the industry we have initiatives like IBM's "hack a hair dryer", or Google's "women can have daycare by work". Really it is worse than the discrimination aimed at the disabled entering work fields. In many cases it harms more the perception of the industry. Because only a chauvinist idiot could think either of the two ads were ok to roll into production. Try invoking some challenge and passion into the field. You know the usual suspects: "pushing boundaries", "creative thinking", "working at the cutting edge", and "going where no one has gone before". Use what mechatronics and computer systems engineers currently do in the field as a baseline. Because when working as an engineer and looking at "Computer Engineer" barbie it is just insulting to the engineering profession. In fact many of the comments up here are insulting to the engineering profession. That is why I totally support 100% using androgynous models for engineering advertising. Because regardless of race, sex, religion, disability or background if you have the aptitude to learn and work in the field that is the dominant characteristic of your person that should be focused on. In the office I do not care if you are married, gay, Muslim, Discordian, vegetarian, conservative, like drinking whisky sours, or any combination of the above. I care whether you can work in the role and how you perform. Seriously why does a simple Vodka ad have all the nous and yet none of the obvious finger pointing discrimination: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZRX3vwkEIQ

No love for GI Joe?

[WolfgangVL]

Why is nobody buying L337 H@XX0r G.I.Joe®? Or Constantly contractor Sally©? Or for the minorities of Indian decent, there is always Blue Badge Barbie®.